[ASL10] Ro8 Day 2 - Page 9

On October 22 2020 18:21 WombaT wrote:
As a relative noob, how is Soma so good as an amateur? Seems the rest of people doing well range from legendary pro gamers like Flash and at the lowest were at least on pro teams.

On October 22 2020 19:08 TornadoSteve wrote:
This is bs, if your results speak for itself youll make connection and relation yourself

On October 22 2020 19:19 evilfatsh1t wrote:
keep in mind almost every major pro came through the "courage tournament" so its safe to say soma was at least on par to any b-teamer in a pro team.

On October 22 2020 00:43 MaGic~PhiL wrote:
the definition of multitasking is literally how many different things you can do in a certain time frame

apm is how many things you can do in a certain time frame

so unless it is fake apm .. on a obviously very basica level it most certainly describes some form of capacity to multitask

On October 22 2020 19:08 TornadoSteve wrote:
This is bs, if your results speak for itself youll make connection and relation yourself

On October 22 2020 23:09 Dangermousecatdog wrote:

That's not what multitasking is, and that's not the defintion of APM either. They are two different concepts. A player with lower APM can and frequently does out-multitask a player with higher APM. Which according to you shouldn't be possible with your defintions. Multitasking is more of the deciding how to and allocating attention effectively. To split the focus of your attention. APM is part of that skillset, but you have confused the measurement for the skill and ability itself.

Example, all pros can micro a battle and macro at the same time. However a better multitasker with the same apm can do all that and scout and fight battles in two places at the same time, or pay attention to harrass and move his units around the map in response to another movement round the map, that leads to an advantge over the lesser multitasking player. Or to a lesser degree micro better by choosing when to macro at the appropriate times.

All pros have more than enough raw apm to multitask. It's 2020 not 2010. We can see them stream and play today, and we can see that they pretty much maintain the same APM when they are multitasking complex situations or just sitting in their base. If what you wrote was correct, we would see massive spikes in APM everytime a multitasking situation occurs, but that is not the case. Sometimes it even lowers.

On October 22 2020 23:42 gg_hertzz wrote:


Ops definition are right on. Multitasking is doing many things at once, and apm is the time you have to do those things. Someone that has high apm in theory has more time to do things because they are working at a faster pace. But there are other factors in how well one multitasks, such as judgement, timing, intuition, etc. The player playing at 400 apm should be able to do more than if he was playing at 200 apm, assuming all other factors are the same.

On October 23 2020 00:47 WombaT wrote:

You’re not doing many things at once, you’re doing singular things and then jumping to something else. And sometimes having to react to new information and make a decision (say in defending a drop)

Below a certain threshold yeah you can’t cycle through each task quickly enough, but parsing information and reacting quickly is also a bottleneck, and probably what separates the great BW multitaskers from the rest.

By want of a crude analogy, I can type at 144 wpm (well, when I wasn’t old and decrepit). Which is pretty high even amongst TLers, never mind the general populace.

I’m still probably getting out multitasked by some experienced admin people if we were to construct some kind of challenge there, even though I’m much faster at them at executing each task individually, they’d have a lot they could do on autopilot that I’d have to think about.

On October 23 2020 00:47 WombaT wrote:

You’re not doing many things at once, you’re doing singular things and then jumping to something else. And sometimes having to react to new information and make a decision (say in defending a drop)

Below a certain threshold yeah you can’t cycle through each task quickly enough, but parsing information and reacting quickly is also a bottleneck, and probably what separates the great BW multitaskers from the rest.

By want of a crude analogy, I can type at 144 wpm (well, when I wasn’t old and decrepit). Which is pretty high even amongst TLers, never mind the general populace.

I’m still probably getting out multitasked by some experienced admin people if we were to construct some kind of challenge there, even though I’m much faster at them at executing each task individually, they’d have a lot they could do on autopilot that I’d have to think about.

On October 23 2020 01:53 gg_hertzz wrote:
Okay, this is why I sometimes hate debating on the internet because people take things extremely literally. Obviously you cannot do many things at once because that would be against the laws of the universe, but for all intents of purpose “at once” in our context should be understood to mean a block of time. I shouldn’t have to explain that obviously you cannot create a zealot, train a worker, control a shuttle, and micro dragon with in the same nano second.

My point still stands, apm is strongly correlated with multitasking and multitasking is being able to do many things “at once”. How well one does it depends on other factors.

On October 23 2020 01:53 gg_hertzz wrote:


Okay, this is why I sometimes hate debating on the internet because people take things extremely literally. Obviously you cannot do many things at once because that would be against the laws of the universe, but for all intents of purpose “at once” in our context should be understood to mean a block of time. I shouldn’t have to explain that obviously you cannot create a zealot, train a worker, control a shuttle, and micro dragon with in the same nano second.

My point still stands, apm is strongly correlated with multitasking and multitasking is being able to do many things “at once”. How well one does it depends on other factors.

On October 23 2020 02:11 Dangermousecatdog wrote:
If you are a 50 or 100 apm player, your multitasking will be limited, in the same way that any action you do in the game is limited. Pros all have 250+ apm as their natural apm. Most will have 300+ apm. They have more than enough raw apm. If we take your poor analogy, we have these cars that can go 250 mph and another that does 300 mph, the same 50 mph difference, and they are to drive down the city with plenty of sharp turns and awareness needed for multiple traffic situations. Which car is better? Neither, they both long surpassed the raw speed needed, it's other skills that take precedence and the speed is not a limiting factor.

Today I watched Zero play. He consistently have 370-400 apm. When situations occured for multitasking, his apm drops. He of course is multitasking during that time. If there is a correlation between apm and multitasking, it is a negative correlation. This tells you everything you should need to know about using apm for pros as a signifier for multitasking.


EDIT:That is not multitasking. That is just cycling through your macro activities whilst microing. Not the same kind of "multitasking skill" that we were talking about where you are taking the advantage from multitasking better, reacting to harrass and punishing poorer multitasking. Which is a separate skill altogether that can be disentangled from apm.

On a basic level you don't need that much apm to insert macro cycle into your micro. You can do that even with 100 apm. Lets say 200 apm arbitrarily to do so in a speedy manner. Which all pros easily surpass. Paying attention to factors outside of that is a different sort of "multitasking" altogether separate from apm. The multitasking we are talking about is more of an awareness skill, rather than a basic macro cycle skill.