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Read the rules in the OP before posting, please. In order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a re-read to refresh your memory! The vast majority of you are contributing in a healthy way, keep it up! NOTE: When providing a source, explain why you feel it is relevant and what purpose it adds to the discussion if it's not obvious. Also take note that unsubstantiated tweets/posts meant only to rekindle old arguments can result in a mod action. | ||
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ticklishmusic
United States15977 Posts
On January 19 2018 00:06 farvacola wrote: Clearly, we just need to setup some kind of massive tower defense game along the border. As someone who has logged hundreds of hours playing Gemcraft and tons of other flash games, I humbly submit myself as a candidate for Assistant Secretary of Homeland Security for Tower Defense. | ||
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Toadesstern
Germany16350 Posts
On January 19 2018 01:51 Plansix wrote: Sounds like 6 years of CHIP funding was tacked onto the CR in an effort to get people to vote for it. That is the one thing that might turn the tide for some Senators. I know the funding being cut has hurt a lot of states, with some people having to fear 30K bills for giving birth and such. Little things, like insulin. Can’t be mad at the GOP for having a good plan, I guess. Edit: Democrats are now pushing for DACA to be added to the CR and they will push for the votes, per NPR’s congressional team. Sounds like Democrats are confidant they could pass the short term spending measure with a few Republican votes and get CHIP and DACA. how does this work? Can anyone put up a bill and people vote on it? Or does it have to be the majority-leader who puts up the bill, whatever it may be? Because if it's the 2nd they might never get to vote on it if the GOP overall doesn't want to have a bill that has 100% Dem support + maybe 1/4 GOP support landing on Trumps desk. | ||
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LegalLord
United Kingdom13775 Posts
On January 19 2018 02:02 ticklishmusic wrote: As someone who has logged hundreds of hours playing Gemcraft and tons of other flash games, I humbly submit myself as a candidate for Assistant Secretary of Homeland Security for Tower Defense. The only real experience in the world that you can get is Desktop Tower Defense. It teaches you to think of your towers not just as towers but also as walls in and of themselves. It’s an important skill to be able to understand how to wall effectively, with towers. | ||
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LegalLord
United Kingdom13775 Posts
I read a headline “Trump names most dangerous country in the world” and the answer is apparently Mexico. | ||
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
On January 19 2018 02:09 Toadesstern wrote: how does this work? Can anyone put up a bill and people vote on it? Or does it have to be the majority-leader who puts up the bill, whatever it may be? Because if it's the 2nd they might never get to vote on it if the GOP overall doesn't want to have a bill that has 100% Dem support + maybe 1/4 GOP support landing on Trumps desk. House makes a bill, kicks it up to the senate after a vote. Senate crafts/amends that bill with changes they will vote for. Bill goes back down for a conference where both houses agree on a final draft. Both houses vote on that draft. Bill goes to the president, signed or vetoed. So the process right now is live, the terms in flux. They are going to slam through a bill and pass it at the 11th hour. But they can't do it without the Democrats. The Democrats are offering votes to pass teh short term resolution, but only if they get DACA and CHIP. It is a terrible deal for the GOP, since they will be back here in a month. But the GOP knows they will take the heat for the shutdown. Edit: It isn't supposed to work like this in any way. The GOP have completely broken the process in congress by trying to strong arm the minority party while also fucking over their own party members. It is really three groups in congress now. The Democrats, Republicans and Conservatives. | ||
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Ciaus_Dronu
South Africa1848 Posts
------------------------------- For myself (I'm not alone in this, but it certainly isn't unanimous), the most important factor to look at when thinking about political correctness is vulnerability and power. I'll illustrate with a really controversial example that I have no intention to debate the specifics of, it is for illustration's sake. Bear in mind I don't have a particularly positive view of religion as a whole for this example. Political correctness in the context of Islam. So the reason I'm going to use this example is because I think it nicely highlights some of the extremes in terms of vulnerability. In the US, muslims are a minority, and a very poorly trusted and respected one at that. Even to the extent that people have been killed in the US in the last two years as a result of attacks against muslims.(reuters). Now things get messy when people use issues with Islam to attack or degrade muslims. The travel ban being a perfect example. Often, attacking the ideology or extremism as a whole is used as a proxy for attacking the people. As such, especially in the context of immigration, and muslims in the US, I urge a lot of caution. One might say I'm quite strongly in favor of a fair amount of political correctness. However, as an ideology, and separately, as a religion with huge power and social sway in its own spheres, I absolutely despise it. I think it is very important to have an honest conversation about its influence and the role it plays in exacerbating things like limitations of free speech, women's rights etc. Exactly as I think any influential social force, power structure or individual in a role of leadership and representation should be examined, spoken of and where valid, criticized. In discussing ideas outside of the context of those who hold them, or when those themselves are not vulnerable, said political correctness is nowhere to be seen. In these discussions political correctness does more to entrench vulnerability, rather than respect it. The distinction is very important. The attacks at Trump over the obesity remarks, in the context of normally "politically correct" posters make sense in this framework. Average Joe with a weight problem may be on the receiving end of a lot stigma, without something like status or a very strong web of social support, they are potentially quite vulnerable. Mocking them is low at best. Trump on the other hand is not vulnerable at all, and should not be allowed to continue to obfuscate reality with yet another obvious lie. If vicious criticism and mockery is what is needed to effectively communicate to people that this is nonsense, and that not everyone has yet accepted reality going away entirely, then so be it (an environment in which this is absolutely necessary is something Trump has gone out of his way to create). Satire has always been effective, it has never been nice. | ||
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IgnE
United States7681 Posts
On January 19 2018 01:33 KwarK wrote: Firstly, obesity is a negative trait, no matter how you paint it. And secondly, it's the lying about obesity that we're harping on here. We didn't see FDR lying about being in a wheelchair. damn kwark, "obesity is a negative trait, no matter how you paint it." i thought you'd be down with body positivity | ||
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Excludos
Norway7969 Posts
On January 19 2018 02:12 LegalLord wrote: https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/953979393180950528 I read a headline “Trump names most dangerous country in the world” and the answer is apparently Mexico. Syria's got nothing on Mexico I tell you | ||
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Excludos
Norway7969 Posts
On January 19 2018 02:32 IgnE wrote: damn kwark, "obesity is a negative trait, no matter how you paint it." i thought you'd be down with body positivity Bit offtopic: It's entirely possible to be overweight and be fine with it. Doesn't mean it's not a objectively negative trait. I honestly wouldn't care too much about Trump being overweight if the rest of his health wasn't deteriorating and he keeps lying about it. | ||
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NewSunshine
United States5938 Posts
If I had to roll my eyes at that, they'd fall right out of my head. Your daily reminder that if Trump says something, you can safely and firmly believe exactly the opposite, and be ok. I don't know what planet he and his supporters live on. | ||
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Toadesstern
Germany16350 Posts
On January 19 2018 02:17 Plansix wrote: House makes a bill, kicks it up to the senate after a vote. Senate crafts/amends that bill with changes they will vote for. Bill goes back down for a conference where both houses agree on a final draft. Both houses vote on that draft. Bill goes to the president, signed or vetoed. So the process right now is live, the terms in flux. They are going to slam through a bill and pass it at the 11th hour. But they can't do it without the Democrats. The Democrats are offering votes to pass teh short term resolution, but only if they get DACA and CHIP. It is a terrible deal for the GOP, since they will be back here in a month. But the GOP knows they will take the heat for the shutdown. Edit: It isn't supposed to work like this in any way. The GOP have completely broken the process in congress by trying to strong arm the minority party while also fucking over their own party members. It is really three groups in congress now. The Democrats, Republicans and Conservatives. Thanks for the explanation. That being said, I think I read some 538 yesterday and they were all saying that they don't think Democrats will strongarm until the end. Yes the GOP needs some Dem-votes but not a lot and while there's a lot of people who are willing to risk a shutdown there are also a couple Democrats who already said they would not let the government shut down over DACA. If those help the GOP they'd still need 2-3 votes or something like that but even then they argued that there's a couple Democrats who have elections comming up in some red or red-ish states, so that might lose them their election if they really strongarm this. So they won't. Or at least that's what 538 was arguing. | ||
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JimmyJRaynor
Canada16466 Posts
even if a 70 year old is in very good health any prognosticator looking to score points has a safe bet proclaiming their health will experience a sharp decline. Reagan was dogged by the "Iran Contra" affair and responded with "i don't remember" ... his "i don't remember" was met with heavy skepticism.... by 1988 he truly didn't remember... hell, he couldn't remember anything.  | ||
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IgnE
United States7681 Posts
On January 19 2018 02:34 Excludos wrote: Bit offtopic: It's entirely possible to be overweight and be fine with it. Doesn't mean it's not a objectively negative trait. I honestly wouldn't care too much about Trump being overweight if the rest of his health wasn't deteriorating and he keeps lying about it. so you're pointing out that not all fat people hate themselves for being fat? "yeah, you know if you're fine with it then you're fine with it, as long as we all agree that it's objectively negative, and otherwise undesirable." isn't this precisely an instance where the doctor says, "hey however much Trump weighs, he's in good, or even excellent, health." are we not to trust Obama's former doctor? | ||
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JimmyJRaynor
Canada16466 Posts
a 6 foot tall person with 9" wrists and a massive bone structure has a very different ideal weight from a 6' tall person with 7" inch wrists. For example, Mike Tyson has a very different ideal weight than Max Holloway. | ||
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Simberto
Germany11343 Posts
On January 19 2018 02:34 Excludos wrote: Bit offtopic: It's entirely possible to be overweight and be fine with it. Doesn't mean it's not a objectively negative trait. I honestly wouldn't care too much about Trump being overweight if the rest of his health wasn't deteriorating and he keeps lying about it. Also, the idea is not that being overweight is good for you. It is about not being mean to overweight people. It is quite clear that being overweight is medically bad, and i doubt most overweight people would choose to be overweight if they could flick a switch and be fit instead. But all of that is the persons own problem, and you shouldn't put additional problems on top of it by being an ass to overweight people. With regards to Trump, the question is another entirely. There are two problems here. Firstly, the POTUS lies basically whenever he opens his mouth. That is a problem. The other is that the POTUS needs to be well enough to do his job. If the POTUS lies about basic facts about his health, you have no idea if he is able to do that. And being an overweight 71 year old does not suggest that he is likely to be in a well enough physical state to lead a nation. | ||
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
https://www.npr.org/people/444796749/scott-detrow https://www.npr.org/people/467975902/susan-davis https://www.npr.org/people/1930401/mara-liasson Most of them have been in DC for a long time and report from within congress/WH. They tweet out what they are seeing in the halls of congress and the general mood. I find it way more informative that the hot takes from afar that 538 does. In general, the stuff I have heard from these reporters is that the Democrats are under a lot of pressure, especially after last weekend. And a growing fear that if they don't draw a line in sand, it will get far worse. The impact of Trump's statement about other countries is still being assessed, especially abroad. Mara Liasson, the most senior reporter on the, pointed out that the country has become very used to this behavior out of Trump. The rest of the world does not endure him the way we do and the statement was shocking to some places that don't see Trump as anything but a very odd President. | ||
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Godwrath
Spain10109 Posts
On January 19 2018 02:02 ticklishmusic wrote: As someone who has logged hundreds of hours playing Gemcraft and tons of other flash games, I humbly submit myself as a candidate for Assistant Secretary of Homeland Security for Tower Defense. Sry, but only Terrans are allowed to apply for the job. | ||
KwarK
United States42024 Posts
On January 19 2018 02:32 IgnE wrote: damn kwark, "obesity is a negative trait, no matter how you paint it." i thought you'd be down with body positivity We all have plenty of vices. I don't believe in being a dick about other peoples' vices, I'm not about to start getting all judgmental or start throwing stones, people in glass houses etc. But it's a vice. | ||
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JimmyJRaynor
Canada16466 Posts
On January 19 2018 02:47 Simberto wrote: Firstly, the POTUS lies basically whenever he opens his mouth. That is a problem. No, he doesn't always lie. In general, politicians lie a lot. Some are better at not getting caught. including the word "basically" is obfuscation. | ||
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oBlade
United States5304 Posts
On January 19 2018 02:38 NewSunshine wrote: Because we all know about the looming threat of Mexican terror. If I had to roll my eyes at that, they'd fall right out of my head. Your daily reminder that if Trump says something, you can safely and firmly believe exactly the opposite, and be ok. I don't know what planet he and his supporters live on. Mexico far and away leads the OECD for homicides, it's consumed by cartel violence - who exist because of drugs, the markets for which are also in the US - and government corruption. It's not a safe place and that is part of why people like to migrate north. It's not wise to incorporate into a worldview the reflex that nothing Trump says could have any overlap with the truth even if you dislike him. | ||
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