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[ASL10] Ro8 Day 2 - Page 9

Forum Index > Brood War Tournaments
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WombaT
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Northern Ireland27478 Posts
October 22 2020 09:21 GMT
#161
As a relative noob, how is Soma so good as an amateur? Seems the rest of people doing well range from legendary pro gamers like Flash and at the lowest were at least on pro teams.
'You'll always be the cuddly marsupial of my heart, despite the inherent flaws of your ancestry' - Squat
TL+ Member
ggsimida
Profile Joined August 2015
1156 Posts
October 22 2020 09:52 GMT
#162
On October 22 2020 18:21 WombaT wrote:
As a relative noob, how is Soma so good as an amateur? Seems the rest of people doing well range from legendary pro gamers like Flash and at the lowest were at least on pro teams.


apparently soma knows Larva personally, which i assume help him establish connections to other players in the expro clique and thus gain lots of exclusive practice opportunities with them. the other amateurs are relatively more isolated and/or not as well connected/related to the expros.
TornadoSteve
Profile Joined March 2018
1147 Posts
October 22 2020 10:08 GMT
#163
This is bs, if your results speak for itself youll make connection and relation yourself
evilfatsh1t
Profile Joined October 2010
Australia8943 Posts
October 22 2020 10:19 GMT
#164
soma was scouted by stx a long time ago but he declined to stay in school. he came through the "rookie league" which was what replaced "courage tournament", so by amateur standards he was already at the top almost 10 years ago.
keep in mind almost every major pro came through the "courage tournament" so its safe to say soma was at least on par to any b-teamer in a pro team.
despite not playing in a team and practicing like the pros he formed a friendship with larva and learnt off him, although now its pretty evident that soma has surpassed his tutor.
ggsimida
Profile Joined August 2015
1156 Posts
Last Edited: 2020-10-22 10:22:20
October 22 2020 10:21 GMT
#165
On October 22 2020 19:08 TornadoSteve wrote:
This is bs, if your results speak for itself youll make connection and relation yourself


heard that from scan btw, doubt hes bullshitting when he has some connections himself.

almost a decade of post kespa BW and soma is literally the only amateur to have elevated and consistently maintain his play at the expro level as shown by both his stellar offline/online results. that cannot happen simply by grinding enmasse on ladder, which is something most amateurs can only do. no more teamhouse in post kespa scene, so the next best thing is to get dedicated guidance/practice from expros.

which is why i really appreciate any initiatives by the kr bw scene that can incidentally help connect the expros with amateurs and generate more dedicated coaching or practice opportunisties for them, competitions like astl or creation of pro teams like snow's postiz are a good start
ggsimida
Profile Joined August 2015
1156 Posts
Last Edited: 2020-10-22 10:31:48
October 22 2020 10:29 GMT
#166
On October 22 2020 19:19 evilfatsh1t wrote:
keep in mind almost every major pro came through the "courage tournament" so its safe to say soma was at least on par to any b-teamer in a pro team.


thing is that he only make a breakthrough as a player and became well known in late 2019? despite the fact that he has actually been around since the old sonic-era days where his results were generally meh and there was nothing outstanding can be gleaned from his competitive play in the tourneys back then. there are also amateurs and semipros who also have some involvement in the kespa scene but none of them have risen as far as soma. this speaks to a period of time where soma really hunkered down to a lot of dedicated coaching/practice from the expros
WombaT
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Northern Ireland27478 Posts
October 22 2020 11:52 GMT
#167
Thanks for the responses, makes some sense to me at least.

I guess even with a lot more information being out there in the streaming age, being privy to why people do things rather than observing and trying to figure it out, getting to brainstorm and practice strategy at a real level is all super important.

'You'll always be the cuddly marsupial of my heart, despite the inherent flaws of your ancestry' - Squat
TL+ Member
TornadoSteve
Profile Joined March 2018
1147 Posts
Last Edited: 2020-10-22 12:34:52
October 22 2020 12:34 GMT
#168
-.-
Dangermousecatdog
Profile Joined December 2010
United Kingdom7084 Posts
Last Edited: 2020-10-22 14:31:57
October 22 2020 14:09 GMT
#169
On October 22 2020 00:43 MaGic~PhiL wrote:
the definition of multitasking is literally how many different things you can do in a certain time frame

apm is how many things you can do in a certain time frame

so unless it is fake apm .. on a obviously very basica level it most certainly describes some form of capacity to multitask

That's not what multitasking is, and that's not the defintion of APM either. They are two different concepts. A player with lower APM can and frequently does out-multitask a player with higher APM. Which according to you shouldn't be possible with your defintions. Multitasking is more of the deciding how to and allocating attention effectively. To split the focus of your attention. APM is part of that skillset, but you have confused the measurement for the skill and ability itself.

Example, all pros can micro a battle and macro at the same time. However a better multitasker with the same apm can do all that and scout and fight battles in two places at the same time, or pay attention to harrass and move his units around the map in response to another movement round the map, that leads to an advantge over the lesser multitasking player. Or to a lesser degree micro better by choosing when to macro at the appropriate times.

All pros have more than enough raw apm to multitask. It's 2020 not 2010. We can see them stream and play today, and we can see that they pretty much maintain the same APM when they are multitasking complex situations or just sitting in their base. If what you wrote was correct, we would see massive spikes in APM everytime a multitasking situation occurs, but that is not the case. Sometimes it even lowers.

Gorsameth
Profile Joined April 2010
Netherlands22703 Posts
October 22 2020 14:29 GMT
#170
On October 22 2020 19:08 TornadoSteve wrote:
This is bs, if your results speak for itself youll make connection and relation yourself
But how do you get the results without the training?

You need to beat pro's to get noticed > You need to get noticed to be able to train with the pro's > You need to train with the pro's to be able to beat the pro's > you need to beat pro's to get noticed.

Its a circle where its incredibly hard to force your way in without someone already on the inside helping you.
It ignores such insignificant forces as time, entropy, and death
gg_hertzz
Profile Blog Joined January 2004
2152 Posts
October 22 2020 14:42 GMT
#171
On October 22 2020 23:09 Dangermousecatdog wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 22 2020 00:43 MaGic~PhiL wrote:
the definition of multitasking is literally how many different things you can do in a certain time frame

apm is how many things you can do in a certain time frame

so unless it is fake apm .. on a obviously very basica level it most certainly describes some form of capacity to multitask

That's not what multitasking is, and that's not the defintion of APM either. They are two different concepts. A player with lower APM can and frequently does out-multitask a player with higher APM. Which according to you shouldn't be possible with your defintions. Multitasking is more of the deciding how to and allocating attention effectively. To split the focus of your attention. APM is part of that skillset, but you have confused the measurement for the skill and ability itself.

Example, all pros can micro a battle and macro at the same time. However a better multitasker with the same apm can do all that and scout and fight battles in two places at the same time, or pay attention to harrass and move his units around the map in response to another movement round the map, that leads to an advantge over the lesser multitasking player. Or to a lesser degree micro better by choosing when to macro at the appropriate times.

All pros have more than enough raw apm to multitask. It's 2020 not 2010. We can see them stream and play today, and we can see that they pretty much maintain the same APM when they are multitasking complex situations or just sitting in their base. If what you wrote was correct, we would see massive spikes in APM everytime a multitasking situation occurs, but that is not the case. Sometimes it even lowers.



Ops definition are right on. Multitasking is doing many things at once, and apm is the time you have to do those things. Someone that has high apm in theory has more time to do things because they are working at a faster pace. But there are other factors in how well one multitasks, such as judgement, timing, intuition, etc. The player playing at 400 apm should be able to do more than if he was playing at 200 apm, assuming all other factors are the same.
evilfatsh1t
Profile Joined October 2010
Australia8943 Posts
October 22 2020 14:57 GMT
#172
the measurement of apm itself is worthless. the only measurement thats actually relevant to multitasking is eapm.
so op and dmcd are both right and wrong. higher eapm directly correlates to doing more things. higher apm means jack shit if 200 of that is spent issuing the same commands 5 times in a row
WombaT
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Northern Ireland27478 Posts
October 22 2020 15:47 GMT
#173
On October 22 2020 23:42 gg_hertzz wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 22 2020 23:09 Dangermousecatdog wrote:
On October 22 2020 00:43 MaGic~PhiL wrote:
the definition of multitasking is literally how many different things you can do in a certain time frame

apm is how many things you can do in a certain time frame

so unless it is fake apm .. on a obviously very basica level it most certainly describes some form of capacity to multitask

That's not what multitasking is, and that's not the defintion of APM either. They are two different concepts. A player with lower APM can and frequently does out-multitask a player with higher APM. Which according to you shouldn't be possible with your defintions. Multitasking is more of the deciding how to and allocating attention effectively. To split the focus of your attention. APM is part of that skillset, but you have confused the measurement for the skill and ability itself.

Example, all pros can micro a battle and macro at the same time. However a better multitasker with the same apm can do all that and scout and fight battles in two places at the same time, or pay attention to harrass and move his units around the map in response to another movement round the map, that leads to an advantge over the lesser multitasking player. Or to a lesser degree micro better by choosing when to macro at the appropriate times.

All pros have more than enough raw apm to multitask. It's 2020 not 2010. We can see them stream and play today, and we can see that they pretty much maintain the same APM when they are multitasking complex situations or just sitting in their base. If what you wrote was correct, we would see massive spikes in APM everytime a multitasking situation occurs, but that is not the case. Sometimes it even lowers.



Ops definition are right on. Multitasking is doing many things at once, and apm is the time you have to do those things. Someone that has high apm in theory has more time to do things because they are working at a faster pace. But there are other factors in how well one multitasks, such as judgement, timing, intuition, etc. The player playing at 400 apm should be able to do more than if he was playing at 200 apm, assuming all other factors are the same.

You’re not doing many things at once, you’re doing singular things and then jumping to something else. And sometimes having to react to new information and make a decision (say in defending a drop)

Below a certain threshold yeah you can’t cycle through each task quickly enough, but parsing information and reacting quickly is also a bottleneck, and probably what separates the great BW multitaskers from the rest.

By want of a crude analogy, I can type at 144 wpm (well, when I wasn’t old and decrepit). Which is pretty high even amongst TLers, never mind the general populace.

I’m still probably getting out multitasked by some experienced admin people if we were to construct some kind of challenge there, even though I’m much faster at them at executing each task individually, they’d have a lot they could do on autopilot that I’d have to think about.
'You'll always be the cuddly marsupial of my heart, despite the inherent flaws of your ancestry' - Squat
TL+ Member
gg_hertzz
Profile Blog Joined January 2004
2152 Posts
October 22 2020 16:53 GMT
#174
On October 23 2020 00:47 WombaT wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 22 2020 23:42 gg_hertzz wrote:
On October 22 2020 23:09 Dangermousecatdog wrote:
On October 22 2020 00:43 MaGic~PhiL wrote:
the definition of multitasking is literally how many different things you can do in a certain time frame

apm is how many things you can do in a certain time frame

so unless it is fake apm .. on a obviously very basica level it most certainly describes some form of capacity to multitask

That's not what multitasking is, and that's not the defintion of APM either. They are two different concepts. A player with lower APM can and frequently does out-multitask a player with higher APM. Which according to you shouldn't be possible with your defintions. Multitasking is more of the deciding how to and allocating attention effectively. To split the focus of your attention. APM is part of that skillset, but you have confused the measurement for the skill and ability itself.

Example, all pros can micro a battle and macro at the same time. However a better multitasker with the same apm can do all that and scout and fight battles in two places at the same time, or pay attention to harrass and move his units around the map in response to another movement round the map, that leads to an advantge over the lesser multitasking player. Or to a lesser degree micro better by choosing when to macro at the appropriate times.

All pros have more than enough raw apm to multitask. It's 2020 not 2010. We can see them stream and play today, and we can see that they pretty much maintain the same APM when they are multitasking complex situations or just sitting in their base. If what you wrote was correct, we would see massive spikes in APM everytime a multitasking situation occurs, but that is not the case. Sometimes it even lowers.



Ops definition are right on. Multitasking is doing many things at once, and apm is the time you have to do those things. Someone that has high apm in theory has more time to do things because they are working at a faster pace. But there are other factors in how well one multitasks, such as judgement, timing, intuition, etc. The player playing at 400 apm should be able to do more than if he was playing at 200 apm, assuming all other factors are the same.

You’re not doing many things at once, you’re doing singular things and then jumping to something else. And sometimes having to react to new information and make a decision (say in defending a drop)

Below a certain threshold yeah you can’t cycle through each task quickly enough, but parsing information and reacting quickly is also a bottleneck, and probably what separates the great BW multitaskers from the rest.

By want of a crude analogy, I can type at 144 wpm (well, when I wasn’t old and decrepit). Which is pretty high even amongst TLers, never mind the general populace.

I’m still probably getting out multitasked by some experienced admin people if we were to construct some kind of challenge there, even though I’m much faster at them at executing each task individually, they’d have a lot they could do on autopilot that I’d have to think about.


Okay, this is why I sometimes hate debating on the internet because people take things extremely literally. Obviously you cannot do many things at once because that would be against the laws of the universe, but for all intents of purpose “at once” in our context should be understood to mean a block of time. I shouldn’t have to explain that obviously you cannot create a zealot, train a worker, control a shuttle, and micro dragon with in the same nano second.

My point still stands, apm is strongly correlated with multitasking and multitasking is being able to do many things “at once”. How well one does it depends on other factors.
gg_hertzz
Profile Blog Joined January 2004
2152 Posts
October 22 2020 16:57 GMT
#175
On October 23 2020 00:47 WombaT wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 22 2020 23:42 gg_hertzz wrote:
On October 22 2020 23:09 Dangermousecatdog wrote:
On October 22 2020 00:43 MaGic~PhiL wrote:
the definition of multitasking is literally how many different things you can do in a certain time frame

apm is how many things you can do in a certain time frame

so unless it is fake apm .. on a obviously very basica level it most certainly describes some form of capacity to multitask

That's not what multitasking is, and that's not the defintion of APM either. They are two different concepts. A player with lower APM can and frequently does out-multitask a player with higher APM. Which according to you shouldn't be possible with your defintions. Multitasking is more of the deciding how to and allocating attention effectively. To split the focus of your attention. APM is part of that skillset, but you have confused the measurement for the skill and ability itself.

Example, all pros can micro a battle and macro at the same time. However a better multitasker with the same apm can do all that and scout and fight battles in two places at the same time, or pay attention to harrass and move his units around the map in response to another movement round the map, that leads to an advantge over the lesser multitasking player. Or to a lesser degree micro better by choosing when to macro at the appropriate times.

All pros have more than enough raw apm to multitask. It's 2020 not 2010. We can see them stream and play today, and we can see that they pretty much maintain the same APM when they are multitasking complex situations or just sitting in their base. If what you wrote was correct, we would see massive spikes in APM everytime a multitasking situation occurs, but that is not the case. Sometimes it even lowers.



Ops definition are right on. Multitasking is doing many things at once, and apm is the time you have to do those things. Someone that has high apm in theory has more time to do things because they are working at a faster pace. But there are other factors in how well one multitasks, such as judgement, timing, intuition, etc. The player playing at 400 apm should be able to do more than if he was playing at 200 apm, assuming all other factors are the same.

You’re not doing many things at once, you’re doing singular things and then jumping to something else. And sometimes having to react to new information and make a decision (say in defending a drop)

Below a certain threshold yeah you can’t cycle through each task quickly enough, but parsing information and reacting quickly is also a bottleneck, and probably what separates the great BW multitaskers from the rest.

By want of a crude analogy, I can type at 144 wpm (well, when I wasn’t old and decrepit). Which is pretty high even amongst TLers, never mind the general populace.

I’m still probably getting out multitasked by some experienced admin people if we were to construct some kind of challenge there, even though I’m much faster at them at executing each task individually, they’d have a lot they could do on autopilot that I’d have to think about.


The best analogy I can think of is if 2 people were given a list of tasks to do in a fixed amount of time but one was given a car that could go 50 mph vs the other that can go 100 mph, given all other conditions are the same you would tell me the one with the faster car could not accomplish more?
Dangermousecatdog
Profile Joined December 2010
United Kingdom7084 Posts
Last Edited: 2020-10-22 17:25:54
October 22 2020 17:11 GMT
#176
If you are a 50 or 100 apm player, your multitasking will be limited, in the same way that any action you do in the game is limited. Pros all have 250+ apm as their natural apm. Most will have 300+ apm. They have more than enough raw apm. If we take your poor analogy, we have these cars that can go 250 mph and another that does 300 mph, the same 50 mph difference, and they are to drive down the city with plenty of sharp turns and awareness needed for multiple traffic situations. Which car is better? Neither, they both long surpassed the raw speed needed, it's other skills that take precedence and the speed is not a limiting factor.

Today I watched Zero play. He consistently have 370-400 apm. When situations occured for multitasking, his apm drops. He of course is multitasking during that time. If there is a correlation between apm and multitasking, it is a negative correlation. This tells you everything you should need to know about using apm for pros as a signifier for multitasking.


EDIT:
On October 23 2020 01:53 gg_hertzz wrote:
Okay, this is why I sometimes hate debating on the internet because people take things extremely literally. Obviously you cannot do many things at once because that would be against the laws of the universe, but for all intents of purpose “at once” in our context should be understood to mean a block of time. I shouldn’t have to explain that obviously you cannot create a zealot, train a worker, control a shuttle, and micro dragon with in the same nano second.

My point still stands, apm is strongly correlated with multitasking and multitasking is being able to do many things “at once”. How well one does it depends on other factors.
That is not multitasking. That is just cycling through your macro activities whilst microing. Not the same kind of "multitasking skill" that we were talking about where you are taking the advantage from multitasking better, reacting to harrass and punishing poorer multitasking. Which is a separate skill altogether that can be disentangled from apm.

On a basic level you don't need that much apm to insert macro cycle into your micro. You can do that even with 100 apm. Lets say 200 apm arbitrarily to do so in a speedy manner. Which all pros easily surpass. Paying attention to factors outside of that is a different sort of "multitasking" altogether separate from apm. The multitasking we are talking about is more of an awareness skill, rather than a basic macro cycle skill.
WombaT
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Northern Ireland27478 Posts
October 22 2020 17:55 GMT
#177
On October 23 2020 01:53 gg_hertzz wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 23 2020 00:47 WombaT wrote:
On October 22 2020 23:42 gg_hertzz wrote:
On October 22 2020 23:09 Dangermousecatdog wrote:
On October 22 2020 00:43 MaGic~PhiL wrote:
the definition of multitasking is literally how many different things you can do in a certain time frame

apm is how many things you can do in a certain time frame

so unless it is fake apm .. on a obviously very basica level it most certainly describes some form of capacity to multitask

That's not what multitasking is, and that's not the defintion of APM either. They are two different concepts. A player with lower APM can and frequently does out-multitask a player with higher APM. Which according to you shouldn't be possible with your defintions. Multitasking is more of the deciding how to and allocating attention effectively. To split the focus of your attention. APM is part of that skillset, but you have confused the measurement for the skill and ability itself.

Example, all pros can micro a battle and macro at the same time. However a better multitasker with the same apm can do all that and scout and fight battles in two places at the same time, or pay attention to harrass and move his units around the map in response to another movement round the map, that leads to an advantge over the lesser multitasking player. Or to a lesser degree micro better by choosing when to macro at the appropriate times.

All pros have more than enough raw apm to multitask. It's 2020 not 2010. We can see them stream and play today, and we can see that they pretty much maintain the same APM when they are multitasking complex situations or just sitting in their base. If what you wrote was correct, we would see massive spikes in APM everytime a multitasking situation occurs, but that is not the case. Sometimes it even lowers.



Ops definition are right on. Multitasking is doing many things at once, and apm is the time you have to do those things. Someone that has high apm in theory has more time to do things because they are working at a faster pace. But there are other factors in how well one multitasks, such as judgement, timing, intuition, etc. The player playing at 400 apm should be able to do more than if he was playing at 200 apm, assuming all other factors are the same.

You’re not doing many things at once, you’re doing singular things and then jumping to something else. And sometimes having to react to new information and make a decision (say in defending a drop)

Below a certain threshold yeah you can’t cycle through each task quickly enough, but parsing information and reacting quickly is also a bottleneck, and probably what separates the great BW multitaskers from the rest.

By want of a crude analogy, I can type at 144 wpm (well, when I wasn’t old and decrepit). Which is pretty high even amongst TLers, never mind the general populace.

I’m still probably getting out multitasked by some experienced admin people if we were to construct some kind of challenge there, even though I’m much faster at them at executing each task individually, they’d have a lot they could do on autopilot that I’d have to think about.


Okay, this is why I sometimes hate debating on the internet because people take things extremely literally. Obviously you cannot do many things at once because that would be against the laws of the universe, but for all intents of purpose “at once” in our context should be understood to mean a block of time. I shouldn’t have to explain that obviously you cannot create a zealot, train a worker, control a shuttle, and micro dragon with in the same nano second.

My point still stands, apm is strongly correlated with multitasking and multitasking is being able to do many things “at once”. How well one does it depends on other factors.

Which imo comes down to parsing information quickly, one’s internal clock and all sorts of other factors over raw APM.

Especially in a game like BW the internal clock and timing factor is probably super useful in being a good multitasker, it probably lowers your APM if it’s good.

Player A sends a shuttle in, knows instinctively when it’s going to arrive in enemy territory and goes and does other stuff, returning to the shuttle just as it’s about to arrive at the destination.

Player B’s clock isn’t developed and he bounces back to check the shuttle multiple times, cutting down his time to achieve other things. I mean it’s a crude example, but player B might be throwing more action inputs into the game, but is not particularly efficient in terms of multitasking vs player A.

If you can effectively use it of course there is no downside really to having higher APM, especially in BW which is so mechanically demanding.

For multitasking chops I don’t think it’s as helpful past a certain threshold, or at least the benefits taper off.

Screens per minute as a metric probably gives us the tools to work out who’s a good multitasker if we combine it with APM and actually analyse some games in real depth. Perhaps someone has done this in the past, would love to read it if so

'You'll always be the cuddly marsupial of my heart, despite the inherent flaws of your ancestry' - Squat
TL+ Member
gg_hertzz
Profile Blog Joined January 2004
2152 Posts
Last Edited: 2020-10-22 18:22:41
October 22 2020 18:06 GMT
#178
On October 23 2020 02:11 Dangermousecatdog wrote:
If you are a 50 or 100 apm player, your multitasking will be limited, in the same way that any action you do in the game is limited. Pros all have 250+ apm as their natural apm. Most will have 300+ apm. They have more than enough raw apm. If we take your poor analogy, we have these cars that can go 250 mph and another that does 300 mph, the same 50 mph difference, and they are to drive down the city with plenty of sharp turns and awareness needed for multiple traffic situations. Which car is better? Neither, they both long surpassed the raw speed needed, it's other skills that take precedence and the speed is not a limiting factor.

Today I watched Zero play. He consistently have 370-400 apm. When situations occured for multitasking, his apm drops. He of course is multitasking during that time. If there is a correlation between apm and multitasking, it is a negative correlation. This tells you everything you should need to know about using apm for pros as a signifier for multitasking.


EDIT:
Show nested quote +
On October 23 2020 01:53 gg_hertzz wrote:
Okay, this is why I sometimes hate debating on the internet because people take things extremely literally. Obviously you cannot do many things at once because that would be against the laws of the universe, but for all intents of purpose “at once” in our context should be understood to mean a block of time. I shouldn’t have to explain that obviously you cannot create a zealot, train a worker, control a shuttle, and micro dragon with in the same nano second.

My point still stands, apm is strongly correlated with multitasking and multitasking is being able to do many things “at once”. How well one does it depends on other factors.
That is not multitasking. That is just cycling through your macro activities whilst microing. Not the same kind of "multitasking skill" that we were talking about where you are taking the advantage from multitasking better, reacting to harrass and punishing poorer multitasking. Which is a separate skill altogether that can be disentangled from apm.

On a basic level you don't need that much apm to insert macro cycle into your micro. You can do that even with 100 apm. Lets say 200 apm arbitrarily to do so in a speedy manner. Which all pros easily surpass. Paying attention to factors outside of that is a different sort of "multitasking" altogether separate from apm. The multitasking we are talking about is more of an awareness skill, rather than a basic macro cycle skill.


In what world does faster not equal more things accomplished given all other factors to be equal? You are talking about something really subjective when I’m just clearly saying faster APM is better “ given all factors to be equal”. This seems like a pretty hard point to refute.

ruhtraeel
Profile Joined July 2010
Canada138 Posts
October 22 2020 21:25 GMT
#179
Soma is looking so strong ZvP nowadays, with his aggression and decision making. That, and even though Snow's PvZ has gotten tremendously better since the KeSPA days, I would still favour top Zergs over him (Soma, Soulkey, Zero, maybe Action as well)
BigFan
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
TLADT24920 Posts
October 22 2020 21:35 GMT
#180
BTW, am I the only one who thought Snow didn't play game 1 that badly? It's true that reavers might have been a better solution to break the contain, but even in the game I linked, Rain was unable to break Soulkey despite having reavers. Furthermore, there were several times where it really looked like Snow would finally be able to break Soma so maybe he thought he needed just another push to do it. Hindsight is 20/20 and it's easy sometimes to get caught up in the flow of things.

It's probably similar to Rain vs Larva on Gold Rush during ASL4 where Rain looked like he was always about to break Larva in their series, but Larva would have just enough units in the right place at the right time to defend. Alternatively, Snow decided that going reavers won't work as well in this situation and figured that having a ton of templars for storm will be enough.
Former BW EiC"Watch Bakemonogatari or I will kill you." -Toad, April 18th, 2017
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