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Recommended Games+ Show Spoiler ++ Show Spoiler [Game 1] +Poll: Recommend Soma vs Bisu Game 1?No (15) 56% If you have time (9) 33% Yes (3) 11% 27 total votes Your vote: Recommend Soma vs Bisu Game 1? (Vote): Yes
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Poll: Recommend Soma vs Bisu Game 2?Yes (43) 96% No (2) 4% If you have time (0) 0% 45 total votes Your vote: Recommend Soma vs Bisu Game 2? (Vote): Yes
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Poll: Recommend Soma vs Bisu Game 3?Yes (24) 89% If you have time (3) 11% No (0) 0% 27 total votes Your vote: Recommend Soma vs Bisu Game 3? (Vote): Yes
(Vote): No
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Poll: Recommend Soma vs Bisu Game 4?Yes (9) 47% If you have time (8) 42% No (2) 11% 19 total votes Your vote: Recommend Soma vs Bisu Game 4? (Vote): Yes
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Poll: Recommend Soma vs Bisu Game 5?Yes (31) 89% If you have time (3) 9% No (1) 3% 35 total votes Your vote: Recommend Soma vs Bisu Game 5? (Vote): Yes
(Vote): No
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Poll: Recommend Soma vs Bisu Game 6?Yes (25) 89% If you have time (2) 7% No (1) 4% 28 total votes Your vote: Recommend Soma vs Bisu Game 6? (Vote): Yes
(Vote): No
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Poll: Recommend Soma vs Bisu Game 7?No (29) 71% Yes (10) 24% If you have time (2) 5% 41 total votes Your vote: Recommend Soma vs Bisu Game 7? (Vote): Yes
(Vote): No
(Vote): If you have time
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On October 18 2025 00:03 Ze'ev wrote:Show nested quote +On October 17 2025 21:33 Bonyth wrote:
Bisu went for fast carriers (after corsairs). He skipped all gas-heavy upgrades, 2nd robotics etc in order to get them. Was that the correct choice? Who knows. But assuming it was a fine choice, his mistake was not unit composition, but how he handled the first fight where he ate in 1 moment 9 acid spores on all of his corsairs.
I have no idea how can't you guys see that. It's because of that micro mistake, how the game turned out in the end. If it wasn't for that, Bisu's chances to win would be much much higher. Yet, a lot of you decided, based on the outcome of the game, that it was the strategy that was bad. Who knows, maybe there are better strategies, but based on this game, I definitely cannot say that the strategical choice was bad. The micro was just that bad in that 1 moment. That aint the consequence of micro; I've never seen that amount of devourer/muta/scourge do anything but faceroll an army of bisu's size. Corsairs get dusted by devourer/muta.
I think once zerg gets that size of an air army, protoss is helpless without spellcaster support from HTs/DAs.
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On October 18 2025 00:24 Ideas wrote:Show nested quote +On October 18 2025 00:03 Ze'ev wrote:On October 17 2025 21:33 Bonyth wrote:
Bisu went for fast carriers (after corsairs). He skipped all gas-heavy upgrades, 2nd robotics etc in order to get them. Was that the correct choice? Who knows. But assuming it was a fine choice, his mistake was not unit composition, but how he handled the first fight where he ate in 1 moment 9 acid spores on all of his corsairs.
I have no idea how can't you guys see that. It's because of that micro mistake, how the game turned out in the end. If it wasn't for that, Bisu's chances to win would be much much higher. Yet, a lot of you decided, based on the outcome of the game, that it was the strategy that was bad. Who knows, maybe there are better strategies, but based on this game, I definitely cannot say that the strategical choice was bad. The micro was just that bad in that 1 moment. That aint the consequence of micro; I've never seen that amount of devourer/muta/scourge do anything but faceroll an army of bisu's size. Corsairs get dusted by devourer/muta. I think once zerg gets that size of an air army, protoss is helpless without spellcaster support from HTs/DAs. Agreed!
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On October 18 2025 00:24 Ideas wrote:Show nested quote +On October 18 2025 00:03 Ze'ev wrote:On October 17 2025 21:33 Bonyth wrote:
Bisu went for fast carriers (after corsairs). He skipped all gas-heavy upgrades, 2nd robotics etc in order to get them. Was that the correct choice? Who knows. But assuming it was a fine choice, his mistake was not unit composition, but how he handled the first fight where he ate in 1 moment 9 acid spores on all of his corsairs.
I have no idea how can't you guys see that. It's because of that micro mistake, how the game turned out in the end. If it wasn't for that, Bisu's chances to win would be much much higher. Yet, a lot of you decided, based on the outcome of the game, that it was the strategy that was bad. Who knows, maybe there are better strategies, but based on this game, I definitely cannot say that the strategical choice was bad. The micro was just that bad in that 1 moment. That aint the consequence of micro; I've never seen that amount of devourer/muta/scourge do anything but faceroll an army of bisu's size. Corsairs get dusted by devourer/muta. I think once zerg gets that size of an air army, protoss is helpless without spellcaster support from HTs/DAs.
Weird, some people don't see it that way.
If I were smarter, I could probably tell what is going on with last season's death valley, but it seems roaring currents is pretty cut and dried to me.
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On October 17 2025 23:12 Dante08 wrote:Show nested quote +On October 17 2025 19:00 TMNT wrote:On October 17 2025 16:15 Dante08 wrote:
Bisu choked so hard on Roaring Currents, wtf was he doing man. He had 2 reavers sitting in his base the whole game when Soma took the expansions outside his base. This is a bad read. Those 2 Reavers are all the ground army he had lol. You can use 2 Reavers to grab some Drones and run, you can't use them to fight mass Hydra. Plus, they're there to defend potential doom drop. Watch more games on this map and you'll realise when P go full skytoss on this map, they have to give up all the land for Z. You can't have enough to control both air AND land. Ideally it'll be 5 base P (3 bottom islands) vs 7 base Z (1 top island) and you fight until one side runs out of steam. Then why build the reavers? He could have at least used them to harass or join the main fight. Soma brought his hydras to fight whenever he could but Bisu just attacked randomly with only air units. Not saying he would have won but those reavers could have been really helpful in some of the fights.
To defend the main and nat in the earlier phase of the game when Carriers are not out yet, and the islands in the later phase. Isn't that obvious? The Reavers served their purpose. At that point in the game they're not that useful anymore. Visit the proleague thread and see the Mini vs Queen game on this map on 15 Oct to see the importance of the reavers during that phase. Since Protoss rushes for Carriers, Reavers are the only defence they have against Hydra bust.
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On October 18 2025 03:08 TMNT wrote:Show nested quote +On October 17 2025 23:12 Dante08 wrote:On October 17 2025 19:00 TMNT wrote:On October 17 2025 16:15 Dante08 wrote:
Bisu choked so hard on Roaring Currents, wtf was he doing man. He had 2 reavers sitting in his base the whole game when Soma took the expansions outside his base. This is a bad read. Those 2 Reavers are all the ground army he had lol. You can use 2 Reavers to grab some Drones and run, you can't use them to fight mass Hydra. Plus, they're there to defend potential doom drop. Watch more games on this map and you'll realise when P go full skytoss on this map, they have to give up all the land for Z. You can't have enough to control both air AND land. Ideally it'll be 5 base P (3 bottom islands) vs 7 base Z (1 top island) and you fight until one side runs out of steam. Then why build the reavers? He could have at least used them to harass or join the main fight. Soma brought his hydras to fight whenever he could but Bisu just attacked randomly with only air units. Not saying he would have won but those reavers could have been really helpful in some of the fights. To defend the main and nat in the earlier phase of the game when Carriers are not out yet, and the islands in the later phase. Isn't that obvious? The Reavers served their purpose. At that point in the game they're not that useful anymore. Visit the proleague thread and see the Mini vs Queen game on this map on 15 Oct to see the importance of the reavers during that phase. Since Protoss rushes for Carriers, Reavers are the only defence they have against Hydra bust.
That circumvents the question. Reavers are an unnecessary tech tree when going air. Even corsair reaver stopped being relevant back in 2000s. The question is limited duration until zerg can go air. You are trying to stop it, just like against terran you are trying to stop them getting a fourth expansion, or the other main. You are lucky against zerg because it takes 248s until zerg can research drop upgrades. However that is not time you can spend on unnecessary tech trees. Zerg also has the option to expand more. Even if you are on similar economy, the idea zerg can turtle and start doing what soma did in that game should scare you. You have to bring the fight to the zerg and bring it fast, or you won't catch zerg off guard. It won't happen with FEs when you relinquish total map control to zerg, zerg will only be emboldened by it and it won't happen with slow tech. Protoss players might be trying too hard to be perfectionists. Yes, zerg will dive at your army with mutalisks and try to hunt HTs. I said make archons and just weather zerg skirmishes until you can march on zerg creep, then your army will pay off. Nothing zerg has by this point can compare to zealots and archons. If zerg is smart it will stay behind with hydralisks waiting. If it has mutalisks, just walk up to its main and start causing havoc. Zerg cannot mix army and economy for long.
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Comments in this thread took me way back to the height of BW with the sweeping generalizations about certain matchups when a fan favorite would lose :')
However, there are bits of truth sprinkled throughout.
Bisu wasn't razor sharp here like he was versus Larva. Corsair control was surprisingly spotty. Decision making on that island map was perplexing. Corner cutting on game 7 versus Soma of all players was so deflating. You're playing Soma: make two cannons and be prepared to hunker down.
And I got to be honest as a zerg boi: I really don't care for Soma's playstyle. It's highly effective, but uninspiring. Doesn't have the range of Soulkey, the quirkiness of Larva, or even the textbook aptitude of Hero or Queen. Mass hydras. Mass speedlings. Muta switches upon Muta switches. Even when he destroyed big air, it took Bisu a-moving his carriers into the middle of the map to do it. He had no defilers or any other kind of follow up. Just more mass mutas and hydras.
Can't believe I'll be rooting for Snow, but that's what I'll be doing.
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On October 18 2025 10:58 MountainDewJunkie wrote:
Comments in this thread took me way back to the height of BW with the sweeping generalizations about certain matchups when a fan favorite would lose :')
However, there are bits of truth sprinkled throughout.
Bisu wasn't razor sharp here like he was versus Larva. Corsair control was surprisingly spotty. Decision making on that island map was perplexing. Corner cutting on game 7 versus Soma of all players was so deflating. You're playing Soma: make two cannons and be prepared to hunker down.
And I got to be honest as a zerg boi: I really don't care for Soma's playstyle. It's highly effective, but uninspiring. Doesn't have the range of Soulkey, the quirkiness of Larva, or even the textbook aptitude of Hero or Queen. Mass hydras. Mass speedlings. Muta switches upon Muta switches. Even when he destroyed big air, it took Bisu a-moving his carriers into the middle of the map to do it. He had no defilers or any other kind of follow up. Just more mass mutas and hydras.
Can't believe I'll be rooting for Snow, but that's what I'll be doing.
embrace soma
embrace bts
embrace early pool
embrace hydra bust
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What a great series that was, even coming off of Snow's amazing games. Inspiring stuff, though I was so sad and angry at + Show Spoiler +
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On October 17 2025 22:48 mtcn77 wrote:Show nested quote +On October 17 2025 22:22 Bonyth wrote:On October 17 2025 21:47 mtcn77 wrote:On October 17 2025 21:33 Bonyth wrote:
Bisu went for fast carriers (after corsairs). He skipped all gas-heavy upgrades, 2nd robotics etc in order to get them. Was that the correct choice? Who knows. But assuming it was a fine choice, his mistake was not unit composition, but how he handled the first fight where he ate in 1 moment 9 acid spores on all of his corsairs.
I have no idea how can't you guys see that. It's because of that micro mistake, how the game turned out in the end. If it wasn't for that, Bisu's chances to win would be much much higher. Yet, a lot of you decided, based on the outcome of the game, that it was the strategy that was bad. Who knows, maybe there are better strategies, but based on this game, I definitely cannot say that the strategical choice was bad. The micro was just that bad in that 1 moment. What are you suggesting? Devourers are going to 9 shot any target they go after, you can't hide. Acid spores have 2*2 spread. Corsair neutron flare has 3*3 spread, however %50 AoE is 1.5*1.5. %25 AoE is below devourer armor dps. I said this before. Just want to clarify, I don't understand your point. Oh, I got how I should say this so you guys can understand: bisu got wrapped in his own image persona. Since he is the first corsair protoss, he got caught fighting island map with his style. I called again and again you cannot win this map with how air protoss plays out, this is the landmark unit bisu couldn't back out off. This is what I meant all this time "protoss needs to play like at the beginning of the millenium." You make archons and corsairs are not the primary air defence. protoss is not obliged to make the life easy for zerg by stacking all corsairs in 1 place together Even if you spread, 9 devourers(let's take the bare minimum we both know there were at least 12) can spread too and if you A+ move, you have a 18*2 spread on however many corsairs you might have. This isn't like corsairs I told you which you have to attack in a 1.5*1.5 cone in order to put a dent in devourers' hp.
You are correct, corsairs are basically useless against devourers. But that's okay, because their job is to protect carriers and attack mutas / scourge. And it's where all the nice micro begins.
Zerg wants to his as many acid spores on as many corsairs as possible in the shortest ammount of time.
Protoss, in order to prevent that, wants to split his corsairs.
Zerg has a critical decision to make, as it's important to land acid spores on carriers too, but there are many leftover corsairs without acid spores. It is important, because devourers on their own don't have enough dps to fight protoss army on their own. So, this is where mutas come into play. If all the corsairs have acid spores on them, mutas won't be shutdown by them, but if some of the corsairs were left untouched, mutas won't make it to carriers.
Well, anyway, a fun micro battle.
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On October 18 2025 18:43 Bonyth wrote:Show nested quote +On October 17 2025 22:48 mtcn77 wrote:On October 17 2025 22:22 Bonyth wrote:On October 17 2025 21:47 mtcn77 wrote:On October 17 2025 21:33 Bonyth wrote:
Bisu went for fast carriers (after corsairs). He skipped all gas-heavy upgrades, 2nd robotics etc in order to get them. Was that the correct choice? Who knows. But assuming it was a fine choice, his mistake was not unit composition, but how he handled the first fight where he ate in 1 moment 9 acid spores on all of his corsairs.
I have no idea how can't you guys see that. It's because of that micro mistake, how the game turned out in the end. If it wasn't for that, Bisu's chances to win would be much much higher. Yet, a lot of you decided, based on the outcome of the game, that it was the strategy that was bad. Who knows, maybe there are better strategies, but based on this game, I definitely cannot say that the strategical choice was bad. The micro was just that bad in that 1 moment. What are you suggesting? Devourers are going to 9 shot any target they go after, you can't hide. Acid spores have 2*2 spread. Corsair neutron flare has 3*3 spread, however %50 AoE is 1.5*1.5. %25 AoE is below devourer armor dps. I said this before. Just want to clarify, I don't understand your point. Oh, I got how I should say this so you guys can understand: bisu got wrapped in his own image persona. Since he is the first corsair protoss, he got caught fighting island map with his style. I called again and again you cannot win this map with how air protoss plays out, this is the landmark unit bisu couldn't back out off. This is what I meant all this time "protoss needs to play like at the beginning of the millenium." You make archons and corsairs are not the primary air defence. protoss is not obliged to make the life easy for zerg by stacking all corsairs in 1 place together Even if you spread, 9 devourers(let's take the bare minimum we both know there were at least 12) can spread too and if you A+ move, you have a 18*2 spread on however many corsairs you might have. This isn't like corsairs I told you which you have to attack in a 1.5*1.5 cone in order to put a dent in devourers' hp. You are correct, corsairs are basically useless against devourers. But that's okay, because their job is to protect carriers and attack mutas / scourge. And it's where all the nice micro begins. Zerg wants to his as many acid spores on as many corsairs as possible in the shortest ammount of time. Protoss, in order to prevent that, wants to split his corsairs. Zerg has a critical decision to make, as it's important to land acid spores on carriers too, but there are many leftover corsairs without acid spores. It is important, because devourers on their own don't have enough dps to fight protoss army on their own. So, this is where mutas come into play. If all the corsairs have acid spores on them, mutas won't be shutdown by them, but if some of the corsairs were left untouched, mutas won't make it to carriers. Well, anyway, a fun micro battle.
Corsairs can go like storm dodging, moving 3 blocks apart, but then how do they attack AoE? All zerg has to do is a move into the protoss air fleet as soma did. The ball is in protoss' court. I think one has to appreciate soma's decisiveness. I've been ranting a lot about devourer muta combo lately.
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On October 18 2025 03:08 TMNT wrote:Show nested quote +On October 17 2025 23:12 Dante08 wrote:On October 17 2025 19:00 TMNT wrote:On October 17 2025 16:15 Dante08 wrote:
Bisu choked so hard on Roaring Currents, wtf was he doing man. He had 2 reavers sitting in his base the whole game when Soma took the expansions outside his base. This is a bad read. Those 2 Reavers are all the ground army he had lol. You can use 2 Reavers to grab some Drones and run, you can't use them to fight mass Hydra. Plus, they're there to defend potential doom drop. Watch more games on this map and you'll realise when P go full skytoss on this map, they have to give up all the land for Z. You can't have enough to control both air AND land. Ideally it'll be 5 base P (3 bottom islands) vs 7 base Z (1 top island) and you fight until one side runs out of steam. Then why build the reavers? He could have at least used them to harass or join the main fight. Soma brought his hydras to fight whenever he could but Bisu just attacked randomly with only air units. Not saying he would have won but those reavers could have been really helpful in some of the fights. To defend the main and nat in the earlier phase of the game when Carriers are not out yet, and the islands in the later phase. Isn't that obvious? The Reavers served their purpose. At that point in the game they're not that useful anymore. Visit the proleague thread and see the Mini vs Queen game on this map on 15 Oct to see the importance of the reavers during that phase. Since Protoss rushes for Carriers, Reavers are the only defence they have against Hydra bust.
Why in the world would you build reavers just to defend, if he wanted to defend hydras in main just use HTs. Bisu did eventually tech to HTs but not before he lost the first big fight. If he got a few HTs the first fight looks completely different.
Bisu is just bad at this kind of non-standard fights and it showed in his game vs Larva ad well.
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On October 19 2025 00:43 Dante08 wrote:Show nested quote +On October 18 2025 03:08 TMNT wrote:On October 17 2025 23:12 Dante08 wrote:On October 17 2025 19:00 TMNT wrote:On October 17 2025 16:15 Dante08 wrote:
Bisu choked so hard on Roaring Currents, wtf was he doing man. He had 2 reavers sitting in his base the whole game when Soma took the expansions outside his base. This is a bad read. Those 2 Reavers are all the ground army he had lol. You can use 2 Reavers to grab some Drones and run, you can't use them to fight mass Hydra. Plus, they're there to defend potential doom drop. Watch more games on this map and you'll realise when P go full skytoss on this map, they have to give up all the land for Z. You can't have enough to control both air AND land. Ideally it'll be 5 base P (3 bottom islands) vs 7 base Z (1 top island) and you fight until one side runs out of steam. Then why build the reavers? He could have at least used them to harass or join the main fight. Soma brought his hydras to fight whenever he could but Bisu just attacked randomly with only air units. Not saying he would have won but those reavers could have been really helpful in some of the fights. To defend the main and nat in the earlier phase of the game when Carriers are not out yet, and the islands in the later phase. Isn't that obvious? The Reavers served their purpose. At that point in the game they're not that useful anymore. Visit the proleague thread and see the Mini vs Queen game on this map on 15 Oct to see the importance of the reavers during that phase. Since Protoss rushes for Carriers, Reavers are the only defence they have against Hydra bust. Why in the world would you build reavers just to defend, if he wanted to defend hydras in main just use HTs. Bisu did eventually tech to HTs but not before he lost the first big fight. If he got a few HTs the first fight looks completely different. Bisu is just bad at this kind of non-standard fights and it showed in his game vs Larva ad well.
Such a weird question. Think about it:
- If Protoss can "just use HTs", why do they even have to bother going through Reaver tech before Templar tech in PvT?
- If Protoss can "just use HTs" to defend Hydras, why do they have to build 6-8 Cannons against Hydra bust on normal maps. Wouldn't it be better to just storm the Hydras?
In the context of this build and this map, P needs a Robo anyway to drop the Probe on the islands for his 3rd. After that it's one building away from the Reaver. Imagine going for Templar tech after that Robo, when all your gas is going into the Double Stargate anyway? By the time you are able to get the first storm out, you'd already lose your nat lol.
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On October 19 2025 00:43 Dante08 wrote:Show nested quote +On October 18 2025 03:08 TMNT wrote:On October 17 2025 23:12 Dante08 wrote:On October 17 2025 19:00 TMNT wrote:On October 17 2025 16:15 Dante08 wrote:
Bisu choked so hard on Roaring Currents, wtf was he doing man. He had 2 reavers sitting in his base the whole game when Soma took the expansions outside his base. This is a bad read. Those 2 Reavers are all the ground army he had lol. You can use 2 Reavers to grab some Drones and run, you can't use them to fight mass Hydra. Plus, they're there to defend potential doom drop. Watch more games on this map and you'll realise when P go full skytoss on this map, they have to give up all the land for Z. You can't have enough to control both air AND land. Ideally it'll be 5 base P (3 bottom islands) vs 7 base Z (1 top island) and you fight until one side runs out of steam. Then why build the reavers? He could have at least used them to harass or join the main fight. Soma brought his hydras to fight whenever he could but Bisu just attacked randomly with only air units. Not saying he would have won but those reavers could have been really helpful in some of the fights. To defend the main and nat in the earlier phase of the game when Carriers are not out yet, and the islands in the later phase. Isn't that obvious? The Reavers served their purpose. At that point in the game they're not that useful anymore. Visit the proleague thread and see the Mini vs Queen game on this map on 15 Oct to see the importance of the reavers during that phase. Since Protoss rushes for Carriers, Reavers are the only defence they have against Hydra bust. Why in the world would you build reavers just to defend, if he wanted to defend hydras in main just use HTs. Bisu did eventually tech to HTs but not before he lost the first big fight. If he got a few HTs the first fight looks completely different. Bisu is just bad at this kind of non-standard fights and it showed in his game vs Larva ad well.
Don't argue with him. It is the sort of person who brings up having ground defences up in an air fight discussion. I salute the cognitive bias to bring up shuttles to ferry probes to the islands when you could avoid them altogether and expand to your natural and third expansions like normal people. What else, you could even recall them if you are so adamant at expanding there once you have completely gained ground superiority over the zerg. Every new tech tree is lost time and money until zerg gets the upper hand.
Protoss can almost coast to victory once the initial muta rush threat is dealt with. Mutas are 138s tech, not including the mutalisk spawning duration. Archons are 157.5s tech, including the HT and meld duration. You can summon archons 5.5 seconds faster than the first mutalisk is even hatched. Make a cannon where the zerg will dive and put an archon in their path to deter them. If zerg attacks your archon, move it closer to your cannon. If it attacks the cannon, move it closer to the mutalisks. Once your initial bases are secure, just put them out of their misery with speed zealots and archons. You can postpone robotics facility for quite some time, it is not as if zerg will suddenly switch to lurkers, it takes a lot out of the brunt of the mutalisk rush. Your answer to the mutalisk rush is making an archon and a photon cannon for every third mutalisk and you have only spent as much as zerg has.
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On October 18 2025 10:58 MountainDewJunkie wrote:
Can't believe I'll be rooting for Snow, but that's what I'll be doing.
20 points from Huffle and see you in court.
I really don't care for Soma's playstyle. It's highly effective, but uninspiring. Doesn't have the range of Soulkey, the quirkiness of Larva, or even the textbook aptitude of Hero or Queen. Mass hydras. Mass speedlings.
I've seen soma flank a retreating army and block it with lurker eggs. Or micro like one ling at the 15 minute mark. I'm pretty sure he can do anything, he's just naturally lean and micro based. He's a 90 minute movie where each scene slides in like a jenga. These other zergs, however, have more filler than Kim K's ass. You call it range, I call it needlessly delaying the W.
You may not like it, or think it's boring, but it's like crapping on a great tagliatelle bolognese. Speaking of which, Snow's PvZ is more uninspired than Olive Garden breadsticks look it up they're bad.
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On October 19 2025 07:41 RogerChillingworth wrote:Show nested quote +On October 18 2025 10:58 MountainDewJunkie wrote:
Can't believe I'll be rooting for Snow, but that's what I'll be doing.
20 points from Huffle and see you in court. Show nested quote +
I really don't care for Soma's playstyle. It's highly effective, but uninspiring. Doesn't have the range of Soulkey, the quirkiness of Larva, or even the textbook aptitude of Hero or Queen. Mass hydras. Mass speedlings.
I've seen soma flank a retreating army and block it with lurker eggs. Or micro like one ling at the 15 minute mark. I'm pretty sure he can do anything, he's just naturally lean and micro based. He's a 90 minute movie where each scene slides in like a jenga. These other zergs, however, have more filler than Kim K's ass. You call it range , I call it needlessly delaying the W. You may not like it, or think it's boring, but it's like crapping on a great tagliatelle bolognese. Speaking of which, Snow's PvZ is more uninspired than Olive Garden breadsticks look it up they're bad.
Yes. He is like july.
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People seem to call it "abusing the matchup", but that's literally using his race to its highest effect. It's not on him to do something different, it's on his opponents to figure out how to counter the swarm. He's larping as the overmind, it's great.
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On October 19 2025 07:26 mtcn77 wrote:
Don't argue with him. It is the sort of person who brings up having ground defences up in an air fight discussion. I salute the cognitive bias to bring up shuttles to ferry probes to the islands when you could avoid them altogether and expand to your natural and third expansions like normal people. What else, you could even recall them if you are so adamant at expanding there once you have completely gained ground superiority over the zerg. Every new tech tree is lost time and money until zerg gets the upper hand.
Protoss can almost coast to victory once the initial muta rush threat is dealt with. Mutas are 138s tech, not including the mutalisk spawning duration. Archons are 157.5s tech, including the HT and meld duration. You can summon archons 5.5 seconds faster than the first mutalisk is even hatched. Make a cannon where the zerg will dive and put an archon in their path to deter them. If zerg attacks your archon, move it closer to your cannon. If it attacks the cannon, move it closer to the mutalisks. Once your initial bases are secure, just put them out of their misery with speed zealots and archons. You can postpone robotics facility for quite some time, it is not as if zerg will suddenly switch to lurkers, it takes a lot out of the brunt of the mutalisk rush. Your answer to the mutalisk rush is making an archon and a photon cannon for every third mutalisk and you have only spent as much as zerg has.
Wow, such ground breaking idea. Why has no one ever thought about "If zerg attacks your archon, move it closer to your cannon. If it attacks the cannon, move it closer to the mutalisks?
But out of curiosity, why are you talking about how to defend Muta rush why absolutely no one is asking?
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On October 19 2025 18:34 TMNT wrote:Show nested quote +On October 19 2025 07:26 mtcn77 wrote:
Don't argue with him. It is the sort of person who brings up having ground defences up in an air fight discussion. I salute the cognitive bias to bring up shuttles to ferry probes to the islands when you could avoid them altogether and expand to your natural and third expansions like normal people. What else, you could even recall them if you are so adamant at expanding there once you have completely gained ground superiority over the zerg. Every new tech tree is lost time and money until zerg gets the upper hand.
Protoss can almost coast to victory once the initial muta rush threat is dealt with. Mutas are 138s tech, not including the mutalisk spawning duration. Archons are 157.5s tech, including the HT and meld duration. You can summon archons 5.5 seconds faster than the first mutalisk is even hatched. Make a cannon where the zerg will dive and put an archon in their path to deter them. If zerg attacks your archon, move it closer to your cannon. If it attacks the cannon, move it closer to the mutalisks. Once your initial bases are secure, just put them out of their misery with speed zealots and archons. You can postpone robotics facility for quite some time, it is not as if zerg will suddenly switch to lurkers, it takes a lot out of the brunt of the mutalisk rush. Your answer to the mutalisk rush is making an archon and a photon cannon for every third mutalisk and you have only spent as much as zerg has. Wow, such ground breaking idea. Why has no one ever thought about "If zerg attacks your archon, move it closer to your cannon. If it attacks the cannon, move it closer to the mutalisks? But out of curiosity, why are you talking about how to defend Muta rush why absolutely no one is asking?
Your answer was "reavers" if anybody is making excuses for nonsense. Somebody has to point out your ignorance. I just want to talk starcraft if that is any business of yours.
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On October 19 2025 20:55 mtcn77 wrote:Show nested quote +On October 19 2025 18:34 TMNT wrote:On October 19 2025 07:26 mtcn77 wrote:
Don't argue with him. It is the sort of person who brings up having ground defences up in an air fight discussion. I salute the cognitive bias to bring up shuttles to ferry probes to the islands when you could avoid them altogether and expand to your natural and third expansions like normal people. What else, you could even recall them if you are so adamant at expanding there once you have completely gained ground superiority over the zerg. Every new tech tree is lost time and money until zerg gets the upper hand.
Protoss can almost coast to victory once the initial muta rush threat is dealt with. Mutas are 138s tech, not including the mutalisk spawning duration. Archons are 157.5s tech, including the HT and meld duration. You can summon archons 5.5 seconds faster than the first mutalisk is even hatched. Make a cannon where the zerg will dive and put an archon in their path to deter them. If zerg attacks your archon, move it closer to your cannon. If it attacks the cannon, move it closer to the mutalisks. Once your initial bases are secure, just put them out of their misery with speed zealots and archons. You can postpone robotics facility for quite some time, it is not as if zerg will suddenly switch to lurkers, it takes a lot out of the brunt of the mutalisk rush. Your answer to the mutalisk rush is making an archon and a photon cannon for every third mutalisk and you have only spent as much as zerg has. Wow, such ground breaking idea. Why has no one ever thought about "If zerg attacks your archon, move it closer to your cannon. If it attacks the cannon, move it closer to the mutalisks? But out of curiosity, why are you talking about how to defend Muta rush why absolutely no one is asking? Your answer was "reavers" if anybody is making excuses for nonsense. Somebody has to point out your ignorance. I just want to talk starcraft if that is any business of yours.
I'm sorry. but... are you actually stupid?
- The guy asked "why build Reavers to defend Hydras?"
- I explained that "in the context of Bisu's build, which is to rush Carriers asap and abandon the traditional ground army, he needs Reavers to defend Hydras"
- You came in to ramble about defending Muta rush and attacking Zerg with Speedlots and Archons, then calling me ignorant?
Wtf is wrong with your brain?
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really... protoss lost to zerg again in a semi finals setting... omg... chocking
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EPT
