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Read the rules in the OP before posting, please.In order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a re-read to refresh your memory! The vast majority of you are contributing in a healthy way, keep it up! NOTE: When providing a source, explain why you feel it is relevant and what purpose it adds to the discussion if it's not obvious. Also take note that unsubstantiated tweets/posts meant only to rekindle old arguments can result in a mod action. |
Questioning patriotism has been a tactic shitty tactic from McCarthy to Nixon and beyond. Employ it, get roped in with the some of the worst of American history. It is really that simple.
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Norway28668 Posts
The reaction to the charge I saw was mostly people stating that there's nothing unpatriotic about being critical of the US. I guess I can grant you that the american left disagrees about them being unpatriotic, because they disagree with your working definition of patriotism. This does differ a bit from my own pov - I have no need to defend my own lack of patriotic feelings. It's fun when watching sports, not a fan aside from that.
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On October 05 2017 04:28 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On October 05 2017 03:18 Liquid`Drone wrote:On October 05 2017 00:51 xDaunt wrote:On October 04 2017 12:20 Gahlo wrote:
I'm happy to state the obvious: The United States is not exactly a paragon of well-run, civilized, and industrious society. Y'all on the Left should be shaming this post a little more. I know how much you guys hate having your patriotism questioned, and this kind of stupid shit does nothing but reinforce those very sentiments. really dunno how you got the impression leftists hate having our patriotism questioned. As far as I'm concerned, what you seemingly regard as patriotism (based on how you phrase your condemnation of gahlo's post) is a vice more than a virtue. Historically, it's a common sore spot for the American Left. And I've seen plenty of American posters object to it around here. I think the reaction to my charge is all you really need to see. Now, it could be that y'all care less than you used to.
I don't think anyone takes you criticizing their patriotism seriously because they don't respect your idea of patriotism. Mostly because it's ridiculous.
EDIT: I think he might be reminiscing about when that trash worked during the Bush administration. But when American kids are going to bed hungry, we've got veterans on the street and killing themselves at nearly 1 an hour, and Americans on a flattened island desperate for help, the "but they don't worship the flag like I do so they can't be patriots" line is easily recognizable as the garbage it is.
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On October 05 2017 04:24 IgnE wrote:Show nested quote +On October 05 2017 01:28 xDaunt wrote:On October 05 2017 01:24 Danglars wrote:On October 05 2017 01:18 Gahlo wrote:On October 05 2017 01:03 xDaunt wrote:
So, comparing the US to a banana republic like Puerto Rico is accurate.... Okay then....
This isn't to say that the US is perfect and that we shouldn't point out its faults, but I'm quite amused to see that y'all won't even acknowledge how retarded Gahlo's statement is.
And as for the point about patriotism, all y'all do on the Left is bitch about the country and call it racist and imperialistic (in a bad way), so please forgive us on the Right for being a little confused as to why we should consider you to be patriotic. Bigger scale, more autonomy, more apologists. Take the L on this one. This country isn't great, it's just okay. You can't polish a turd, you need to work it into fertilizer. If the US is so great, MAGA is pointless. I have no great love for this country. It talks a big game but rarely backs it up. I don't respect that. Just when I think we can achieve some unanimity in condemning the politicization of PR hurricane relief, I run across people that will trash the US as a whole to avoid looking at PR's unique failings. Okay. If everything's already shit, PR-US-Trump, I guess we can't make any useful distinctions anymore. See, the problem is that Left has taken subjectivist thought too far and to its ultimate conclusion -- there are no meaningful distinctions anymore. We're all the same. This is an incoherent criticism. You accuse the Left of identitarian politics where a radical, unintelligible difference exists between identity groups (you are white, therefore you dont understand and cant understand what its like to be black; you are cis . . .). Yet here you say the Left has taken "subjectivism" to its logical extreme which in your view is some kind of universalism. On the contrary, the Left is not universal enough. There is no core or residuum of universality in the particularized human experience anymore. Everyone is confined to their own way of life. It is the conservative position which treats every subject as the same. Its subject is either the universal subject which shares its democratic, white, liberal values with all (conservative, American) subjects. Or the person is not a subject at all, but the Other, an objectified entity. Is that not the purpose of the pomp and myth of patriotism? To naturalize, eternalize, universalize the historical American moment (as Barthes would have it)? America has and always will offer the American dream and equality under the law to the citizens which rightly share in its patriotic myths?
Pfff, let me have my fun.
The universalism on the Left that I was referring to is their relentless refusal to judge on cultural issues. I don't see how this is necessarily inconsistent and mutually exclusive of their dabbling in identitarian politics for political gains. Likewise, I don't see where you get off accusing conservatives of universalism. Nationalism, is by any definition, the exact opposite of universalism.
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On October 05 2017 01:46 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On October 05 2017 01:34 Mohdoo wrote:On October 05 2017 01:26 xDaunt wrote:On October 05 2017 01:23 Mohdoo wrote:On October 05 2017 01:20 xDaunt wrote:On October 05 2017 01:18 Plansix wrote:
The dude Xdaunt voted for won the election by running around the country saying it was garbage, but we hate America for doing the same thing. Apparently we aren’t patriots, but we could get Xdaunt’s vote. Good luck arguing that Trump and his supporters are unpatriotic. They very clearly side side with the country and the flag on just about every issue. The contrast is quite stark with y'all on the Left. Can you explain how exactly someone sides with a flag? how does someone oppose the flag? Surely you have noted where the battle lines are drawn on the NFL issue. I can't think of a better example illustrating my point: the American Left is far too eager to throw the country under the bus. I would argue that having there be symbols or ideas that are considered off limits is unamerican. We are a nation born from revolution. Kicking shit over, throwing a fuss and hitting people in the nuts to get attention is who we are. We make a fuss, we make a scene and we are a generally enthusiastic bunch. Doing stuff that offends people and creates enthused dialogue is American. I don't think that there are any symbols or ideas that are "off limits." But when the express message behind a certain symbol is that America is "I'm not going to honor a racist country," we're well-into unpatriotic territory at that point and well-beyond the underlying idea of merely "we need to fix police abuse to improve society."
I still think you are still misrepresenting the situation. I have not seen anything to indicate the fundamental love for the country being gone, just that the country is deeply troubled. A marriage can be in complete shambles, yet you still love each other. That kinda thing.
If I may continue the marriage analogy. Let's say someone decides to stop talking to their spouse until they stop drinking. They know the drinking problem is going to ultimately destroy the marriage, so this person, out of love for their future, takes a firm stand against allowing the drinking to continue. In many ways, no longer talking could be said to kill what it is to have a relationship, but not entirely. So long as it was done in hopes of one day having a long, prosperous, loving relationship, you could say an emotional boycott is actually a loving thing to do. That is how I view the knee stuff.
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On October 05 2017 04:28 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On October 05 2017 03:18 Liquid`Drone wrote:On October 05 2017 00:51 xDaunt wrote:On October 04 2017 12:20 Gahlo wrote:
I'm happy to state the obvious: The United States is not exactly a paragon of well-run, civilized, and industrious society. Y'all on the Left should be shaming this post a little more. I know how much you guys hate having your patriotism questioned, and this kind of stupid shit does nothing but reinforce those very sentiments. really dunno how you got the impression leftists hate having our patriotism questioned. As far as I'm concerned, what you seemingly regard as patriotism (based on how you phrase your condemnation of gahlo's post) is a vice more than a virtue. Historically, it's a common sore spot for the American Left. And I've seen plenty of American posters object to it around here. I think the reaction to my charge is all you really need to see. Now, it could be that y'all care less than you used to.
Why do you keep typing "y'all"?
And why does no one comment that he types "y'all"?
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On October 05 2017 04:55 Dangermousecatdog wrote:Show nested quote +On October 05 2017 04:28 xDaunt wrote:On October 05 2017 03:18 Liquid`Drone wrote:On October 05 2017 00:51 xDaunt wrote:On October 04 2017 12:20 Gahlo wrote:
I'm happy to state the obvious: The United States is not exactly a paragon of well-run, civilized, and industrious society. Y'all on the Left should be shaming this post a little more. I know how much you guys hate having your patriotism questioned, and this kind of stupid shit does nothing but reinforce those very sentiments. really dunno how you got the impression leftists hate having our patriotism questioned. As far as I'm concerned, what you seemingly regard as patriotism (based on how you phrase your condemnation of gahlo's post) is a vice more than a virtue. Historically, it's a common sore spot for the American Left. And I've seen plenty of American posters object to it around here. I think the reaction to my charge is all you really need to see. Now, it could be that y'all care less than you used to. Why do you keep typing "y'all"? And why does no one comment that he types "y'all"?
It's his less than creative version of "bruh" as a somewhat condescending method of trying to come off as disconnected and unconcerned with the ideas and responses being discussed. It's a shitty attempt at semi-trolling.
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On October 05 2017 04:55 Dangermousecatdog wrote:Show nested quote +On October 05 2017 04:28 xDaunt wrote:On October 05 2017 03:18 Liquid`Drone wrote:On October 05 2017 00:51 xDaunt wrote:On October 04 2017 12:20 Gahlo wrote:
I'm happy to state the obvious: The United States is not exactly a paragon of well-run, civilized, and industrious society. Y'all on the Left should be shaming this post a little more. I know how much you guys hate having your patriotism questioned, and this kind of stupid shit does nothing but reinforce those very sentiments. really dunno how you got the impression leftists hate having our patriotism questioned. As far as I'm concerned, what you seemingly regard as patriotism (based on how you phrase your condemnation of gahlo's post) is a vice more than a virtue. Historically, it's a common sore spot for the American Left. And I've seen plenty of American posters object to it around here. I think the reaction to my charge is all you really need to see. Now, it could be that y'all care less than you used to. Why do you keep typing "y'all"? And why does no one comment that he types "y'all"?
Always asking the right questions.
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I think of it like raising a kid. You can be an engaged parent who helps with homework, rewards good behavior, encourages with extra curriculars and teaches your kid how to behave and all that. Or you can turn a blind eye and assume your kid is a perfect little angel and that his bad grades are due to poor teaching or whatever.
I use ya'll because that's the vernacular I grew up with, personally.
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On October 05 2017 04:49 Mohdoo wrote:Show nested quote +On October 05 2017 01:46 xDaunt wrote:On October 05 2017 01:34 Mohdoo wrote:On October 05 2017 01:26 xDaunt wrote:On October 05 2017 01:23 Mohdoo wrote:On October 05 2017 01:20 xDaunt wrote:On October 05 2017 01:18 Plansix wrote:
The dude Xdaunt voted for won the election by running around the country saying it was garbage, but we hate America for doing the same thing. Apparently we aren’t patriots, but we could get Xdaunt’s vote. Good luck arguing that Trump and his supporters are unpatriotic. They very clearly side side with the country and the flag on just about every issue. The contrast is quite stark with y'all on the Left. Can you explain how exactly someone sides with a flag? how does someone oppose the flag? Surely you have noted where the battle lines are drawn on the NFL issue. I can't think of a better example illustrating my point: the American Left is far too eager to throw the country under the bus. I would argue that having there be symbols or ideas that are considered off limits is unamerican. We are a nation born from revolution. Kicking shit over, throwing a fuss and hitting people in the nuts to get attention is who we are. We make a fuss, we make a scene and we are a generally enthusiastic bunch. Doing stuff that offends people and creates enthused dialogue is American. I don't think that there are any symbols or ideas that are "off limits." But when the express message behind a certain symbol is that America is "I'm not going to honor a racist country," we're well-into unpatriotic territory at that point and well-beyond the underlying idea of merely "we need to fix police abuse to improve society." I still think you are still misrepresenting the situation. I have not seen anything to indicate the fundamental love for the country being gone, just that the country is deeply troubled. A marriage can be in complete shambles, yet you still love each other. That kinda thing.
When we start accusing the nation of being racist and, in doing so, attack its historical and cultural foundations, we're way-beyond the type of rhetoric that could be characterized as "relationship saving." That's the rhetoric of ugly divorce.
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On October 05 2017 04:56 Mohdoo wrote:Show nested quote +On October 05 2017 04:55 Dangermousecatdog wrote:On October 05 2017 04:28 xDaunt wrote:On October 05 2017 03:18 Liquid`Drone wrote:On October 05 2017 00:51 xDaunt wrote:On October 04 2017 12:20 Gahlo wrote:
I'm happy to state the obvious: The United States is not exactly a paragon of well-run, civilized, and industrious society. Y'all on the Left should be shaming this post a little more. I know how much you guys hate having your patriotism questioned, and this kind of stupid shit does nothing but reinforce those very sentiments. really dunno how you got the impression leftists hate having our patriotism questioned. As far as I'm concerned, what you seemingly regard as patriotism (based on how you phrase your condemnation of gahlo's post) is a vice more than a virtue. Historically, it's a common sore spot for the American Left. And I've seen plenty of American posters object to it around here. I think the reaction to my charge is all you really need to see. Now, it could be that y'all care less than you used to. Why do you keep typing "y'all"? And why does no one comment that he types "y'all"? It's his less than creative version of "bruh" as a somewhat condescending method of trying to come off as disconnected and unconcerned with the ideas and responses being discussed. It's a shitty attempt at semi-trolling.
No, I just use y'all in every day speech.
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I suppose it would be helpful to see whether Trump or the NFL players are seen as appropriate:
The poll found that 51 percent of those surveyed said the players' protests were appropriate while 42 percent said they were inappropriate.
The results differ from a CBS News/YouGov poll released on Sept. 29 that found 52 percent of Americans disapproved of the players kneeling, while 38 percent approved.
In the USA Today poll, over two-thirds (68 percent), said that Trump's call for NFL owners to fire players and for fans to boycott their games was inappropriate. Only 27 percent of responders agreed with Trump's response.
Source
While plenty of people disagree with the protests, more people disagree with how Trump handled it. Yet this is paraded as a win for Trump.
On October 05 2017 04:59 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On October 05 2017 04:49 Mohdoo wrote:On October 05 2017 01:46 xDaunt wrote:On October 05 2017 01:34 Mohdoo wrote:On October 05 2017 01:26 xDaunt wrote:On October 05 2017 01:23 Mohdoo wrote:On October 05 2017 01:20 xDaunt wrote:On October 05 2017 01:18 Plansix wrote:
The dude Xdaunt voted for won the election by running around the country saying it was garbage, but we hate America for doing the same thing. Apparently we aren’t patriots, but we could get Xdaunt’s vote. Good luck arguing that Trump and his supporters are unpatriotic. They very clearly side side with the country and the flag on just about every issue. The contrast is quite stark with y'all on the Left. Can you explain how exactly someone sides with a flag? how does someone oppose the flag? Surely you have noted where the battle lines are drawn on the NFL issue. I can't think of a better example illustrating my point: the American Left is far too eager to throw the country under the bus. I would argue that having there be symbols or ideas that are considered off limits is unamerican. We are a nation born from revolution. Kicking shit over, throwing a fuss and hitting people in the nuts to get attention is who we are. We make a fuss, we make a scene and we are a generally enthusiastic bunch. Doing stuff that offends people and creates enthused dialogue is American. I don't think that there are any symbols or ideas that are "off limits." But when the express message behind a certain symbol is that America is "I'm not going to honor a racist country," we're well-into unpatriotic territory at that point and well-beyond the underlying idea of merely "we need to fix police abuse to improve society." I still think you are still misrepresenting the situation. I have not seen anything to indicate the fundamental love for the country being gone, just that the country is deeply troubled. A marriage can be in complete shambles, yet you still love each other. That kinda thing. When we start accusing the nation of being racist and, in doing so, attack its historical and cultural foundations, we're way-beyond the type of rhetoric that could be characterized as "relationship saving." That's the rhetoric of ugly divorce.
We know the country was founded on extremely racist principals right? I mean we agree that America at least *was* a racist country?
The problem seems to be that you think it stopped in some unspecified year, so that now it's no longer a valid criticism.
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On October 05 2017 04:59 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On October 05 2017 04:49 Mohdoo wrote:On October 05 2017 01:46 xDaunt wrote:On October 05 2017 01:34 Mohdoo wrote:On October 05 2017 01:26 xDaunt wrote:On October 05 2017 01:23 Mohdoo wrote:On October 05 2017 01:20 xDaunt wrote:On October 05 2017 01:18 Plansix wrote:
The dude Xdaunt voted for won the election by running around the country saying it was garbage, but we hate America for doing the same thing. Apparently we aren’t patriots, but we could get Xdaunt’s vote. Good luck arguing that Trump and his supporters are unpatriotic. They very clearly side side with the country and the flag on just about every issue. The contrast is quite stark with y'all on the Left. Can you explain how exactly someone sides with a flag? how does someone oppose the flag? Surely you have noted where the battle lines are drawn on the NFL issue. I can't think of a better example illustrating my point: the American Left is far too eager to throw the country under the bus. I would argue that having there be symbols or ideas that are considered off limits is unamerican. We are a nation born from revolution. Kicking shit over, throwing a fuss and hitting people in the nuts to get attention is who we are. We make a fuss, we make a scene and we are a generally enthusiastic bunch. Doing stuff that offends people and creates enthused dialogue is American. I don't think that there are any symbols or ideas that are "off limits." But when the express message behind a certain symbol is that America is "I'm not going to honor a racist country," we're well-into unpatriotic territory at that point and well-beyond the underlying idea of merely "we need to fix police abuse to improve society." I still think you are still misrepresenting the situation. I have not seen anything to indicate the fundamental love for the country being gone, just that the country is deeply troubled. A marriage can be in complete shambles, yet you still love each other. That kinda thing. When we start accusing the nation of being racist and, in doing so, attack its historical and cultural foundations, we're way-beyond the type of rhetoric that could be characterized as "relationship saving." That's the rhetoric of ugly divorce.
This is you choosing to get offended and upset over the language being used. That is on you. If you want to criticize how it makes you feel, that's one thing. But your criticism has been the intended message. I am saying that you are misunderstanding the intended message and that your sensitivity is what is causing issues for you.
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On October 05 2017 04:55 Dangermousecatdog wrote:Show nested quote +On October 05 2017 04:28 xDaunt wrote:On October 05 2017 03:18 Liquid`Drone wrote:On October 05 2017 00:51 xDaunt wrote:On October 04 2017 12:20 Gahlo wrote:
I'm happy to state the obvious: The United States is not exactly a paragon of well-run, civilized, and industrious society. Y'all on the Left should be shaming this post a little more. I know how much you guys hate having your patriotism questioned, and this kind of stupid shit does nothing but reinforce those very sentiments. really dunno how you got the impression leftists hate having our patriotism questioned. As far as I'm concerned, what you seemingly regard as patriotism (based on how you phrase your condemnation of gahlo's post) is a vice more than a virtue. Historically, it's a common sore spot for the American Left. And I've seen plenty of American posters object to it around here. I think the reaction to my charge is all you really need to see. Now, it could be that y'all care less than you used to. Why do you keep typing "y'all"? And why does no one comment that he types "y'all"?
what's wrong with saying y'all? Some people from the south use y'all, as do some other people.
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On October 05 2017 04:59 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On October 05 2017 04:49 Mohdoo wrote:On October 05 2017 01:46 xDaunt wrote:On October 05 2017 01:34 Mohdoo wrote:On October 05 2017 01:26 xDaunt wrote:On October 05 2017 01:23 Mohdoo wrote:On October 05 2017 01:20 xDaunt wrote:On October 05 2017 01:18 Plansix wrote:
The dude Xdaunt voted for won the election by running around the country saying it was garbage, but we hate America for doing the same thing. Apparently we aren’t patriots, but we could get Xdaunt’s vote. Good luck arguing that Trump and his supporters are unpatriotic. They very clearly side side with the country and the flag on just about every issue. The contrast is quite stark with y'all on the Left. Can you explain how exactly someone sides with a flag? how does someone oppose the flag? Surely you have noted where the battle lines are drawn on the NFL issue. I can't think of a better example illustrating my point: the American Left is far too eager to throw the country under the bus. I would argue that having there be symbols or ideas that are considered off limits is unamerican. We are a nation born from revolution. Kicking shit over, throwing a fuss and hitting people in the nuts to get attention is who we are. We make a fuss, we make a scene and we are a generally enthusiastic bunch. Doing stuff that offends people and creates enthused dialogue is American. I don't think that there are any symbols or ideas that are "off limits." But when the express message behind a certain symbol is that America is "I'm not going to honor a racist country," we're well-into unpatriotic territory at that point and well-beyond the underlying idea of merely "we need to fix police abuse to improve society." I still think you are still misrepresenting the situation. I have not seen anything to indicate the fundamental love for the country being gone, just that the country is deeply troubled. A marriage can be in complete shambles, yet you still love each other. That kinda thing. When we start accusing the nation of being racist and, in doing so, attack its historical and cultural foundations, we're way-beyond the type of rhetoric that could be characterized as "relationship saving." That's the rhetoric of ugly divorce.
We're not calling the nation racist, only the perpetrators of racism. Some, e.g. MLK, include the enabling silent majority into the former group.
How you warp calling out racism as attacking the - racist - historic and cultural foundation of the USA, is kinda funny.
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Despite fears that the legalization of marijuana might encourage use among adolescents, the rate of marijuana use among teenagers has dropped to its lowest point since 1994. Among youth between the ages of 12 and 17, marijuana usage has been on a downward trend since at least 2002, even though recreational marijuana shops opened in 2014.
Currently, 6.5 percent of individuals in this age range use m
The same survey from 2014 reported that 7.1 percent of youth aged 12 to 17 used marijuana on a monthly basis compared to 8.2 percent in 2002. Marijuana use among teenagers is declining regardless of whether it is legally available to some members of the public.
In contrast, the same survey found that marijuana use among adults aged 18 to 34 is at its highest rate since 1985. Nearly 21 percent of Americans between 18 and 25 use marijuana at least once a month, while monthly usage is reported to be 14.5 percent among adults aged 26 to 34.
These numbers have been rising for several decades; the last national survey saw an increase from 17.3 percent to 19.1 percent among 18 to 25-year-olds between 2002-2013, so current rates seem to be a continuation of an existing trend.
Alcohol use decreased alongside an increase in marijuana use by adults 18 or older according to the 2017 survey, suggesting that people are replacing liquor consumption with marijuana use.
According to a study covered earlier this year by saludmóvil™, individuals who used medical marijuana to treat their symptoms of pain (whether chronic, regularly occurring, or acute) reported a 42 percent drop in alcohol consumption.
A recent Quinnipiac poll found that a majority of adults in America — 61 percent — believe that lawmakers should legalize marijuana in the United States, while a resounding 94 percent support allowing adults to legally use marijuana for medical purposes if prescribed by a doctor.
Source
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On October 05 2017 04:46 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On October 05 2017 04:24 IgnE wrote:On October 05 2017 01:28 xDaunt wrote:On October 05 2017 01:24 Danglars wrote:On October 05 2017 01:18 Gahlo wrote:On October 05 2017 01:03 xDaunt wrote:
So, comparing the US to a banana republic like Puerto Rico is accurate.... Okay then....
This isn't to say that the US is perfect and that we shouldn't point out its faults, but I'm quite amused to see that y'all won't even acknowledge how retarded Gahlo's statement is.
And as for the point about patriotism, all y'all do on the Left is bitch about the country and call it racist and imperialistic (in a bad way), so please forgive us on the Right for being a little confused as to why we should consider you to be patriotic. Bigger scale, more autonomy, more apologists. Take the L on this one. This country isn't great, it's just okay. You can't polish a turd, you need to work it into fertilizer. If the US is so great, MAGA is pointless. I have no great love for this country. It talks a big game but rarely backs it up. I don't respect that. Just when I think we can achieve some unanimity in condemning the politicization of PR hurricane relief, I run across people that will trash the US as a whole to avoid looking at PR's unique failings. Okay. If everything's already shit, PR-US-Trump, I guess we can't make any useful distinctions anymore. See, the problem is that Left has taken subjectivist thought too far and to its ultimate conclusion -- there are no meaningful distinctions anymore. We're all the same. This is an incoherent criticism. You accuse the Left of identitarian politics where a radical, unintelligible difference exists between identity groups (you are white, therefore you dont understand and cant understand what its like to be black; you are cis . . .). Yet here you say the Left has taken "subjectivism" to its logical extreme which in your view is some kind of universalism. On the contrary, the Left is not universal enough. There is no core or residuum of universality in the particularized human experience anymore. Everyone is confined to their own way of life. It is the conservative position which treats every subject as the same. Its subject is either the universal subject which shares its democratic, white, liberal values with all (conservative, American) subjects. Or the person is not a subject at all, but the Other, an objectified entity. Is that not the purpose of the pomp and myth of patriotism? To naturalize, eternalize, universalize the historical American moment (as Barthes would have it)? America has and always will offer the American dream and equality under the law to the citizens which rightly share in its patriotic myths? Pfff, let me have my fun. The universalism on the Left that I was referring to is their relentless refusal to judge on cultural issues. I don't see how this is necessarily inconsistent and mutually exclusive of their dabbling in identitarian politics for political gains. Likewise, I don't see where you get off accusing conservatives of universalism. Nationalism, is by any definition, the exact opposite of universalism.
i "accused" the conservatives of "universalism" only within their own "cultures." its circumscribed within the class of "human bodies" but is universal within the narrower class of "proper subjects." see my point about subject-object relations and dealing with the other. that is part of what makes the Right able to criticize puerto rico's economic failure ("they are just like me and normal Americans, so there must be a moral failure there to account for their poverty"). while for the Left, rather than making PR the same they instead emphasize the difference ("PR and its subjects are differently placed in the world, their situation is different and determinative, they suffer from racism, trade oppression, predatory financing, lack of natural resources, etc.).
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On October 05 2017 05:05 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:Show nested quote +Despite fears that the legalization of marijuana might encourage use among adolescents, the rate of marijuana use among teenagers has dropped to its lowest point since 1994. Among youth between the ages of 12 and 17, marijuana usage has been on a downward trend since at least 2002, even though recreational marijuana shops opened in 2014.
Currently, 6.5 percent of individuals in this age range use m
The same survey from 2014 reported that 7.1 percent of youth aged 12 to 17 used marijuana on a monthly basis compared to 8.2 percent in 2002. Marijuana use among teenagers is declining regardless of whether it is legally available to some members of the public.
In contrast, the same survey found that marijuana use among adults aged 18 to 34 is at its highest rate since 1985. Nearly 21 percent of Americans between 18 and 25 use marijuana at least once a month, while monthly usage is reported to be 14.5 percent among adults aged 26 to 34.
These numbers have been rising for several decades; the last national survey saw an increase from 17.3 percent to 19.1 percent among 18 to 25-year-olds between 2002-2013, so current rates seem to be a continuation of an existing trend.
Alcohol use decreased alongside an increase in marijuana use by adults 18 or older according to the 2017 survey, suggesting that people are replacing liquor consumption with marijuana use.
According to a study covered earlier this year by saludmóvil™, individuals who used medical marijuana to treat their symptoms of pain (whether chronic, regularly occurring, or acute) reported a 42 percent drop in alcohol consumption.
A recent Quinnipiac poll found that a majority of adults in America — 61 percent — believe that lawmakers should legalize marijuana in the United States, while a resounding 94 percent support allowing adults to legally use marijuana for medical purposes if prescribed by a doctor. Source
Friendly reminder that Jeff Sessions is a complete and total moron when it comes to cannabis, and he happens to be in charge of enforcing the laws...
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On October 05 2017 05:07 GreenHorizons wrote:Show nested quote +On October 05 2017 05:05 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:Despite fears that the legalization of marijuana might encourage use among adolescents, the rate of marijuana use among teenagers has dropped to its lowest point since 1994. Among youth between the ages of 12 and 17, marijuana usage has been on a downward trend since at least 2002, even though recreational marijuana shops opened in 2014.
Currently, 6.5 percent of individuals in this age range use m
The same survey from 2014 reported that 7.1 percent of youth aged 12 to 17 used marijuana on a monthly basis compared to 8.2 percent in 2002. Marijuana use among teenagers is declining regardless of whether it is legally available to some members of the public.
In contrast, the same survey found that marijuana use among adults aged 18 to 34 is at its highest rate since 1985. Nearly 21 percent of Americans between 18 and 25 use marijuana at least once a month, while monthly usage is reported to be 14.5 percent among adults aged 26 to 34.
These numbers have been rising for several decades; the last national survey saw an increase from 17.3 percent to 19.1 percent among 18 to 25-year-olds between 2002-2013, so current rates seem to be a continuation of an existing trend.
Alcohol use decreased alongside an increase in marijuana use by adults 18 or older according to the 2017 survey, suggesting that people are replacing liquor consumption with marijuana use.
According to a study covered earlier this year by saludmóvil™, individuals who used medical marijuana to treat their symptoms of pain (whether chronic, regularly occurring, or acute) reported a 42 percent drop in alcohol consumption.
A recent Quinnipiac poll found that a majority of adults in America — 61 percent — believe that lawmakers should legalize marijuana in the United States, while a resounding 94 percent support allowing adults to legally use marijuana for medical purposes if prescribed by a doctor. Source Friendly reminder that Jeff Sessions is a complete and total moron when it comes to cannabis, and he happens to be in charge of enforcing the laws...
Sessions is too obsessed with war on drugs virtue signaling to look at reality.
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alternatively, the conservative mode of analyzing PR's failure is to turn PR and its denizens into the objectified Other: "they are just third world animals incapable of helping themselves, and would be an endless money pit, like Africa is. the best we can do is try to make profit there where we can and accept the 'right subjects' as immigrants to our major cities where they display the requisite ambition, education, and deference to American myth."
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EPT
