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On January 30 2012 08:21 Let it Raine wrote:
lol @ all the anti zerg qq
yo every pro zerg complains so we're all just insane and stupid!
hey that's what you said, nobody says anything like that lol.
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idra is just complaining cuz his style of play hasn't changed in over a year, while the protoss have altered their play vs zerg! he needs to explore other strategies and cheese styles!
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On January 30 2012 06:59 Choboo wrote:Show nested quote +On January 30 2012 06:57 CameronJ wrote:
How can you say "IdrA never stops whining" when literally every OTHER zerg says the same?
ask stephano
What are you talking about, i saw stephano complain about stuff in his streamchat aswell, and even to similar stuff.
Fact of the matter is, many of the top zerg unanimously complain that zerg is underpowered, even players from other races agree.
Dongraegu, nestea AND leenock, all three of them complained about zerg being underpowered at some point, nestea and dongraegu recently.
These are probably the top three zerg, and they unanimously complain about basically the same stuff.
The phrase "idra never stops whining" is getting old when almost every other top zerg agrees to some extend.
The game is balanced around imbalances, it was like that in BW and it is still like that.
If there is stuff that is imbalanced, you counter with another imbalance, which counterbalances the first imbalance.
Any game that has several races to choose from will work that way, since the units just arent the same.
Its all about exploiting imbalances that are at your disposal, and trying to avoid imbalances that your opponent has at his exposal.
Currently though zerg is starting to run into a lot more imbalances, and just keep losing like they didnt stand a chance.
At this point im fairly certain that zerg genuinely is weaker than the other races, but that doesnt mean you cant win at all, not yet anyways.
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On January 30 2012 08:28 Funguuuuu wrote:
Its funny that people seem to think Idra is whining, when every other Zerg in the Code S ro16 said ZvP is their toughest match-up. The only Zerg who seems able to do well in ZvP is Stephano.
It's Idra. People jump on everything he says, no matter if it's true or not.
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hmm, i dont see huk not winning and idra should win. i disagree with idra, the match is a lot more balanced now at least from the stats that ive seen
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On January 30 2012 08:21 Incognoto wrote:Show nested quote +On January 30 2012 08:04 Whatson wrote:On January 30 2012 07:52 Incognoto wrote:
You know, it's not really my kind of thing condoning whining and complaining. It tends to get on my nerves. I also believe that Idra isn't playing to the best of his capacity. He's got the rote mechanics but he needs that extra something... Either way, I also really dislike people, who really don't know better, shitting on a professional opinion.
"Well, if Idra said ZvP is imba atm, it sure as hell must not be"... come on guys seriously? Who plays SC2 all day long? You or Idra? Who has the better insight on the game?
Again, I'm not saying Idra is always right and that he should be worshiped like Flash a god, but his statements should at very least not be scoffed at that lightly and should hold some meaning.
The biggest problem with his statements is that he's ALWAYS said that Protoss is OP against Zerg. Ever since he lost to White-ra in the HDH Invitational in early beta, he's been complaining against toss nonstop. Even when ZvP was considered heavily zerg favored, he continued to say that Toss was OP. So really, nobody should believe him when he claims that Toss is OP now, because, after all, he's been saying the same thing for the past two years, and it's almost never been true. I'm not going to defend Idra's pov, nor am I going to defend Idra's "whining". Yeah he does complain a lot, but unlike everyone here who can only base their arguments on statistics and theorycrafting, Idra has actual experience. My point is that people are too quick to dismiss his opinion. Instead of "Oh well, I wonder why Idra believes that ZvP is imba, it would be interesting to know why he believes something like that, especially considering the level at which he plays" people are going "LOLOL IDRA IS GAY AND WRONG". This happened in the crowbar/policemen thread too. People have their heads stuck so far up their asses their ears are filled with shit and they absolutely refuse to listen to people who actually know what they're talking about. An unfortunate trend..
Once again, it's because he's always claimed 'Toss imba!' In the beginning, I think a lot of us might have believed him, but he's been saying the same thing forever. He loses more and more credibility the longer he repeats himself in the same way, especially since Code S zergs like Coca and Lucky are doing fantastic versus Toss. Maybe it's just that Idra isn't good enough to compete against the upper tier Protoss. I mean, he's always blamed others for his losses so...
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On January 30 2012 08:29 FaRess wrote:Show nested quote +On January 30 2012 08:26 MichaelDonovan wrote:On January 30 2012 06:59 Choboo wrote:On January 30 2012 06:57 CameronJ wrote:
How can you say "IdrA never stops whining" when literally every OTHER zerg says the same?
ask stephano Stephano doesn't play against Korean Protoss so it doesn't matter what he thinks about the matchup. he didn't play tails and hero offline and wasnt playing them while he was in korea, try to be less obvious when you hate.
There was zero hate in my post and only a raging fanboy would see hate in my post. I have no problem with Stephano, but when we say that Stephano is the only zerg that has no problem with protoss, it doesn't really matter because he doesn't train with Koreans. Beating MaNa or Incontrol is not the same as beating MC or Genius. That was my point.
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On January 30 2012 08:31 Whatson wrote:Show nested quote +On January 30 2012 08:21 Incognoto wrote:On January 30 2012 08:04 Whatson wrote:On January 30 2012 07:52 Incognoto wrote:
You know, it's not really my kind of thing condoning whining and complaining. It tends to get on my nerves. I also believe that Idra isn't playing to the best of his capacity. He's got the rote mechanics but he needs that extra something... Either way, I also really dislike people, who really don't know better, shitting on a professional opinion.
"Well, if Idra said ZvP is imba atm, it sure as hell must not be"... come on guys seriously? Who plays SC2 all day long? You or Idra? Who has the better insight on the game?
Again, I'm not saying Idra is always right and that he should be worshiped like Flash a god, but his statements should at very least not be scoffed at that lightly and should hold some meaning.
The biggest problem with his statements is that he's ALWAYS said that Protoss is OP against Zerg. Ever since he lost to White-ra in the HDH Invitational in early beta, he's been complaining against toss nonstop. Even when ZvP was considered heavily zerg favored, he continued to say that Toss was OP. So really, nobody should believe him when he claims that Toss is OP now, because, after all, he's been saying the same thing for the past two years, and it's almost never been true. I'm not going to defend Idra's pov, nor am I going to defend Idra's "whining". Yeah he does complain a lot, but unlike everyone here who can only base their arguments on statistics and theorycrafting, Idra has actual experience. My point is that people are too quick to dismiss his opinion. Instead of "Oh well, I wonder why Idra believes that ZvP is imba, it would be interesting to know why he believes something like that, especially considering the level at which he plays" people are going "LOLOL IDRA IS GAY AND WRONG". This happened in the crowbar/policemen thread too. People have their heads stuck so far up their asses their ears are filled with shit and they absolutely refuse to listen to people who actually know what they're talking about. An unfortunate trend.. Once again, it's because he's always claimed 'Toss imba!' In the beginning, I think a lot of us might have believed him, but he's been saying the same thing forever. He loses more and more credibility the longer he repeats himself in the same way, especially since Code S zergs like Coca and Lucky are doing fantastic versus Toss. Maybe it's just that Idra isn't good enough to compete against the upper tier Protoss. I mean, he's always blamed others for his losses so...
CoCa hasn't played in like 2 months. His relation to the metagame is near zero right now, as far as what we can observe.
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On January 30 2012 08:26 MichaelDonovan wrote:Show nested quote +On January 30 2012 06:59 Choboo wrote:On January 30 2012 06:57 CameronJ wrote:
How can you say "IdrA never stops whining" when literally every OTHER zerg says the same?
ask stephano Stephano doesn't play against Korean Protoss so it doesn't matter what he thinks about the matchup.
He did play in Korea not too long ago and was (almost?) top 10 GM. I don't think much changed since then. He also don't have to beat every protoss if he doesn't think that he is better than every protoss.
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stephanos zvp IS among the best though.
he understands what you have to be doing and he does it really, really well.
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On January 30 2012 08:31 Whatson wrote:Show nested quote +On January 30 2012 08:21 Incognoto wrote:On January 30 2012 08:04 Whatson wrote:On January 30 2012 07:52 Incognoto wrote:
You know, it's not really my kind of thing condoning whining and complaining. It tends to get on my nerves. I also believe that Idra isn't playing to the best of his capacity. He's got the rote mechanics but he needs that extra something... Either way, I also really dislike people, who really don't know better, shitting on a professional opinion.
"Well, if Idra said ZvP is imba atm, it sure as hell must not be"... come on guys seriously? Who plays SC2 all day long? You or Idra? Who has the better insight on the game?
Again, I'm not saying Idra is always right and that he should be worshiped like Flash a god, but his statements should at very least not be scoffed at that lightly and should hold some meaning.
The biggest problem with his statements is that he's ALWAYS said that Protoss is OP against Zerg. Ever since he lost to White-ra in the HDH Invitational in early beta, he's been complaining against toss nonstop. Even when ZvP was considered heavily zerg favored, he continued to say that Toss was OP. So really, nobody should believe him when he claims that Toss is OP now, because, after all, he's been saying the same thing for the past two years, and it's almost never been true. I'm not going to defend Idra's pov, nor am I going to defend Idra's "whining". Yeah he does complain a lot, but unlike everyone here who can only base their arguments on statistics and theorycrafting, Idra has actual experience. My point is that people are too quick to dismiss his opinion. Instead of "Oh well, I wonder why Idra believes that ZvP is imba, it would be interesting to know why he believes something like that, especially considering the level at which he plays" people are going "LOLOL IDRA IS GAY AND WRONG". This happened in the crowbar/policemen thread too. People have their heads stuck so far up their asses their ears are filled with shit and they absolutely refuse to listen to people who actually know what they're talking about. An unfortunate trend.. Once again, it's because he's always claimed 'Toss imba!' In the beginning, I think a lot of us might have believed him, but he's been saying the same thing forever. He loses more and more credibility the longer he repeats himself in the same way, especially since Code S zergs like Coca and Lucky are doing fantastic versus Toss. Maybe it's just that Idra isn't good enough to compete against the upper tier Protoss. I mean, he's always blamed others for his losses so...
Of course, what people like you tend to forget is that Protoss has been nerfed in ZvP repeatedly since release as well...
Not exactly crying wolf when the balance patches match your statements every single time, is it?
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almost 90% of zergs i ask say that zvt is there best matchup lol
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On January 30 2012 08:32 MichaelDonovan wrote:Show nested quote +On January 30 2012 08:31 Whatson wrote:On January 30 2012 08:21 Incognoto wrote:On January 30 2012 08:04 Whatson wrote:On January 30 2012 07:52 Incognoto wrote:
You know, it's not really my kind of thing condoning whining and complaining. It tends to get on my nerves. I also believe that Idra isn't playing to the best of his capacity. He's got the rote mechanics but he needs that extra something... Either way, I also really dislike people, who really don't know better, shitting on a professional opinion.
"Well, if Idra said ZvP is imba atm, it sure as hell must not be"... come on guys seriously? Who plays SC2 all day long? You or Idra? Who has the better insight on the game?
Again, I'm not saying Idra is always right and that he should be worshiped like Flash a god, but his statements should at very least not be scoffed at that lightly and should hold some meaning.
The biggest problem with his statements is that he's ALWAYS said that Protoss is OP against Zerg. Ever since he lost to White-ra in the HDH Invitational in early beta, he's been complaining against toss nonstop. Even when ZvP was considered heavily zerg favored, he continued to say that Toss was OP. So really, nobody should believe him when he claims that Toss is OP now, because, after all, he's been saying the same thing for the past two years, and it's almost never been true. I'm not going to defend Idra's pov, nor am I going to defend Idra's "whining". Yeah he does complain a lot, but unlike everyone here who can only base their arguments on statistics and theorycrafting, Idra has actual experience. My point is that people are too quick to dismiss his opinion. Instead of "Oh well, I wonder why Idra believes that ZvP is imba, it would be interesting to know why he believes something like that, especially considering the level at which he plays" people are going "LOLOL IDRA IS GAY AND WRONG". This happened in the crowbar/policemen thread too. People have their heads stuck so far up their asses their ears are filled with shit and they absolutely refuse to listen to people who actually know what they're talking about. An unfortunate trend.. Once again, it's because he's always claimed 'Toss imba!' In the beginning, I think a lot of us might have believed him, but he's been saying the same thing forever. He loses more and more credibility the longer he repeats himself in the same way, especially since Code S zergs like Coca and Lucky are doing fantastic versus Toss. Maybe it's just that Idra isn't good enough to compete against the upper tier Protoss. I mean, he's always blamed others for his losses so... CoCa hasn't played in like 2 months. His relation to the metagame is near zero right now, as far as what we can observe.
last time i saw lucky play was in the team league, he got completely out played by the protoss but won through literally, the luckiest base trade ever.
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On January 30 2012 08:33 Let it Raine wrote:
stephanos zvp IS among the best though.
he understands what you have to be doing and he does it really, really well.
yea he seems to get to that late game much more safer then all the other zergs
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You know people wouldn't accuse idra of being a whiner if he hadn't been claiming that ZvP is P favored for over a year when most of last year zerg had positive win ratios vs toss.
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Normally I would be rooting for Huk, but you know recently, with the hard work Idra has been putting in I just can't help but root for him! I hope Huk and Idra meet, would be a great match.
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On January 30 2012 08:34 WolfintheSheep wrote:Show nested quote +On January 30 2012 08:31 Whatson wrote:On January 30 2012 08:21 Incognoto wrote:On January 30 2012 08:04 Whatson wrote:On January 30 2012 07:52 Incognoto wrote:
You know, it's not really my kind of thing condoning whining and complaining. It tends to get on my nerves. I also believe that Idra isn't playing to the best of his capacity. He's got the rote mechanics but he needs that extra something... Either way, I also really dislike people, who really don't know better, shitting on a professional opinion.
"Well, if Idra said ZvP is imba atm, it sure as hell must not be"... come on guys seriously? Who plays SC2 all day long? You or Idra? Who has the better insight on the game?
Again, I'm not saying Idra is always right and that he should be worshiped like Flash a god, but his statements should at very least not be scoffed at that lightly and should hold some meaning.
The biggest problem with his statements is that he's ALWAYS said that Protoss is OP against Zerg. Ever since he lost to White-ra in the HDH Invitational in early beta, he's been complaining against toss nonstop. Even when ZvP was considered heavily zerg favored, he continued to say that Toss was OP. So really, nobody should believe him when he claims that Toss is OP now, because, after all, he's been saying the same thing for the past two years, and it's almost never been true. I'm not going to defend Idra's pov, nor am I going to defend Idra's "whining". Yeah he does complain a lot, but unlike everyone here who can only base their arguments on statistics and theorycrafting, Idra has actual experience. My point is that people are too quick to dismiss his opinion. Instead of "Oh well, I wonder why Idra believes that ZvP is imba, it would be interesting to know why he believes something like that, especially considering the level at which he plays" people are going "LOLOL IDRA IS GAY AND WRONG". This happened in the crowbar/policemen thread too. People have their heads stuck so far up their asses their ears are filled with shit and they absolutely refuse to listen to people who actually know what they're talking about. An unfortunate trend.. Once again, it's because he's always claimed 'Toss imba!' In the beginning, I think a lot of us might have believed him, but he's been saying the same thing forever. He loses more and more credibility the longer he repeats himself in the same way, especially since Code S zergs like Coca and Lucky are doing fantastic versus Toss. Maybe it's just that Idra isn't good enough to compete against the upper tier Protoss. I mean, he's always blamed others for his losses so... Of course, what people like you tend to forget is that Protoss has been nerfed in ZvP repeatedly since release as well... Not exactly crying wolf when the balance patches match your statements every single time, is it?
This is totally false. When Z got their reworked Infestor they started face smashing everyone by doing nothing but building like 20 Infestors and face rolling their keyboards to victory.
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On January 30 2012 08:37 LeFroMaGe wrote:
Normally I would be rooting for Huk, but you know recently, with the hard work Idra has been putting in I just can't help but root for him! I hope Huk and Idra meet, would be a great match.
I think that would be unfortunate because that would mean one of them gets knocked into code B. 
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On January 30 2012 08:26 MichaelDonovan wrote:Show nested quote +On January 30 2012 06:59 Choboo wrote:On January 30 2012 06:57 CameronJ wrote:
How can you say "IdrA never stops whining" when literally every OTHER zerg says the same?
ask stephano Stephano doesn't play against Korean Protoss so it doesn't matter what he thinks about the matchup.
So you're saying foreigners are completely irrelevant? Strange of you to be posting here on a foreigner website then.
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EPT
