Ukraine Crisis - Page 33

On January 29 2014 07:15 Greem wrote:


The single thing that acomplished is some news for the media. A peacefull crowd in total silence would've done the same.But then again, the history will repeat itself , like the old "orange revolution" thing, because there is no one competent around in that crowd to make a difference, since they methods speak for them more than the words they use.A clever leader or group of people whos desire truly lies in bringing better standarts of life wouldn't get close to those public crowd methods and violence of any kind , destruction or fear.

On January 29 2014 07:17 DeepElemBlues wrote:


6) Yanukovich offered to change the offices of the president and prime minister so the prime minister has significantly more power at the expense of the presidency. Part of the deal would be that Yanukovich is immune from future prosecution.

Yanukovich is starting to run scared. Putin finally overreached, all those victories of his during the last 10 years finally made him a little overconfident and he made a big mistake.

On January 29 2014 06:34 Cheerio wrote:

So your opinion that only 50 000 people support EuroMaidan is based on what? Any social poll you've read about?

On January 29 2014 08:52 zeo wrote:

The reason these protests gained any momentum in the first place is because Ukraine is one of the poorest countries in Europe. Unemployment is huge, those that have a job get 150 euro a month, equipment at state institutions like schools and hospitals haven’t changed since the fall of the Soviet Union, and the people are running for their lives out of the country. Everyone is depressed, poor, maybe drunk, you have cities with 4-5 million people that are ‘dolled up’ to look nice but the rest of the country looked better during Romanov times.

Because of the state the country is in the Orange revolution happened, because nothing changed that EUro government fell, the people rushed to the polls and the head of state became Yanukovych. Still nothing changed, that’s why people went to these protests in the beginning, because Yanukovych did not fulfill his promises, just like Tymoshenko, or that idiot Yushchenko, and before them Kuchma and Kravchuk.

And when the people realized that the protests were simple demagoguery and a mechanism to turn them into a toy of Western foreign policy to be used to piss off Russia, the people stepped back. Alas the damage was done, unrest started, in came the national socialist sympathizers and hooligans and things went out of control. The people left on the street aren’t protesters, rather fanatics.

Of course, the fact that Ukraine is poor is no fault of anyone from the sides, nor Russia, nor ‘Europe’. After the fall of the Soviet Union mass robbery of state property, cowboy privatizations, tycoonization of the economy, no real state of law or any serious state apparatus happened. Simply put, the same as Russia in the 90’s, its just that Russia during the 2000’s got Putin who, love him or hate him, brought the situation under control, tightened the belt and started building a serious country (though how much success he had is a topic for itself and I won’t go into it here). But Ukraine never got such a personality, it just continued its steep fall into ruin and division.

If you take a look at our unfortunate Viktor, his sin was not having the balls to fight the tycoons, oligarchs and the astronomical corruption rampant in the country like Putin did when he came to power. Is Yanukovych the right man for Ukraine? No. But at the same time we can only hope that the sane people of Ukraine wake up and see that Klicko, the children of Bandera, and commissars of the EU are not the way to a better life. But that a better life can be achieved through fighting the corruption and mafia within their own ranks and society in general. Destroying your own country achieves nothing.

On January 29 2014 08:52 zeo wrote:

The reason these protests gained any momentum in the first place is because Ukraine is one of the poorest countries in Europe. Unemployment is huge, those that have a job get 150 euro a month, equipment at state institutions like schools and hospitals haven’t changed since the fall of the Soviet Union, and the people are running for their lives out of the country. Everyone is depressed, poor, maybe drunk, you have cities with 4-5 million people that are ‘dolled up’ to look nice but the rest of the country looked better during Romanov times.

Because of the state the country is in the Orange revolution happened, because nothing changed that EUro government fell, the people rushed to the polls and the head of state became Yanukovych. Still nothing changed, that’s why people went to these protests in the beginning, because Yanukovych did not fulfill his promises, just like Tymoshenko, or that idiot Yushchenko, and before them Kuchma and Kravchuk.

And when the people realized that the protests were simple demagoguery and a mechanism to turn them into a toy of Western foreign policy to be used to piss off Russia, the people stepped back. Alas the damage was done, unrest started, in came the national socialist sympathizers and hooligans and things went out of control. The people left on the street aren’t protesters, rather fanatics.

Of course, the fact that Ukraine is poor is no fault of anyone from the sides, nor Russia, nor ‘Europe’. After the fall of the Soviet Union mass robbery of state property, cowboy privatizations, tycoonization of the economy, no real state of law or any serious state apparatus happened. Simply put, the same as Russia in the 90’s, its just that Russia during the 2000’s got Putin who, love him or hate him, brought the situation under control, tightened the belt and started building a serious country (though how much success he had is a topic for itself and I won’t go into it here). But Ukraine never got such a personality, it just continued its steep fall into ruin and division.

If you take a look at our unfortunate Viktor, his sin was not having the balls to fight the tycoons, oligarchs and the astronomical corruption rampant in the country like Putin did when he came to power. Is Yanukovych the right man for Ukraine? No. But at the same time we can only hope that the sane people of Ukraine wake up and see that Klicko, the children of Bandera, and commissars of the EU are not the way to a better life. But that a better life can be achieved through fighting the corruption and mafia within their own ranks and society in general. Destroying your own country achieves nothing.

On January 29 2014 08:52 zeo wrote:

The reason these protests gained any momentum in the first place is because Ukraine is one of the poorest countries in Europe. Unemployment is huge, those that have a job get 150 euro a month, equipment at state institutions like schools and hospitals haven’t changed since the fall of the Soviet Union, and the people are running for their lives out of the country. Everyone is depressed, poor, maybe drunk, you have cities with 4-5 million people that are ‘dolled up’ to look nice but the rest of the country looked better during Romanov times.

Because of the state the country is in the Orange revolution happened, because nothing changed that EUro government fell, the people rushed to the polls and the head of state became Yanukovych. Still nothing changed, that’s why people went to these protests in the beginning, because Yanukovych did not fulfill his promises, just like Tymoshenko, or that idiot Yushchenko, and before them Kuchma and Kravchuk.

And when the people realized that the protests were simple demagoguery and a mechanism to turn them into a toy of Western foreign policy to be used to piss off Russia, the people stepped back. Alas the damage was done, unrest started, in came the national socialist sympathizers and hooligans and things went out of control. The people left on the street aren’t protesters, rather fanatics.

Of course, the fact that Ukraine is poor is no fault of anyone from the sides, nor Russia, nor ‘Europe’. After the fall of the Soviet Union mass robbery of state property, cowboy privatizations, tycoonization of the economy, no real state of law or any serious state apparatus happened. Simply put, the same as Russia in the 90’s, its just that Russia during the 2000’s got Putin who, love him or hate him, brought the situation under control, tightened the belt and started building a serious country (though how much success he had is a topic for itself and I won’t go into it here). But Ukraine never got such a personality, it just continued its steep fall into ruin and division.

If you take a look at our unfortunate Viktor, his sin was not having the balls to fight the tycoons, oligarchs and the astronomical corruption rampant in the country like Putin did when he came to power. Is Yanukovych the right man for Ukraine? No. But at the same time we can only hope that the sane people of Ukraine wake up and see that Klicko, the children of Bandera, and commissars of the EU are not the way to a better life. But that a better life can be achieved through fighting the corruption and mafia within their own ranks and society in general. Destroying your own country achieves nothing.

On January 29 2014 09:39 Greem wrote:


It's well written. General information nothing to specific is stated but from my experience living in Ukraine and observing it from outside and drawing comparison, its pretty much as i would describe this.

I actually don't understand people who laugh at so called "conspiracies" , i dont like that name but whatever, there is a plan behind stuff, Ukraine is actually rich in mineral resources, the soil is good, proximity to Russia with it natural resources, there is money on the line for other countries, money to be saved or gained, so yes one may go tricky to say it soft to get it done . Its been like that for a long time when people discovered that war no longer is the best option to get stuff. Conflict is what humans famous for, and there are not much noble hearths out there, too harsh for them to accept this reality of lies i guess.

Funny how this discussion start and go, obviously no one got 100% facts, no wikileak like proof around most of the time , yet its usually easier do defend the most simplier thing, when its get complicated people tend to ignore it, because "naaah, that too strange or impossible or no way it could be truth, yet after time passed we all see the hidious truth appear all the time.Ignorance is trully a blessing. Its just easier to get straight facts like , to sum up 1+1 to get a 2 . Anyway in the end if people of one country speaking the same language and having mostly identical culture can get opossed and in war state, thats very sad.And what is even more sad is that this things spread, this might be some kind of push for other similar situation in few years or centurys somehwere in other side, like maybe this crowd took they exampley somewhere else .

On January 29 2014 23:24 Cheerio wrote:
Russia has reintroduced most of the artificial trade barriers that were in place in August 2013 during the so-called "trade war" against Ukraine aimed to sabotage the EU-Ukraine association agreement. Looks like relations between Putin and Yanukovich have broken down.

On January 29 2014 08:52 zeo wrote:

The reason these protests gained any momentum in the first place is because Ukraine is one of the poorest countries in Europe. Unemployment is huge, those that have a job get 150 euro a month, equipment at state institutions like schools and hospitals haven’t changed since the fall of the Soviet Union, and the people are running for their lives out of the country. Everyone is depressed, poor, maybe drunk, you have cities with 4-5 million people that are ‘dolled up’ to look nice but the rest of the country looked better during Romanov times.

Because of the state the country is in the Orange revolution happened, because nothing changed that EUro government fell, the people rushed to the polls and the head of state became Yanukovych. Still nothing changed, that’s why people went to these protests in the beginning, because Yanukovych did not fulfill his promises, just like Tymoshenko, or that idiot Yushchenko, and before them Kuchma and Kravchuk.

And when the people realized that the protests were simple demagoguery and a mechanism to turn them into a toy of Western foreign policy to be used to piss off Russia, the people stepped back. Alas the damage was done, unrest started, in came the national socialist sympathizers and hooligans and things went out of control. The people left on the street aren’t protesters, rather fanatics.

Of course, the fact that Ukraine is poor is no fault of anyone from the sides, nor Russia, nor ‘Europe’. After the fall of the Soviet Union mass robbery of state property, cowboy privatizations, tycoonization of the economy, no real state of law or any serious state apparatus happened. Simply put, the same as Russia in the 90’s, its just that Russia during the 2000’s got Putin who, love him or hate him, brought the situation under control, tightened the belt and started building a serious country (though how much success he had is a topic for itself and I won’t go into it here). But Ukraine never got such a personality, it just continued its steep fall into ruin and division.

If you take a look at our unfortunate Viktor, his sin was not having the balls to fight the tycoons, oligarchs and the astronomical corruption rampant in the country like Putin did when he came to power. Is Yanukovych the right man for Ukraine? No. But at the same time we can only hope that the sane people of Ukraine wake up and see that Klicko, the children of Bandera, and commissars of the EU are not the way to a better life. But that a better life can be achieved through fighting the corruption and mafia within their own ranks and society in general. Destroying your own country achieves nothing.

On January 29 2014 23:12 Cheerio wrote:

Unfortunately some Ukrainians are either too biased or not intelligent enough to see what is going on.

Ukraine's political uprising began more than two months ago as a pro-European movement after Yanukovych rejected an integration pact with the European Union. Instead he accepted a $15bn bailout from Russia. The Kremlin has now said it may fail to pay the loan in full if the government changes.