|
Read the rules in the OP before posting, please.In order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a re-read to refresh your memory! The vast majority of you are contributing in a healthy way, keep it up! NOTE: When providing a source, explain why you feel it is relevant and what purpose it adds to the discussion if it's not obvious. Also take note that unsubstantiated tweets/posts meant only to rekindle old arguments can result in a mod action. |
On July 25 2016 23:23 Mohdoo wrote:
I feel like Bernie is better poised to win than Clinton at this point. Would the DNC dumping Clinton not be a good thing at this point? I would argue this could make Bernie way more viable than he was previously. The victim of corruption who everyone replied in favor of. Somewhat poetic. It doesn't matter if there's no evidence of directly shredding Bernie documents or something. The headline happened and all the headline readers of our country have made up their mind.
Do you have any idea what would happen if they gave the nomination to Bernie? The people who voted for Clinton would be pissed and revolt. There would be a new round of digging into his past by the RNC. He wouldn't have the public mandate or majority vote. The only reason his wife’s debacle of managing and sinking college isn’t front and center due to him not winning.
Of course he seems more viable. If he had won, who’s servers do you think would have been hacked? Do you think his staff’s emails were polite and fluffy, saying totally not terrible shit about Clinton?
This is politics, it’s up and down. We are a long way from November and people have been in the lead now and lost in amazing fashion. Remember that huge number of voters do not make up their mind until late October. A large number make up their mind the day off the election.
|
I would recommend reading more than the just the headlines. In a nutshell, if there was REAL evidence of conspiracy rather than a few derogatory emails, it would be the actual headlines vs. stuff calling Weaver an asshole.
I'm pretty sure Bernie understands the emails and why they said those things. I'd be curious to see the kind of stuff his campaign has said internally. I'd speculate that there are probably some inappropriate things about certain officials.
|
On July 25 2016 23:02 shabby wrote:
Hell, if I were him I'd even resign from the democratic party. What a bunch of twats
Ideologically Bernie is closer to the Green Party than to the Democrats and he knows that. He also knows that nominally being a Democrat is the only way for him to get enough visibility for people to actually vote for him.
|
United States42978 Posts
On July 25 2016 23:23 Mohdoo wrote:
I feel like Bernie is better poised to win than Clinton at this point. Would the DNC dumping Clinton not be a good thing at this point? I would argue this could make Bernie way more viable than he was previously. The victim of corruption who everyone replied in favor of. Somewhat poetic. It doesn't matter if there's no evidence of directly shredding Bernie documents or something. The headline happened and all the headline readers of our country have made up their mind.
Yeah except the party voted for Clinton. If the party had voted for Bernie, he became the presumptive nominee, Clinton endorsed him and then after a bad story he got dumped in favour of Clinton can you imagine the outrage from GH and the like? There is a strong suggestion from many people in this topic that Clinton isn't the candidate they want, just the candidate that they have. But for an awful lot of people Clinton is the candidate that they want, and that includes the majority of the Democratic party. She won, and not just with superdelegates.
|
On July 25 2016 23:34 KwarK wrote:
But for an awful lot of people Clinton is the candidate that they want, and that includes the majority of the Democratic party. She won, and not just with superdelegates.
To be fair, for a lot of people who voted for Hillary, she's not the candidate they want, just that Bernie isn't either.
|
On July 25 2016 23:35 TheYango wrote:Show nested quote +On July 25 2016 23:34 KwarK wrote:
But for an awful lot of people Clinton is the candidate that they want, and that includes the majority of the Democratic party. She won, and not just with superdelegates. To be fair, for a lot of people who voted for Hillary, she's not the candidate they want, just that Bernie isn't either.
I don’t think they would be super pumped if the DNC just invalidated their vote because the election got hard and some bad polling arrived. I don’t think that would earn them any loyalty. Just like if Bernie takes a dump on the DNC during his speech and denounces Clinton, he will end any chances for him to effect the change he wants.
|
On July 25 2016 23:34 KwarK wrote:Show nested quote +On July 25 2016 23:23 Mohdoo wrote:
I feel like Bernie is better poised to win than Clinton at this point. Would the DNC dumping Clinton not be a good thing at this point? I would argue this could make Bernie way more viable than he was previously. The victim of corruption who everyone replied in favor of. Somewhat poetic. It doesn't matter if there's no evidence of directly shredding Bernie documents or something. The headline happened and all the headline readers of our country have made up their mind. Yeah except the party voted for Clinton. If the party had voted for Bernie, he became the presumptive nominee, Clinton endorsed him and then after a bad story he got dumped in favour of Clinton can you imagine the outrage from GH and the like? There is a strong suggestion from many people in this topic that Clinton isn't the candidate they want, just the candidate that they have. But for an awful lot of people Clinton is the candidate that they want, and that includes the majority of the Democratic party. She won, and not just with superdelegates.
Well then I hope Bernie's meeting with delegates and his following speech are an extremely convincing endorsement of Clinton. If this is the road were on, let's give ourselves the best shot. I fully realize it's not nearly as bad as headlines indicate. But most people just read headlines and don't even open articles. People are really, really stupid.
|
On July 25 2016 23:35 TheYango wrote:Show nested quote +On July 25 2016 23:34 KwarK wrote:
But for an awful lot of people Clinton is the candidate that they want, and that includes the majority of the Democratic party. She won, and not just with superdelegates. To be fair, for a lot of people who voted for Hillary, she's not the candidate they want, just that Bernie isn't either.
She's not perfect, but she's plenty good enough. Expecting her to be perfect is the equivalent of expecting love at first sight - plus, this is politics not dating.
On July 25 2016 23:38 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On July 25 2016 23:35 TheYango wrote:On July 25 2016 23:34 KwarK wrote:
But for an awful lot of people Clinton is the candidate that they want, and that includes the majority of the Democratic party. She won, and not just with superdelegates. To be fair, for a lot of people who voted for Hillary, she's not the candidate they want, just that Bernie isn't either. I don’t think they would be super pumped if the DNC just invalidated their vote because the election got hard and some bad polling arrived. I don’t think that would earn them any loyalty. Just like if Bernie takes a dump on the DNC during his speech and denounces Clinton, he will end any chances for him to effect the change he wants.
If that were the RNC thought, they would have dumped Trump for Kasich. 
I am rather sad that this Trump surge has not been reflected in the odds market. I'm not able to get as many shares as I thought I would be getting.
|
United States42978 Posts
On July 25 2016 23:39 Mohdoo wrote:
But most people just read headlines and don't even open articles. People are really, really stupid.
Most people won't remember this by election day.
|
On July 25 2016 23:38 Plansix wrote:
I don’t think they would be super pumped if the DNC just invalidated their vote because the election got hard and some bad polling arrived. I don’t think that would earn them any loyalty. Just like if Bernie takes a dump on the DNC during his speech and denounces Clinton, he will end any chances for him to effect the change he wants.
Sure, I agree with that.
|
On July 25 2016 23:41 KwarK wrote:Show nested quote +On July 25 2016 23:39 Mohdoo wrote:
But most people just read headlines and don't even open articles. People are really, really stupid. Most people won't remember this by election day.
Even from this side of the globe I know they have plenty of things to remember about Clinton.
|
On July 25 2016 23:44 Clonester wrote:Show nested quote +On July 25 2016 23:41 KwarK wrote:On July 25 2016 23:39 Mohdoo wrote:
But most people just read headlines and don't even open articles. People are really, really stupid. Most people won't remember this by election day. Even from this side of the globe I know they have plenty of things to remember about Clinton.
If Clinton was a Republican, the same people that rally blindly behind her would be asking for her head after her job as a secretary of state (and Obama's for that matter).
|
United States42978 Posts
On July 25 2016 23:44 Clonester wrote:Show nested quote +On July 25 2016 23:41 KwarK wrote:On July 25 2016 23:39 Mohdoo wrote:
But most people just read headlines and don't even open articles. People are really, really stupid. Most people won't remember this by election day. Even from this side of the globe I know they have plenty of things to remember about Clinton.
People like myself don't decide elections. A lot of people who give a shit and are paying attention already know who they're voting for and pretty much nothing will make them change. And I think most informed people are within that group, if you know what the two stand for and you know what you stand for then you can pick pretty easily. Both sides always have a ton of these voters because they wouldn't exist as a party if they couldn't reliably get 40% of the popular vote with a cardboard cutout as a candidate. The votes that actually decide it, the ones which are up for grabs for both sides, are the people who aren't really paying attention imo.
|
On July 25 2016 23:10 ticklishmusic wrote:Show nested quote +On July 25 2016 22:53 xDaunt wrote:On July 25 2016 22:27 ticklishmusic wrote:On July 25 2016 19:43 TMagpie wrote:
So the big story is that the guy not liked by fellow democrats was not actually liked by fellow democrats and the person suspected of wanting to help Hilary get into office now works directly with Hilary to get her into office?
That's the big story? Pretty much. I am still waiting for actual evidence of bias in actual conduct of business, though people would rather be condescending and outraged about it. Pretty much par for the course. Worth adding, Eva Longoria was Obama's 2012 honorary chair. The position pays zero dollars. It sounds like a lot more than it actually is, though I expect the Clinton campaign to make DWS useful in some way. She's a useful idiot, hopefully she starts being the useful part ore than the idiot part. It's not the direct compensation of the position that matters. It's the connections that the position affords that matter. This is why appointments to the boards of federal commissions are so sought after. This is also why the DNC is now going to get into trouble for awarding these positions to donors (not that we ever expected that anything else was happening on either side of the aisle). The actual email says: Show nested quote +Any folks who you’d like to be considered to be on the board of (for example) USPS, NEA, NEH. Basically anyone who has a niche interest and might like to serve on the board of one of these orgs. It seems like they're reaching into their network for people who might be good fits for these positions? Perish the thought. If I happen to know someone who I had a good working relationship with and there was a position I knew about where they'd be a good fit, I might recommend them. These folks donated, yes, but most of them are going to pretty qualified for these positions. There's going to be some more egregious cases of nepotism, and that's wrong. However, it's a fact of life. Relationships are important, though they shouldn't be all the end all be all. For example, I work 60 hours a week (I love my job, usually) and I do a pretty solid job, paid pretty decently as well. As part of my responsibilities, I have access to all the salaries of our employees, or a pretty good estimate. We have a guy who graduated last year with a degree in politics, his dad happens to be in the C-suite. Although he's not particularly qualified, he's a "project manager" and makes a decent bit more than me. He's in the office less than 40 hrs a week, and I'm not exactly sure what project he manages. Does it suck? Yes. But I understand why that's a thing though I wish it weren't.
You work too much buddy.
|
On July 25 2016 23:50 GoTuNk! wrote:Show nested quote +On July 25 2016 23:44 Clonester wrote:On July 25 2016 23:41 KwarK wrote:On July 25 2016 23:39 Mohdoo wrote:
But most people just read headlines and don't even open articles. People are really, really stupid. Most people won't remember this by election day. Even from this side of the globe I know they have plenty of things to remember about Clinton. If Clinton was a Republican, the same people that rally blindly behind her would be asking for her head after her job as a secretary of state (and Obama's for that matter).
Perhaps if you were American or otherwise had some kind of substantive interaction with the United States, you'd be better at posing empty hypotheticals.
|
On July 25 2016 23:41 KwarK wrote:Show nested quote +On July 25 2016 23:39 Mohdoo wrote:
But most people just read headlines and don't even open articles. People are really, really stupid. Most people won't remember this by election day.
Normally I'd agree, but this is a little different than something like plagiarizing a speech or putting a foot in one's mouth. This is something that has antagonized a huge chunk of the democrat electorate (specifically, the politically active chunk) in a way that is not easily repaired.
I wonder what the DNC and Hillary are offering Bernie right now to get his followers back in line.
|
The more I think about it,the more I think that tim kaine is a bad pick.
Its the safe pick,the pick you make when you are sure that you are going to win the election. Clinton still does not see the real danger of the republican ticket.
And like others have said,this election is anything but your ordinary election. A "safe" and conservative ticket wont win you the election in November. The polarization in the country has gone to far for that.
Think Clinton should have gone all in on warren,hammering the supposed weak spot trump has with women. Clinton herself is unable to do so because she got to much dirt hanging around her,warren would be perfect.
Maybe tim kaine will surprise us positively but don't have high hopes for that.
The democrats gloating about the supposed chaotic state of the republican party a few months ago can now start reflecting on the state their own party is in. Trump is sitting and watching it fall apart,doesnt have to do anything.
Will the democratic convention be able to unify behind Clinton? it seems more doubtfull with every passing day.
But they don't have a choice, it now is Clinton or bust.
|
On July 25 2016 23:58 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On July 25 2016 23:41 KwarK wrote:On July 25 2016 23:39 Mohdoo wrote:
But most people just read headlines and don't even open articles. People are really, really stupid. Most people won't remember this by election day. Normally I'd agree, but this is a little different than something like plagiarizing a speech or putting a foot in one's mouth. This is something that has antagonized a huge chunk of the democrat electorate (specifically, the politically active chunk) in a way that is not easily repaired. I wonder what the DNC and Hillary are offering Bernie right now to get his followers back in line.
If they were politically active they would know how the politics works and they would not be making these ridiculous statements.
They give the complete opposite vibe to me. A bunch of people who only now got into the system and are having a hard reality check.
|
Bernie supporters would still be insane to vote for Trump and I think they probably know that.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
