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On January 28 2014 23:04 zeo wrote:Show nested quote +On January 28 2014 22:54 Velr wrote:
A Country blaming mainly outside influence/the EU/Russia/USA or even better "JOURNALISM" for its problems is like some redneck blaming immigrants for all his problems.
Its just dumb. You are missing the point. If you think no outside power is 'training' and funding the protests you are delusional. Funny how whichever protests McCain shows up at end up destroying their own country, I'm sure they destroyed themselves all on their own.
Do you have any actual evidence? This claim is conspiratorial at best without it...
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United States43980 Posts
On January 28 2014 23:04 zeo wrote:Show nested quote +On January 28 2014 22:54 Velr wrote:
A Country blaming mainly outside influence/the EU/Russia/USA or even better "JOURNALISM" for its problems is like some redneck blaming immigrants for all his problems.
Its just dumb. You are missing the point. If you think no outside power is 'training' and funding the protests you are delusional. Funny how whichever protests McCain shows up at end up destroying their own country, I'm sure they destroyed themselves all on their own.
You realise McCain's job is literally to go to unstable places and report back to the US gov wtf is going on. You're going "hey guys, I noticed McCain keeps showing up where there are protests, this can't be coincidence" and you're right, it's not a coincidence, that's his job. But it doesn't mean he's somehow causing them. Think about it for a second, if McCain was able to cause protests so he could get sent places on the government dime we'd have protests in tropical desert islands, Vegas, 5* restaurants, palaces, that kind of shit. He wouldn't want to start some protests so he could go check out Syria or the Ukraine or any of those shitholes.
Your conspiracy makes no sense, McCain is not starting protests just so he can go visit places. There is a connection, it's called his job.
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On January 29 2014 00:36 KwarK wrote:He wouldn't want to start some protests so he could go check out Syria or the Ukraine or any of those shitholes.
I think you should apologise for calling certain countries "shitholes". If not, I will have to message one of admins.
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United States43980 Posts
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On January 29 2014 01:10 KwarK wrote:
Have you seen Syria?
Yes, I have. I have seen photos regarding Ukraine's situation, too. This still doesn't allow you to directly insult countries by calling them "shitholes". It'd have been much better if you said something like "countries whose situation looks grim right now" or similar. Otherwise, "shitholes" sounds like you're generally against them.
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United States43980 Posts
Well fortunately I didn't call any of the people from them shitholes and countries, being inanimate, are unlikely to get offended by internet posts. Of course that doesn't stop people from getting offended on the behalf of an inanimate object but if they try that then I'll get counter offended on the behalf of logic and then we'll all be very upset at each other.
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On January 29 2014 01:25 KwarK wrote:
Well fortunately I didn't call any of the people from them shitholes and countries, being inanimate, are unlikely to get offended by internet posts. Of course that doesn't stop people from getting offended on the behalf of an inanimate object but if they try that then I'll get counter offended on the behalf of logic and then we'll all be very upset at each other.
This is why I love KwarK
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On January 29 2014 01:25 KwarK wrote:
Well fortunately I didn't call any of the people from them shitholes and countries, being inanimate, are unlikely to get offended by internet posts. Of course that doesn't stop people from getting offended on the behalf of an inanimate object but if they try that then I'll get counter offended on the behalf of logic and then we'll all be very upset at each other.
But would the reaction be different if someone called say the US or the UK shitholes? Although I guess that's very hypothetical since generally when people start their country bashing they go way beyond just calling the country a shithole, but still. Are you saying it's ok to call countries shitholes because the country is not a person, and so as long as you don't say anything about the people living there it's ok, or that it's ok to do that to countries like ukraine and syria because the countries are in a much shittier state than say countries like the US or UK?
Although I am with kwark that it's beyond silly to say that someone who's sent to these places to report to us on the protests/situation is somehow starting them. That's like saying that that just because day9 happened to cast idra quitting games he had won that day9 is actually forcing idra to quit games he's about to win, because he's there when it happens.
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United States43980 Posts
It comes down to the difference between "Americans are dumb" and "America has some broad social issues that need addressing". One is an attack on the people who live there, the other an opinion on the state of the country. If you want to provide commentary on another nation then I see no reason why you should not be able to, nor why it should always be positive. The example of Syria is one in which shithole is about as positive as you can get. But this ought to be a website feedback discussion really.
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On January 28 2014 23:23 radiatoren wrote:Show nested quote +On January 28 2014 23:04 zeo wrote:On January 28 2014 22:54 Velr wrote:
A Country blaming mainly outside influence/the EU/Russia/USA or even better "JOURNALISM" for its problems is like some redneck blaming immigrants for all his problems.
Its just dumb. You are missing the point. If you think no outside power is 'training' and funding the protests you are delusional. Funny how whichever protests McCain shows up at end up destroying their own country, I'm sure they destroyed themselves all on their own. Do you have any actual evidence? This claim is conspiratorial at best without it...
Once upon a time in the Maidan square of Kiev were gathered:
- The ambassadors of the United States of America, France, Spain, Denmark, Germany
- the Assistant Secretary of State for European and Eurasian Affairs at the United States Department of State - Victoria Nuland
- American senators - John McCain and Chis Murphy
- the Foreign Minister of Germany - Guido Westerwelle
- High Representative of the Union for Foreign Affairs and Security Policy for the European Union - Catherine Ashton
- the former president of Georgia - Mikheil Saakashvili
- the Foreign Minister of the Netherlands - Frans Timmermans
- Member of the European parliament - Jacek Protasiewicz
- the Foreign Minister of Lithuania - Linas Antanas Linkevičius
- former Prime Minister of Poland - Jaroslav Kačinjski
- Senator of the Cech Republic - Jaromír Štětina
And stated to Russia that they should not interfere in the internal affairs of Ukraine.
Of course, what was I saying. No way did NATO members countries influence anything that has happened in the Ukraine over the past month because evul dick-tator right? Lets all move to the paradises that have propped up in the middle east due to the same kind of meddling
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United States43980 Posts
On January 29 2014 01:57 zeo wrote:Show nested quote +On January 28 2014 23:23 radiatoren wrote:On January 28 2014 23:04 zeo wrote:On January 28 2014 22:54 Velr wrote:
A Country blaming mainly outside influence/the EU/Russia/USA or even better "JOURNALISM" for its problems is like some redneck blaming immigrants for all his problems.
Its just dumb. You are missing the point. If you think no outside power is 'training' and funding the protests you are delusional. Funny how whichever protests McCain shows up at end up destroying their own country, I'm sure they destroyed themselves all on their own. Do you have any actual evidence? This claim is conspiratorial at best without it... Once upon a time in the Maidan square of Kiev were gathered: - The ambassadors of the United States of America, France, Spain, Denmark, Germany - the Assistant Secretary of State for European and Eurasian Affairs at the United States Department of State - Victoria Nuland - American senators - John McCain and Chis Murphy - the Foreign Minister of Germany - Guido Westerwelle - High Representative of the Union for Foreign Affairs and Security Policy for the European Union - Catherine Ashton - the former president of Georgia - Mikheil Saakashvili - the Foreign Minister of the Netherlands - Frans Timmermans - Member of the European parliament - Jacek Protasiewicz - the Foreign Minister of Lithuania - Linas Antanas Linkevičius - former Prime Minister of Poland - Jaroslav Kačinjski - Senator of the Cech Republic - Jaromír Štětina And stated to Russia that they should not interfere in the internal affairs of Ukraine. Of course, what was I saying. No way did NATO members countries influence anything that has happened in the Ukraine over the past month because evul dick-tator right? Lets all move to the paradises that have propped up in the middle east due to the same kind of meddling
Yes but do you have any actual evidence? This claim is conspiratorial at best without it.
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Hell and even if the EU governments are supporting the protesters, like what's the big deal? The protesters are pro - European, the government sides with Russia. It's understandable that Europe would support the opposition both for political and humanistic reasons.
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How is the EU even supporting the protests?
Are they airdropping food for the protesters?
Are they teaches them how to make a molotov?
This isn't government's arming rebels. Its a civil protest ffs.
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On January 29 2014 01:59 KwarK wrote:Show nested quote +On January 29 2014 01:57 zeo wrote:On January 28 2014 23:23 radiatoren wrote:On January 28 2014 23:04 zeo wrote:On January 28 2014 22:54 Velr wrote:
A Country blaming mainly outside influence/the EU/Russia/USA or even better "JOURNALISM" for its problems is like some redneck blaming immigrants for all his problems.
Its just dumb. You are missing the point. If you think no outside power is 'training' and funding the protests you are delusional. Funny how whichever protests McCain shows up at end up destroying their own country, I'm sure they destroyed themselves all on their own. Do you have any actual evidence? This claim is conspiratorial at best without it... Once upon a time in the Maidan square of Kiev were gathered: - The ambassadors of the United States of America, France, Spain, Denmark, Germany - the Assistant Secretary of State for European and Eurasian Affairs at the United States Department of State - Victoria Nuland - American senators - John McCain and Chis Murphy - the Foreign Minister of Germany - Guido Westerwelle - High Representative of the Union for Foreign Affairs and Security Policy for the European Union - Catherine Ashton - the former president of Georgia - Mikheil Saakashvili - the Foreign Minister of the Netherlands - Frans Timmermans - Member of the European parliament - Jacek Protasiewicz - the Foreign Minister of Lithuania - Linas Antanas Linkevičius - former Prime Minister of Poland - Jaroslav Kačinjski - Senator of the Cech Republic - Jaromír Štětina And stated to Russia that they should not interfere in the internal affairs of Ukraine. Of course, what was I saying. No way did NATO members countries influence anything that has happened in the Ukraine over the past month because evul dick-tator right? Lets all move to the paradises that have propped up in the middle east due to the same kind of meddling Yes but do you have any actual evidence? This claim is conspiratorial at best without it.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Covert_United_States_foreign_regime_change_actions
http://www.policymic.com/articles/77309/what-the-media-doesn-t-get-about-the-protests-in-ukraine
http://globalresearch.ca/articles/CHO411D.html
Indeed anything less than leaked CIA documents won't convince people so from now on I will be asking for actual evidence for everything. Prove that USAID and The National Endowment for Democracy are not involved in the protests.
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On January 29 2014 02:35 Gorsameth wrote:
How is the EU even supporting the protests?
Are they airdropping food for the protesters?
Are they teaches them how to make a molotov?
This isn't government's arming rebels. Its a civil protest ffs.
all you need is money, srsly. (and some agitators)
do you realy think the protesters are paying for the molotovs from their salaries?.
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On January 29 2014 02:45 zeo wrote:Show nested quote +On January 29 2014 01:59 KwarK wrote:On January 29 2014 01:57 zeo wrote:On January 28 2014 23:23 radiatoren wrote:On January 28 2014 23:04 zeo wrote:On January 28 2014 22:54 Velr wrote:
A Country blaming mainly outside influence/the EU/Russia/USA or even better "JOURNALISM" for its problems is like some redneck blaming immigrants for all his problems.
Its just dumb. You are missing the point. If you think no outside power is 'training' and funding the protests you are delusional. Funny how whichever protests McCain shows up at end up destroying their own country, I'm sure they destroyed themselves all on their own. Do you have any actual evidence? This claim is conspiratorial at best without it... Once upon a time in the Maidan square of Kiev were gathered: - The ambassadors of the United States of America, France, Spain, Denmark, Germany - the Assistant Secretary of State for European and Eurasian Affairs at the United States Department of State - Victoria Nuland - American senators - John McCain and Chis Murphy - the Foreign Minister of Germany - Guido Westerwelle - High Representative of the Union for Foreign Affairs and Security Policy for the European Union - Catherine Ashton - the former president of Georgia - Mikheil Saakashvili - the Foreign Minister of the Netherlands - Frans Timmermans - Member of the European parliament - Jacek Protasiewicz - the Foreign Minister of Lithuania - Linas Antanas Linkevičius - former Prime Minister of Poland - Jaroslav Kačinjski - Senator of the Cech Republic - Jaromír Štětina And stated to Russia that they should not interfere in the internal affairs of Ukraine. Of course, what was I saying. No way did NATO members countries influence anything that has happened in the Ukraine over the past month because evul dick-tator right? Lets all move to the paradises that have propped up in the middle east due to the same kind of meddling Yes but do you have any actual evidence? This claim is conspiratorial at best without it. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Covert_United_States_foreign_regime_change_actionshttp://www.policymic.com/articles/77309/what-the-media-doesn-t-get-about-the-protests-in-ukrainehttp://globalresearch.ca/articles/CHO411D.htmlIndeed anything less than leaked CIA documents won't convince people so from now on I will be asking for actual evidence for everything. Prove that USAID and The National Endowment for Democracy are not involved in the protests.
Well let's just cut to the chase, and I apologize if I missed it: do you support the reforms being implemented by the Ukrainian regime? If so, why?
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On January 29 2014 02:45 zeo wrote:Show nested quote +On January 29 2014 01:59 KwarK wrote:On January 29 2014 01:57 zeo wrote:On January 28 2014 23:23 radiatoren wrote:On January 28 2014 23:04 zeo wrote:On January 28 2014 22:54 Velr wrote:
A Country blaming mainly outside influence/the EU/Russia/USA or even better "JOURNALISM" for its problems is like some redneck blaming immigrants for all his problems.
Its just dumb. You are missing the point. If you think no outside power is 'training' and funding the protests you are delusional. Funny how whichever protests McCain shows up at end up destroying their own country, I'm sure they destroyed themselves all on their own. Do you have any actual evidence? This claim is conspiratorial at best without it... Once upon a time in the Maidan square of Kiev were gathered: - The ambassadors of the United States of America, France, Spain, Denmark, Germany - the Assistant Secretary of State for European and Eurasian Affairs at the United States Department of State - Victoria Nuland - American senators - John McCain and Chis Murphy - the Foreign Minister of Germany - Guido Westerwelle - High Representative of the Union for Foreign Affairs and Security Policy for the European Union - Catherine Ashton - the former president of Georgia - Mikheil Saakashvili - the Foreign Minister of the Netherlands - Frans Timmermans - Member of the European parliament - Jacek Protasiewicz - the Foreign Minister of Lithuania - Linas Antanas Linkevičius - former Prime Minister of Poland - Jaroslav Kačinjski - Senator of the Cech Republic - Jaromír Štětina And stated to Russia that they should not interfere in the internal affairs of Ukraine. Of course, what was I saying. No way did NATO members countries influence anything that has happened in the Ukraine over the past month because evul dick-tator right? Lets all move to the paradises that have propped up in the middle east due to the same kind of meddling Yes but do you have any actual evidence? This claim is conspiratorial at best without it. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Covert_United_States_foreign_regime_change_actionshttp://www.policymic.com/articles/77309/what-the-media-doesn-t-get-about-the-protests-in-ukrainehttp://globalresearch.ca/articles/CHO411D.htmlIndeed anything less than leaked CIA documents won't convince people so from now on I will be asking for actual evidence for everything. Prove that USAID and The National Endowment for Democracy are not involved in the protests.
Not until you prove that Serbia wasn't behind the Occupy Wall Street protests.
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On January 29 2014 02:50 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On January 29 2014 02:45 zeo wrote:On January 29 2014 01:59 KwarK wrote:On January 29 2014 01:57 zeo wrote:On January 28 2014 23:23 radiatoren wrote:On January 28 2014 23:04 zeo wrote:On January 28 2014 22:54 Velr wrote:
A Country blaming mainly outside influence/the EU/Russia/USA or even better "JOURNALISM" for its problems is like some redneck blaming immigrants for all his problems.
Its just dumb. You are missing the point. If you think no outside power is 'training' and funding the protests you are delusional. Funny how whichever protests McCain shows up at end up destroying their own country, I'm sure they destroyed themselves all on their own. Do you have any actual evidence? This claim is conspiratorial at best without it... Once upon a time in the Maidan square of Kiev were gathered: - The ambassadors of the United States of America, France, Spain, Denmark, Germany - the Assistant Secretary of State for European and Eurasian Affairs at the United States Department of State - Victoria Nuland - American senators - John McCain and Chis Murphy - the Foreign Minister of Germany - Guido Westerwelle - High Representative of the Union for Foreign Affairs and Security Policy for the European Union - Catherine Ashton - the former president of Georgia - Mikheil Saakashvili - the Foreign Minister of the Netherlands - Frans Timmermans - Member of the European parliament - Jacek Protasiewicz - the Foreign Minister of Lithuania - Linas Antanas Linkevičius - former Prime Minister of Poland - Jaroslav Kačinjski - Senator of the Cech Republic - Jaromír Štětina And stated to Russia that they should not interfere in the internal affairs of Ukraine. Of course, what was I saying. No way did NATO members countries influence anything that has happened in the Ukraine over the past month because evul dick-tator right? Lets all move to the paradises that have propped up in the middle east due to the same kind of meddling Yes but do you have any actual evidence? This claim is conspiratorial at best without it. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Covert_United_States_foreign_regime_change_actionshttp://www.policymic.com/articles/77309/what-the-media-doesn-t-get-about-the-protests-in-ukrainehttp://globalresearch.ca/articles/CHO411D.htmlIndeed anything less than leaked CIA documents won't convince people so from now on I will be asking for actual evidence for everything. Prove that USAID and The National Endowment for Democracy are not involved in the protests. Well let's just cut to the chase, and I apologize if I missed it: do you support the reforms being implemented by the Ukrainian regime? If so, why?
I've stated before, no, of course the current government could do a better job. Does this give 50,000 people the right to hold 45 million of their countrymen hostage? Does it give them the right to destroy their own country? No.
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On January 29 2014 02:58 zeo wrote:Show nested quote +On January 29 2014 02:50 xDaunt wrote:On January 29 2014 02:45 zeo wrote:On January 29 2014 01:59 KwarK wrote:On January 29 2014 01:57 zeo wrote:On January 28 2014 23:23 radiatoren wrote:On January 28 2014 23:04 zeo wrote:On January 28 2014 22:54 Velr wrote:
A Country blaming mainly outside influence/the EU/Russia/USA or even better "JOURNALISM" for its problems is like some redneck blaming immigrants for all his problems.
Its just dumb. You are missing the point. If you think no outside power is 'training' and funding the protests you are delusional. Funny how whichever protests McCain shows up at end up destroying their own country, I'm sure they destroyed themselves all on their own. Do you have any actual evidence? This claim is conspiratorial at best without it... Once upon a time in the Maidan square of Kiev were gathered: - The ambassadors of the United States of America, France, Spain, Denmark, Germany - the Assistant Secretary of State for European and Eurasian Affairs at the United States Department of State - Victoria Nuland - American senators - John McCain and Chis Murphy - the Foreign Minister of Germany - Guido Westerwelle - High Representative of the Union for Foreign Affairs and Security Policy for the European Union - Catherine Ashton - the former president of Georgia - Mikheil Saakashvili - the Foreign Minister of the Netherlands - Frans Timmermans - Member of the European parliament - Jacek Protasiewicz - the Foreign Minister of Lithuania - Linas Antanas Linkevičius - former Prime Minister of Poland - Jaroslav Kačinjski - Senator of the Cech Republic - Jaromír Štětina And stated to Russia that they should not interfere in the internal affairs of Ukraine. Of course, what was I saying. No way did NATO members countries influence anything that has happened in the Ukraine over the past month because evul dick-tator right? Lets all move to the paradises that have propped up in the middle east due to the same kind of meddling Yes but do you have any actual evidence? This claim is conspiratorial at best without it. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Covert_United_States_foreign_regime_change_actionshttp://www.policymic.com/articles/77309/what-the-media-doesn-t-get-about-the-protests-in-ukrainehttp://globalresearch.ca/articles/CHO411D.htmlIndeed anything less than leaked CIA documents won't convince people so from now on I will be asking for actual evidence for everything. Prove that USAID and The National Endowment for Democracy are not involved in the protests. Well let's just cut to the chase, and I apologize if I missed it: do you support the reforms being implemented by the Ukrainian regime? If so, why? I've stated before, no, of course the current government could do a better job. Does this give 50,000 people the right to hold 45 million of their countrymen hostage? Does it give them the right to destroy their own country? No.
Okay, so does that mean that the citizens should not protest the abuse of civil liberties? Are these types of protests never warranted?
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On January 29 2014 03:00 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On January 29 2014 02:58 zeo wrote:On January 29 2014 02:50 xDaunt wrote:On January 29 2014 02:45 zeo wrote:On January 29 2014 01:59 KwarK wrote:On January 29 2014 01:57 zeo wrote:On January 28 2014 23:23 radiatoren wrote:On January 28 2014 23:04 zeo wrote:On January 28 2014 22:54 Velr wrote:
A Country blaming mainly outside influence/the EU/Russia/USA or even better "JOURNALISM" for its problems is like some redneck blaming immigrants for all his problems.
Its just dumb. You are missing the point. If you think no outside power is 'training' and funding the protests you are delusional. Funny how whichever protests McCain shows up at end up destroying their own country, I'm sure they destroyed themselves all on their own. Do you have any actual evidence? This claim is conspiratorial at best without it... Once upon a time in the Maidan square of Kiev were gathered: - The ambassadors of the United States of America, France, Spain, Denmark, Germany - the Assistant Secretary of State for European and Eurasian Affairs at the United States Department of State - Victoria Nuland - American senators - John McCain and Chis Murphy - the Foreign Minister of Germany - Guido Westerwelle - High Representative of the Union for Foreign Affairs and Security Policy for the European Union - Catherine Ashton - the former president of Georgia - Mikheil Saakashvili - the Foreign Minister of the Netherlands - Frans Timmermans - Member of the European parliament - Jacek Protasiewicz - the Foreign Minister of Lithuania - Linas Antanas Linkevičius - former Prime Minister of Poland - Jaroslav Kačinjski - Senator of the Cech Republic - Jaromír Štětina And stated to Russia that they should not interfere in the internal affairs of Ukraine. Of course, what was I saying. No way did NATO members countries influence anything that has happened in the Ukraine over the past month because evul dick-tator right? Lets all move to the paradises that have propped up in the middle east due to the same kind of meddling Yes but do you have any actual evidence? This claim is conspiratorial at best without it. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Covert_United_States_foreign_regime_change_actionshttp://www.policymic.com/articles/77309/what-the-media-doesn-t-get-about-the-protests-in-ukrainehttp://globalresearch.ca/articles/CHO411D.htmlIndeed anything less than leaked CIA documents won't convince people so from now on I will be asking for actual evidence for everything. Prove that USAID and The National Endowment for Democracy are not involved in the protests. Well let's just cut to the chase, and I apologize if I missed it: do you support the reforms being implemented by the Ukrainian regime? If so, why? I've stated before, no, of course the current government could do a better job. Does this give 50,000 people the right to hold 45 million of their countrymen hostage? Does it give them the right to destroy their own country? No. Okay, so does that mean that the citizens should not protest the abuse of civil liberties? Are these types of protests never warranted?
The protests were perfectly normal before McCain came to Kiev. The people on the streets now have long since stopped being protestors.
On January 29 2014 02:54 frogrubdown wrote:
Not until you prove that Serbia wasn't behind the Occupy Wall Street protests.
The professional revolutionaries from Otpor were involved in setting up Occupy... so in a way Serbian citizens were involved, Otpor was set up by NATO so I doubt the state was behind it.
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EPT
