EPTUS Politics Mega-thread - Page 2277
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Read the rules in the OP before posting, please. In order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a re-read to refresh your memory! The vast majority of you are contributing in a healthy way, keep it up! NOTE: When providing a source, explain why you feel it is relevant and what purpose it adds to the discussion if it's not obvious. Also take note that unsubstantiated tweets/posts meant only to rekindle old arguments can result in a mod action. | ||
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{CC}StealthBlue
United States41117 Posts
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Mohdoo
United States15398 Posts
On September 09 2015 13:42 {CC}StealthBlue wrote: Jeb Bush looked terrified during the entire interview with Colbert. I think he realizes his image is in shambles and he's essentially running on funding alone. I look forward to being able to watch this interview once it's online. | ||
Fighter
Korea (South)1531 Posts
On September 09 2015 13:58 Mohdoo wrote: I think he realizes his image is in shambles and he's essentially running on funding alone. I look forward to being able to watch this interview once it's online. Damn was that tonight? Would love if someone could post a link to a vod once it goes up! (or point me where to look :p) | ||
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Introvert
United States4659 Posts
edit: oh we passed it by phew | ||
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writer22816
United States5775 Posts
On September 09 2015 10:21 Chewbacca. wrote: Psh. Average salary for a Seattle teacher is ~50k according to google, and they get way more time off than your average worker. Hard to side with them on this strike.. You don't think teachers are underpaid? 50k after going through college + grad school is mind-boggling low. I'm a rising undergraduate senior in college majoring in CS and my internship this summer paid double that. I know a lot of teachers aren't in it for the money but I personally see no problem with them campaigning for a wage that's more consistent with their qualifications and their contributions to society. | ||
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Slaughter
United States20254 Posts
Teachers overall do seem to be underpaid and have low prestige despite how important their jobs are. | ||
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DarkPlasmaBall
United States43793 Posts
Broken down by state, over a few decades, if curious: https://nces.ed.gov/programs/digest/d13/tables/dt13_211.60.asp I'm fortunate enough to live in New Jersey, where our teachers are some of the best paid in the country... of course, on the other hand, our absurdly high taxes and cost/ standard of living balances that out! EDIT: If one wishes to talk about prestige, it's certainly one of lower prestige in this country ("Those who can't do, teach"; parents frequently siding with their children over teachers; etc.), whereas many other countries with better educational systems give educators a much higher cultural level of respect and gratitude. | ||
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IgnE
United States7681 Posts
On September 09 2015 10:21 Chewbacca. wrote: Psh. Average salary for a Seattle teacher is ~50k according to google, and they get way more time off than your average worker. Hard to side with them on this strike.. Psh. They should take their $40k starting salary and be happy. It's a dream to work with kids all day and they get summers off! It's like they work 6 hour days. | ||
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
On September 09 2015 20:35 IgnE wrote: Psh. They should take their $40k starting salary and be happy. It's a dream to work with kids all day and they get summers off! It's like they work 6 hour days. I cannot tell which of these is sarcastic. But teachers should be paid more just for the sheer number of children they need to manage and care for. That is on top of the amount of education they are required to get compared to any other profession out there as similar pay. And dealing with shitty kids shitty parents should warrant some level of hazard pay. | ||
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Sermokala
United States13738 Posts
Teachers unions have not had a good string of luck with strikes recently. | ||
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
On September 09 2015 22:29 Sermokala wrote: I never understood why teachers summers weren't filled with training and education for the teachers. Would justify paying them a fair years wage and help them with their jobs as some sort of offseason. Teachers unions have not had a good string of luck with strikes recently. Well they don’t get paid a full year’s wage. They take their salary over the summer, but their pay is only for the time they worked. And they are required to educate themselves during the summer and take additional classes on teaching. Every teacher in the US is required to attend a specific number of classes to stay licensed. And the main problem with teachers unions(in general, there are a lot of unions nation wide and they are not all the same) is the are focused on preserving jobs for the teachers and the teachers rights, even if it is at odds with the quality of education for the children. And this has been increasing over the years, where they goal is to protect teachers over the students. And when you are at odds with the parents in a school system, its difficult to get support. But then again, there is also the problem of parents and the communities wanting way to much control over their school systems and dictating curriculum, which isn't great either. The top secret plan is to have teachers paid 80K-100K a year, give them high standards and make them difficult, but not impossible to fire. When the pay is that high, the field becomes way more competitive. Which is what we want. | ||
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Mohdoo
United States15398 Posts
On September 09 2015 22:29 Sermokala wrote: I never understood why teachers summers weren't filled with training and education for the teachers. Would justify paying them a fair years wage and help them with their jobs as some sort of offseason. Teachers unions have not had a good string of luck with strikes recently. School should always just be year round. It doesn't make sense for kids to not be in school at all for 3 months. Breaks are good, but an entire season is just madness and makes no sense. | ||
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
On September 10 2015 00:02 Mohdoo wrote: School should always just be year round. It doesn't make sense for kids to not be in school at all for 3 months. Breaks are good, but an entire season is just madness and makes no sense. There is pretty strong evidence that should be the case and long vacations are much better for development. A lot of the development kid do in live has very little to do with lesson plans or even classes. Maybe lengthening school year for the last two years of high school might be effective. | ||
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Stratos_speAr
United States6959 Posts
On September 09 2015 22:29 Sermokala wrote: I never understood why teachers summers weren't filled with training and education for the teachers. Would justify paying them a fair years wage and help them with their jobs as some sort of offseason. Teachers unions have not had a good string of luck with strikes recently. They often are. My cousin is a high school teacher and she is quite busy on the summer. | ||
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ticklishmusic
United States15977 Posts
On September 10 2015 00:08 Plansix wrote: There is pretty strong evidence that should be the case and long vacations are much better for development. A lot of the development kid do in live has very little to do with lesson plans or even classes. Maybe lengthening school year for the last two years of high school might be effective. I'd advocate the opposite-- first couple of years of high school are near round, the second two you have summer break but have to go out and accomplish something. You can get a job or internship, do some real volunteer work, or take summer classes. I think having some sort of real world exposure (if not necessarily experience) would really help a lot of high schoolers. Maybe they'd know not to microwave a can of coup in the microwave... or that you have to add water to ramen noodles before cooking them. | ||
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
On September 10 2015 00:18 ticklishmusic wrote: I'd advocate the opposite-- first couple of years of high school are near round, the second two you have summer break but have to go out and accomplish something. You can get a job or internship, do some real volunteer work, or take summer classes. I think having some sort of real world exposure (if not necessarily experience) would really help a lot of high schoolers. Maybe they'd know not to microwave a can of coup in the microwave... or that you have to add water to ramen noodles before cooking them. Age 14-16 is pretty rough for kids developmentally, which is the problem with that. They have a lot going on with their cognitive abilities, hormones and other basic development. And studies have found that longer school hours and extra work leads to depression and anxiety disorders. We know a lot more about child brain development that we did even 10 years ago and more class room time doesn’t lead to more learning. Maybe longer school years with shorter school days. And of course, there is conflicting evidence with people saying all America kids are fine, even though we lead in the world in childhood depression. | ||
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TheTenthDoc
United States9561 Posts
On September 09 2015 19:41 DarkPlasmaBall wrote: The average (median) salary for a primary/ secondary teacher in any given state is usually around $50-60K, but keep in mind this is not starting salary... this includes the first-year teachers, and this includes those who have been teaching for 30 years. Broken down by state, over a few decades, if curious: https://nces.ed.gov/programs/digest/d13/tables/dt13_211.60.asp No stat can be both the average and median salary, they're different statistics. If it were the median the outliers of first year teachers and 30 year veterans wouldn't matter, though, and the site just says average, so it's probably average. Unless you mean medians and averages generally both break down to that range in other data. But if it's median the outliers won't matter nearly as much (if at all) so it's often more useful when gauging something like this. | ||
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Sermokala
United States13738 Posts
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Chewbacca.
United States3634 Posts
On September 09 2015 20:35 IgnE wrote: Psh. They should take their $40k starting salary and be happy. It's a dream to work with kids all day and they get summers off! It's like they work 6 hour days. You don't become a teacher if you do not like kids. And nobody is claiming teachers work 6 hours a day and have the entire summer off, but they work a hell of a lot less than your average starting engineer or whatever, many of which don't have very high starting salaries either. | ||
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
On September 10 2015 01:05 Chewbacca. wrote: You don't become a teacher if you do not like kids. And nobody is claiming teachers work 6 hours a day and have the entire summer off, but they work a hell of a lot less than your average starting engineer or whatever, many of which don't have very high starting salaries either. I am not sure I agree that teaching 150-300 middle/highshcool kids US history/math/writing isn’t just as hard as any starting engineering job. I’ve never been an engineer, but I’ve worked as a teacher. There is nothing easy about that job and you take a lot of your work home with you. I think one of the major problems with education is that people undervalue the challenge and work required to teach. | ||
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