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On April 10 2012 21:30 ladyumbra wrote:
To grow the scene and retain casual watcher's interest tournaments don't have to limit the amount of players any one region can send. Instead teams need to work on making players (regardless of nationality) more interesting. Tell me who somone is, where they came from in life and show me why I should start to care about them. People don't like MKP just becuase he's good, they like him because he's emotional, and funny and easy to empathise with. He has a storyline worth following and being emotionally invested in. Most players probably have some key story or trait that could become what they are known for other than just their spectacular play, teams and journalists should be working harder to let fans get to know players better.
THIS is actually the most important point. Teams, tournaments and players themselves need to work on marketing players!
It has been mentioned for a long time but there has been very little improvement.
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On April 10 2012 21:48 marcesr wrote:Show nested quote +On April 10 2012 21:30 ladyumbra wrote:
To grow the scene and retain casual watcher's interest tournaments don't have to limit the amount of players any one region can send. Instead teams need to work on making players (regardless of nationality) more interesting. Tell me who somone is, where they came from in life and show me why I should start to care about them. People don't like MKP just becuase he's good, they like him because he's emotional, and funny and easy to empathise with. He has a storyline worth following and being emotionally invested in. Most players probably have some key story or trait that could become what they are known for other than just their spectacular play, teams and journalists should be working harder to let fans get to know players better.
THIS is actually the most important point. Teams, tournaments and players themselves need to work on marketing players! It has been mentioned for a long time but there has been very little improvement.
It's not easy to market Koreans. It's a lot easier to market foreigners.
You'll have a few Koreans (Boxer, MC) who are easy. But you really think the casual fan is going to tune in to watch the 30th best Korean? I think they'd rather watch White-Ra, or up and coming players (Scarlett) of European descent. It may be racist or nationalistic but it is the truth.
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On April 10 2012 07:09 Avril_Lavigne wrote:
Team liquid should implement a "like" function or thumbs up function to peoples responses. That way I can "like" the non ignorant.
Go back to reddit.
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Train and stfu...
Do people complain about Kenyans winning Marathon or other country-sided sports ?
NO !!
Just train, get better and shut up !
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When you say recent events, do you mean at every events Koreans have ever participated in?
The thing to do, is keep inviting them. I want to see the best players duke it out.
Many of the Korean players are learning English, it would be fantastic to see more and more of this!
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On April 10 2012 07:06 HorsemasterK wrote:
Its too bad that you think people are only able to cheer for people from their own country.
This.
I sometimes cheer for korean players even if they're playing a "foreigner". Nationality is really the last thing on my list when I choose who to cheer for.
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On April 10 2012 21:59 H.Endymion wrote:
Train and stfu...
Do people complain about Kenyans winning Marathon or other country-sided sports ?
NO !!
Just train, get better and shut up !
The same Kenyans don't compete in every marathon.
You are asking players to train 10 hours a day at 0 salary and 0 income, in order to potentially make money in the future? That's the problem.
With no intermediary tournaments for budding stars, players with potential won't play because they have to feed themselves. This is why in every major sport there are minor leagues or challenger circuits (eg. Tennis, Basketball, etc.) - so that developing players have a chance to earn at least a meager wage as opposed to nil.
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I think there is only one thing left to do that is to embrace the korean dominance . They have been dominating bw for a decade and they are going to do the same if sc2 last that long  . Always bet on the koreans man they are pretty good .
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On April 10 2012 22:00 bouhko wrote:Show nested quote +On April 10 2012 07:06 HorsemasterK wrote:
Its too bad that you think people are only able to cheer for people from their own country. This. I sometimes cheer for korean players even if they're playing a "foreigner". Nationality is really the last thing on my list when I choose who to cheer for.
For you it isn't important. For a lot of people it is.
The problem with TeamLiquid is it's full of people who are huge hardcore BW/SC2 fans (hence the LoL bashing), including myself. They don't understand the casual gamer and just assume that everyone is into the Korean thing.
You're scaring off a lot of potential fans when they watch MLG and realize it's two players who can't even speak English.
When I first started watching SC2 awhile back I was deeply connected to Idra, HuK, InControl, Sheth, Kiwikaki, Select, etc. - now of course I don't mind watching Koreans. But I still remember the first time I watched a Day[9] daily using a replay with two Koreans and I was like... who the heck are these players, not that interesting.
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There were 2 pretty big tournaments in Europe, the Gathering and Copenhagen games where there were plenty of top EU players. The IPL 4 was marketed as bringing together the best players in the world so I think it was fine to have all the Koreans there.
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From a spectator point of view, it makes little difference to me where the players come from.
However, from a players perspective, I can imagine it is very hard to break into the scene when even the top foreigner players struggle to make it past a couple of rounds in a major tournament before they are knocked out.
If things continue like they did in IPL4, the foreigner scene may just die out (not from a fan perspective, but players just won't be able to financially justify competing).
Even the big 'foreigner' teams all have major korean names on their rosters now, can there be any going back?
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On April 10 2012 21:53 FairForever wrote:Show nested quote +On April 10 2012 21:48 marcesr wrote:On April 10 2012 21:30 ladyumbra wrote:
To grow the scene and retain casual watcher's interest tournaments don't have to limit the amount of players any one region can send. Instead teams need to work on making players (regardless of nationality) more interesting. Tell me who somone is, where they came from in life and show me why I should start to care about them. People don't like MKP just becuase he's good, they like him because he's emotional, and funny and easy to empathise with. He has a storyline worth following and being emotionally invested in. Most players probably have some key story or trait that could become what they are known for other than just their spectacular play, teams and journalists should be working harder to let fans get to know players better.
THIS is actually the most important point. Teams, tournaments and players themselves need to work on marketing players! It has been mentioned for a long time but there has been very little improvement. It's not easy to market Koreans. It's a lot easier to market foreigners. You'll have a few Koreans (Boxer, MC) who are easy. But you really think the casual fan is going to tune in to watch the 30th best Korean? I think they'd rather watch White-Ra, or up and coming players (Scarlett) of European descent. It may be racist or nationalistic but it is the truth.
Boxer, MC, MKP, DRG, MMA, etc. are all as easy to market as WhiteRa, Idra, Stephano, etc.. Similarly, aLive, Ganzi, Alicia, etc. are all as easy to market as Axslav, Kas, Nerchio, etc.. Difference is, the Koreans produce much better games.
I honestly do not get the "Koreans show less personality" lines at all.
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On April 10 2012 22:10 FuzzyJAM wrote:Show nested quote +On April 10 2012 21:53 FairForever wrote:On April 10 2012 21:48 marcesr wrote:On April 10 2012 21:30 ladyumbra wrote:
To grow the scene and retain casual watcher's interest tournaments don't have to limit the amount of players any one region can send. Instead teams need to work on making players (regardless of nationality) more interesting. Tell me who somone is, where they came from in life and show me why I should start to care about them. People don't like MKP just becuase he's good, they like him because he's emotional, and funny and easy to empathise with. He has a storyline worth following and being emotionally invested in. Most players probably have some key story or trait that could become what they are known for other than just their spectacular play, teams and journalists should be working harder to let fans get to know players better.
THIS is actually the most important point. Teams, tournaments and players themselves need to work on marketing players! It has been mentioned for a long time but there has been very little improvement. It's not easy to market Koreans. It's a lot easier to market foreigners. You'll have a few Koreans (Boxer, MC) who are easy. But you really think the casual fan is going to tune in to watch the 30th best Korean? I think they'd rather watch White-Ra, or up and coming players (Scarlett) of European descent. It may be racist or nationalistic but it is the truth. Boxer, MC, MKP, DRG, MMA, etc. are all as easy to market as WhiteRa, Idra, Stephano, etc.. Similarly, aLive, Ganzi, Alicia, etc. are all as easy to market as Axslav, Kas, Nerchio, etc.. Difference is, the Koreans produce much better games. I honestly do not get the "Koreans show less personality" lines at all.
The language barrier is the biggest problem in marketing Koreans.
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Papua New Guinea1059 Posts
If Koreans dominate SC2, like they did in BW, SC2 foreign scene is gonna die within 2 years to be left with a handfull fo people posting on teamliquid and some community events and tournaments sponsored by a pizza place.
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On April 10 2012 22:18 Egyptian_Head wrote:Show nested quote +On April 10 2012 22:10 FuzzyJAM wrote:On April 10 2012 21:53 FairForever wrote:On April 10 2012 21:48 marcesr wrote:On April 10 2012 21:30 ladyumbra wrote:
To grow the scene and retain casual watcher's interest tournaments don't have to limit the amount of players any one region can send. Instead teams need to work on making players (regardless of nationality) more interesting. Tell me who somone is, where they came from in life and show me why I should start to care about them. People don't like MKP just becuase he's good, they like him because he's emotional, and funny and easy to empathise with. He has a storyline worth following and being emotionally invested in. Most players probably have some key story or trait that could become what they are known for other than just their spectacular play, teams and journalists should be working harder to let fans get to know players better.
THIS is actually the most important point. Teams, tournaments and players themselves need to work on marketing players! It has been mentioned for a long time but there has been very little improvement. It's not easy to market Koreans. It's a lot easier to market foreigners. You'll have a few Koreans (Boxer, MC) who are easy. But you really think the casual fan is going to tune in to watch the 30th best Korean? I think they'd rather watch White-Ra, or up and coming players (Scarlett) of European descent. It may be racist or nationalistic but it is the truth. Boxer, MC, MKP, DRG, MMA, etc. are all as easy to market as WhiteRa, Idra, Stephano, etc.. Similarly, aLive, Ganzi, Alicia, etc. are all as easy to market as Axslav, Kas, Nerchio, etc.. Difference is, the Koreans produce much better games. I honestly do not get the "Koreans show less personality" lines at all. The language barrier is the biggest problem in marketing Koreans.
Thank goodness there are translators then.
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One thing I don't like about IPL was that they seeded, Nestea, MMA and MC directly into pool play, the players who qualified in some way, aLive, Puma, Polt, Bomber, MarineKing.
I don't mind them inviting the previous champions back, but now i think its better to only invite top 8 for IPL5.
Aslong as koreans recieve the same treatment as foreigners im fine with it, whoever plays best get the price.
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i don't understand why people want to watch sub-par players and keep out the above par ones?
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Unless your talking about a olympics type event
Then limiting the numbers from 1 country or another only hurts the event it would be better for every tournament to be mostly or maybe only Korean participants if they are the best of the best providing the most entertainment and value for money for the fans, sponsors and the event themselfs.
Personally I don't think thats the case there a more than a few none Korean players who can compete and a whole load more that can cause an upset or take a game or two here and there which adds to the entertainment.
However if you limited the numbers of players from one country you have to be fair do that for all of them besides the best player/players are still going to win limiting numbers will not make players better just limit the chances of others.
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*shrugs* I never got into the BW scene, but most of my favourite players are Koreans. Mate of mine who doesn't even watch knows the korean players better than any 'foreigner' so I'd say they market themselves with great play.
If they need to market themselves on personality more, then a lot of them are really working on that. MC and Polt have shown great english and personality. Some players show great personality, the language barrier isn't a true barrier to them. MC and Whitera show this imo. They're probably two of the most popular sc2 players who were not originally english speakers.
So as a whole, not sure why people are bringing up the language barrier. All non-english countries deal with it, not just Korea.
So for me: great skill is just as easy to market as great personality. The marketer's dream is someone that has both. Probably like 1% of all progamers, but that's why they're the dream and not the standard.
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EPT
