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{ToT}ColmA
Japan3260 Posts
On a sidenote i find it hilarious what jinro said 1 month ago bout TSL lag for koreans on US server and now this~ the perspective of a man always changes when he is involved i guess *edit* sad to not see empire invited, with their new invites i think they would be a good invite. | ||
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nihlon
Sweden5581 Posts
On May 02 2011 19:34 Go0g3n wrote: I think it's a bit silly. TL set and met a pretty high standard when it comes to hosting tournaments and making cross-realm gameplay as fair and lag-free as possible, but you can't expect everyone to follow, especially for team competitions. I'm, however surprised, that, Liquid declined to participate in somewhat unfavorable conditions, they only would've applied to EU vs KOR games, and half of TL lineup (Ret, TLO, Tyler) would've been able to play those comfortably. Well, Huk and Jinro basically declined the NASL because of the playing conditions (lag and time concerns) so I don't take it as any surprise they turn down a team event in NA when have half the team in Korea. | ||
bkrow
Australia8532 Posts
On May 02 2011 20:18 deL wrote: In general, I think SEA would have a favourable ping for Korea over the others, and be quite poor for both EU and NA participants. Maybe only as bad as NA-EU though so I guess it's worth a shot, it gets lonely on SEA sometimes :3 As soon as someone mentioned SEA i knew you would fly into this thread haha i just had this feeling  On the other hand, this is going to be pretty cool; I hope the teams don't underestimate the 2v2 quality because that is what won EG the machinima - Ax and Strife looked really awesome in that tournament, and will be really hard to stop. Should be interesting to see how sixjax do.. very interesting. | ||
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nihlon
Sweden5581 Posts
On May 02 2011 20:22 {ToT}ColmA wrote: I think its stupid to even invite a clan like TL to stuff like this if the rules are like that cause lets be honest - games will not be fair due to blizzards retarded battle.net latency shit. The TSL solution might ve advantages over the EG solution but its still crap and far away from what would be considered "good conditions". On a sidenote i find it hilarious what jinro said 1 month ago bout TSL lag for koreans on US server and now this~ the perspective of a man always changes when he is involved i guess *edit* sad to not see empire invited, with their new invites i think they would be a good invite. Please read Jinro's post in this thread before you start making claims about his opinions that he doesn't represent. | ||
Liquid`Jinro
Sweden33723 Posts
On May 02 2011 20:22 {ToT}ColmA wrote: I think its stupid to even invite a clan like TL to stuff like this if the rules are like that cause lets be honest - games will not be fair due to blizzards retarded battle.net latency shit. The TSL solution might ve advantages over the EG solution but its still crap and far away from what would be considered "good conditions". On a sidenote i find it hilarious what jinro said 1 month ago bout TSL lag for koreans on US server and now this~ the perspective of a man always changes when he is involved i guess *edit* sad to not see empire invited, with their new invites i think they would be a good invite. ...... How many times do I have to address this? I am asking for the SAME conditions as TSL, which I PLAYED IN. I played TSL FROM Korea. I am asking for the same TSL conditions that I defended then. Its seriously fucking annoying the way people try to twist it like that. On May 02 2011 20:24 nihlon wrote: Well, Huk and Jinro basically declined the NASL because of the playing conditions (lag and time concerns) so I don't take it as any surprise they turn down a team event in NA when have half the team in Korea. It was mostly the time for me. | ||
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cuppatea
United Kingdom1401 Posts
On May 02 2011 20:05 eGo.SiGns wrote: I really dont understand all this hatred towards implementing 2vs2s. Its just 1 game, while 4 games are still 1vs1. If your teams is that much better and you win all 1vs1, you dont even need those 2vs2 anyway - even though i would assume they will play out all 5 games, at least thats what happens normally - . Yeah, they may be some imbalances in 2on2 because blizzard cant balance 2vs2 in the same way they do 1vs1, but all those players know these imbalances and can react accordingly. Their is no strategy in 2on2 thats completly unbeatable , even though it may force you to pit 2 players together just because you want 2 specific races playing together. And plz, dont start with stuff like "2v2 is boring and unskilled", there are many people out there, that enjoy watching a nice 2v2 game, and if it were that unskilled, how come the same players always seem to shine in these team competitions? IMO it actually requires more skills, because the whole aspect of working together with your partner is completly new. The skills as such may not have the same "deepth" , but you obviously need new and other skills additionally to your outstanding micro,marco, observational skills. Greetings, SiGns With 2v2's making up a quarter of the games prior to the ace match a team only needs to win 1 out of 3 1v1's to take it there. A team could have only 1 player who wins a 1v1 all season and still win this league. In fact EG won the MRI almost entirely through 2v2's and Idra ace matches, despite getting owned in the regular 1v1 portion almost every week (I wonder if this factored into EG's decision to include 2v2, since they're probably going to get a free point from it every match?). The reason 2v2 is such a terrible format, though, is because we aren't going to see dedicated 2v2 teams facing each other, we're just going to see a bunch of 1v1 players playing in 2v2's, with the teams that practice very little for it (probably Axslav/Strifecro) beating the teams that don't practice at all (almost everyone else). They might as well have 3 SC2 1v1's and then a game of Street Fighter 4 to decide the 4th point. | ||
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furcifer
Norway54 Posts
But from where I sit it doesn't look like you declined because of the rules of the tournament but more for the reason that EG wouldn't change them for your 3(?) players, living in Korea and that to me doesnt look like taking a stand at all, it looks more like arrogance. | ||
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sertman
United States540 Posts
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halvorg
Norway717 Posts
On May 02 2011 20:35 furcifer wrote: In my opinion, declining the invitation because you don't agree with the way they decided to run this league seems completely reasonable to me. But from where I sit it doesn't look like you declined because of the rules of the tournament but more for the reason that EG wouldn't change them for your 3(?) players, living in Korea and that to me doesnt look like taking a stand at all, it looks more like arrogance. Uhhh, whats the difference? | ||
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sc2olorin
292 Posts
On May 02 2011 14:23 Liquid`HayprO wrote: me and ret would destroy 2v2. it seems very strange that the people behind this team league keep talking about the players in kr. we are only 3 so thats not the major problem. the problem is that NA is starting to become the place to play at when it comes to leagues. thats just not the right move especially when most us players have moved to the eu server anyway. That may be true now, but if EG's main goal is to grow the NA scene (which it certainly seems to be), then their decision seems to be absolutely the right move. | ||
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Demonace34
United States2493 Posts
On May 02 2011 20:35 cuppatea wrote: With 2v2's making up a quarter of the games prior to the ace match a team only needs to win 1 out of 3 1v1's to take it there. A team could have only 1 player who wins a 1v1 all season and still win this league. In fact EG won the MRI almost entirely through 2v2's and Idra ace matches, despite getting owned in the regular 1v1 portion almost every week (I wonder if this factored into EG's decision to include 2v2, since they're probably going to get a free point from it every match?). The reason 2v2 is such a terrible format, though, is because we aren't going to see dedicated 2v2 teams facing each other, we're just going to see a bunch of 1v1 players playing in 2v2's, with the teams that practice very little for it (probably Axslav/Strifecro) beating the teams that don't practice at all (almost everyone else). They might as well have 3 SC2 1v1's and then a game of Street Fighter 4 to decide the 4th point. Horrible comparison, Micro and macro still come into play along with a ton of strategy. I think the only mirror team they should take out is ZZ. I think it adds some extra flair and a funny aspect to it. If people hate it that much, I'd rather it have a serious team format, and 2v2 for a 1k prizepool or something just for enjoyment of people who like that aspect of the game. | ||
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Zechs
United Kingdom321 Posts
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Stuv
Netherlands942 Posts
And to be on-topic: The 2vs2 really excites me, brings a new dimension into competitive team-play. | ||
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fabulously
Norway724 Posts
Gogo ROOT! | ||
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robih
Austria1086 Posts
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imweakless
757 Posts
i think they are better than sixjax and mym .. 2v2 is pretty exciting but i had a bad felling that it will not live to its hype | ||
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Ultramus
United States319 Posts
I mean have we gotten so spoiled that just the opportunity to participate in a league with a large prize pool so common that you can overlook it just because it puts a percentage of your players at a disadvantage? Where is the sense of self sacrifice for the team? Is it so impossible for 3 members of the team to experience lag to allow the other members to play, I mean it's TL's prerogative who they sent out to play anyways and they could limit the disadvantage that way. To attack the organizers is to insult the very invite they received in the first place. If you decline to play then do so respectfully. | ||
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Karma`
United Kingdom13 Posts
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Klive5ive
United Kingdom6056 Posts
On May 02 2011 14:23 Liquid`HayprO wrote: me and ret would destroy 2v2. it seems very strange that the people behind this team league keep talking about the players in kr. we are only 3 so thats not the major problem. the problem is that NA is starting to become the place to play at when it comes to leagues. thats just not the right move especially when most us players have moved to the eu server anyway. Why is that a bad move? Is that not the point though? To make it possible to play entirely on NA and make a good living? The long term goal would be for everyone to be able to make a name for themselves in their own regions and then join up occasionally for "best of the world" tournaments. I'd also really like to see you back up the claim that Ret and yourself would dominate in 2v2. Shame we won't get to see that. | ||
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SnapCall
94 Posts
On May 02 2011 11:49 iNcontroL wrote: TSL had a huge population of korean invites (so it makes sense to accommodate koreans/KR server) EG MC has 1 team with people on the kOR server and even then it isn't their whole team. Excluding Sen EVERY OTHER PLAYER is from NA/EU which has 10x better connection than korea. Why would the majority (VAST MAJORITY) take a hit to the benefit of TL and it's few players in korea? A NA team hosts a tourney on the NA server where it's casters/teams are mostly located and TL asks for an unreasonable exception and then slanders EG... not your finest moment Tyler. i'm not sure whether you think the request from TL is unreasonable, because the other teams would have decreased chances of winning vs TL or because of the inconvenience of switching servers. in either case i don't see why it matters how many players are playing from korea. if half the players are from korea, almost every game has to be played on altering servers and alot of players are affected by it. if only a small percentage of players is in korea, most games aren't affected at all. what im trying to say is, the lesser korean players are involved the lesser players have to alter servers/inconvenience is caused. think about the last EG tournament, where the winner of the "normal tournament" played idra for an extra price. if i recall correctly, everyone playing that weekend, excluding idra(who was still in korea back then), was from NA/EU and every game, excluding the one with idra, was played on NA. for the game vs idra however there was some kind of special rule. im not 100% sure on that, but i think all games were played on NA and idra got to choose all maps, regardless of who won the map before. do you think that was a an "unreasonable exception" too? | ||
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