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Recommended Games+ Show Spoiler ++ Show Spoiler [Game 1] +Poll: Recommend Soma vs BeSt Game 1?Yes (6) 55% If you have time (5) 45% No (0) 0% 11 total votes Your vote: Recommend Soma vs BeSt Game 1? (Vote): Yes
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Poll: Recommend Soma vs BeSt Game 2?No (13) 93% Yes (1) 7% If you have time (0) 0% 14 total votes Your vote: Recommend Soma vs BeSt Game 2? (Vote): Yes
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Poll: Recommend Soma vs BeSt Game 3?Yes (11) 92% If you have time (1) 8% No (0) 0% 12 total votes Your vote: Recommend Soma vs BeSt Game 3? (Vote): Yes
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Poll: Recommend Soma vs BeSt Game 4?No (5) 63% If you have time (3) 38% Yes (0) 0% 8 total votes Your vote: Recommend Soma vs BeSt Game 4? (Vote): Yes
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Poll: Recommend Soma vs BeSt Game 5?No (6) 67% If you have time (3) 33% Yes (0) 0% 9 total votes Your vote: Recommend Soma vs BeSt Game 5? (Vote): Yes
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Poll: Recommend Soma vs BeSt Game 6?No (6) 46% If you have time (5) 38% Yes (2) 15% 13 total votes Your vote: Recommend Soma vs BeSt Game 6? (Vote): Yes
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Poll: Recommend Soma vs BeSt Game 7?If you have time (10) 59% No (5) 29% Yes (2) 12% 17 total votes Your vote: Recommend Soma vs BeSt Game 7? (Vote): Yes
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On September 29 2025 20:55 TMNT wrote:Show nested quote +On September 29 2025 20:48 RowdierBob wrote:
Best macros like no one else and yet tries to get way too fancy with his builds today. Soma way too good. If he tried standard builds, he would have lost 0 4. It's Best's (and Soma's) offbeat builds that got him the 2 wins today (33% seems about right). But Zerg's got more tricks and Soma's got better early micro. Tbh if Soma had gone for standard macro the result would probably have been the same, but I guess this got the job done for him without more intense effort.
I dunno. The closest thing we had to a macro game Best won pretty handily. I agree he would’ve still prob lost but I think it was his best chance to win too.
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On September 29 2025 20:58 RowdierBob wrote:Show nested quote +On September 29 2025 20:55 TMNT wrote:On September 29 2025 20:48 RowdierBob wrote:
Best macros like no one else and yet tries to get way too fancy with his builds today. Soma way too good. If he tried standard builds, he would have lost 0 4. It's Best's (and Soma's) offbeat builds that got him the 2 wins today (33% seems about right). But Zerg's got more tricks and Soma's got better early micro. Tbh if Soma had gone for standard macro the result would probably have been the same, but I guess this got the job done for him without more intense effort. I dunno. The closest thing we had to a macro game Best won pretty handily. I agree he would’ve still prob lost but I think it was his best chance to win too.
It wasn't a standard game though. Some went for 3 Hatch Lair with both Spire and Hydra, then lost his Spire and the Mutas did nothing. Best went for a Core expand and got the early scout with Sair. Protoss defends that and most of the times a solid macro follow up is enough to kill Zerg, which was what happenned.
The loss on Uldolmok was so unnecessary. He saw the early Lair and just assumed "it's quick Muta/Lurker, no way he ling rushes on such distance, no need to have a wall with cannon then". Well, then Soma ling rushed.
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On September 29 2025 20:57 [sc1f]eonzerg wrote:Show nested quote +On September 29 2025 20:56 RJBTVYOUTUBE wrote:
Soma has learned from Soulkey's style. Difference is however Soma has the best zerg micro, and the best macro too. Hope he can maintain form in ro4 and maybe finals. I was actually thinking that SOma is not bullshit a Jaedong 3.0 from the Kespa era. The insane mechanics and way more refined and insane game knowledge. If not same than Soulkey close to him for sure.
imo soma always had the potential to be the best, he just needed to accept this fact and fix his mental
being removed from the scene while SK won everything was such a great opportunity to learn and observe. there's nothing SK could do that soma can't do better
sometimes you just need to watch players that are arguably worse than yourself which for some reason do much better in specific circumstances and learn from that
also some things just take a bit of time until it kinda clicks and suddenly what was hard becomes easy. if anyone remembers how JD entered the scene and was this absolute monster in vs Z and T but somehow struggled against protoss?
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I think you guys are crazy and drunk on this (very unimpressive win because Best is just terrible mentally and also against this style in particular).
Soulkey is a monster macro player. Sure Soma has better micro but Soma has no comeback potential in his games, he gets into his mindgames and switches whilst Soulkey actually has Plan B's and Plan C's even from dire situations. That's why he won it 4 times.
Soma a lot of the times folds like a cheap tent if his main strategy fails. He's nowhere near the champion SK is.
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On September 29 2025 21:25 oxKnu wrote:
I think you guys are crazy and drunk on this (very unimpressive win because Best is just terrible mentally and also against this style in particular).
Soulkey is a monster macro player. Sure Soma has better micro but Soma has no comeback potential in his games, he gets into his mindgames and switches whilst Soulkey actually has Plan B's and Plan C's even from dire situations. That's why he won it 4 times.
Soma a lot of the times folds like a cheap tent if his main strategy fails. He's nowhere near the champion SK is.
Maybe try watching something else than ASL and u will understand. You are downplaying the most dominant online zerg player from the past 5 years lol. But like Snow he never managed to get an ASL. But every single progamer respect Soma. In fact FlaSh value him super high for killing 1-1-1. He introduced boosting. Created new metas for zerg. But yeah if you just watch ASL and see him getting elimanted all the time i can see how you see him as overrated.
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Best's mentality actually looked pretty decent to me during this entire season.
Like, he was outclassed mechanically and tactically today, and in some games, like the last one, strategically.
But his mental looked better than ever to me. Looks like he's starting to actually develop champion qualities in how he prepares for the series and how he handles things going off the rails. Started last season, but this season was very noticeable to me.
Maybe I'm coping, but IMO he's growing.
Maybe it was just low pressure of facing Soma (in other words, no expectations on him), but he performed well even when there were expectations - where he used to always fold.
And Soma is a monster, yeah. He's always been an innovator with crazy mechanics, and tbh all he needed was time to flourish.
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On September 29 2025 21:40 [sc1f]eonzerg wrote:Show nested quote +On September 29 2025 21:25 oxKnu wrote:
I think you guys are crazy and drunk on this (very unimpressive win because Best is just terrible mentally and also against this style in particular).
Soulkey is a monster macro player. Sure Soma has better micro but Soma has no comeback potential in his games, he gets into his mindgames and switches whilst Soulkey actually has Plan B's and Plan C's even from dire situations. That's why he won it 4 times.
Soma a lot of the times folds like a cheap tent if his main strategy fails. He's nowhere near the champion SK is. Maybe try watching something else than ASL and u will understand. You are downplaying the most dominant online zerg player from the past 5 years lol. But like Snow he never managed to get an ASL. But every single progamer respect Soma. In fact FlaSh value him super high for killing 1-1-1. He introduced boosting. Created new metas for zerg. But yeah if you just watch ASL and see him getting elimanted all the time i can see how you see him as overrated.
I don't think he is overrated. I was actually defending him before he made that ASL final where people were cornering him as some sort of matchup specialist(?).
But there is a clear difference between him and Soulkey. SK is a precious gem of the game overall. Soma is just a contender for now.
I hope Bisu comes through because his style will showcase Soma's weaknesses if that series actually has some decent games. Soma will make mince meat out of players that can't Corsair micro. Bisu is a different game.
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On September 29 2025 21:41 Soulforged wrote:
Best's mentality actually looked pretty decent to me during this entire season.
Like, he was outclassed mechanically and tactically today, and in some games, like the last one, strategically.
But his mental looked better than ever to me. Looks like he's starting to actually develop champion qualities in how he prepares for the series and how he handles things going off the rails. Started last season, but this season was very noticeable to me.
Maybe I'm coping, but IMO he's growing.
Maybe it was just low pressure of facing Soma (in other words, no expectations on him), but he performed well even when there were expectations - where he used to always fold.
And Soma is a monster, yeah. He's always been an innovator with crazy mechanics, and tbh all he needed was time to flourish.
I don't think he is growing that much. Must be frustrating to always falter mentally towards the end of tournaments. But what was different now is that he knew and identified that he cannot play standard vs Soma. Even though it ended up being ugly in the end, the mindset was to change strategy which, believe it or not, he was not willing to even consider a few ASLs back. From that point of view, that was obvious.
That's actually one of the critique's of the other pros, for him and Queen in general. Well, plus the fact that he cannot micro Sairs, which is basically a running joke at this point.
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On September 29 2025 21:41 Soulforged wrote:
Best's mentality actually looked pretty decent to me during this entire season.
Like, he was outclassed mechanically and tactically today, and in some games, like the last one, strategically.
But his mental looked better than ever to me. Looks like he's starting to actually develop champion qualities in how he prepares for the series and how he handles things going off the rails. Started last season, but this season was very noticeable to me.
Maybe I'm coping, but IMO he's growing.
Maybe it was just low pressure of facing Soma (in other words, no expectations on him), but he performed well even when there were expectations - where he used to always fold.
And Soma is a monster, yeah. He's always been an innovator with crazy mechanics, and tbh all he needed was time to flourish.
Couldn't have said it better
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Honestly, Soma didn't play great. He looked pretty shaky. And the pressure is only going to increase...
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Best used to have problems of tunnel vision on strategy, likely caused by excess optimization, making him very predictable. He was literally trying to outplay everyone on mechanics and stability alone.
Think the series that started him exploring other paths more was the one-sided ASL beatdown Mini gave him a while back.
The other problem he had was straight up nerves, getting too shaky, too much adrenaline, the heavier the expectations and the further he's in. When he's a complete underdog that usually doesn't rise, but when he has a shot or god forbid is a favorite in a ro8 or further in, he used to completely fold.
Idk any solutions to that besides exposure therapy, some people start stone cold, some need a lot of experience, and Best over the years has been one of the worst offenders.
There's a running joke that a silver miner can only win a finals against another silver miner, because they both choke. And Best is the ultimate silver miner.
But now? It kind of seemed that he's getting there. His performance didn't really drop. I gave up hopes on Best many years ago, but now I'm starting to hope again.
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For a non-Jaedong ZvP to only have a single game recommended, that pretty much screams that the Zerg player won the series but probably lost the recommended game. If it were a Jaedong series, the opposite would be true.
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On September 29 2025 21:40 [sc1f]eonzerg wrote:Show nested quote +On September 29 2025 21:25 oxKnu wrote:
I think you guys are crazy and drunk on this (very unimpressive win because Best is just terrible mentally and also against this style in particular).
Soulkey is a monster macro player. Sure Soma has better micro but Soma has no comeback potential in his games, he gets into his mindgames and switches whilst Soulkey actually has Plan B's and Plan C's even from dire situations. That's why he won it 4 times.
Soma a lot of the times folds like a cheap tent if his main strategy fails. He's nowhere near the champion SK is. Maybe try watching something else than ASL and u will understand. You are downplaying the most dominant online zerg player from the past 5 years lol. But like Snow he never managed to get an ASL. But every single progamer respect Soma. In fact FlaSh value him super high for killing 1-1-1. He introduced boosting. Created new metas for zerg. But yeah if you just watch ASL and see him getting elimanted all the time i can see how you see him as overrated.
Wasn't it that just a few months ago when I said Zerg only looked weak because they were missing Soma and you said that we didn't even know if he would recover after military? Now he's the most online dominant in the past 5 years? So with Queen's back to back ASL, Soulkey's 4 peat, Hero making top 4 regularly and Soma being the most online dominant, doesn't look like Zerg was that weak and it was only Soulkey like you guys used to claim?
Anyway, not disagreeing with your post here. Just trying to point out that how absurd it is that in the past 2 years you used Soma in the military as evidence for ZvP not favouring Zerg.
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On September 29 2025 22:37 TMNT wrote:Show nested quote +On September 29 2025 21:40 [sc1f]eonzerg wrote:On September 29 2025 21:25 oxKnu wrote:
I think you guys are crazy and drunk on this (very unimpressive win because Best is just terrible mentally and also against this style in particular).
Soulkey is a monster macro player. Sure Soma has better micro but Soma has no comeback potential in his games, he gets into his mindgames and switches whilst Soulkey actually has Plan B's and Plan C's even from dire situations. That's why he won it 4 times.
Soma a lot of the times folds like a cheap tent if his main strategy fails. He's nowhere near the champion SK is. Maybe try watching something else than ASL and u will understand. You are downplaying the most dominant online zerg player from the past 5 years lol. But like Snow he never managed to get an ASL. But every single progamer respect Soma. In fact FlaSh value him super high for killing 1-1-1. He introduced boosting. Created new metas for zerg. But yeah if you just watch ASL and see him getting elimanted all the time i can see how you see him as overrated. Wasn't it that just a few months ago when I said Zerg only looked weak because they were missing Soma and you said that we didn't even know if he would recover after military? Now he's the most online dominant in the past 5 years? So with Queen's back to back ASL, Soulkey's 4 peat, Hero making top 4 regularly and Soma being the most online dominant, doesn't look like Zerg was that weak and it was only Soulkey like you guys used to claim? Anyway, not disagreeing with your post here. Just trying to point out that how absurd it is that in the past 2 years you used Soma in the military as evidence for ZvP not favouring Zerg.
Well i wasnt sure how in form Soma will be after the miltary. And even when Soma was doing really good he wasnt doing good in ASL it doesnt really change that much. Zerg online And offline was struggling hardcore apart from SK. The queen ASLs zerg was doing good actually cant deny that. It was not only Soma tho. Larva quit. Effort quit. QUeen insane slump. Jaedong been mediocre since ever. And Hero is also under performing lately. You cant deny that apart from SK zerg wasnt doing well. Is funny cuz is not like SK help that much online. SO is basically Some the online zerg goat lol.
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On September 29 2025 21:09 Kraekkling wrote:
There's nothing SK could do that soma can't do better
sometimes you just need to watch players that are arguably worse than yourself which for some reason do much better in specific circumstances and learn from that.
This is such a petty take. Soma and SK have different styles, Soma is more flashy and more entertaining, but soulkey excels at areas where other zergs are nowhere close to him. One of them is his scouting, specially against Terran. For instance, he always keeps a few annoying hyperactive zerglings at the Terran entrance to scout, create/fake the threat of a ling flood and bait marines out of position. His trademark marine crushing move starts with that. And of course there is his survivability to constant pressure, specially against Terran, that earned him the nickname of iron wall.
Soma's ZvT is good, but it's never been near peak Soulkey level.
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I thought iron wall nickname was cuz of his unbreakable defense and never dying when defiler is out lol
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On September 29 2025 23:10 [sc1f]eonzerg wrote:
I thought iron wall nickname was cuz of his unbreakable defense and never dying when defiler is out lol
Yes, but that's the thing with SK. If you are thinking that that's what makes him special it's a gross disservice to him. He managed to transcend that role and is now a multiple year champion.
Soma has a lot of ground to cover. A lot.
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Honestly, Soma didn't play great. He looked pretty shaky. And the pressure is only going to increase...
What??? Guy came back twice this series, if that wasn't big pressure then I don't know what is... In game on Dominator he was clinical. On Litmus it was pure dominance and fresh mind. His decision was really accurate I wouldn't call him shaky.
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On September 29 2025 23:17 oxKnu wrote:Show nested quote +On September 29 2025 23:10 [sc1f]eonzerg wrote:
I thought iron wall nickname was cuz of his unbreakable defense and never dying when defiler is out lol Yes, but that's the thing with SK. If you are thinking that that's what makes him special it's a gross disservice to him. He managed to transcend that role and is now a multiple year champion. Soma has a lot of ground to cover. A lot.
So does Soulkey. Soulkey would be an absolute bonjwa if he focused more on his early game mining and set ups. Soulkey was never the "best" online zerg player for even more than 2-3 weeks when proleague is the most important platform for a player's earnings. (not asl). Think of ASL as an incentive, like a year-end bonus based on some performance. Most of their income comes from proleague and Soma has always been the best performing zerg in proleague with his early game mineral optimization, advantageous setup to snowball into favorable macro game for him, and carefully crafted builds. The only thing Soma lacks is really the standard game that Soulkey has. Soulkey is the best "standard" player while Soma is closely catching up to his powess.
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On September 29 2025 23:18 Kespa1988 wrote:Show nested quote +Honestly, Soma didn't play great. He looked pretty shaky. And the pressure is only going to increase... What??? Guy came back twice this series, if that wasn't big pressure then I don't know what is... In game on Dominator he was clinical. On Litmus it was pure dominance and fresh mind. His decision was really accurate I wouldn't call him shaky.
It took me a while to figure out what you meant. 'Came back', as in, he was a game down?
OK. Both of those were basically gifts. Best didn't build his wall in one of those...
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EPT
