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Read the rules in the OP before posting, please.

In order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a re-read to refresh your memory! The vast majority of you are contributing in a healthy way, keep it up!

NOTE: When providing a source, explain why you feel it is relevant and what purpose it adds to the discussion if it's not obvious.
Also take note that unsubstantiated tweets/posts meant only to rekindle old arguments can result in a mod action.
GreenHorizons
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States23610 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-04-12 23:31:02
April 12 2017 23:25 GMT
#146581
On April 13 2017 07:35 LegalLord wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 13 2017 06:49 GreenHorizons wrote:
On April 13 2017 06:37 LegalLord wrote:
Trump according to Trump is the best president we've had in ages. Look how much he resolved in just 80ish days.

Woohoo! Arbiter now!


If Trump makes it 4 years that means when we finally finish his first 100 days, we'll only have about 13 and half more periods like this to go.

Judging by the news, bombing Syria once earns him about three days of reprieve from criticism for being too close to Russia. By that metric I think we need about 450 more of these to keep the media-based Russia investigation buried in the news cycle.


Bombing Assad's assets* maybe, we've been dropping bombs in Syria for a while now, Obama and Trump. But it's looking like Trump could have Putin in Gitmo and Democrats would be bringing up stories about how it's a cover for Putin personally building Nukes in Cuba's underground network.

EDIT: Then the Sally Yates and Louise Mench's would find a way to tie Bernie's Cuba video as a signal to a then rising KGB Putin who had a clandestine meeting with Sanders in 1988 setting this all in motion. Oh yeah, BLM is Russian propaganda too.
"People like to look at history and think 'If that was me back then, I would have...' We're living through history, and the truth is, whatever you are doing now is probably what you would have done then" "Scratch a Liberal..."
LegalLord
Profile Blog Joined April 2013
United States13779 Posts
April 12 2017 23:29 GMT
#146582
On April 13 2017 08:25 GreenHorizons wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 13 2017 07:35 LegalLord wrote:
On April 13 2017 06:49 GreenHorizons wrote:
On April 13 2017 06:37 LegalLord wrote:
Trump according to Trump is the best president we've had in ages. Look how much he resolved in just 80ish days.

Woohoo! Arbiter now!


If Trump makes it 4 years that means when we finally finish his first 100 days, we'll only have about 13 and half more periods like this to go.

Judging by the news, bombing Syria once earns him about three days of reprieve from criticism for being too close to Russia. By that metric I think we need about 450 more of these to keep the media-based Russia investigation buried in the news cycle.


Bombing Assad's assets* maybe, we've been dropping bombs in Syria for a while now, Obama and Trump. But it's looking like Trump could have Putin in Gitmo and Democrats would be bringing up stories about how it's a cover for Putin personally building Nukes in Cuba's underground network.

They're locked in a trap where they need it to be Russia who lost them the election, because admitting a failure to win over the voters they needed at every level of government is not possible.
History will sooner or later sweep the European Union away without mercy.
Danglars
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States12133 Posts
April 12 2017 23:31 GMT
#146583
On April 13 2017 07:30 a_flayer wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 13 2017 07:21 Danglars wrote:
On April 13 2017 05:46 Wulfey_LA wrote:
On April 13 2017 05:41 GreenHorizons wrote:
Are we close enough to another cold war for Democrats to drop the Trump is Russia's stooge stuff?


Every new piece of classified information that comes out reveals deeper ties. The new AP reports of Manafort really getting paid according to the Ukranian black book, the Page FISA warrant, Nunes distractions just being a heap of lies. Why do you want to sweep this under the rug? Why not let the investigation into Russian interference continue?

EDIT: just today we have Trump hinting at a lack of confidence in Comey. What will it take before you realize the value of these investigations? Foreign interference matters, lets find out.

"No, it's not too late," Trump said when Maria Bartiromo asked if it was too late to fire Comey. "But you know I have confidence in him. We’ll see what happens. It’s going to be interesting."


http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/trump-not-too-late-fire-comey

I think GH is talking the leak-section, which is pretty intent on finding more and more smoke and only hints of fires. The investigation itself is fine. Nunes actually found something mostly unrelated to Russia that might involve conspiracy to unmask and leak. I'm waiting for the investigation into that too. Right now, the better move is to focus on all the awful things he's doing and plans to do and not put the investigation cart before the horse.

To GH, Democrats are too invested in weekly Red Scare news to stop now. It's too connected to illegitimate president narratives and whatever you want to call the big-baddie literally-Hitler narrative.

Please, Hitler wasn't so bad. A spokesman for the American government told me this, so it must be true.

One of his worst flubs if we eliminate totally awful spin acts he's forced to do as part of his job. Doubly funny to hear the crowd that went overboard on holocaust denier allegations.
Great armies come from happy zealots, and happy zealots come from California!
TL+ Member
{CC}StealthBlue
Profile Blog Joined January 2003
United States41117 Posts
April 13 2017 00:52 GMT
#146584
A former foreign policy adviser to Donald Trump’s campaign whose communications reportedly were monitored by the FBI over suspicions he was acting as an agent of a foreign power refused to disclose who brought him onto the team in a Wednesday interview.

Carter Page’s connection to the Trump campaign received renewed attention after the Washington Post reported Tuesday that the FBI and Justice Department obtained a Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act warrant last summer to keep track of his communications. Asked repeatedly by CNN’s Jake Tapper to “clear things up” by sharing the name of the individual who brought him onto the Trump team, Page demurred, saying he wanted to protect that person’s “privacy.”

“Was it Paul Manafort?” Tapper asked, referring to Trump’s former campaign chairman.

“It was not Paul Manafort,” Page replied. “I’ve never met Paul Manafort and I’ve never spoken with him. Again, out of respect to their privacy, if I told you a name, Jake, there would be dozens of phone calls on that individual’s phone within the next ten minutes.”

“Was it Sam Clovis?” Tapper pressed, referring to a top campaign policy adviser.

“I have no comment,” Page said, insisting the person’s name was “not relevant.”

“Someone was trying to bring you into the campaign, I’m trying to find out who it was,” Tapper said.

“It’s an irrelevant person,” Page said.

“He was not the first person that brought me in,” he added, presumably referring to Clovis. “I can assure you of that.”

“At least we know it was a man,” Tapper snarked.

Page previously made headlines for confirming that he met briefly with Russian ambassador Sergey Kislyak during the 2016 Republican National Convention in Cleveland, and also confirming that he met with and passed documents to a Russian intelligence operative in 2013.

“I didn’t want to be a spy,” Page told ABC News after his 2013 meeting was first made public last week. “I’m not a spy.”

The Trump team has sought to diminish its relationship with Page, who left the campaign in September 2016. An anonymous GOP source close to the White House, and Page himself, both insisted to NBC News that Page actually never met Trump. The GOP source also said Page had no official title, was never on staff and received no compensation for his role.

This information conflicts with Page’s conversation with Tapper, in which he accepted the premise that some individual brought him onto the Trump campaign in an advisory role.


Source
"Smokey, this is not 'Nam, this is bowling. There are rules."
ShoCkeyy
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
7815 Posts
April 13 2017 01:13 GMT
#146585
Anybody worrying about the NK news? Seems like this time it's really happening.
Life?
zlefin
Profile Blog Joined October 2012
United States7689 Posts
April 13 2017 01:23 GMT
#146586
On April 13 2017 10:13 ShoCkeyy wrote:
Anybody worrying about the NK news? Seems like this time it's really happening.

I haven't heard much new about it; so I'm not worrying.
anything real is unlikely to happen, as there's far too many people who truly understand the risks in the situation.
Great read: http://shorensteincenter.org/news-coverage-2016-general-election/ great book on democracy: http://press.princeton.edu/titles/10671.html zlefin is grumpier due to long term illness. Ignoring some users.
GreenHorizons
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States23610 Posts
April 13 2017 01:38 GMT
#146587
On April 13 2017 10:23 zlefin wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 13 2017 10:13 ShoCkeyy wrote:
Anybody worrying about the NK news? Seems like this time it's really happening.

I haven't heard much new about it; so I'm not worrying.
anything real is unlikely to happen, as there's far too many people who truly understand the risks in the situation.


It's a free for all, whoever convinces Trump of whatever gets him to sign off on it. Some things it doesn't matter how many people know better if Trump has already done something.

The travel ban comes to mind. Dozens of people that would have told him why he shouldn't do that were either bypassed or ignored. I wouldn't count on saner minds automatically preventing Trump from doing something that could start a war. I mean it's just a matter of time before some reporter tells Trump some insult coming out of North Korea Trump responds in kind and Kimmie does something a crazy spoiled man child despot might do.
"People like to look at history and think 'If that was me back then, I would have...' We're living through history, and the truth is, whatever you are doing now is probably what you would have done then" "Scratch a Liberal..."
zlefin
Profile Blog Joined October 2012
United States7689 Posts
April 13 2017 01:50 GMT
#146588
The Korea situation is sufficiently sensitive, and the military knows it; they won't start a war recklessly regardless of hwat trump says. It isn't the same as syria.
Great read: http://shorensteincenter.org/news-coverage-2016-general-election/ great book on democracy: http://press.princeton.edu/titles/10671.html zlefin is grumpier due to long term illness. Ignoring some users.
Mohdoo
Profile Joined August 2007
United States15736 Posts
April 13 2017 02:18 GMT
#146589
If Trump actually ends up trading currency manipulator status for NK, I will be impressed and will tip my fedora at m'basedemporerking
{CC}StealthBlue
Profile Blog Joined January 2003
United States41117 Posts
April 13 2017 02:22 GMT
#146590
Aug. 19 was an eventful day for Paul Manafort.

That morning, he stepped down from guiding Donald J. Trump’s presidential campaign, after a brief tenure during which Mr. Trump won the Republican nomination, Democrats’ emails were hacked and the campaign’s contacts with Russia came under scrutiny. Dogged by revelations about past financial dealings in Ukraine, Mr. Manafort retreated from public view.

But behind the scenes, he was busy with other matters. Papers were recorded that same day creating a shell company controlled by Mr. Manafort that soon received $13 million in loans from two businesses with ties to Mr. Trump, including one that partners with a Ukrainian-born billionaire and another led by a Trump economic adviser. They were among $20 million in loans secured by properties belonging to Mr. Manafort and his wife.

The purpose of the loans is unstated in public records, although at least some of them appear to be part of an effort by Mr. Manafort to stave off a personal financial crisis stemming from failed investments with his son-in-law.

The transactions raise a number of questions, including whether Mr. Manafort’s decision to turn to Trump-connected lenders was related to his role in the campaign, where he had agreed to serve for free.

They also shine a light on the rich real estate portfolio that Mr. Manafort acquired during and after the years he worked in Ukraine. Mr. Manafort, often using shell companies, invested millions of dollars in various properties, including apartments and condos in New York, homes in Florida and Virginia and luxury houses in Los Angeles.

Mr. Manafort’s ties to Ukraine and Russia have come under scrutiny as federal officials investigate Russian meddling in the American presidential election. Investigators are known to have examined aspects of his finances, including bank accounts he had in the secretive tax haven of Cyprus; there is no indication his recent loans are part of the inquiry.

The source of the money for the real estate purchases is not clear, and Mr. Manafort never filed lobbying registrations for his work in Ukraine that would have disclosed his compensation. Such registrations are necessary for activities that involve influencing policy and public opinion in the United States, and some of Mr. Manafort’s Ukraine work appeared to fall into that category. Anti-corruption officials in Ukraine say $12.7 million in “off the books” cash payments were earmarked for him in a handwritten ledger kept by the political party of the deposed strongman Viktor F. Yanukovych.

Last month, a Ukrainian lawmaker released documents that appeared to corroborate one of the ledger entries, and on Wednesday The Associated Press reported confirmation of another payment. The two payments in 2007 and 2009, totaling $1.2 million, were routed through shell companies in Belize to a bank account in Virginia belonging to Mr. Manafort’s consulting firm.

Mr. Manafort has previously claimed the ledger is a fake. On Wednesday, he issued a statement that did not dispute the ledger entries, but suggested that any payments he received were legal because they were not made in cash.

“Mr. Manafort has always denied that he ever received any cash payments for his work and has consistently maintained that he received all of his payments, for services rendered, through wire transfers conducted through the international banking system,” the statement said.

Separately on Wednesday, a spokesman for Mr. Manafort said he had “received formal guidance recently from the authorities” on the need to register, retroactively, for lobbying work in Ukraine, and was “taking appropriate steps in response.” Mr. Manafort was advised last week that he should file the belated registration within 30 days to come into compliance with the law, according to a person with direct knowledge of conversations between Mr. Manafort’s lawyers and the Justice Department.

One of Mr. Manafort’s recent loans, previously unreported, was for $3.5 million in September from the private lending unit of Spruce Capital, a small New York investment firm that has a Ukrainian connection through the billionaire Alexander Rovt. An American citizen who made his fortune in the privatization of the fertilizer industry in post-Soviet Ukraine and has long done business in that part of the world, Mr. Rovt is a financial backer of Spruce, whose co-founder Joshua Crane has been a developer of Trump hotel projects.

Mr. Crane did not respond to requests for comment. Mr. Rovt, who donated $10,000 to Mr. Trump’s campaign on Election Day — the campaign refunded most of it because it was over the legal maximum of $2,700 — said he had never met Mr. Manafort and was not involved in the loan to him. “I did not recommend him or put the parties together,” Mr. Rovt said in an email provided by his lawyer.

Mr. Manafort declined to answer specific questions about any of his loans, other than to say that they “are personal and all reflect arm’s-length transactions at or above market rates.” He derided the interest that his finances had generated in the news media and among do-it-yourself researchers, some of whom have even set up a website that dissects his loans.


Source
"Smokey, this is not 'Nam, this is bowling. There are rules."
zlefin
Profile Blog Joined October 2012
United States7689 Posts
April 13 2017 02:28 GMT
#146591
On April 13 2017 11:18 Mohdoo wrote:
If Trump actually ends up trading currency manipulator status for NK, I will be impressed and will tip my fedora at m'basedemporerking

that's not gonna happen, it's far too uneven a trade. To get NK, you'd need to do something like give up taiwan.
Great read: http://shorensteincenter.org/news-coverage-2016-general-election/ great book on democracy: http://press.princeton.edu/titles/10671.html zlefin is grumpier due to long term illness. Ignoring some users.
{CC}StealthBlue
Profile Blog Joined January 2003
United States41117 Posts
April 13 2017 02:37 GMT
#146592
I'm going to Florida in 3 weeks...

Florida has entered a state of emergency as firefighters battle more than 100 wildfires that are raging throughout more than 20,000 acres in the state — from the northern border, to the Panhandle, to the southern tip.

Gov. Rick Scott issued the state of emergency order Tuesday, allowing regional and local agencies to redirect their personnel to fight the wildfires and enlisting the help of the Florida National Guard. The order also puts Florida in a position to receive assistance from the federal government.

State officials say less than a month into the spring season, large swaths of South and Central Florida are approaching drought-like conditions.

“This may only get worse as we enter the hotter summer months, and it is crucial that we take every action right now to be prepared,” Scott said Tuesday in a statement.

The state has not seen such active wildfires since 2011, according to the governor’s office.

More than 1,494 wildfires have burned 79,629 acres in Florida so far this year, according to the Florida Forest Service. That is five times the number of acres burned in the same period last year.

The largest active area — the Parliament fire — has damaged the Big Cypress National Preserve in the southern part of the state, burning 41 square miles. This fire started March 18 and is 95 percent contained. The Cowbell fire, also in the Big Cypress National Preserve, has burned nearly 16,000 acres, according to the National Parks Service. That fire, which started March 30, is still growing and is only 11 percent contained.

Florida State Forester Jim Karels told the Tallahassee Democrat that about 90 percent of the fires this have been caused by humans and there is “no end in sight” as they continue to battle the fires. The unusually dry conditions are raising fears there could be a repeat of the historic 1998 wildfires that swept through the state, destroying at least 342 homes and causing an estimated $393 million in damage.

State fire officials said that since then, they have improved their management of controlled burns in a way that reduces the risk of wildfires.

Karels told the NewsHour that fires in urban areas, not the remote Parliament or Cowbell fires, pose the greatest concern because they have the potential to damage critical infrastructure like roads and homes. “The real struggles are in the urban interface areas like in Hernando County, Franklin County, Naples and Martin County. Fires that are threatening evacuation of homes,” he said.


Source
"Smokey, this is not 'Nam, this is bowling. There are rules."
Karis Vas Ryaar
Profile Blog Joined July 2011
United States4396 Posts
April 13 2017 02:39 GMT
#146593
As someone who lived in northern California for years you get used to fires. Just makes the air smokey
"I'm not agreeing with a lot of Virus's decisions but they are working" Tasteless. Ipl4 Losers Bracket Virus 2-1 Maru
{CC}StealthBlue
Profile Blog Joined January 2003
United States41117 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-04-13 04:00:28
April 13 2017 03:58 GMT
#146594
More proof that Boomer generation will go down as the most selfish and destructive generation in history.

"Smokey, this is not 'Nam, this is bowling. There are rules."
GreenHorizons
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States23610 Posts
April 13 2017 04:39 GMT
#146595
On April 13 2017 12:58 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
More proof that Boomer generation will go down as the most selfish and destructive generation in history.

https://twitter.com/crampell/status/852232657928937472


"Tell Gammy to let us get universal healthcare or we're putting her in the home." -Charlotte Clinton
"People like to look at history and think 'If that was me back then, I would have...' We're living through history, and the truth is, whatever you are doing now is probably what you would have done then" "Scratch a Liberal..."
LegalLord
Profile Blog Joined April 2013
United States13779 Posts
April 13 2017 04:43 GMT
#146596
Still, support for UHC is rather substantial these days. Progress, finally.
History will sooner or later sweep the European Union away without mercy.
GreenHorizons
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States23610 Posts
April 13 2017 04:49 GMT
#146597
On April 13 2017 13:43 LegalLord wrote:
Still, support for UHC is rather substantial these days. Progress, finally.


That's a pretty unfavorable way to ask the question too. There was another poll out recently that had Republicans with a plurality in support.

It's pretty clear UHC is one of those things we want and our politicians don't for.... rea$on$.
"People like to look at history and think 'If that was me back then, I would have...' We're living through history, and the truth is, whatever you are doing now is probably what you would have done then" "Scratch a Liberal..."
WolfintheSheep
Profile Joined June 2011
Canada14127 Posts
April 13 2017 04:52 GMT
#146598
On April 13 2017 12:58 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
More proof that Boomer generation will go down as the most selfish and destructive generation in history.

https://twitter.com/crampell/status/852232657928937472

And this is why young people actually need to vote.
Average means I'm better than half of you.
Yurie
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
12010 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-04-13 05:01:10
April 13 2017 04:57 GMT
#146599
On April 13 2017 13:52 WolfintheSheep wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 13 2017 12:58 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
More proof that Boomer generation will go down as the most selfish and destructive generation in history.

https://twitter.com/crampell/status/852232657928937472

And this is why young people actually need to vote.


It is an interesting subject on how to complete that goal though. Maybe enforced compulsory voting might be a decent idea for a few elections to promote the culture?

A way to do it without adding direct costs to the government could be to deny passports and social security or similar subsidies if not voting or submitting a reason of why one can not.
Karis Vas Ryaar
Profile Blog Joined July 2011
United States4396 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-04-13 05:05:23
April 13 2017 05:04 GMT
#146600
I'm all for automatic voter registration but thats not politically viable.

one thing maybe is more candidates who are younger.
"I'm not agreeing with a lot of Virus's decisions but they are working" Tasteless. Ipl4 Losers Bracket Virus 2-1 Maru
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