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Read the rules in the OP before posting, please.

In order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a re-read to refresh your memory! The vast majority of you are contributing in a healthy way, keep it up!

NOTE: When providing a source, explain why you feel it is relevant and what purpose it adds to the discussion if it's not obvious.
Also take note that unsubstantiated tweets/posts meant only to rekindle old arguments can result in a mod action.
Nevuk
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
United States16280 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-08-04 21:49:02
August 04 2017 21:48 GMT
#166061
DWS is claiming that her IT staffer was only arrested due to racial profiling...
ongresswoman Debbie Wasserman Schultz defiantly stands by her decision to keep an information technology aide on her payroll for six months after he was banned from the House network and fired by other members of Congress.

“I believe that I did the right thing, and I would do it again,” Wasserman Schultz said Thursday in an exclusive interview with the Sun Sentinel. “There are times when you can’t be afraid to stand alone, and you have to stand up for what’s right.

“It would have been easier for me to just fire him,” she said.

The Weston Democrat did fire Imran Awan last week after he was arrested on bank fraud charges at an airport while trying to leave the country.

As the former Democratic National Committee chairwoman, Wasserman Schultz is the most prominent Democrat who employed Awan. Her decision to keep employing Awan has been under fire from her Democratic primary challenger, Republicans and multiple conservative websites. They’ve suggested Wasserman Schultz is hiding something and the Awan matter is much more serious than she’s letting on.

His arrest, the congresswoman said, had nothing to do with the months-long investigation of Awan as an IT worker for a variety of members of Congress. An FBI affidavit filed with the criminal complaint said Awan and his wife claimed a property used to secure a home equity line of credit was a “principal residence,” when it was, in fact, a rental property. Wasserman Schultz said there still hasn’t been any evidence presented that he’s done anything wrong involving his work for Congress.

Awan, his wife and brothers worked for years for various members of Congress, including Wasserman Schultz. He was a so-called shared employee, with each office paying a part-time salary.

In February, Wasserman Schultz said, chiefs of staffs for members of Congress were told that Awan was under investigation and his access to the House network was suspended. House payroll records show that multiple members of Congress terminated Awan quickly, early in February.

Instead of firing him, Wasserman Schultz said her office worked with the House chief administration officer to develop a job description that “would allow him to continue to do work … until such time as there were other charges brought or we had some evidence that there was something that was produced that warranted further action.”
[...]

www.sun-sentinel.com
LegalLord
Profile Blog Joined April 2013
United States13779 Posts
August 04 2017 21:50 GMT
#166062
I believe that about as much as I believe that DWS did nothing wrong and that she resigned because she just took one for the team.
History will sooner or later sweep the European Union away without mercy.
Karis Vas Ryaar
Profile Blog Joined July 2011
United States4396 Posts
August 04 2017 21:59 GMT
#166063
"I'm not agreeing with a lot of Virus's decisions but they are working" Tasteless. Ipl4 Losers Bracket Virus 2-1 Maru
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
August 04 2017 22:01 GMT
#166064
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
LegalLord
Profile Blog Joined April 2013
United States13779 Posts
August 04 2017 22:03 GMT
#166065
Personally I don't think democratic when talking about judiciaries, so I find the Fox point moot.
History will sooner or later sweep the European Union away without mercy.
Mohdoo
Profile Joined August 2007
United States15743 Posts
August 04 2017 22:05 GMT
#166066
On August 05 2017 06:59 Karis Vas Ryaar wrote:
https://twitter.com/thehill/status/893569255354109952


I hate arguments like this. Something being democratic does not automatically make it "good". Something being undemocratic does not automatically make it "bad". Police are not democratic. School is not democratic. There are a billion of instances in criminal justice where it is not democratic.

A pathetic, shitty strawman.
Danglars
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States12133 Posts
August 04 2017 22:21 GMT
#166067
On August 05 2017 06:48 Nevuk wrote:
DWS is claiming that her IT staffer was only arrested due to racial profiling...
Show nested quote +
ongresswoman Debbie Wasserman Schultz defiantly stands by her decision to keep an information technology aide on her payroll for six months after he was banned from the House network and fired by other members of Congress.

“I believe that I did the right thing, and I would do it again,” Wasserman Schultz said Thursday in an exclusive interview with the Sun Sentinel. “There are times when you can’t be afraid to stand alone, and you have to stand up for what’s right.

“It would have been easier for me to just fire him,” she said.

The Weston Democrat did fire Imran Awan last week after he was arrested on bank fraud charges at an airport while trying to leave the country.

As the former Democratic National Committee chairwoman, Wasserman Schultz is the most prominent Democrat who employed Awan. Her decision to keep employing Awan has been under fire from her Democratic primary challenger, Republicans and multiple conservative websites. They’ve suggested Wasserman Schultz is hiding something and the Awan matter is much more serious than she’s letting on.

His arrest, the congresswoman said, had nothing to do with the months-long investigation of Awan as an IT worker for a variety of members of Congress. An FBI affidavit filed with the criminal complaint said Awan and his wife claimed a property used to secure a home equity line of credit was a “principal residence,” when it was, in fact, a rental property. Wasserman Schultz said there still hasn’t been any evidence presented that he’s done anything wrong involving his work for Congress.

Awan, his wife and brothers worked for years for various members of Congress, including Wasserman Schultz. He was a so-called shared employee, with each office paying a part-time salary.

In February, Wasserman Schultz said, chiefs of staffs for members of Congress were told that Awan was under investigation and his access to the House network was suspended. House payroll records show that multiple members of Congress terminated Awan quickly, early in February.

Instead of firing him, Wasserman Schultz said her office worked with the House chief administration officer to develop a job description that “would allow him to continue to do work … until such time as there were other charges brought or we had some evidence that there was something that was produced that warranted further action.”
[...]

www.sun-sentinel.com

She keeps on doubling down. Everybody else dumped the IT guy after his rights to work in congressional servers were revoked. This was several months ago, but DWS kept him on staff. Unforced errors, guys. To think she once stood as the DNC chair. GOP no better with Priebus. Such dysfunction.
Great armies come from happy zealots, and happy zealots come from California!
TL+ Member
Nebuchad
Profile Blog Joined December 2012
Switzerland12620 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-08-04 22:28:39
August 04 2017 22:25 GMT
#166068
On August 05 2017 07:05 Mohdoo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 05 2017 06:59 Karis Vas Ryaar wrote:
https://twitter.com/thehill/status/893569255354109952


I hate arguments like this. Something being democratic does not automatically make it "good". Something being undemocratic does not automatically make it "bad". Police are not democratic. School is not democratic. There are a billion of instances in criminal justice where it is not democratic.

A pathetic, shitty strawman.


On top of the hypocrisy and the bad argument, I legit don't understand how grand juries would possibly be argued to be undemocratic in the first place.

Like, what does he want, a national poll before indictment?
No will to live, no wish to die
Mohdoo
Profile Joined August 2007
United States15743 Posts
August 04 2017 22:30 GMT
#166069
On August 05 2017 07:25 Nebuchad wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 05 2017 07:05 Mohdoo wrote:
On August 05 2017 06:59 Karis Vas Ryaar wrote:
https://twitter.com/thehill/status/893569255354109952


I hate arguments like this. Something being democratic does not automatically make it "good". Something being undemocratic does not automatically make it "bad". Police are not democratic. School is not democratic. There are a billion of instances in criminal justice where it is not democratic.

A pathetic, shitty strawman.


On top of the hypocrisy and the bad argument, I legit don't understand how grand juries would possibly be argued to be undemocratic in the first place.

Like, what does he want, a national poll before indictment?


Candidate got electoral votes --> bad things happening to him is undemocratic is the long story short I think.
Nebuchad
Profile Blog Joined December 2012
Switzerland12620 Posts
August 04 2017 22:34 GMT
#166070
On August 05 2017 07:30 Mohdoo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 05 2017 07:25 Nebuchad wrote:
On August 05 2017 07:05 Mohdoo wrote:
On August 05 2017 06:59 Karis Vas Ryaar wrote:
https://twitter.com/thehill/status/893569255354109952


I hate arguments like this. Something being democratic does not automatically make it "good". Something being undemocratic does not automatically make it "bad". Police are not democratic. School is not democratic. There are a billion of instances in criminal justice where it is not democratic.

A pathetic, shitty strawman.


On top of the hypocrisy and the bad argument, I legit don't understand how grand juries would possibly be argued to be undemocratic in the first place.

Like, what does he want, a national poll before indictment?


Candidate got electoral votes --> bad things happening to him is undemocratic is the long story short I think.


Okay... There's no universe in which that actually makes sense though right?

I'm with you on the main point, I'd rather we cover how the arguments are bad before we cover possible hypocrisy connected to them, it's a more sound approach
No will to live, no wish to die
DarkPlasmaBall
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States46705 Posts
August 04 2017 22:38 GMT
#166071
Donald Trump is coming to New Jersey for vacation. For 17 days: http://newjersey.news12.com/story/36066785/president-trump-begins-17-day-vacation-in-new-jersey

America: When the president vacations in your state for longer than your governor governs there.

"There is nothing more satisfying than looking at a crowd of people and helping them get what I love." ~Day[9] Daily #100
Gahlo
Profile Joined February 2010
United States35174 Posts
August 04 2017 22:40 GMT
#166072
On August 05 2017 07:25 Nebuchad wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 05 2017 07:05 Mohdoo wrote:
On August 05 2017 06:59 Karis Vas Ryaar wrote:
https://twitter.com/thehill/status/893569255354109952


I hate arguments like this. Something being democratic does not automatically make it "good". Something being undemocratic does not automatically make it "bad". Police are not democratic. School is not democratic. There are a billion of instances in criminal justice where it is not democratic.

A pathetic, shitty strawman.


On top of the hypocrisy and the bad argument, I legit don't understand how grand juries would possibly be argued to be undemocratic in the first place.

Like, what does he want, a national poll before indictment?

Then you'd have people arguing for a system to make people from smaller states count more.
IgnE
Profile Joined November 2010
United States7684 Posts
August 04 2017 22:52 GMT
#166073
grand juries have like a 98% indictment rate so thats a possible argument
It is terrible to die of thirst at sea. Must you so salt your truth that it will no longer even slake thirst?
ZerOCoolSC2
Profile Blog Joined February 2015
9077 Posts
August 04 2017 22:53 GMT
#166074
A federal jury in Brooklyn, N.Y., has convicted former pharmaceutical executive and "pharma bro" Martin Shkreli of securities fraud.

He was found guilty Friday on three counts — two counts of securities fraud and one count of conspiracy to commit securities fraud — out of a total of eight counts. Shkreli is best known for increasing the price of a life-saving drug for people with AIDS by 5,000 percent, from $13.50 to $750 per pill, when he was head of Turing Pharmaceuticals.

Shkreli has not been sentenced and faces up to 20 years in prison, as WSHU's Charles Lane tells our Newscast unit. Still, he declared victory when he was acquitted of what he termed the most "important charges."

"After the verdict was read, Shkreli and his lawyer said they were pleased and anticipated a light sentencing with minimal fines and no jail time," Lane reported. "During the trial, Shkreli openly mocked prosecutors and ultimately never took the stand in his defense."

Source
I just want that damn Wu-Tang album
KwarK
Profile Blog Joined July 2006
United States44448 Posts
August 04 2017 22:56 GMT
#166075
His defence there was amusing. It was essentially "yeah, I was running a Ponzi scheme to fund my wild degen Wall St bets but then I won big and paid them all back so what's the big deal?"
ModeratorThe angels have the phone box
Gorsameth
Profile Joined April 2010
Netherlands22703 Posts
August 04 2017 22:56 GMT
#166076
On August 05 2017 07:52 IgnE wrote:
grand juries have like a 98% indictment rate so thats a possible argument

Could that be because they are not formed until solid proof has already been found?
It ignores such insignificant forces as time, entropy, and death
farvacola
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United States18876 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-08-04 22:59:41
August 04 2017 22:59 GMT
#166077
The standard for a true bill is also really low, so I think it's a mix. Frankly, the only real problem I see with grand juries deals with their treatment of the cops. Beyond that, they tend to get a bad rap because of how cloak and dagger they seem, though most folks don't understand that preliminary exams are mostly the same thing in front of a judge instead of a grand jury.
"when the Dead Kennedys found out they had skinhead fans, they literally wrote a song titled 'Nazi Punks Fuck Off'"
Saryph
Profile Joined April 2010
United States1955 Posts
August 04 2017 23:06 GMT
#166078
Would you even care if he was guilty? - Fox News

WOULD YOU EVEN CARE IF HE WAS GUILTY?

The stock market is up, unemployment is down and the economy seems to be picking up some steam. The streets are mostly safe, the nation is mostly secure and the world is mostly at peace.

So does it matter to you whether or not the president is a crook? The answer for a lot of Americans may be no.

With the revelation that a grand jury is looking at evidence against members of President Trump’s 2016 campaign team, we move closer still to the possibility that someone could be in very big trouble.

Special Counsel Robert Mueller and his squad are moving fast, and the likelihood that some charges will be brought can no longer be ignored. It is not hard to imagine a moment in the very near future where some associate of the president is in the dock, charged with misdeeds relating to Russian interference in the 2016 election.

But, again, we ask: Would it matter to you?
...
DarkPlasmaBall
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States46705 Posts
August 04 2017 23:09 GMT
#166079
Oh fuck you, Fox News.
"There is nothing more satisfying than looking at a crowd of people and helping them get what I love." ~Day[9] Daily #100
KwarK
Profile Blog Joined July 2006
United States44448 Posts
August 04 2017 23:10 GMT
#166080
That's the peak of Fox News doublethink.

Firstly, economy picking up some steam? Ah yes, because the 8 years of economic growth and the doubling of the stock market wasn't enough but now Trump has taken over the economy has finally picked up steam. And that 60% unemployment rate or whatever that Trump was talking about? Well he added 200k jobs and now we're at full employment. Things are good. Everyone praise Trump. And the streets are safe. Not like last year when he was insisting that rape gangs of immigrants were murdering everyone. Now it's fine.

Secondly, does it matter if the President conspired with a foreign power to change the result of the election? Well, yes, yes it does.
ModeratorThe angels have the phone box
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