EPTAnd if there's anything such as a real claim for land, surely the northern quarter of our own little island has a great claim? But as we're all (thankfully) democratic, it should be down to the residents, not geography. And that's how it should stay.
The Falklands or las Malvinas? - Page 9
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Vore210
Ireland256 Posts
And if there's anything such as a real claim for land, surely the northern quarter of our own little island has a great claim? But as we're all (thankfully) democratic, it should be down to the residents, not geography. And that's how it should stay. | ||
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Ganjamaster
Argentina475 Posts
On June 18 2011 02:40 IntoTheWow wrote: Don't know much about popularity %, because those fluctuate a lot depending on who's measuring them, but Kirchner will probably win the presidential elections in first round, that most polls agree on. Kirchner has already won just because no viable alternative will be able to consolidate in time to pose a real threat come the election, especially when she goes around handing out LCD flatscreens to watch the Copa America (just to people who are on welfare and social programs, L O fucking L). The posturing is because internal forces (the unions, other party elements) want to gain more power and seats in the official lists. She cannot hold them off if she appears weak, so she has to make some ridiculous statements such as the falklands one to show power. | ||
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sc4k
United Kingdom5454 Posts
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IntoTheWow
is awesome32275 Posts
On June 18 2011 02:52 Ganjamaster wrote: Kirchner has already won just because no viable alternative will be able to consolidate in time to pose a real threat come the election, especially when she goes around handing out LCD flatscreens to watch the Copa America (just to people who are on welfare and social programs, L O fucking L). The posturing is because internal forces (the unions, other party elements) want to gain more power and seats in the official lists. She cannot hold them off if she appears weak, so she has to make some ridiculous statements such as the falklands one to show power. Can you remain on topic? If you want to talk about inner Argentinian politics, then open a thread for it. | ||
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IntoTheWow
is awesome32275 Posts
On June 18 2011 02:32 Mafe wrote: Your popularity is approaching zero? Gogo lets look for another state on which the people can focus their hatred . One of the oldest political tricks in the world. But otherwise I dont know too much about Argentinas present shape. Can anyone confirm or deny my guess? I think it has to do with continuing the claim. If you don't show interest and claim by your own means, no one is going to do it for you, so Argentina on one side, continues to claims, this keeps the claim relevant, and Argentina can quote themselves as being the ones trying to use the diplomatic route. On the other hand, England won't discuss it cause it's not in their interest (same way it's in Argentina's interest to discuss it). In the end the claim over this servers both parties since it brings nationalism into the table and raises popularity or gives each government another banner to hold and wave, while the crowd waves little national flags. | ||
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Ganjamaster
Argentina475 Posts
On June 18 2011 03:02 IntoTheWow wrote: Can you remain on topic? If you want to talk about inner Argentinian politics, then open a thread for it. Not enough Argentines here to warrant its own thread. People in the thread want to know why CFK made those inflammatory statements, I am merely providing the appropriate context for it. | ||
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IntoTheWow
is awesome32275 Posts
On June 18 2011 03:07 Ganjamaster wrote: Not enough Argentines here to warrant its own thread. People in the thread want to know why CFK made those inflammatory statements, I am merely providing the appropriate context for it. You are not providing context, you are spewing propaganda, the same thing you are accusing me on. Providing context would be talking about the big scheme of things in our politics, not some LCD financing plan which is but nickles. We get it, you don't like the current ruling political party. | ||
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ElPeque.fogata
Uruguay462 Posts
On June 18 2011 01:31 IntoTheWow wrote: Haha, sorry but this is so wrong it's funny. I don't know where you read this. The coin thing has nothing to do with our economy but with our bus system :p (Argentina was one of the few countries that kept on growing in the middle of the economic crisis and holds on to some big reserves right now). Oh! But do we know our beloved neighbors! - You manipulate your inflation measurements to suit whatever you want. - You can't even pay your foreign debt. We now a days hear about Greece may have to default Well, Argentina has been in default for quite a while now... - Your bonds are worth nothing because no one trusts you will ever pay. - You stole your coutrymen's retirement funds to try to even your spending deficit. Central bank reserves by themselves mean nothing. You can't touch them without spiraling either inflation or the exchange rate out of the scale, shooting yourself in the foot. You can cheat on your accounting for a while, but it will blow up in your faces as it always did and as it is about to happen in Spain, Greece, et al. And you achieve all that even though in terms of natural resources you should be within the top 5 richest countries in the world. Yet always so cocky i'm not sure if it is painful or funny. No wonder the rest of the south american countries smile to each others in irony when the spoiled single child calls for special attention. Economic crisis? What crisis? Your government congratulates itself on having survived when all the rest plummeted. Newsflash!!! All your neighbors did and are doing much much better. Mostly not because of doing things right (in many cases just the opposite) but because of not doing them as wrong as you did/are doing. And the reason we are doing pretty good right now is that our economies depend on commodities. And in times of crisis, people stop buying appartments, then cars, then computers, then ipods......... but they'll keep on buying food. So this post-modern banana republic pride is ridiculous. Same story during the world wars. Uruguay was recalled by many as "the Switzerland of America" during those times. My ancestors believed the phrase literally and came here from europe to find a better life and they certainly did. Then the first world stopped buying us dry canned meat at the price of gold. We then didn't want to wake up to reallity and kept the spending without getting any better at doing anything (we are so great!). We went bankrupt, social living standards plummeted. Social unrest. And the conditions were met for whatever right or left wing totalitarian to take control. We all had our own flavor of dictator. But even our dictators facepalmed when you invaded the Malvinas. We, Uruguayans have almost the same ethnicity as Argentinians (a little more spanish and less italian blood), and have very similar flavor of spanish, so we are usually mistaken for Argentinians. As tourists, we learn to be outspoken about our nationality to avoid confusion and so we are treated with less distrust. | ||
KwarK
United States42957 Posts
On June 18 2011 03:06 IntoTheWow wrote: I think it has to do with continuing the claim. If you don't show interest and claim by your own means, no one is going to do it for you, so Argentina on one side, continues to claims, this keeps the claim relevant, and Argentina can quote themselves as being the ones trying to use the diplomatic route. On the other hand, England won't discuss it cause it's not in their interest (same way it's in Argentina's interest to discuss it). In the end the claim over this servers both parties since it brings nationalism into the table and raises popularity or gives each government another banner to hold and wave, while the crowd waves little national flags. I think Britain doesn't discuss it because we find the matter quite absurd. They're a long way outside Argentinian waters and no Argentinians live there. It's honestly not worth paying the diplomat to show up and say that we're not willing to negotiate it. | ||
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Drteeth
Great Britain415 Posts
When you got your arse kicked that hard the first time only true a idiot would send more conscripts to theirs deaths. Unless the French sell them 10 million exocet missiles the chances of victory are extremely slim indeed | ||
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Ganjamaster
Argentina475 Posts
On June 18 2011 03:13 ElPeque.fogata wrote: Oh! But do we know our beloved neighbors! - You manipulate your inflation measurements to suit whatever you want. - You can't even pay your foreign debt. We now a days hear about Greece may have to default Well, Argentina has been in default for quite a while now... - Your bonds are worth nothing because no one trusts you will ever pay. - You stole your coutrymen's retirement funds to try to even your spending deficit. Central bank reserves by themselves mean nothing. You can't touch them without spiraling either inflation or the exchange rate out of the scale, shooting yourself in the foot. You can cheat on your accounting for a while, but it will blow up in your faces as it always did and as it is about to happen in Spain, Greece, et al. And you achieve all that even though in terms of natural resources you should be within the top 5 richest countries in the world. Yet always so cocky i'm not sure if it is painful or funny. No wonder the rest of the south american countries smile to each others in irony when the spoiled single child calls for special attention. Economic crisis? What crisis? Your government congratulates itself on having survived when all the rest plummeted. Newsflash!!! All your neighbors did and are doing much much better. Mostly not because of doing things right (in many cases just the opposite) but because of not doing them as wrong as you did/are doing. And the reason we are doing pretty good right now is that our economies depend on commodities. And in times of crisis, people stop buying appartments, then cars, then computers, then ipods......... but they'll keep on buying food. So this post-modern banana republic pride is ridiculous. Same story during the world wars. Uruguay was recalled by many as "the Switzerland of America" during those times. My ancestors believed the phrase literally and came here from europe to find a better life and they certainly did. Then the first world stopped buying us dry canned meat at the price of gold. We then didn't want to wake up to reallity and kept the spending without getting any better at doing anything (we are so great!). We went bankrupt, social living standards plummeted. Social unrest. And the conditions were met for whatever right or left wing totalitarian to take control. We all had our own flavor of dictator. But even our dictators facepalmed when you invaded the Malvinas. We, Uruguayans have almost the same ethnicity as Argentinians (a little more spanish and less italian blood), and have very similar flavor of spanish, so we are usually mistaken for Argentinians. As tourists, we learn to be outspoken about our nationality to avoid confusion and so we are treated with less distrust. You are so quick to point out our flaws and yet your economy depends a great deal on us. Many of the things you consume are made by us, you watch our media and you benefit from out tourism. Your whole economy is based on the black, illegal money of argentines deposited in your unscrupulous banks and deregulated financial system, so if I were you I would shut up and pour yourself another mate because if we took all that money out you would have to swim across the river to clean toilets. @IntoTheWow So economic/social policies (trade restrictions, social programmes) are not relevant policies to be discussed? We can continue this elsehwere, I agree we have derailed too much. | ||
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thoradycus
Malaysia3262 Posts
On June 18 2011 03:19 Drteeth wrote: I was there in 1982 in the Royal Navy and it's a horrible godforsaken place, however, it's ours, I think Argentina would be extremely silly to try and ever take it again. When you got your arse kicked that hard the first time only true a idiot would send more conscripts to theirs deaths. Unless the French sell them 10 million exocet missiles the chances of victory are extremely slim indeed oooo snap | ||
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Drteeth
Great Britain415 Posts
# What ship were you on? | ||
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Ganjamaster
Argentina475 Posts
On June 18 2011 03:19 Drteeth wrote: I was there in 1982 in the Royal Navy and it's a horrible godforsaken place, however, it's ours, I think Argentina would be extremely silly to try and ever take it again. When you got your arse kicked that hard the first time only true a idiot would send more conscripts to theirs deaths. Unless the French sell them 10 million exocet missiles the chances of victory are extremely slim indeed Actually, the idiot dictator sold 80% of our Exocet missiles before the war started, thank god I might add, because the Brits would have been real pissed if we actually sank their carrier and other biggers vessels in the task force. | ||
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Drteeth
Great Britain415 Posts
Fortunately our soldiers. sailors and airmen etc were volunteers and not conscripts. Scary times as a 16 year old fresh out of training. ![[image loading]](http://ravenrepublic.net/blog/wp-content/uploads/2010/08/HMS-SHEFFIELD.7-.jpg) | ||
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Ganjamaster
Argentina475 Posts
On June 18 2011 03:28 Drteeth wrote: I was pretty pissed when I got sunk I must admit. Luckily the dictator in question should have sold the one that hit us as it was a dud and luckily didn't explode. Fortunately our soldiers. sailors and airmen etc were volunteers and not conscripts. I am also thankful for that my friend, because then you wouldn´t be posting here! The Falklands War probably takes the prize for most retarded war ever. The only thing it proved was that our pilots were pretty damn good, other than that it was a silly waste of life. | ||
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Drteeth
Great Britain415 Posts
Of course we were all very nervous but we had no real clue of what was to face us. I think only the operations officers or those safely tucked away in Whitehall had really heard of the exocet and the pukaras that fired them. The Argentine pilots were very highly skilled and were quite a handful at times. While the ship was sinking we were actually firing rifles or machine guns at the planes buzzing over us. It was truly a retarded war, like all wars, All it did was make Mrs Thatcher a hero and everyone knows what a C**T she was. | ||
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ElPeque.fogata
Uruguay462 Posts
On June 18 2011 03:22 Ganjamaster wrote: You are so quick to point out our flaws and yet your economy depends a great deal on us. Many of the things you consume are made by us, you watch our media and you benefit from out tourism. Your whole economy is based on the black, illegal money of argentines deposited in your unscrupulous banks and deregulated financial system, so if I were you I would shut up and pour yourself another mate because if we took all that money out you would have to swim across the river to clean toilets. @IntoTheWow So economic/social policies (trade restrictions, social programmes) are not relevant policies to be discussed? We can continue this elsehwere, I agree we have derailed too much. Well... Nope. That is what your government tells you. Argentinians account for 30% of the money in Uruguayan banks. It would only hurt us if they took it all away in one sweep. That is exactly what happened in 2002 when we had to refinance our debt and you defaulted. And the main reason Argentinians put their money in here is because Argentina has a long history of manipulating their economy, switching rules on the fly, expropiating, and just being too corrupt. Which is just bad for business. And you know what? We are doing particularily good right now because your government sucks so much that your best farmers are MOVING to our lands because even though your land is much more fertile, they make more money in our shitty lands and much worse exchange rate, boosting our exports. Actually... Why don't you pay us a visit and see how much you can buy here with Argentinian pesos. You might be surprised. (I go to buenos aires once in a while to buy cheap stuff  ).In any case. Both Argentina and Brazil have always fucked with us. Our country is very small, we have no scale productivity, no oil, no gas (though now it seems there is some study that says we might), and Brazil and Argentina are both huge both in human and natural resources, and both have very high trade restrictions for our products. And they even prohibit us from doing commerce treaties with other countries else we would be more severely punished with tariffs, etc. Long story short. We are the small bullyed kid in the neighbourhood. Yet here we are. And there you are. | ||
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Ganjamaster
Argentina475 Posts
On June 18 2011 03:46 ElPeque.fogata wrote: Well... Nope. That is what your government tells you. Argentinians account for 30% of the money in Uruguayan banks. It would only hurt us if they took it all away in one sweep. That is exactly what happened in 2002 when we had to refinance our debt and you defaulted. And the main reason Argentinians put their money in here is because Argentina has a long history of manipulating their economy, switching rules on the fly, expropiating, and just being too corrupt. Which is just bad for business. And you know what? We are doing particularily good right now because your government sucks so much that your best farmers are MOVING to our lands because even though your land is much more fertile, they make more money in our shitty lands and much worse exchange rate, boosting our exports. Actually... Why don't you pay us a visit and see how much you can buy here with Argentinian pesos. You might be surprised. (I go to buenos aires once in a while to buy cheap stuff ).In any case. Both Argentina and Brazil have always fucked with us. Our country is very small, we have no scale productivity, no oil, no gas (though now it seems there is some study that says we might), and Brazil and Argentina are both huge both in human and natural resources, and both have very high trade restrictions for our products. And they even prohibit us from doing commerce treaties with other countries else we would be more severely punished with tariffs, etc. Long story short. We are the small bullyed kid in the neighbourhood. Yet here we are. And there you are. HAhaha "our best farmers". It is the LAND which makes our products good, not the farmers. If it were because of technical proficiency we would have been overtaken by EU/USA long ago in terms of farming. You are bullied because Uruguayans tend to act butthurt (like you) in every thread were Argentina is discussed. The real deal is nobody cares about Uruguay, live with it. Yeah, here I am, I go once a year to Uruguay to fornicate with your women and drink your wine, and thats about it. User was warned for this post | ||
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Drteeth
Great Britain415 Posts
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