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corumjhaelen
France6884 Posts
On November 20 2012 07:52 zalz wrote: I never understood all the love for Ender's Game. It really just strikes me as very average. Something like "The Wind-Up Girl" seems like far better sci-fi imo. I think it resonnate ver well with a certain type of audience which want to see themselves in Ender. | ||
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zalz
Netherlands3704 Posts
On November 20 2012 07:56 corumjhaelen wrote: I think it resonnate ver well with a certain type of audience which want to see themselves in Ender. See, that I might understand. Whilst reading it, I did feel that loner-me aged 14 might have really loved this book. But most of the things just seemed incredibly superficial, and most of the mind-games just didn't really make much sense. I can see how a certain kind of person might really love the book as a sort of fantasy about being this super genius loner, but just as a book, I can't see all the praise it gets. It's personal fantasy and wish fulfillment, but the book itself is just mediocre. | ||
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corumjhaelen
France6884 Posts
On November 20 2012 08:02 zalz wrote: See, that I might understand. Whilst reading it, I did feel that loner-me aged 14 might have really loved this book. But most of the things just seemed incredibly superficial, and most of the mind-games just didn't really make much sense. I can see how a certain kind of person might really love the book as a sort of fantasy about being this super genius loner, but just as a book, I can't see all the praise it gets. It's personal fantasy and wish fulfillment, but the book itself is just mediocre. I completely agree with you. I had trouble identifying with the character yself, because his feelings were really shallow, and frankly uninteresting. Like you, I guess if I had read it when I was 12 I would have felt differently. | ||
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Ysellian
Netherlands9029 Posts
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corumjhaelen
France6884 Posts
On November 20 2012 08:35 Ysellian wrote: I'm pretty sure Ender's Game is a book dedicated to a younger audience, right? The topics handled, the training camp, the character's ages, everything is really geared towards the child in you IMO. Yes of course, I don't disagree. It seems to appeal to some older people though, and I don't really see why. | ||
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Zeon0
Austria2995 Posts
but its a short book, which u can get for 5€ on amazon, so i think its a good buy On November 20 2012 07:44 Cuh wrote: 50 shades of grey trilogy. i see what u did there! | ||
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niladorus
Greece116 Posts
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snotboogie
Australia3550 Posts
![[image loading]](http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/7/79/See_No_Evil_book.jpg/150px-See_No_Evil_book.jpg) It's the memoirs of one of the CIA's top spies. Throughout the decades Baer had been operating in the Middle East trying to combat terrorism. The book is really eye opening on the whole process of intelligence gathering, and the interesting and dramatic situations that arise in the course of spycraft. It's a breathtaking ride through warzones and bombings, but this book is also a critique on CIA's policy and direction in the years leading up to 9/11. I'm sure the CIA has changed its modus operandi since 2003 (when this book was written), but for anyone interested in real spy stuff, I'd recommend this book heartily. | ||
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deth2munkies
United States4051 Posts
Dresden Files is the only series that's managed to keep my attention recently, and I can't wait for this one. | ||
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Animzor
Sweden2154 Posts
On November 20 2012 07:56 corumjhaelen wrote: I think it resonnate ver well with a certain type of audience which want to see themselves in Ender. Sounds like Twilight for boys. I have thought about reading it for a while, but now I probably wont. | ||
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sam!zdat
United States5559 Posts
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ShrykLdr
Canada44 Posts
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sam!zdat
United States5559 Posts
Have you read Infinite Jest? It is a little bit like what House of Leaves wishes it were | ||
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Werk
United States294 Posts
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ZapRoffo
United States5544 Posts
On November 20 2012 08:38 corumjhaelen wrote: Yes of course, I don't disagree. It seems to appeal to some older people though, and I don't really see why. Ender's Game was way ahead of its time on a couple things though which I think keeps it in place as a significant sci-fi work and not just a YA novel, it has a place alongside stuff like Neuromancer and Snowcrash (while none of them are like brilliant works of literature, it's hard to even say they are well written). Mainly gaming, and gaming in education, and also it totally nailed some parts of the future internet, like the whole idea of blogging and its influence in politics. Also the whole ending twist seems now like an early influence to a whole trend in movies/pop literature/etc.. Also Wuthering Heights is a great choice, in my eyes one of the most underrated novels ever, an amazing personal expression. | ||
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corumjhaelen
France6884 Posts
On November 20 2012 23:47 ZapRoffo wrote: Ender's Game was way ahead of its time on a couple things though which I think keeps it in place as a significant sci-fi work and not just a YA novel, it has a place alongside stuff like Neuromancer and Snowcrash (while none of them are like brilliant works of literature, it's hard to even say they are well written). Mainly gaming, and gaming in education, and also it totally nailed some parts of the future internet, like the whole idea of blogging and its influence in politics. Also the whole ending twist seems now like an early influence to a whole trend in movies/pop literature/etc.. Also Wuthering Heights is a great choice, in my eyes one of the most underrated novels ever, an amazing personal expression. Twist endings, or the cheapest manipulation trick ever. I hate them 90% of the time. I won't put that to the credit of Ender's game^^ Ender's game is not a bad book though. It's decently written, keeps you kinda interested, the moral implications are not completely retarded... There are way worst teenage books ! Thanks for the heads up =) That being said, I'm not sure underrated is the word, I mean it's a critically acclaimed book, and at least as a frenchman, it's considered as one of the great novel of the XIX century. | ||
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ZapRoffo
United States5544 Posts
On November 21 2012 00:03 corumjhaelen wrote: Twist endings, or the cheapest manipulation trick ever. I hate them 90% of the time. I won't put that to the credit of Ender's game^^ Ender's game is not a bad book though. It's decently written, keeps you kinda interested, the moral implications are not completely retarded... There are way worst teenage books ! Thanks for the heads up =) That being said, I'm not sure underrated is the word, I mean it's a critically acclaimed book, and at least as a frenchman, it's considered as one of the great novel of the XIX century. I think how Ender's Game does the twist is pretty superior in a way though, like it's already dissected the trend that mostly came later. Instead of it being obsessed with cleverness in how it reframes the entire preceding action, it's just like so plain and dry and like sardonically acknowledges how let down-y it is. + Show Spoiler + You read to the end and then you get there and it's just like "oh by the way, you won the war. It's over. Grats. Now go live the rest of your life." I say underrated because now it seems like a lot of people just have the image of it as "that book that teenage girls way misunderstand and identify with in its tragic romance." I like it better than almost any of its contemporaries; for me it kills Jane Eyre, Vanity Fair, anything by Jane Austen, etc. in how sophisticated, powerful, emotionally complex and interesting narratively it is. | ||
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corumjhaelen
France6884 Posts
On November 21 2012 00:48 ZapRoffo wrote: I think how Ender's Game does the twist is pretty superior in a way though, like it's already dissected the trend that mostly came later. Instead of it being obsessed with cleverness in how it reframes the entire preceding action, it's just like so plain and dry and like sardonically acknowledges how let down-y it is. + Show Spoiler + You read to the end and then you get there and it's just like "oh by the way, you won the war. It's over. Grats. Now go live the rest of your life." I say underrated because now it seems like a lot of people just have the image of it as "that book that teenage girls way misunderstand and identify with in its tragic romance." I like it better than almost any of its contemporaries; for me it kills Jane Eyre, Vanity Fair, anything by Jane Austen, etc. in how sophisticated, powerful, emotionally complex and interesting narratively it is. I agree it's a lot less obnoxious, it doesn't try to "blow your mind" and it makes sense. I'd say saying its satire is a bit exagerated though. Well, Austen seems to appeal a lot to teenage girl as well^^ Maybe I underestimate it compared to french novelists because of my french superiority complex, I'll have the pleasure to see that myself once my dear Julien + Show Spoiler + gets executed | ||
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Acrofales
Spain18451 Posts
About Ender's game: it's a novel for teenagers, but it does it pretty damned well. The rest of the Ender books are very different, and while at times it gets a bit preachy, I feel that he handles the moral questions he raises incredibly well, without really imposing his religious view on the books or the characters. | ||
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sam!zdat
United States5559 Posts
How I loathe wuthering heights | ||
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