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Since this whole topic degenerated into the usual balance flamefest where every topic ends up if unmoderated it's time for it to clean up. Locking this down for a while. Any posts made after my post [page 233] not addressing the changes in this patch directly and containting flames or general balance whine will get banned for at least a week. ~Nyovne There is way too much flaming in this thread right now. Calm down before you post! (Page 271) ~iamke55 | ||
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MrCon
France29748 Posts
Corruption with the big damage of banelings should work well, and the 3-5 corruptors will help too. Perhaps thebest solution will have to have a diverse army. Bane bombs usually work well alone against colossi, but is less reliable than just neural everything then watch the battle while having a beer. | ||
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Medrea
10003 Posts
On September 09 2011 16:54 wats0n wrote: PvZ was 52% to 48% protoss favored in June according to this chart I think in the natural evolution of the game protoss would easily figure out how to beat infestors. If you watched Code A qualifiers you would see Hero come from behind with less bases and beat Sirius just with templars versus infestors. Templars counter infestors. As a protoss player, I want to see TvP balanced. I feel PvZ can work itself out in time. I am pretty sure more changes are coming down the pipe that will make this infestor change make more sense. I mean, clearly terran is starting to run away with a lead, so there response is to.....nerf zerg the most? Nope! More changes are coming. | ||
Zelniq
United States7166 Posts
On September 09 2011 16:48 Loodah wrote: Why? The idea that the zerg can steal the only good dps units that protoss have is silly. but that's the design of the spell.. you're basically saying the spell itself is stupid which I always thought was kind of true, maybe in HotS they'll replace it with something else. though if you've ever delved into the sound files you'll see they've made special "infested" voice souds of every single terran and protoss unit in the game. not just 1 or 2 for each but several..somehow I think given this and the general effort into the design of it/the infestor, i imagine they'd have a hard time removing it entirely. i'd much rather see them figure out some other ways (like give protoss better ways of dealing with it) rather than just limit the spell so much | ||
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wats0n
United States509 Posts
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Medrea
10003 Posts
On September 09 2011 16:57 wats0n wrote: Corruptors should be allowed to land then. Because having all your supply tied up in a horrible unit is a joke and not the way the game should be. They can transform into broodlords. Which are pretty much always good. | ||
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youngminii
Australia7514 Posts
Oh yeah, my suggestion for NP is to make it so that it removes the unit from battle. It can be Vortex style or just frozen in place while unable to do anything. This literally halves the effect which is pretty balanced imo. There's no real reason why Zergs need an ability that lets them control an entire unit for 12 seconds. | ||
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Grumbels
Netherlands7032 Posts
On September 09 2011 16:47 TheDraken wrote: 1.) All zergs admit PvZ is broken. But PvT is also broken. So it's likely a reason to buff toss, not nerf zerg. 2.) If you're worried about units being clumped up, that's something you'll have to actually prevent yourself *gasp*. Ask any zerg how to engage in a concave or multiprong... it's something we've had to do since the dawn of time. This is a bit silly, in Starcraft II it is not races that are imbalanced, but match-ups. So if Protoss has a problem PvZ on certain maps you can change any three of those to get a result. I see a lot of zergs complaining that "don't nerf zerg, fix protoss" but either they don't get it or they're just sad a tool has been taken away from them. All races always want to be played in a way where they're perfectly in control all the time, even if expected win/loss is somehow 50%, but it's just not always possible and oftentimes control for one player translates to lack of control for the other. In the current situation, as a protoss player you can be quite lost on what to do versus infestors, it's just so hard to protect your colossi and units that you sometimes feel helpless. Nerfing the infestor gives protoss control back, lets them micro more and so on. | ||
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wats0n
United States509 Posts
So you have to wonder how EMP escapes unscathed and neural gets the chop. | ||
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Medrea
10003 Posts
On September 09 2011 16:59 wats0n wrote: Like, if you asked me what's worse neural parasite or EMP I would laugh my ass off. One EMP can lose you the game. ONE. I've never seen one neural win a game and if so then there was a viable counter with templars. So you have to wonder how EMP escapes unscathed and neural gets the chop. OK on this I agree entirely. EMP is unbelievable at times. Energy drainer that deals instant psi-storm damage? Also decloaks? | ||
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justinpal
United States3810 Posts
On September 09 2011 16:57 Zelniq wrote: i'd much rather see them figure out some other ways (like give protoss better ways of dealing with it) rather than just limit the spell so much The genius in this statement cannot be understated, except I think Toss already have several ways to deal with it, as well as Terran for that matter. | ||
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MrCon
France29748 Posts
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Ryder.
1117 Posts
On September 09 2011 16:46 Jason54178 wrote: Just emailed Blizzard questioning the NP nerf and they respond with saying that Infestor's are subpar and in parenthesis say Neural Parasite is good against Thors... http://imgur.com/CzOty You emailed a customer service representative, not David fucking Kim. I'm surprised the guy even answered you in the first place given how you addressed your question, but regardless, he probably doesn't even know what he is talking about and can provide you with no decent information anyway. | ||
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okrane
France265 Posts
Without this what are the viable targets for NP: Against P: * Immortals * High Templars (to storm) * Void Rays Of the three, Immortals seem to be the best choice to use NP on simply because, HTs can feedback the infestor before he can get near and voids aren't that much of an issue. Against T: * Tanks * Ghost (to emp other ghosts) * Vikings (in BL vs Viking Battles) Tanks are always going to be tricky, because of their superior range, and Ghost emp is always a gimmick. Aganst Z: Infestors (lol) If this change goes through, I figure an increase in the range of NP should be implemented to counteract the downsides. Or maybe make the possession permanent. It seems pretty weird tho, I fear people will just stop researching it. Any change that kills a micro portion of the game is a bad one to me. | ||
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okrane
France265 Posts
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enecateReAP
United Kingdom378 Posts
And now I have to make corruptors, which SUCK, they don't kill collosi quick enough...so your army just melts before you even kill them...x.X; | ||
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devilcry
Bulgaria53 Posts
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TheDraken
United States640 Posts
On September 09 2011 16:59 Grumbels wrote: This is a bit silly, in Starcraft II it is not races that are imbalanced, but match-ups. So if Protoss has a problem PvZ on certain maps you can change any three of those to get a result. I see a lot of zergs complaining that "don't nerf zerg, fix protoss" but either they don't get it or they're just sad a tool has been taken away from them. All races always want to be played in a way where they're perfectly in control all the time, even if expected win/loss is somehow 50%, but it's just not always possible and oftentimes control for one player translates to lack of control for the other. In the current situation, as a protoss player you can be quite lost on what to do versus infestors, it's just so hard to protect your colossi and units that you sometimes feel helpless. Nerfing the infestor gives protoss control back, lets them micro more and so on. You essentially disagreed with me and then gave partial evidence to support my conclusion while ignoring the other part of my argument so you didn't have to directly support my conclusion. Good job! | ||
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Nightkaira
Singapore412 Posts
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iCanada
Canada10660 Posts
Now the only real thing Zerg has that deals with Thors efficiently is Roaches, and maybe Broodlords. If you need to make roaches to get to BLs, you won't have anything to really deal with Vikings/Ghosts... Pure roach is too supply inefficient to beat 200/200 army with more than two thors. Lings take forever and back again to kill a thor with any armor upgrades... I mean, Zergs might figure something out eventually... but Thors suddenly seem really really strong against Zerg. | ||
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Zelniq
United States7166 Posts
On September 09 2011 17:04 Nightkaira wrote: u can still fungal or NE other units. imagine 6 NE on 6 colo or 6 thors ur army is gg. what? | ||
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