|
Since this whole topic degenerated into the usual balance flamefest where every topic ends up if unmoderated it's time for it to clean up. Locking this down for a while. Any posts made after my post [page 233] not addressing the changes in this patch directly and containting flames or general balance whine will get banned for at least a week. ~Nyovne
There is way too much flaming in this thread right now. Calm down before you post! (Page 271) ~iamke55 |
On September 09 2011 14:10 Soulish wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2011 14:04 Itsmedudeman wrote:On September 09 2011 14:03 BeeNu wrote:On September 09 2011 14:00 NineteenSC2 wrote:On September 09 2011 13:59 BeeNu wrote:On September 09 2011 13:56 NineteenSC2 wrote:On September 09 2011 13:55 BeeNu wrote:On September 09 2011 13:53 NineteenSC2 wrote:On September 09 2011 13:51 BeeNu wrote:On September 09 2011 13:36 NineteenSC2 wrote:
Lol, this is how toss felt when khaydarian amulet was removed. Anyway, the infestor was just too good of a unit. Good against sentries, void rays, carriers, mothership, zealots, stalkers, pheonixes, archons, collosi, dts, observers, and probes. Good for defending, as well as attacking, as well as harrassing. In a strategy game when there's a unit that's good at everything the correct phrase to drescribe it is: overpowered
p.s. left the high templar out cause that's debatable.
Don't worry guys, the ghost is next. Sure I can kinda agree with that, Infestors fill too many roles. What you're failing to realize is that the Hydralisk and Corruptor [and to a lesser extent the Ultralisk] are almost entirely useless units. I'm all for this nerf if Blizzard wants to go ahead and fix some of the glaring problems Zerg has, but in the mean time this is ridiculous. I agree the other units (in comparison to the infestor) are not as good at all. In fact, no unit is when compared to the infestor. However, zerg already has a unit to deal (I'm only talking about zvp/pvz here) with collosi - the corrupter. If anything, this is going to give zergs an easier transition into broodlords. Corruptors are awful vs Colossi, have you ever actually tried using them? I'm not going back to that crap. I'd rather switch races then play every ZvP as a bloody tightrope walk hoping I have *exactly* the right number of Corrupors, not too many not too few, to actually not get roflstomped every game. ah well, you could always fungal and baneling carpet bomb. Ever hear of these funny little things called Blink Stalkers and Void Rays? Yeah. Fun stuff. Can't blink when you're fungal'd and infestors > void rays. What league are you? (genuine question, not being rude... sorry if it comes out that way) I'm in Masters, and the people I play against never get every single Stalker caught in a fungal. It's easy for Protoss to split units around when Infestors are in range, pick off Infestors and Overlords like it's nothing. Blinking blindly into infestors is the stupidest thing you could do. Stop making straw men. He never said anything about blinking into infestors. Ever heard of using blink to dodge fg? Or not blinking at all and just spreading ur units? ( notice how he never mentioned blink.
Dodging an instant spell? That's luck more than micro skill. What other ways are you going to pick off infestors? HTs? They'll just get fungaled or taken care of by a few lings. The range and the speed of hts isn't good enough to allow you to micro against infestor ling on an even level. It's obvious he meant blink to pick them off in the context.
|
Hopefully some of these changes won't see the light
|
On September 09 2011 14:13 Odal wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2011 13:57 desrow wrote:On September 09 2011 13:55 Nomad123 wrote:On September 09 2011 13:52 -_- wrote:On September 09 2011 13:51 Nomad123 wrote:On September 09 2011 13:48 desrow wrote:On September 09 2011 13:44 Nomad123 wrote:On September 09 2011 13:43 Grimjim wrote:On September 09 2011 13:37 desrow wrote:On September 09 2011 13:33 Nomad123 wrote:
[quote]
both templars & infestors wait to regenerate energy. that part is fair. if you have 200 energy templars, then infestors will have high energy as well.
now you remove broodlord from your argument. thank you. you obviously were too short sighted with your examples.
templars are ridiculously slow for their own good. infestor movement speed was reduced also last patch, for their own good. this helps players not have their spellcasters die cause they move so fast and go in front of battle.
reality is, if opponent can fungal you, you can feedback them as well. movement speed is not a factor in your argument.
I don't know why I'm spending so much time arguing with someone with such a low post count but FUNGAL has LONGER range than FEEDBACK because the circle thingy GOES further THAN the range of feedback going to bed have fun cryin zergs  Oh look, someone with no major tournament wins is acting superior to a forum poster. Why don't you win some tournaments before you talk down to those on this forum? You have to earn your superiority first. it's ok grimjim, i pointed out to him that he's wrong. feedback & fungal are same range. i'll assume he'll conveniently be quiet now, and should start to learn how to use HT and feedback dood there's something wrong with you YES on paper they have the same range BUT the "AOE" of fungal hits further than feedback dont make me go in game and use paint WTF are u that dumb ? not as dumb as someone who equates forum posts with game understanding yes it's "AOE", so? you can't walk? your HT walk too slow? your HT so alone that opponent can walk the extra 2 range to fungal you? see my point now? it's same range, while you can argue that it adds 2 range cause its AOE, reality is, in battle HTs aren't alone, and infestors can't just walk up to HT straight up. learn to spread out your HT. all your arguments have been bullocks (broodlords, movement speed, etc.). fact is, if opponent got to fungal you, then you did something wrong cause you should be able to feedback him too. You're obviously wrong, and you're just digging yourself a deeper and deeper hole. good job not pointing where "wrong" was in that post who ever saw HT so alone in battle? lol i guess desrow was too busy looking at opponent's "6-10" broodlords. i dunno. we'll have to ask him. the reason i mention your 34 posts is because your arguments have no legitimacy because...who the hell are you? you're probably a diamond league dood who's flipping tables about neural parasite and having an argument with me when all your doing is theorycrafting while i spend my day playing zergs like stephano sheth destiny machine idra (rarely) now I'm not saying im a big shot or i'm a top protoss but i have a way better experience of the situtiation than you will ever have. i know this is a cool thing to do to QQ and theory craft when ur stuck in diamond but comon man.. Or you could just ignore people and have a mature adult discussion about balance like most of us. Personal attacks are pointless. On topic though, it is a bit silly that zerg has come to pretty much 100% depend infestors to stay in the game in every match up. I feel like infestors are a somewhat boring unit overall and I would hope that with this nerf (if it goes through) comes something decent at least in HoTS to make zerg more interesting. At least things like defilers had interesting synergy with other units, infestor broodlord just feels clunky and neural was just kind of a band-aid to a bigger issue.
Infestor a boring unit? What? They can spawn Infested Terran, which is being used A LOT these days against Protoss, Fungal and Mind Control units..
if that is a boring unit then what the hell is a "fun" unit?
|
On September 09 2011 14:06 chinstrap wrote:
Why couldnt they just do something sensible like nerf infestef terran dps rather than making a whole spell useless....
This patch suddenly went from being pretty good to making me consider quitting / race swithching.
Remember infested terrans have the same dps as marines unstimmed....so if they get nerfed dps then one should imagine regular marines getting nerfed..and we all know how that ownt happen
|
On September 09 2011 14:13 BeeNu wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2011 14:12 NineteenSC2 wrote:On September 09 2011 14:10 BeeNu wrote:On September 09 2011 14:08 NineteenSC2 wrote:On September 09 2011 14:03 BeeNu wrote:On September 09 2011 14:00 NineteenSC2 wrote:On September 09 2011 13:59 BeeNu wrote:On September 09 2011 13:56 NineteenSC2 wrote:On September 09 2011 13:55 BeeNu wrote:On September 09 2011 13:53 NineteenSC2 wrote:
[quote]
I agree the other units (in comparison to the infestor) are not as good at all. In fact, no unit is when compared to the infestor. However, zerg already has a unit to deal (I'm only talking about zvp/pvz here) with collosi - the corrupter.
If anything, this is going to give zergs an easier transition into broodlords.
Corruptors are awful vs Colossi, have you ever actually tried using them? I'm not going back to that crap. I'd rather switch races then play every ZvP as a bloody tightrope walk hoping I have *exactly* the right number of Corrupors, not too many not too few, to actually not get roflstomped every game. ah well, you could always fungal and baneling carpet bomb. Ever hear of these funny little things called Blink Stalkers and Void Rays? Yeah. Fun stuff. Can't blink when you're fungal'd and infestors > void rays. What league are you? (genuine question, not being rude... sorry if it comes out that way) I'm in Masters, and the people I play against never get every single Stalker caught in a fungal. It's easy for Protoss to split units around when Infestors are in range, pick off Infestors and Overlords like it's nothing. Also it takes an insane amount of fungals to actually kill a Void Ray, idk if you've ever tried it but in a real battle it's not an effective use of energy at all. No matter what your opponent does you'll fungal his collosi and the majority of his stalkers. I don't see the problem. If he decides to blink back he can say good bye to his collosi. No you're missing the point. Protoss just use Blink to split their stalkers to minimize the Fungal damage and try picking off Infestors and/or Broodlords. Void Rays just kill everything. Sure you can go in Fungaling stuff but Colossus outrange Fungal and will just annihilate everything. Without Neural it's like "oh you are casting Fungal? Ok ZAAAAAAP" Colossus roast them. Ehh maybe I am missing the point but in all the games I play, the infestors pull their weight just by fungals. Well in the games I play in any sort of serious engagement if I have infestors and have forgotten to research Neural Parasite I'm like "oh...ok...gg" Whatever. If this ridiculous change actually makes it to patch I'm switching races.
That's... true. Anyway, we'll just have to wait and see where blizzard is going with this. Also, I really hope terran gets some kind of major nerf.
|
new patch notes says u can't neuro massive units.. zvp just got way harder.
|
On September 09 2011 14:13 Spectorials wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2011 14:10 Sajaki wrote:On September 09 2011 14:09 Spectorials wrote:
A serious question:
What unit WOULD you neural after this change? Can only think of HT or Ghost?
Might as well remove the ability :S? Siege tanks, voidrays and immortals. They're the next biggest ones to come to mind. But you don't build Infestors for 2 out of 3 of those... Also Voidrays its more energy efficient to use fungal and infested terran.
Are you saying Zerg only make Infestors for NP? Because virtually EVERY ZvP transitions into Infestor mid/late game, regardless of what the Protoss is going...just because of Fungals.
|
On September 09 2011 14:13 Dommk wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2011 14:04 Nomad123 wrote:On September 09 2011 14:01 Whitewing wrote:On September 09 2011 13:58 Nomad123 wrote:On September 09 2011 13:56 kheldorin wrote:On September 09 2011 13:51 Nomad123 wrote:On September 09 2011 13:48 desrow wrote:On September 09 2011 13:44 Nomad123 wrote:On September 09 2011 13:43 Grimjim wrote:On September 09 2011 13:37 desrow wrote:[quote] I don't know why I'm spending so much time arguing with someone with such a low post count but FUNGAL has LONGER range than FEEDBACK because the circle thingy GOES further THAN the range of feedback going to bed have fun cryin zergs Oh look, someone with no major tournament wins is acting superior to a forum poster. Why don't you win some tournaments before you talk down to those on this forum? You have to earn your superiority first. it's ok grimjim, i pointed out to him that he's wrong. feedback & fungal are same range. i'll assume he'll conveniently be quiet now, and should start to learn how to use HT and feedback dood there's something wrong with you YES on paper they have the same range BUT the "AOE" of fungal hits further than feedback dont make me go in game and use paint WTF are u that dumb ? not as dumb as someone who equates forum posts with game understanding yes it's "AOE", so? you can't walk? your HT walk too slow? your HT so alone that opponent can walk the extra 2 range to fungal you? see my point now? it's same range, while you can argue that it adds 2 range cause its AOE, reality is, in battle HTs aren't alone, and infestors can't just walk up to HT straight up. learn to spread out your HT. all your arguments have been bullocks (broodlords, movement speed, etc.). fact is, if opponent got to fungal you, then you did something wrong cause you should be able to feedback him too. What are you talking about?? Infestors are not going to go forward to fungal HTs. They will be fungalling the main army and since the main army is usually faster than the HTs, they will be about 2 hexes infront. Which means in practice the infestors will be in range of the main army while the HTs will be out of range of the infestors. With 2 people of equal skill, infestors should never get feedbacked but Protoss players just have a lot more better micro than Zerg players. yup that's exactly my point. read it again (heck, read all the quotes, it's desrow that's pointing out the thing that you're pointing out against lol) Read what you just agreed with again. Here, I'll repost it for you: "With 2 people of equal skill, infestors should never get feedbacked but Protoss players just have a lot more better micro than Zerg players." Yeah. Play better and don't get hit by feedbacks. Fungal does actually outrange feedback by virtue of being an aoe. If you can't accept that, you're an idiot. Also, if the high templar are at the front of the army to feedback, you can fungal them. If they are in the back, you can cast your spells before feedback goes off. "but protoss players just have a lot more better micro than zerg players", then it won't be trouble for protoss players to feedback them. that's why i agree. and play better and don't get hit by fungals  "and play better and don't get hit by fungals " ROFL, do you actually play this game?
"and play better and don't get hit by feedbacks "
ROFL, do you actually play this game?
|
On September 09 2011 14:09 TheDraken wrote:
Honestly NP was one of the more intelligent balance precautions Blizz designed. If there's any unit in the game that is "OP", zerg can just neural it and it becomes theirs, thereby discouraging the other race from massing that unit and abusing it. If zergs want to QQ about some unit being OP, they should just neural it and the OP unit is now theirs.
Blizz is absolutely retarded to get rid of that.
While I see how it will fix zerg dominance over toss, it will force zerg to always go roach hydra corruptor, which is a horribly stale and fragile way to play.
The real problem is what it will do to ZvT. Already terrans are having a blast doing all these cute one-base timings and pressure to exploit early game zerg, and now terrans will have yet ANOTHER all-in they can throw at zerg with fast repair thor. Zerg loses so much against a terran who pushes with 3 thors and all his SCVs, only to get back on his feet right when terran comes back with 3 more thors and another base worth of SCVs. Survive that? He comes back with 4 more thors and another 20 SCVs.
Zerg needs to tech to hive to win a game apparently. Terran doesn't even need workers.
Definitely losing respect for blizz.
Fungal still kicks stalker and sentry ass I might add (right?). Might add an interesting dynamic, kill off the stalkers with fungal before they engage and the open the floodgates with a crap ton of corrupters to take out the rest of the colossus. This will make PvZ A LOT less silly to play. Before it was just herp herp derp...You went collosus? Let me take those big guys off your hands. Oh wait.... Nothing left in your army kills shit?
|
On September 09 2011 14:15 NineteenSC2 wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2011 14:13 BeeNu wrote:On September 09 2011 14:12 NineteenSC2 wrote:On September 09 2011 14:10 BeeNu wrote:On September 09 2011 14:08 NineteenSC2 wrote:On September 09 2011 14:03 BeeNu wrote:On September 09 2011 14:00 NineteenSC2 wrote:On September 09 2011 13:59 BeeNu wrote:On September 09 2011 13:56 NineteenSC2 wrote:On September 09 2011 13:55 BeeNu wrote:
[quote]
Corruptors are awful vs Colossi, have you ever actually tried using them? I'm not going back to that crap. I'd rather switch races then play every ZvP as a bloody tightrope walk hoping I have *exactly* the right number of Corrupors, not too many not too few, to actually not get roflstomped every game. ah well, you could always fungal and baneling carpet bomb. Ever hear of these funny little things called Blink Stalkers and Void Rays? Yeah. Fun stuff. Can't blink when you're fungal'd and infestors > void rays. What league are you? (genuine question, not being rude... sorry if it comes out that way) I'm in Masters, and the people I play against never get every single Stalker caught in a fungal. It's easy for Protoss to split units around when Infestors are in range, pick off Infestors and Overlords like it's nothing. Also it takes an insane amount of fungals to actually kill a Void Ray, idk if you've ever tried it but in a real battle it's not an effective use of energy at all. No matter what your opponent does you'll fungal his collosi and the majority of his stalkers. I don't see the problem. If he decides to blink back he can say good bye to his collosi. No you're missing the point. Protoss just use Blink to split their stalkers to minimize the Fungal damage and try picking off Infestors and/or Broodlords. Void Rays just kill everything. Sure you can go in Fungaling stuff but Colossus outrange Fungal and will just annihilate everything. Without Neural it's like "oh you are casting Fungal? Ok ZAAAAAAP" Colossus roast them. Ehh maybe I am missing the point but in all the games I play, the infestors pull their weight just by fungals. Well in the games I play in any sort of serious engagement if I have infestors and have forgotten to research Neural Parasite I'm like "oh...ok...gg" Whatever. If this ridiculous change actually makes it to patch I'm switching races. That's... true. Anyway, we'll just have to wait and see where blizzard is going with this. Also, I really hope terran gets some kind of major nerf.
No, 62.5% of code S being Terran is because better players chose Terran... Also terran being highest in the win rate for the last 13 months doesn't actually mean anything as it's only 2-4%.
Buff the siege tank please.
|
On September 09 2011 14:14 Fig wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2011 14:11 Nomad123 wrote:On September 09 2011 14:09 Fig wrote:On September 09 2011 14:08 Nomad123 wrote:On September 09 2011 14:07 Fig wrote:On September 09 2011 14:06 Nomad123 wrote:On September 09 2011 14:05 Fig wrote:On September 09 2011 14:04 BeeNu wrote:On September 09 2011 14:03 Fig wrote:On September 09 2011 13:59 BeeNu wrote:
[quote]
Ever hear of these funny little things called Blink Stalkers and Void Rays?
Yeah.
Fun stuff. Blink stalkers and uncharged void rays do have rather low DPS, if you notice in those battles, the overlords are always the last things left, it is very hard to kill them before they drop their cargo, which is why baneling bombing is so good. Don't knock it till you try it. You act like I haven't tried it before? I've tried it many, many times. Sometimes it works, sometimes it gets absolutely demolished by a player who knows how to micro. can't micro if you fungal can't fungal if you micro actually fungal is instant and can be used at 9 range with more radius than storm. If you miss with it it's your problem. actually feedback is instant and can be used at 9 range with obvious support from army. If you miss with it it's your problem. stop trolling, it's obvious you can't miss with feedback, but fungals CAN prevent you from ever getting in range. stop trolling, it's obvious you can't miss with fungal, but feedback CAN prevent infestors from ever casting fungal. Hey this is about neural parasite, fungal has already been buffed and nerfed. I already made my point about neural, so if you want to continue talking about fungal, go ahead, but I'm not gonna follow along.
ask desrow, he's the one who brought up neural parasite into the discussion when feedback was mentioned.
|
On September 09 2011 14:10 Nomad123 wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2011 14:09 ReignFayth wrote:On September 09 2011 14:06 Nomad123 wrote:On September 09 2011 14:06 ReignFayth wrote:On September 09 2011 14:04 Nomad123 wrote:On September 09 2011 14:01 Whitewing wrote:On September 09 2011 13:58 Nomad123 wrote:On September 09 2011 13:56 kheldorin wrote:On September 09 2011 13:51 Nomad123 wrote:On September 09 2011 13:48 desrow wrote:
[quote]
dood there's something wrong with you YES on paper they have the same range BUT the "AOE" of fungal hits further than feedback dont make me go in game and use paint WTF are u that dumb ? not as dumb as someone who equates forum posts with game understanding yes it's "AOE", so? you can't walk? your HT walk too slow? your HT so alone that opponent can walk the extra 2 range to fungal you? see my point now? it's same range, while you can argue that it adds 2 range cause its AOE, reality is, in battle HTs aren't alone, and infestors can't just walk up to HT straight up. learn to spread out your HT. all your arguments have been bullocks (broodlords, movement speed, etc.). fact is, if opponent got to fungal you, then you did something wrong cause you should be able to feedback him too. What are you talking about?? Infestors are not going to go forward to fungal HTs. They will be fungalling the main army and since the main army is usually faster than the HTs, they will be about 2 hexes infront. Which means in practice the infestors will be in range of the main army while the HTs will be out of range of the infestors. With 2 people of equal skill, infestors should never get feedbacked but Protoss players just have a lot more better micro than Zerg players. yup that's exactly my point. read it again (heck, read all the quotes, it's desrow that's pointing out the thing that you're pointing out against lol) Read what you just agreed with again. Here, I'll repost it for you: "With 2 people of equal skill, infestors should never get feedbacked but Protoss players just have a lot more better micro than Zerg players." Yeah. Play better and don't get hit by feedbacks. Fungal does actually outrange feedback by virtue of being an aoe. If you can't accept that, you're an idiot. Also, if the high templar are at the front of the army to feedback, you can fungal them. If they are in the back, you can cast your spells before feedback goes off. "but protoss players just have a lot more better micro than zerg players", then it won't be trouble for protoss players to feedback them. that's why i agree. and play better and don't get hit by fungals why do you act all condescending, what league are you in? as condescending as "who the hell are you?" said by desrow? i can do better Anyway I just think you shouldn't get into an argument if you don't really know what you're talking about, cuz thus far you have only been embarassing yourself.... so my advice to you is to just drop it why i'm touched that you care so much about me. thanks for your advice. i'll gladly ignore it though if i may.
Didn't expect you to be smart about all of this, feel free to make a fool of yourself even more
|
This has got to be the best patch ever released and the most game changing. As a Zerg player, i felt that fungal and NP was indeed too strong and felt that massing infestors and lings didn't require any skill at all and was indeed imbalanced.
Despite all the biased opinions coming from the zergs, i really wish the NP nerf goes through. I really think this will change the metagame for the good. Especially ZvP, and Zerg vs Terran Mech
|
If this goes through Im switching to terran. seriously this is out of control
|
United States7483 Posts
On September 09 2011 14:13 Dommk wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2011 14:04 Nomad123 wrote:On September 09 2011 14:01 Whitewing wrote:On September 09 2011 13:58 Nomad123 wrote:On September 09 2011 13:56 kheldorin wrote:On September 09 2011 13:51 Nomad123 wrote:On September 09 2011 13:48 desrow wrote:On September 09 2011 13:44 Nomad123 wrote:On September 09 2011 13:43 Grimjim wrote:On September 09 2011 13:37 desrow wrote:[quote] I don't know why I'm spending so much time arguing with someone with such a low post count but FUNGAL has LONGER range than FEEDBACK because the circle thingy GOES further THAN the range of feedback going to bed have fun cryin zergs Oh look, someone with no major tournament wins is acting superior to a forum poster. Why don't you win some tournaments before you talk down to those on this forum? You have to earn your superiority first. it's ok grimjim, i pointed out to him that he's wrong. feedback & fungal are same range. i'll assume he'll conveniently be quiet now, and should start to learn how to use HT and feedback dood there's something wrong with you YES on paper they have the same range BUT the "AOE" of fungal hits further than feedback dont make me go in game and use paint WTF are u that dumb ? not as dumb as someone who equates forum posts with game understanding yes it's "AOE", so? you can't walk? your HT walk too slow? your HT so alone that opponent can walk the extra 2 range to fungal you? see my point now? it's same range, while you can argue that it adds 2 range cause its AOE, reality is, in battle HTs aren't alone, and infestors can't just walk up to HT straight up. learn to spread out your HT. all your arguments have been bullocks (broodlords, movement speed, etc.). fact is, if opponent got to fungal you, then you did something wrong cause you should be able to feedback him too. What are you talking about?? Infestors are not going to go forward to fungal HTs. They will be fungalling the main army and since the main army is usually faster than the HTs, they will be about 2 hexes infront. Which means in practice the infestors will be in range of the main army while the HTs will be out of range of the infestors. With 2 people of equal skill, infestors should never get feedbacked but Protoss players just have a lot more better micro than Zerg players. yup that's exactly my point. read it again (heck, read all the quotes, it's desrow that's pointing out the thing that you're pointing out against lol) Read what you just agreed with again. Here, I'll repost it for you: "With 2 people of equal skill, infestors should never get feedbacked but Protoss players just have a lot more better micro than Zerg players." Yeah. Play better and don't get hit by feedbacks. Fungal does actually outrange feedback by virtue of being an aoe. If you can't accept that, you're an idiot. Also, if the high templar are at the front of the army to feedback, you can fungal them. If they are in the back, you can cast your spells before feedback goes off. "but protoss players just have a lot more better micro than zerg players", then it won't be trouble for protoss players to feedback them. that's why i agree. and play better and don't get hit by fungals "and play better and don't get hit by fungals " ROFL, do you actually play this game?
No he actually doesn't, his account has no ladder games played this or last season: http://us.battle.net/sc2/en/profile/2277952/1/Nomad/
Oh, and apparently, according to his TL post, he's platinum.
|
On September 09 2011 14:13 BeeNu wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2011 14:12 NineteenSC2 wrote:On September 09 2011 14:10 BeeNu wrote:On September 09 2011 14:08 NineteenSC2 wrote:On September 09 2011 14:03 BeeNu wrote:On September 09 2011 14:00 NineteenSC2 wrote:On September 09 2011 13:59 BeeNu wrote:On September 09 2011 13:56 NineteenSC2 wrote:On September 09 2011 13:55 BeeNu wrote:On September 09 2011 13:53 NineteenSC2 wrote:
[quote]
I agree the other units (in comparison to the infestor) are not as good at all. In fact, no unit is when compared to the infestor. However, zerg already has a unit to deal (I'm only talking about zvp/pvz here) with collosi - the corrupter.
If anything, this is going to give zergs an easier transition into broodlords.
Corruptors are awful vs Colossi, have you ever actually tried using them? I'm not going back to that crap. I'd rather switch races then play every ZvP as a bloody tightrope walk hoping I have *exactly* the right number of Corrupors, not too many not too few, to actually not get roflstomped every game. ah well, you could always fungal and baneling carpet bomb. Ever hear of these funny little things called Blink Stalkers and Void Rays? Yeah. Fun stuff. Can't blink when you're fungal'd and infestors > void rays. What league are you? (genuine question, not being rude... sorry if it comes out that way) I'm in Masters, and the people I play against never get every single Stalker caught in a fungal. It's easy for Protoss to split units around when Infestors are in range, pick off Infestors and Overlords like it's nothing. Also it takes an insane amount of fungals to actually kill a Void Ray, idk if you've ever tried it but in a real battle it's not an effective use of energy at all. No matter what your opponent does you'll fungal his collosi and the majority of his stalkers. I don't see the problem. If he decides to blink back he can say good bye to his collosi. No you're missing the point. Protoss just use Blink to split their stalkers to minimize the Fungal damage and try picking off Infestors and/or Broodlords. Void Rays just kill everything. Sure you can go in Fungaling stuff but Colossus outrange Fungal and will just annihilate everything. Without Neural it's like "oh you are casting Fungal? Ok ZAAAAAAP" Colossus roast them. Ehh maybe I am missing the point but in all the games I play, the infestors pull their weight just by fungals. Well in the games I play in any sort of serious engagement if I have infestors and have forgotten to research Neural Parasite I'm like "oh...ok...gg" Whatever. If this ridiculous change actually makes it to patch I'm switching races.
Zergs have a TON of ways to deal with anything outside of NP. Most of the high level zergs don't even rely on NP. The only player to consistently rely heavily on NP to deal with everything is destiny, but then I could see why people are so outraged because so many people on TL watch him play and base their play off him even though it's not even standard.
|
On September 09 2011 14:18 Kisezik wrote:
This has got to be the best patch ever released and most game changing. As a Zerg player, i felt that fungal and NP was indeed too strong and felt that massing infestors and lings didn't require any skill at all and was indeed imbalanced.
you play on SEA ladder... of course you think this your opponents just move command into your infestors.
|
On September 09 2011 14:18 ReignFayth wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2011 14:10 Nomad123 wrote:On September 09 2011 14:09 ReignFayth wrote:On September 09 2011 14:06 Nomad123 wrote:On September 09 2011 14:06 ReignFayth wrote:On September 09 2011 14:04 Nomad123 wrote:On September 09 2011 14:01 Whitewing wrote:On September 09 2011 13:58 Nomad123 wrote:On September 09 2011 13:56 kheldorin wrote:On September 09 2011 13:51 Nomad123 wrote:[quote] not as dumb as someone who equates forum posts with game understanding yes it's "AOE", so? you can't walk? your HT walk too slow? your HT so alone that opponent can walk the extra 2 range to fungal you? see my point now? it's same range, while you can argue that it adds 2 range cause its AOE, reality is, in battle HTs aren't alone, and infestors can't just walk up to HT straight up. learn to spread out your HT. all your arguments have been bullocks (broodlords, movement speed, etc.). fact is, if opponent got to fungal you, then you did something wrong cause you should be able to feedback him too. What are you talking about?? Infestors are not going to go forward to fungal HTs. They will be fungalling the main army and since the main army is usually faster than the HTs, they will be about 2 hexes infront. Which means in practice the infestors will be in range of the main army while the HTs will be out of range of the infestors. With 2 people of equal skill, infestors should never get feedbacked but Protoss players just have a lot more better micro than Zerg players. yup that's exactly my point. read it again (heck, read all the quotes, it's desrow that's pointing out the thing that you're pointing out against lol) Read what you just agreed with again. Here, I'll repost it for you: "With 2 people of equal skill, infestors should never get feedbacked but Protoss players just have a lot more better micro than Zerg players." Yeah. Play better and don't get hit by feedbacks. Fungal does actually outrange feedback by virtue of being an aoe. If you can't accept that, you're an idiot. Also, if the high templar are at the front of the army to feedback, you can fungal them. If they are in the back, you can cast your spells before feedback goes off. "but protoss players just have a lot more better micro than zerg players", then it won't be trouble for protoss players to feedback them. that's why i agree. and play better and don't get hit by fungals why do you act all condescending, what league are you in? as condescending as "who the hell are you?" said by desrow? i can do better Anyway I just think you shouldn't get into an argument if you don't really know what you're talking about, cuz thus far you have only been embarassing yourself.... so my advice to you is to just drop it why i'm touched that you care so much about me. thanks for your advice. i'll gladly ignore it though if i may. Didn't expect you to be smart about all of this, feel free to make a fool of yourself even more
Thank you. I'll always think of you and embrace the freedom you mentioned.
|
The real question is why did blizzard decide to nerf zerg when terran is the top dog?
|
I can see the premise of what blizzard is trying to do, nerf the infestor which seems to be causing problems but I honestly have a better idea, make fungal only able to hit ground units and biological air. With neural parasite no longer able to hit massive I think that this limits neural greatly and would be only used to steal spellcasters and use them against their own army. Also in smaller pushes using them to neural immortals and tanks but with the amount of energy needed to cast neural and the upgrade, I am pretty sure that it would just be a better idea to cast infested terrans or fungal. Before people reject my idea and say that would be too weird of a rule to only allow fungal to hit biological air, remember that neural is unable to be used on ultras even outside of the PTR.
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
