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Read the rules in the OP before posting, please.In order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a re-read to refresh your memory! The vast majority of you are contributing in a healthy way, keep it up! NOTE: When providing a source, explain why you feel it is relevant and what purpose it adds to the discussion if it's not obvious. Also take note that unsubstantiated tweets/posts meant only to rekindle old arguments can result in a mod action. |
On February 04 2015 11:56 Danglars wrote:Show nested quote +On February 04 2015 11:41 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:A bill funding the Department of Homeland Security failed in the Senate Tuesday because it would block the president's executive action on deportations. The question now is, what will Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell try next?
The department runs out of money on Feb. 27. Texas senator and potential presidential candidate Ted Cruz insists DHS not get any money unless Republicans get to undo the president's immigration policies. That places McConnell in a dilemma — how does he placate Cruz and his allies while avoiding a shutdown of the agency?
Republican Cruz has vowed he will stop at nothing to block the president's executive action on immigration. And when you ask him exactly how he intends to do that, he says it's already in writing. Go look it up.
"I wrote a long op-ed two months ago, laying [out] precisely what we should do. We should use the power of confirmations and we should use the power of the purse," Cruz said as he slipped into an elevator at the Capitol.
His op-ed argues those are the two ways to defeat the president's executive action. Block all nominations, except those vital to national security. And deny funding for Obama's plan to defer deportations for some 5 million immigrants living here illegally.
Problem for Cruz is, he can't actually make either proposal happen.
"If you're a coalition of one or five, you can gum up the works for a little bit of time, but it's very hard to grind the Senate to a halt," said Sarah Binder of the Brookings Institution. Source Congressional leadership has confirmations and the power of the purse. We've already heard McConnell surrender one of those options, not good. I don't see either house or senate stopping this, the response has just been too tepid. Republicans will suffer a big hit not delivering on campaign promises and the dearth of leadership will continue. Outside chance of renegade tea party types bailing on Boehner in big enough numbers to force him into action.
So, question regarding that "power of the purse" thing. How can you block funding for not deporting people? To me that does not sound like something that costs money. Deporting them, that would require policemen, cars, planes, administrative efforts to find out where to deport them to, etc...But not doing any of that should not cost money.
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
On February 04 2015 15:39 coverpunch wrote:Show nested quote +On February 04 2015 15:32 GreenHorizons wrote:On February 04 2015 15:21 coverpunch wrote:On February 04 2015 12:48 Mohdoo wrote:On February 04 2015 12:45 coverpunch wrote:On February 04 2015 12:40 Mohdoo wrote:On February 04 2015 12:15 JonnyBNoHo wrote:On February 04 2015 11:46 Mohdoo wrote:On February 04 2015 11:42 JonnyBNoHo wrote:On February 04 2015 11:32 oneofthem wrote:
[quote]
dude's clearly backtracking. Not really. Did you watch the interview? He said many times that vaccines are great. I expect better of you man. Mental disorders. Mental disorders. Mental disorders. Mental disorders. Mental disorders. Mental disorders. Mental disorders. Mental disorders. Mental disorders. Mental disorders. Mental disorders. Mental disorders. Mental disorders. Mental disorders. Mental disorders. Mental disorders. Mental disorders. Mental disorders. You are consistently refusing to recognize what he said about mental disorders. I'll repost it: "I have heard of many tragic cases of walking, talking normal children who wound up with profound mental disorders after vaccines," Direct quote. Whether he says they are good or not is irrelevant to the point you are avoiding. "Many" tragic cases. He lied by saying he has heard of these cases because it's not real. How are you not getting this? Nice tantrum bro  I know what he said. Children developing mental disorders after vaccination is almost certainly a true statement, since vaccination happens at a young age and mental disorders often take time to either be noticed or manifest. There's also an implied causality there which he later pointed out isn't what he meant. The guy made a poor reference and later corrected himself for it. That happens to everyone, and trying to take a dump on the guy over it is just trollish. Are you actually saying that you believe him when he says that wasn't what he originally meant? In what world would mentioning mental disorders ever have any relevance other than a causation relationship? It's quite obvious he meant it differently from the way you've interpreted and tortured it to look like. So what exactly is it you think he meant? I think he meant exactly what he said he meant in his backpedal - he made a foolish link that sounded and was taken like it implied a causation and that wasn't his point. He was trying to speak out against mandatory regimes of vaccinations and for more parental choice. It was a dumb place to make a stand. He didn't repeat it 18 times in a row like you did before going on to say non scientists shouldn't be allowed any opinion on scientific matters and actually describing a work later declared "utterly false" and retracted as having scientific rigor because it passed peer review, despite the fact that there were a slew of other studies by 2008 challenging the original link as the anti-anti-vaccine had already started. Why would he bring attention to the "temporal" relationship anyway? Speculative but I would guess to illustrate a nanny state forcing vaccines on kids without regard to side effects or medical exemptions, where parents who know their kids' unique issues could make a better choice. But anti-vaxxers are almost never people complaining about side effects or requiring medical exemptions, which is what made it a dumb statement and brought out the outrage.
how is that not a causal argument? what are you even talking about?
NANNY STATE IS FORCING ME TO VACCINE the tyranny
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On February 04 2015 15:21 coverpunch wrote:Show nested quote +On February 04 2015 12:48 Mohdoo wrote:On February 04 2015 12:45 coverpunch wrote:On February 04 2015 12:40 Mohdoo wrote:On February 04 2015 12:15 JonnyBNoHo wrote:On February 04 2015 11:46 Mohdoo wrote:On February 04 2015 11:42 JonnyBNoHo wrote:On February 04 2015 11:32 oneofthem wrote:On February 04 2015 10:31 JonnyBNoHo wrote:On February 04 2015 04:19 oneofthem wrote:
[quote]
the charge isn't that he's anti-vax but he is entertaining the anti-vax position, which is very very far from the CDC info you posted. Eh... in like one fragment of one sentence, sure. He tried to clarify his point today anyways: "I did not say vaccines caused disorders, just that they were temporally related—I did not allege causation. I support vaccines, I receive them myself and I had all of my children vaccinated. In fact, today I received the booster shot for the vaccines I got when I went to Guatemala last year," Paul said in the statement. Link dude's clearly backtracking. Not really. Did you watch the interview? He said many times that vaccines are great. I expect better of you man. Mental disorders. Mental disorders. Mental disorders. Mental disorders. Mental disorders. Mental disorders. Mental disorders. Mental disorders. Mental disorders. Mental disorders. Mental disorders. Mental disorders. Mental disorders. Mental disorders. Mental disorders. Mental disorders. Mental disorders. Mental disorders. You are consistently refusing to recognize what he said about mental disorders. I'll repost it: "I have heard of many tragic cases of walking, talking normal children who wound up with profound mental disorders after vaccines," Direct quote. Whether he says they are good or not is irrelevant to the point you are avoiding. "Many" tragic cases. He lied by saying he has heard of these cases because it's not real. How are you not getting this? Nice tantrum bro I know what he said. Children developing mental disorders after vaccination is almost certainly a true statement, since vaccination happens at a young age and mental disorders often take time to either be noticed or manifest. There's also an implied causality there which he later pointed out isn't what he meant. The guy made a poor reference and later corrected himself for it. That happens to everyone, and trying to take a dump on the guy over it is just trollish. Are you actually saying that you believe him when he says that wasn't what he originally meant? In what world would mentioning mental disorders ever have any relevance other than a causation relationship? It's quite obvious he meant it differently from the way you've interpreted and tortured it to look like. So what exactly is it you think he meant? I think he meant exactly what he said he meant in his backpedal - he made a foolish link that sounded and was taken like it implied a causation and that wasn't his point. He was trying to speak out against mandatory regimes of vaccinations and for more parental choice. It was a dumb place to make a stand. He didn't repeat it 18 times in a row like you did before going on to say non scientists shouldn't be allowed any opinion on scientific matters and actually describing a work later declared "utterly false" and retracted as having scientific rigor because it passed peer review, despite the fact that there were a slew of other studies by 2008 challenging the original link as the anti-anti-vaccine had already started.
The mental gymnastics here are pretty incredible.
You're putting an absurd amount of effort into justifying and playing down his comments when there is no way in hell you'd ever do this for any candidate that wasn't a Republican.
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There was no reason for him to bring up mental disorders except to imply a causal relationship, and no amount of backpedaling can make up for that damage. I'm sure there are people somewhere in this country now saying "Rand Paul acknowledges that vaccines can cause mental disorders." He can't possibly say he is pro-vaccine and mention mental disorders in the same sentence with any intellectual honesty.
My take is that he is pro-vaccine, pro-parent's rights, and was just trying to pander to both sides. Doing that on a public health issue like vaccinations, however, is deplorable. And protection of "parent's rights" should never actively endanger the lives of other children. That's when your rights end.
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Scott Walker Pushing Drug Testing For Welfare Recipients
It didn’t work in Florida, as it was too expensive, and they found that not enough welfare recipients were on drugs. And it’s unconstitutional. It won’t work in Wisconsin.
Medicaid recipients in Wisconsin would be required to undergo drug testing and could be limited in how long they can receive benefits under measures proposed Thursday by Gov. Scott Walker, who is positioning himself as a reformer as he eyes a 2016 presidential run.
Source
If Florida didn't have enough people on drugs to make it fiscally sensible it sure isn't going to make fiscal sense in Wisconsin.
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On January 11 2015 12:51 dAPhREAk wrote:Show nested quote +On January 11 2015 06:51 GreenHorizons wrote:(CNN)George Zimmerman -- the man acquitted by a Florida jury over the death of Trayvon Martin -- was arrested Friday in Florida on suspicion of aggravated assault and domestic violence with a weapon, local authorities said.
The 31-year-old Florida man was arrested by police in Lake Mary around 10 p.m. and booked into the John E. Polk Correctional Facility, according to that facility's website. That facility, like its website, is run by the Seminole County Sheriff's Office.
It all came about after Zimmerman allegedly threw a wine bottle at a girlfriend, his lawyer Don West told reporters.
"Whatever happened took place several days ago," said West. "And, as far as I know, they have not been together for some time, certainly not since then."
Police first learned about it after coming "in contact with the (alleged) victim at a traffic stop," Lake Mary police spokeswoman Bianca Gillett said.
The incident is the latest legal run-in for Zimmerman since his acquittal in July 2012 on a murder charge in the death of Martin, a 17-year-old African-American. In fact, it's his second arrest for alleged domestic violence against a girlfriend -- though Lake Mary police spokeswoman Bianca Gillett said this alleged "victim is not the same (woman) as in 2013."
"It's clear he hasn't been very lucky with the ladies the last few months," West said of his client. SourceTeenage boys were too dangerous so he's moved on to fighting women. I just hope people are at least a bit more skeptical of GZ's telling of the events the night Trayvon was killed by now. Hopefully this one doesn't let him off so he at least won't be running around with a (legal) gun anymore. why would people be more skeptical? he was found not guilty before. also, this is the second domestic violence charges with the first being dropped. i find it interesting that the charges were brought after the victim was pulled over by the police. seems odd. Show nested quote +Lake Mary Police spokeswoman Officer Bianca Gillett said the fight occurred Monday at Zimmerman's Lake Mary residence. Though nobody involved called 911, police found out about the fight when an officer pulled Zimmerman's girlfriend over for a routine traffic stop around 11:50 p.m. Monday, Gillett said.
"The driver stated she was just involved in a domestic altercation with George Zimmerman," Gillett said in a statement. http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/trayvon-martin-george-zimmerman/os-george-zimmerman-arrested-assault-lake-mary-20150110-story.html
zimmerman charges dropped again after witness recants testimony.
http://www.cnn.com/2015/01/30/us/george-zimmerman-no-charges/
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On February 05 2015 06:11 dAPhREAk wrote:Show nested quote +On January 11 2015 12:51 dAPhREAk wrote:On January 11 2015 06:51 GreenHorizons wrote:(CNN)George Zimmerman -- the man acquitted by a Florida jury over the death of Trayvon Martin -- was arrested Friday in Florida on suspicion of aggravated assault and domestic violence with a weapon, local authorities said.
The 31-year-old Florida man was arrested by police in Lake Mary around 10 p.m. and booked into the John E. Polk Correctional Facility, according to that facility's website. That facility, like its website, is run by the Seminole County Sheriff's Office.
It all came about after Zimmerman allegedly threw a wine bottle at a girlfriend, his lawyer Don West told reporters.
"Whatever happened took place several days ago," said West. "And, as far as I know, they have not been together for some time, certainly not since then."
Police first learned about it after coming "in contact with the (alleged) victim at a traffic stop," Lake Mary police spokeswoman Bianca Gillett said.
The incident is the latest legal run-in for Zimmerman since his acquittal in July 2012 on a murder charge in the death of Martin, a 17-year-old African-American. In fact, it's his second arrest for alleged domestic violence against a girlfriend -- though Lake Mary police spokeswoman Bianca Gillett said this alleged "victim is not the same (woman) as in 2013."
"It's clear he hasn't been very lucky with the ladies the last few months," West said of his client. SourceTeenage boys were too dangerous so he's moved on to fighting women. I just hope people are at least a bit more skeptical of GZ's telling of the events the night Trayvon was killed by now. Hopefully this one doesn't let him off so he at least won't be running around with a (legal) gun anymore. why would people be more skeptical? he was found not guilty before. also, this is the second domestic violence charges with the first being dropped. i find it interesting that the charges were brought after the victim was pulled over by the police. seems odd. Lake Mary Police spokeswoman Officer Bianca Gillett said the fight occurred Monday at Zimmerman's Lake Mary residence. Though nobody involved called 911, police found out about the fight when an officer pulled Zimmerman's girlfriend over for a routine traffic stop around 11:50 p.m. Monday, Gillett said.
"The driver stated she was just involved in a domestic altercation with George Zimmerman," Gillett said in a statement. http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/trayvon-martin-george-zimmerman/os-george-zimmerman-arrested-assault-lake-mary-20150110-story.html zimmerman charges dropped again after witness recants testimony. http://www.cnn.com/2015/01/30/us/george-zimmerman-no-charges/
Maybe it didn't happen or maybe.....
+ Show Spoiler +There's no universal reason why victims of domestic violence later recant statements against their attackers, but the close relationship between them usually plays a big role in changing the victim's story. In some situations, it's the fear of more violence in the future if the attacker is acquitted or the charges are dropped, or even after the attacker spent time behind bars. This fear is especially pronounced when local police and government resources exist to make sure victims are protected when their attackers are released.
Victims may also face external pressure to recant when their attacker plays a significant role in their life or in the life of someone close to them. If, for example, a woman's abusive husband was the sole source of financial support for her and their children, she may be reluctant to risk his going to jail or prison if it means the family suffers. For these recanting victims, they may consider enduring the abuse as less harmful than being homeless or otherwise abandoned.
Surprisingly, some victims recant out of a sense of guilt. This is usually prompted by their attacker making themselves out to be a victim of the criminal justice system. In a study of jailhouse conversations between domestic violence perpetrators and their victims, researchers saw a pattern of the attackers minimizing the situation, then appealing for sympathy and, ultimately, asking the victim to recant.
I admit I don't know for sure one way or the other, but one might wonder how many different people telling similar stories it will take before he loses the benefit of the doubt?
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On February 05 2015 06:11 dAPhREAk wrote:Show nested quote +On January 11 2015 12:51 dAPhREAk wrote:On January 11 2015 06:51 GreenHorizons wrote:(CNN)George Zimmerman -- the man acquitted by a Florida jury over the death of Trayvon Martin -- was arrested Friday in Florida on suspicion of aggravated assault and domestic violence with a weapon, local authorities said.
The 31-year-old Florida man was arrested by police in Lake Mary around 10 p.m. and booked into the John E. Polk Correctional Facility, according to that facility's website. That facility, like its website, is run by the Seminole County Sheriff's Office.
It all came about after Zimmerman allegedly threw a wine bottle at a girlfriend, his lawyer Don West told reporters.
"Whatever happened took place several days ago," said West. "And, as far as I know, they have not been together for some time, certainly not since then."
Police first learned about it after coming "in contact with the (alleged) victim at a traffic stop," Lake Mary police spokeswoman Bianca Gillett said.
The incident is the latest legal run-in for Zimmerman since his acquittal in July 2012 on a murder charge in the death of Martin, a 17-year-old African-American. In fact, it's his second arrest for alleged domestic violence against a girlfriend -- though Lake Mary police spokeswoman Bianca Gillett said this alleged "victim is not the same (woman) as in 2013."
"It's clear he hasn't been very lucky with the ladies the last few months," West said of his client. SourceTeenage boys were too dangerous so he's moved on to fighting women. I just hope people are at least a bit more skeptical of GZ's telling of the events the night Trayvon was killed by now. Hopefully this one doesn't let him off so he at least won't be running around with a (legal) gun anymore. why would people be more skeptical? he was found not guilty before. also, this is the second domestic violence charges with the first being dropped. i find it interesting that the charges were brought after the victim was pulled over by the police. seems odd. Lake Mary Police spokeswoman Officer Bianca Gillett said the fight occurred Monday at Zimmerman's Lake Mary residence. Though nobody involved called 911, police found out about the fight when an officer pulled Zimmerman's girlfriend over for a routine traffic stop around 11:50 p.m. Monday, Gillett said.
"The driver stated she was just involved in a domestic altercation with George Zimmerman," Gillett said in a statement. http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/trayvon-martin-george-zimmerman/os-george-zimmerman-arrested-assault-lake-mary-20150110-story.html zimmerman charges dropped again after witness recants testimony. http://www.cnn.com/2015/01/30/us/george-zimmerman-no-charges/
Anybody else think its kinda complete BS how much the media cares about the life of one private citizen?
How is this news?
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On February 04 2015 23:54 Stratos_speAr wrote:Show nested quote +On February 04 2015 15:21 coverpunch wrote:On February 04 2015 12:48 Mohdoo wrote:On February 04 2015 12:45 coverpunch wrote:On February 04 2015 12:40 Mohdoo wrote:On February 04 2015 12:15 JonnyBNoHo wrote:On February 04 2015 11:46 Mohdoo wrote:On February 04 2015 11:42 JonnyBNoHo wrote:On February 04 2015 11:32 oneofthem wrote:On February 04 2015 10:31 JonnyBNoHo wrote:[quote] Eh... in like one fragment of one sentence, sure. He tried to clarify his point today anyways: [quote] Link dude's clearly backtracking. Not really. Did you watch the interview? He said many times that vaccines are great. I expect better of you man. Mental disorders. Mental disorders. Mental disorders. Mental disorders. Mental disorders. Mental disorders. Mental disorders. Mental disorders. Mental disorders. Mental disorders. Mental disorders. Mental disorders. Mental disorders. Mental disorders. Mental disorders. Mental disorders. Mental disorders. Mental disorders. You are consistently refusing to recognize what he said about mental disorders. I'll repost it: "I have heard of many tragic cases of walking, talking normal children who wound up with profound mental disorders after vaccines," Direct quote. Whether he says they are good or not is irrelevant to the point you are avoiding. "Many" tragic cases. He lied by saying he has heard of these cases because it's not real. How are you not getting this? Nice tantrum bro I know what he said. Children developing mental disorders after vaccination is almost certainly a true statement, since vaccination happens at a young age and mental disorders often take time to either be noticed or manifest. There's also an implied causality there which he later pointed out isn't what he meant. The guy made a poor reference and later corrected himself for it. That happens to everyone, and trying to take a dump on the guy over it is just trollish. Are you actually saying that you believe him when he says that wasn't what he originally meant? In what world would mentioning mental disorders ever have any relevance other than a causation relationship? It's quite obvious he meant it differently from the way you've interpreted and tortured it to look like. So what exactly is it you think he meant? I think he meant exactly what he said he meant in his backpedal - he made a foolish link that sounded and was taken like it implied a causation and that wasn't his point. He was trying to speak out against mandatory regimes of vaccinations and for more parental choice. It was a dumb place to make a stand. He didn't repeat it 18 times in a row like you did before going on to say non scientists shouldn't be allowed any opinion on scientific matters and actually describing a work later declared "utterly false" and retracted as having scientific rigor because it passed peer review, despite the fact that there were a slew of other studies by 2008 challenging the original link as the anti-anti-vaccine had already started. The mental gymnastics here are pretty incredible. You're putting an absurd amount of effort into justifying and playing down his comments when there is no way in hell you'd ever do this for any candidate that wasn't a Republican.
Wow that's weird, you can read my mind and tell me my opinions before I ever post them.
And I didnt "justify" it. I explicitly called it dumb...twice!
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On February 05 2015 06:27 GreenHorizons wrote:Show nested quote +On February 05 2015 06:11 dAPhREAk wrote:On January 11 2015 12:51 dAPhREAk wrote:On January 11 2015 06:51 GreenHorizons wrote:(CNN)George Zimmerman -- the man acquitted by a Florida jury over the death of Trayvon Martin -- was arrested Friday in Florida on suspicion of aggravated assault and domestic violence with a weapon, local authorities said.
The 31-year-old Florida man was arrested by police in Lake Mary around 10 p.m. and booked into the John E. Polk Correctional Facility, according to that facility's website. That facility, like its website, is run by the Seminole County Sheriff's Office.
It all came about after Zimmerman allegedly threw a wine bottle at a girlfriend, his lawyer Don West told reporters.
"Whatever happened took place several days ago," said West. "And, as far as I know, they have not been together for some time, certainly not since then."
Police first learned about it after coming "in contact with the (alleged) victim at a traffic stop," Lake Mary police spokeswoman Bianca Gillett said.
The incident is the latest legal run-in for Zimmerman since his acquittal in July 2012 on a murder charge in the death of Martin, a 17-year-old African-American. In fact, it's his second arrest for alleged domestic violence against a girlfriend -- though Lake Mary police spokeswoman Bianca Gillett said this alleged "victim is not the same (woman) as in 2013."
"It's clear he hasn't been very lucky with the ladies the last few months," West said of his client. SourceTeenage boys were too dangerous so he's moved on to fighting women. I just hope people are at least a bit more skeptical of GZ's telling of the events the night Trayvon was killed by now. Hopefully this one doesn't let him off so he at least won't be running around with a (legal) gun anymore. why would people be more skeptical? he was found not guilty before. also, this is the second domestic violence charges with the first being dropped. i find it interesting that the charges were brought after the victim was pulled over by the police. seems odd. Lake Mary Police spokeswoman Officer Bianca Gillett said the fight occurred Monday at Zimmerman's Lake Mary residence. Though nobody involved called 911, police found out about the fight when an officer pulled Zimmerman's girlfriend over for a routine traffic stop around 11:50 p.m. Monday, Gillett said.
"The driver stated she was just involved in a domestic altercation with George Zimmerman," Gillett said in a statement. http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/trayvon-martin-george-zimmerman/os-george-zimmerman-arrested-assault-lake-mary-20150110-story.html zimmerman charges dropped again after witness recants testimony. http://www.cnn.com/2015/01/30/us/george-zimmerman-no-charges/ Maybe it didn't happen or maybe..... + Show Spoiler +There's no universal reason why victims of domestic violence later recant statements against their attackers, but the close relationship between them usually plays a big role in changing the victim's story. In some situations, it's the fear of more violence in the future if the attacker is acquitted or the charges are dropped, or even after the attacker spent time behind bars. This fear is especially pronounced when local police and government resources exist to make sure victims are protected when their attackers are released.
Victims may also face external pressure to recant when their attacker plays a significant role in their life or in the life of someone close to them. If, for example, a woman's abusive husband was the sole source of financial support for her and their children, she may be reluctant to risk his going to jail or prison if it means the family suffers. For these recanting victims, they may consider enduring the abuse as less harmful than being homeless or otherwise abandoned.
Surprisingly, some victims recant out of a sense of guilt. This is usually prompted by their attacker making themselves out to be a victim of the criminal justice system. In a study of jailhouse conversations between domestic violence perpetrators and their victims, researchers saw a pattern of the attackers minimizing the situation, then appealing for sympathy and, ultimately, asking the victim to recant. I admit I don't know for sure one way or the other, but one might wonder how many different people telling similar stories it will take before he loses the benefit of the doubt?
until we throw out the constitution, every person in the world could accuse him and we should still give him the benefit of the doubt. considering this was a short term gf, i don't think general behavior of domestic violence victims really applies. those tend to be spouses, long term relationships, family members, etc. situations where one person relies heavily on the other or there is a strong connection.
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On February 05 2015 07:23 dAPhREAk wrote:Show nested quote +On February 05 2015 06:27 GreenHorizons wrote:On February 05 2015 06:11 dAPhREAk wrote:On January 11 2015 12:51 dAPhREAk wrote:On January 11 2015 06:51 GreenHorizons wrote:(CNN)George Zimmerman -- the man acquitted by a Florida jury over the death of Trayvon Martin -- was arrested Friday in Florida on suspicion of aggravated assault and domestic violence with a weapon, local authorities said.
The 31-year-old Florida man was arrested by police in Lake Mary around 10 p.m. and booked into the John E. Polk Correctional Facility, according to that facility's website. That facility, like its website, is run by the Seminole County Sheriff's Office.
It all came about after Zimmerman allegedly threw a wine bottle at a girlfriend, his lawyer Don West told reporters.
"Whatever happened took place several days ago," said West. "And, as far as I know, they have not been together for some time, certainly not since then."
Police first learned about it after coming "in contact with the (alleged) victim at a traffic stop," Lake Mary police spokeswoman Bianca Gillett said.
The incident is the latest legal run-in for Zimmerman since his acquittal in July 2012 on a murder charge in the death of Martin, a 17-year-old African-American. In fact, it's his second arrest for alleged domestic violence against a girlfriend -- though Lake Mary police spokeswoman Bianca Gillett said this alleged "victim is not the same (woman) as in 2013."
"It's clear he hasn't been very lucky with the ladies the last few months," West said of his client. SourceTeenage boys were too dangerous so he's moved on to fighting women. I just hope people are at least a bit more skeptical of GZ's telling of the events the night Trayvon was killed by now. Hopefully this one doesn't let him off so he at least won't be running around with a (legal) gun anymore. why would people be more skeptical? he was found not guilty before. also, this is the second domestic violence charges with the first being dropped. i find it interesting that the charges were brought after the victim was pulled over by the police. seems odd. Lake Mary Police spokeswoman Officer Bianca Gillett said the fight occurred Monday at Zimmerman's Lake Mary residence. Though nobody involved called 911, police found out about the fight when an officer pulled Zimmerman's girlfriend over for a routine traffic stop around 11:50 p.m. Monday, Gillett said.
"The driver stated she was just involved in a domestic altercation with George Zimmerman," Gillett said in a statement. http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/trayvon-martin-george-zimmerman/os-george-zimmerman-arrested-assault-lake-mary-20150110-story.html zimmerman charges dropped again after witness recants testimony. http://www.cnn.com/2015/01/30/us/george-zimmerman-no-charges/ Maybe it didn't happen or maybe..... + Show Spoiler +There's no universal reason why victims of domestic violence later recant statements against their attackers, but the close relationship between them usually plays a big role in changing the victim's story. In some situations, it's the fear of more violence in the future if the attacker is acquitted or the charges are dropped, or even after the attacker spent time behind bars. This fear is especially pronounced when local police and government resources exist to make sure victims are protected when their attackers are released.
Victims may also face external pressure to recant when their attacker plays a significant role in their life or in the life of someone close to them. If, for example, a woman's abusive husband was the sole source of financial support for her and their children, she may be reluctant to risk his going to jail or prison if it means the family suffers. For these recanting victims, they may consider enduring the abuse as less harmful than being homeless or otherwise abandoned.
Surprisingly, some victims recant out of a sense of guilt. This is usually prompted by their attacker making themselves out to be a victim of the criminal justice system. In a study of jailhouse conversations between domestic violence perpetrators and their victims, researchers saw a pattern of the attackers minimizing the situation, then appealing for sympathy and, ultimately, asking the victim to recant. I admit I don't know for sure one way or the other, but one might wonder how many different people telling similar stories it will take before he loses the benefit of the doubt? until we throw out the constitution, every person in the world could accuse him and we should still give him the benefit of the doubt. considering this was a short term gf, i don't think general behavior of domestic violence victims really applies. those tend to be spouses, long term relationships, family members, etc. situations where one person relies heavily on the other or there is a strong connection.
I thought we had already established that due process was considered wildly overrated around here.
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
better leave security to the private vigilante with violent streak rather than nanny state police
due process also wont get in the way of taking justice into own hands. where was due process when this guy decided to play police? who is the judge and court he's working with
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On February 05 2015 07:27 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On February 05 2015 07:23 dAPhREAk wrote:On February 05 2015 06:27 GreenHorizons wrote:On February 05 2015 06:11 dAPhREAk wrote:On January 11 2015 12:51 dAPhREAk wrote:On January 11 2015 06:51 GreenHorizons wrote:(CNN)George Zimmerman -- the man acquitted by a Florida jury over the death of Trayvon Martin -- was arrested Friday in Florida on suspicion of aggravated assault and domestic violence with a weapon, local authorities said.
The 31-year-old Florida man was arrested by police in Lake Mary around 10 p.m. and booked into the John E. Polk Correctional Facility, according to that facility's website. That facility, like its website, is run by the Seminole County Sheriff's Office.
It all came about after Zimmerman allegedly threw a wine bottle at a girlfriend, his lawyer Don West told reporters.
"Whatever happened took place several days ago," said West. "And, as far as I know, they have not been together for some time, certainly not since then."
Police first learned about it after coming "in contact with the (alleged) victim at a traffic stop," Lake Mary police spokeswoman Bianca Gillett said.
The incident is the latest legal run-in for Zimmerman since his acquittal in July 2012 on a murder charge in the death of Martin, a 17-year-old African-American. In fact, it's his second arrest for alleged domestic violence against a girlfriend -- though Lake Mary police spokeswoman Bianca Gillett said this alleged "victim is not the same (woman) as in 2013."
"It's clear he hasn't been very lucky with the ladies the last few months," West said of his client. SourceTeenage boys were too dangerous so he's moved on to fighting women. I just hope people are at least a bit more skeptical of GZ's telling of the events the night Trayvon was killed by now. Hopefully this one doesn't let him off so he at least won't be running around with a (legal) gun anymore. why would people be more skeptical? he was found not guilty before. also, this is the second domestic violence charges with the first being dropped. i find it interesting that the charges were brought after the victim was pulled over by the police. seems odd. Lake Mary Police spokeswoman Officer Bianca Gillett said the fight occurred Monday at Zimmerman's Lake Mary residence. Though nobody involved called 911, police found out about the fight when an officer pulled Zimmerman's girlfriend over for a routine traffic stop around 11:50 p.m. Monday, Gillett said.
"The driver stated she was just involved in a domestic altercation with George Zimmerman," Gillett said in a statement. http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/trayvon-martin-george-zimmerman/os-george-zimmerman-arrested-assault-lake-mary-20150110-story.html zimmerman charges dropped again after witness recants testimony. http://www.cnn.com/2015/01/30/us/george-zimmerman-no-charges/ Maybe it didn't happen or maybe..... + Show Spoiler +There's no universal reason why victims of domestic violence later recant statements against their attackers, but the close relationship between them usually plays a big role in changing the victim's story. In some situations, it's the fear of more violence in the future if the attacker is acquitted or the charges are dropped, or even after the attacker spent time behind bars. This fear is especially pronounced when local police and government resources exist to make sure victims are protected when their attackers are released.
Victims may also face external pressure to recant when their attacker plays a significant role in their life or in the life of someone close to them. If, for example, a woman's abusive husband was the sole source of financial support for her and their children, she may be reluctant to risk his going to jail or prison if it means the family suffers. For these recanting victims, they may consider enduring the abuse as less harmful than being homeless or otherwise abandoned.
Surprisingly, some victims recant out of a sense of guilt. This is usually prompted by their attacker making themselves out to be a victim of the criminal justice system. In a study of jailhouse conversations between domestic violence perpetrators and their victims, researchers saw a pattern of the attackers minimizing the situation, then appealing for sympathy and, ultimately, asking the victim to recant. I admit I don't know for sure one way or the other, but one might wonder how many different people telling similar stories it will take before he loses the benefit of the doubt? until we throw out the constitution, every person in the world could accuse him and we should still give him the benefit of the doubt. considering this was a short term gf, i don't think general behavior of domestic violence victims really applies. those tend to be spouses, long term relationships, family members, etc. situations where one person relies heavily on the other or there is a strong connection. I thought we had already established that due process was considered wildly overrated around here.
well if the due process results in a psychopath running around killing black people and beating women I'd say it's indeed overrated.
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On February 05 2015 07:29 Nyxisto wrote:Show nested quote +On February 05 2015 07:27 xDaunt wrote:On February 05 2015 07:23 dAPhREAk wrote:On February 05 2015 06:27 GreenHorizons wrote:On February 05 2015 06:11 dAPhREAk wrote:On January 11 2015 12:51 dAPhREAk wrote:On January 11 2015 06:51 GreenHorizons wrote:(CNN)George Zimmerman -- the man acquitted by a Florida jury over the death of Trayvon Martin -- was arrested Friday in Florida on suspicion of aggravated assault and domestic violence with a weapon, local authorities said.
The 31-year-old Florida man was arrested by police in Lake Mary around 10 p.m. and booked into the John E. Polk Correctional Facility, according to that facility's website. That facility, like its website, is run by the Seminole County Sheriff's Office.
It all came about after Zimmerman allegedly threw a wine bottle at a girlfriend, his lawyer Don West told reporters.
"Whatever happened took place several days ago," said West. "And, as far as I know, they have not been together for some time, certainly not since then."
Police first learned about it after coming "in contact with the (alleged) victim at a traffic stop," Lake Mary police spokeswoman Bianca Gillett said.
The incident is the latest legal run-in for Zimmerman since his acquittal in July 2012 on a murder charge in the death of Martin, a 17-year-old African-American. In fact, it's his second arrest for alleged domestic violence against a girlfriend -- though Lake Mary police spokeswoman Bianca Gillett said this alleged "victim is not the same (woman) as in 2013."
"It's clear he hasn't been very lucky with the ladies the last few months," West said of his client. SourceTeenage boys were too dangerous so he's moved on to fighting women. I just hope people are at least a bit more skeptical of GZ's telling of the events the night Trayvon was killed by now. Hopefully this one doesn't let him off so he at least won't be running around with a (legal) gun anymore. why would people be more skeptical? he was found not guilty before. also, this is the second domestic violence charges with the first being dropped. i find it interesting that the charges were brought after the victim was pulled over by the police. seems odd. Lake Mary Police spokeswoman Officer Bianca Gillett said the fight occurred Monday at Zimmerman's Lake Mary residence. Though nobody involved called 911, police found out about the fight when an officer pulled Zimmerman's girlfriend over for a routine traffic stop around 11:50 p.m. Monday, Gillett said.
"The driver stated she was just involved in a domestic altercation with George Zimmerman," Gillett said in a statement. http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/trayvon-martin-george-zimmerman/os-george-zimmerman-arrested-assault-lake-mary-20150110-story.html zimmerman charges dropped again after witness recants testimony. http://www.cnn.com/2015/01/30/us/george-zimmerman-no-charges/ Maybe it didn't happen or maybe..... + Show Spoiler +There's no universal reason why victims of domestic violence later recant statements against their attackers, but the close relationship between them usually plays a big role in changing the victim's story. In some situations, it's the fear of more violence in the future if the attacker is acquitted or the charges are dropped, or even after the attacker spent time behind bars. This fear is especially pronounced when local police and government resources exist to make sure victims are protected when their attackers are released.
Victims may also face external pressure to recant when their attacker plays a significant role in their life or in the life of someone close to them. If, for example, a woman's abusive husband was the sole source of financial support for her and their children, she may be reluctant to risk his going to jail or prison if it means the family suffers. For these recanting victims, they may consider enduring the abuse as less harmful than being homeless or otherwise abandoned.
Surprisingly, some victims recant out of a sense of guilt. This is usually prompted by their attacker making themselves out to be a victim of the criminal justice system. In a study of jailhouse conversations between domestic violence perpetrators and their victims, researchers saw a pattern of the attackers minimizing the situation, then appealing for sympathy and, ultimately, asking the victim to recant. I admit I don't know for sure one way or the other, but one might wonder how many different people telling similar stories it will take before he loses the benefit of the doubt? until we throw out the constitution, every person in the world could accuse him and we should still give him the benefit of the doubt. considering this was a short term gf, i don't think general behavior of domestic violence victims really applies. those tend to be spouses, long term relationships, family members, etc. situations where one person relies heavily on the other or there is a strong connection. I thought we had already established that due process was considered wildly overrated around here. well if the due process results in a psychopath running around killing black people and beating women I'd say it's indeed overrated.
hyperbole aside, where does psychopath come from? just curious.
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I don't know where the hyperbole accusation comes from because that's quite literally what has happened, and I think don't think what he does qualifies as normal behaviour but maybe that's just me
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On February 05 2015 07:35 Nyxisto wrote:
I don't know where the hyperbole accusation comes from because that's quite literally what has happened, and I think don't think what he does qualifies as normal behaviour but maybe that's just me
I don't know anything about the DV cases, but the sum of the evidence in the Trayvon Martin case strongly suggested that Zimmerman had the right to shoot Trayvon, which is why he was acquitted.
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On February 05 2015 07:35 Nyxisto wrote:
I don't know where the hyperbole accusation comes from because that's quite literally what has happened, and I think don't think what he does qualifies as normal behaviour but maybe that's just me
i see. so, you are using it in the sense that you have no idea what it actually means. thanks for satisfying my curiosity.
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On February 05 2015 07:37 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On February 05 2015 07:35 Nyxisto wrote:
I don't know where the hyperbole accusation comes from because that's quite literally what has happened, and I think don't think what he does qualifies as normal behaviour but maybe that's just me I don't know anything about the DV cases, but the sum of the evidence in the Trayvon Martin case strongly suggested that Zimmerman had the right to shoot Trayvon, which is why he was acquitted.
By law he acted while not entirely correct (ignoring the police dispatch) he was within his rights.
I think the issue Nyxisto has, and myself aswell, is that his actions shouldnt have been within the law.
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On February 05 2015 07:37 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On February 05 2015 07:35 Nyxisto wrote:
I don't know where the hyperbole accusation comes from because that's quite literally what has happened, and I think don't think what he does qualifies as normal behaviour but maybe that's just me I don't know anything about the DV cases, but the sum of the evidence in the Trayvon Martin case strongly suggested that Zimmerman had the right to shoot Trayvon, which is why he was acquitted.
Yeah the "right to" and it being good choices that led him to that point are drastically different. The law just bailed him out of a situation he never should of been in.
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On February 05 2015 07:41 Gorsameth wrote:Show nested quote +On February 05 2015 07:37 xDaunt wrote:On February 05 2015 07:35 Nyxisto wrote:
I don't know where the hyperbole accusation comes from because that's quite literally what has happened, and I think don't think what he does qualifies as normal behaviour but maybe that's just me I don't know anything about the DV cases, but the sum of the evidence in the Trayvon Martin case strongly suggested that Zimmerman had the right to shoot Trayvon, which is why he was acquitted. By law he acted while not entirely correct (ignoring the police dispatch) he was within his rights. I think the issue Nyxisto has, and myself aswell, is that his actions shouldnt have been within the law.
Yes, I thought that was pretty clear. If what this guy does is within the law then the law has some serious problems and not the people criticizing him.
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EPT
