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On January 30 2011 16:31 scrubtastic wrote:Show nested quote +On January 30 2011 16:10 Turbovolver wrote:On January 30 2011 16:06 Ecrilon wrote:
So tired of this excuse. So tired of it. Prove it. Seriously, prove it. Prove that Fantasy didn't develop and these builds himself. Prove that Stork never takes advice about builds from anyone. Prove that oov figured out all the timings, tricks and subtleties that Fantasy must have practiced in these builds before he fed them, as you say, to Fantasy. It is a lame excuse, but what you can't deny is that Stork can play cellphone games all night and still deliver, whereas Fantasy needs to develop builds and have them work to get anywhere. His play crumbles when thrown off guard, as we all saw in that famous Fantasy vs Action failfest. Fantasy has to have something...otherwise Canata would have succeeded. Canata's signature was losing after gaining an advantage, something Fantasy does occasionally but not like Canata did. Fantasy is still doing well in WL - do you think he has to prepare *everything*? Whether you like it or not he has the fundamentals to perform. What Fantasy is not is Flash, who probably has the best overall game sense in the world, takes all sorts of calculated risks and adapts his play very very well. But really, who else has that? No other Terran does, that's for sure. JD is great at adapting but still loses games to overaggression.
I completely agree with this and as someone mentioned I'm tired of people saying if Stork plays poorly and loses it doesn't count, but when Fantasy loses because he blundered it does.
Being consistent across your games is important and being not predictable is also important. As the above poster mentioned, Flash is so damn good because he is like water and just adapts to pretty much anything. He is a solid PL player because he can be sent out whatever and play against anyone and crush them. He is also unpredictable because not only can he macro and play a ridiculous standard game, but he can also cheese the crap out of you. Both Flash and Jaedong have nerves of steel and can win games with pure willpower...
Fantasy prepared very well and cut through Stork like butter... when you lose you lose and that's a loss, you can't pick and choose games you want and base a players skill on that... unfortunatly sc isnt a NR 20 game where you can win by being the best standard player.
Edit: Also to all the Stork fans, remember he got manhandled 0-3 vs Zero as well... out of two back to back Bo5s he couldn't even take a single game or even really get somewhat close to winning... to be honest Stork has never done any play or crisis management which was mindblowing or completely new... Stork is a great and fantastic player and will always be at the top, but he lacks that little bit of spark to take a title.
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On January 30 2011 16:30 flamewheel wrote:
SKT fans vs Stork fans.
So good.
Ya, it's almost as fun as the games themselves. I've brought out some popcorn, gonna kick back and enjoy the show.
Go Stork fans!
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United States5582 Posts
On January 30 2011 16:30 flamewheel wrote:
SKT fans vs Stork fans.
So good.
And KHAN fans call us "Bisu-only" fans... How ironic.
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On January 30 2011 16:34 TheJoyBringer wrote:Show nested quote +On January 30 2011 16:16 StorkHwaiting wrote:On January 30 2011 16:06 Ecrilon wrote:On January 30 2011 16:01 StorkHwaiting wrote:On January 30 2011 15:59 Ecrilon wrote:
So because Stork is technically favored in a completely standard game he is supposed to be better? Because if there were no early tank snipes, no reaver harassment, no vulture harassment, no odd bio switches, no DT rushes, no bunker rushes, no economic cheese, and no oddities of any sort Stork would win against standard Terran mech->Vessel with standard Gates->Arbiter or Gates->Carrier, that makes him the better player? Are you simply telling me that his mechanics are better, or what? I'm telling you that without 1000 SKT coaching staff and Flash/Jaehoon to feed Fantasy instructions on how to win, Stork would win. So tired of this excuse. So tired of it. Prove it. Seriously, prove it. Prove that Fantasy didn't develop and these builds himself. Prove that Stork never takes advice about builds from anyone. Prove that oov figured out all the timings, tricks and subtleties that Fantasy must have practiced in these builds before he fed them, as you say, to Fantasy. From the player's own mouth: What kind of help did your coaching team give you? ▲ They helped a lot around the builds. (T)iloveoov coach told me not to think about too many things at once, but instead, think only about a single build made around one of the opponent's possible build. So, OOV's advice was don't think about anything. Just do that single build that counters your opponent's possible build. Yeah, it's such an excuse... And OOV isn't the only coach. There's a whole coaching staff, and he locked up Jaehoon and Flash. Fantasy was willing to sell his ass to a gang of convicts to win these Finals. Stork couldn't even be bothered looking for practice partners outside his house. OSL Finals = Fantasy ridic preparation team > Stork's arrogance. Lol I'm gonna let loose a little on this one, so bear with me. Suck on it. Yea, SUCK ON IT. Sorry, your favorite little player Stork lost yesterday. Oh wait, I really don't care about that because I don't focus on the loser of the match. I focus on the only player that I care about, which is Fantasy. And guess what? He won yesterday, that's enough to make me happy, and not that Stork lost. But apparently you can't deal with that. If you're not happy, then you don't want anyone else to be happy either. And not only that, you feel the need to take your disappointment and sadness and make that into hatred towards Fantasy and his fans. Is that not true? One shouldn't feel angry that another player won, one should only feel disappointment because his favorite player lost. Only those who are too weak to deal with those emotions feels to need to lash out at others, acting like an immature child. I'm sorry, but the world is not "fair". And by fair I mean "does not go the way you want everything to go" because nothing about yesterday's results were unfair. Once again I'm going to say, if anything, criticize Stork for letting you down. Stop tearing down others to fulfill your own inability to deal when things don't go your way.
Actually he was criticizing Stork for being arrogant and complacent and somewhat praised Fantasy for having the will to do anything to win. Just sayin.
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On January 30 2011 15:52 StorkHwaiting wrote:Show nested quote +On January 30 2011 15:47 JustQuitWarcraftIII wrote:On January 30 2011 15:44 StorkHwaiting wrote:On January 30 2011 15:38 nayumi wrote:On January 30 2011 15:36 MarineHeroSamKhan wrote:
SONG BYUNG GOO!!!! I wonder how Fantasy even managed to beat stork 3-0 by being better? By doing blind hard counter builds that lose to anything other than Stork's predictable builds. Like I said so many times already, Stork lost the finals. Fantasy didn't win them. He just showed up. So Fantasy took 3 games off Stork last night and 1 loss today makes him someone who "only" showed up and Stork the obviously better player. Maybe if Stork would stop being so cocky and thinking that his opponents could not plan some counters, he would actually not "lose" any more finals. If you know anything about Stork as a player, you would know that's exactly what happened. Stork is an arrogant bastard and he drops final after final because he's convinced he's better than the opponent and all he needs to do is play solid no-mistake games. Hubris has always been his downfall. Stork was heavily favored vs Bisu when they met. Stork was heavily favored vs JD when they met. And Flash was an upstart when they met, although he did crush Stork in the GOM Star Invitational just before it. In that series too, Stork stubbornly kept going carriers even though Flash had proven once already in a bo5 that he had Stork's number. That's just the way Stork is. He's ridiculously bone-headed sometimes.
I don't think you were around for Stork's old finals.
First of all, it was a foregone conclusion that Flash was going to beat him. Flash had developed a new, dominant style of TvP, and no one really knew how to counter it. It was similar to Midas' old style but much more refined and steady. Calling flash an "upstart" is ridiculous...he bulldozed Bisu in the semifinals a week beforehand, and was personally responsible for transforming Katrina from NFZ 2.0 into a TvP playground.
The series against Bisu was really, really close, and was pretty much a toss-up going in. Your claim of stork's devotion to playing "solid no-mistake games" is funny, considering he lost the series by making one of the worst mistakes in the history of professional BW. In no way was Stork a heavy favorite here. He only got into the MSL after many failed attempts in the survivor league, and had an unbelievably easy road to the finals (he played 910 in the QF, who was primarily a 2on2 player for POS/MBC and should never have made it that far in an individual league).
As for the Jaedong series, I'm not sure you realize how bad Stork's PvZ was back then. Up to that point, he was barely holding a 50% win rate in the matchup, compared to over 60% in PvT and PvZ. He was still a favorite because Jaedong had a shaky ZvP, but when Jaedong took the game on Katrina (the lone P map), Stork was already defeated mentally. To make it worse, the spawns on Fantasy were quite unlucky, with Stork getting LoC and Jaedong getting SGG.
It's great that you did some research on BW history, but your understanding of these finals is lackluster.
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Even within the protoss fanbase, there's a good portion of people who love to criticize the greatest toss to ever play this game(Bisu).
Fantasy is really acting like a Shine for Stork right now, except with 1 more OSL gold and a fanbase that loves him. Lots and lots of hate on him from Stork fans.
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On January 30 2011 16:40 Ryo wrote:Show nested quote +On January 30 2011 16:34 TheJoyBringer wrote:On January 30 2011 16:16 StorkHwaiting wrote:On January 30 2011 16:06 Ecrilon wrote:On January 30 2011 16:01 StorkHwaiting wrote:On January 30 2011 15:59 Ecrilon wrote:
So because Stork is technically favored in a completely standard game he is supposed to be better? Because if there were no early tank snipes, no reaver harassment, no vulture harassment, no odd bio switches, no DT rushes, no bunker rushes, no economic cheese, and no oddities of any sort Stork would win against standard Terran mech->Vessel with standard Gates->Arbiter or Gates->Carrier, that makes him the better player? Are you simply telling me that his mechanics are better, or what? I'm telling you that without 1000 SKT coaching staff and Flash/Jaehoon to feed Fantasy instructions on how to win, Stork would win. So tired of this excuse. So tired of it. Prove it. Seriously, prove it. Prove that Fantasy didn't develop and these builds himself. Prove that Stork never takes advice about builds from anyone. Prove that oov figured out all the timings, tricks and subtleties that Fantasy must have practiced in these builds before he fed them, as you say, to Fantasy. From the player's own mouth: What kind of help did your coaching team give you? ▲ They helped a lot around the builds. (T)iloveoov coach told me not to think about too many things at once, but instead, think only about a single build made around one of the opponent's possible build. So, OOV's advice was don't think about anything. Just do that single build that counters your opponent's possible build. Yeah, it's such an excuse... And OOV isn't the only coach. There's a whole coaching staff, and he locked up Jaehoon and Flash. Fantasy was willing to sell his ass to a gang of convicts to win these Finals. Stork couldn't even be bothered looking for practice partners outside his house. OSL Finals = Fantasy ridic preparation team > Stork's arrogance. Lol I'm gonna let loose a little on this one, so bear with me. Suck on it. Yea, SUCK ON IT. Sorry, your favorite little player Stork lost yesterday. Oh wait, I really don't care about that because I don't focus on the loser of the match. I focus on the only player that I care about, which is Fantasy. And guess what? He won yesterday, that's enough to make me happy, and not that Stork lost. But apparently you can't deal with that. If you're not happy, then you don't want anyone else to be happy either. And not only that, you feel the need to take your disappointment and sadness and make that into hatred towards Fantasy and his fans. Is that not true? One shouldn't feel angry that another player won, one should only feel disappointment because his favorite player lost. Only those who are too weak to deal with those emotions feels to need to lash out at others, acting like an immature child. I'm sorry, but the world is not "fair". And by fair I mean "does not go the way you want everything to go" because nothing about yesterday's results were unfair. Once again I'm going to say, if anything, criticize Stork for letting you down. Stop tearing down others to fulfill your own inability to deal when things don't go your way. Actually he was criticizing Stork for being arrogant and complacent and somewhat praised Fantasy for having the will to do anything to win. Just sayin.
That's a nice spin on it. I got the feeling he was saying that Stork has the superior talent and if he had wanted to he would have won. And that Fantasy won only because he was helped by so many people.
In any walks of life, there are people who are loved for their talents because slacking off and still doing awesome is deemed so much cooler than working your ass off for some reason. Stork is the epitome of that.
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On January 30 2011 16:06 Zona wrote:Sheesh, the arguments that take place in BW LR threads lately after the games end are so awful to read. Show nested quote +On January 30 2011 15:55 nayumi wrote:On January 30 2011 15:48 StorkHwaiting wrote:On January 30 2011 15:40 structuralinertia wrote:
here's the deal. Fanta's TvP is awesome. Stork's PvT is awesome. Fanta played better last night, stork played better today. Simple as that methinks It's not. Fanta's TvP is simply vulture harass. Beyond that, he's nothing special. Stork is a PvT god. Last night, Fanta got 2 build order wins and then a dismantling in game 3 that looked like Stork never even practiced vs dropship play. Today, Stork made a counter to Fantasy's retarded blind anti-shuttle build and handily crushed him. It showed simply that Stork is the superior player and should have had the balls to switch up his play rather than rely on the same stupid build just because it won him games. It's a classic case of Stork arrogance thinking he's so far superior that he doesn't need to innovate to win. It's why he's a constant silver medalist. If you look at Stork's thought process during his Incruit OSL run, he was totally different. He explicitly stated that he was going to switch things up and try to play mind games and surprise his opponent because those are essential ingredients to winning a bo5. For some inexplicable reason, he forgot that yesterday. Fantasy blind countered Stork's predictability, Stork is the more superior player. Stork blind countered Fantasy's predictability, Stork is the more superior player. I think you're right. But you summed up his argument pretty well. Heh.
Bisu, Stork, Jaedong, and Flash fans all seem to be an easy troll -.-.
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On January 30 2011 16:45 dtz wrote:Show nested quote +On January 30 2011 16:40 Ryo wrote:On January 30 2011 16:34 TheJoyBringer wrote:On January 30 2011 16:16 StorkHwaiting wrote:On January 30 2011 16:06 Ecrilon wrote:On January 30 2011 16:01 StorkHwaiting wrote:On January 30 2011 15:59 Ecrilon wrote:
So because Stork is technically favored in a completely standard game he is supposed to be better? Because if there were no early tank snipes, no reaver harassment, no vulture harassment, no odd bio switches, no DT rushes, no bunker rushes, no economic cheese, and no oddities of any sort Stork would win against standard Terran mech->Vessel with standard Gates->Arbiter or Gates->Carrier, that makes him the better player? Are you simply telling me that his mechanics are better, or what? I'm telling you that without 1000 SKT coaching staff and Flash/Jaehoon to feed Fantasy instructions on how to win, Stork would win. So tired of this excuse. So tired of it. Prove it. Seriously, prove it. Prove that Fantasy didn't develop and these builds himself. Prove that Stork never takes advice about builds from anyone. Prove that oov figured out all the timings, tricks and subtleties that Fantasy must have practiced in these builds before he fed them, as you say, to Fantasy. From the player's own mouth: What kind of help did your coaching team give you? ▲ They helped a lot around the builds. (T)iloveoov coach told me not to think about too many things at once, but instead, think only about a single build made around one of the opponent's possible build. So, OOV's advice was don't think about anything. Just do that single build that counters your opponent's possible build. Yeah, it's such an excuse... And OOV isn't the only coach. There's a whole coaching staff, and he locked up Jaehoon and Flash. Fantasy was willing to sell his ass to a gang of convicts to win these Finals. Stork couldn't even be bothered looking for practice partners outside his house. OSL Finals = Fantasy ridic preparation team > Stork's arrogance. Lol I'm gonna let loose a little on this one, so bear with me. Suck on it. Yea, SUCK ON IT. Sorry, your favorite little player Stork lost yesterday. Oh wait, I really don't care about that because I don't focus on the loser of the match. I focus on the only player that I care about, which is Fantasy. And guess what? He won yesterday, that's enough to make me happy, and not that Stork lost. But apparently you can't deal with that. If you're not happy, then you don't want anyone else to be happy either. And not only that, you feel the need to take your disappointment and sadness and make that into hatred towards Fantasy and his fans. Is that not true? One shouldn't feel angry that another player won, one should only feel disappointment because his favorite player lost. Only those who are too weak to deal with those emotions feels to need to lash out at others, acting like an immature child. I'm sorry, but the world is not "fair". And by fair I mean "does not go the way you want everything to go" because nothing about yesterday's results were unfair. Once again I'm going to say, if anything, criticize Stork for letting you down. Stop tearing down others to fulfill your own inability to deal when things don't go your way. Actually he was criticizing Stork for being arrogant and complacent and somewhat praised Fantasy for having the will to do anything to win. Just sayin. That's a nice spin on it. I got the feeling he was saying that Stork has the superior talent and if he had wanted to he would have won. And that Fantasy won only because he was helped by so many people. In any walks of life, there are people who are loved for their talents because slacking off and still doing awesome is deemed so much cooler than working your ass off for some reason. Stork is the epitome of that.
LOL
SKT fans v Stork fans so funny.
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On January 30 2011 16:48 Ghostpvp wrote:Show nested quote +On January 30 2011 16:06 Zona wrote:Sheesh, the arguments that take place in BW LR threads lately after the games end are so awful to read. On January 30 2011 15:55 nayumi wrote:On January 30 2011 15:48 StorkHwaiting wrote:On January 30 2011 15:40 structuralinertia wrote:
here's the deal. Fanta's TvP is awesome. Stork's PvT is awesome. Fanta played better last night, stork played better today. Simple as that methinks It's not. Fanta's TvP is simply vulture harass. Beyond that, he's nothing special. Stork is a PvT god. Last night, Fanta got 2 build order wins and then a dismantling in game 3 that looked like Stork never even practiced vs dropship play. Today, Stork made a counter to Fantasy's retarded blind anti-shuttle build and handily crushed him. It showed simply that Stork is the superior player and should have had the balls to switch up his play rather than rely on the same stupid build just because it won him games. It's a classic case of Stork arrogance thinking he's so far superior that he doesn't need to innovate to win. It's why he's a constant silver medalist. If you look at Stork's thought process during his Incruit OSL run, he was totally different. He explicitly stated that he was going to switch things up and try to play mind games and surprise his opponent because those are essential ingredients to winning a bo5. For some inexplicable reason, he forgot that yesterday. Fantasy blind countered Stork's predictability, Stork is the more superior player. Stork blind countered Fantasy's predictability, Stork is the more superior player. I think you're right. But you summed up his argument pretty well. Heh. Bisu, Stork, Jaedong, and Flash fans all seem to be an easy troll -.-.
That's because they have so many fans, that someone will probably respond considering the size of this forum. Usually 2-5 of the most dedicated fans unless the person says something especially stupid.
+ Show Spoiler +Flash is boring.
JD's career is over.
Bisu is bonjwa ezpz.
Stork is the forever kong because he can only play cellphone games.
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5003 Posts
Holy shit, the Stork Interview is HUGE
soooo long. this is like a OSL winner's interview haha
anyway for people bitching about Stork/Fantasy, Stork admitted pretty much how he only learned how to deal with Fantasy's build on the train ride back home so yeah. Stork admits that he got absolutely destroyed by Fantasy -- outplayed in strategies and play so i don't know why the fans are so delusional regarding this :O
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United States5582 Posts
On January 30 2011 16:56 Milkis wrote:
Holy shit, the Stork Interview is HUGE
soooo long. this is like a OSL winner's interview haha
anyway for people bitching about Stork/Fantasy, Stork admitted pretty much how he only learned how to deal with Fantasy's build on the train ride back home so yeah
Lol srsly?
*Checks*
...oh snap, I'm not doing that shit. Heeeeeeeellz no. I ain't going near that essay at all. It even has 2 pics instead of 1, the hell?!
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On January 30 2011 16:59 Holgerius wrote:
Sounds epic, can't wait.
exactly what i was gonna say.
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On January 30 2011 16:56 Milkis wrote:
Holy shit, the Stork Interview is HUGE
soooo long. this is like a OSL winner's interview haha
anyway for people bitching about Stork/Fantasy, Stork admitted pretty much how he only learned how to deal with Fantasy's build on the train ride back home so yeah. Stork admits that he got absolutely destroyed by Fantasy -- outplayed in strategies and play so i don't know why the fans are so delusional regarding this :O
Exactly, Stork got outplayed in strategies and he lost. Not in mechanics, or in gamesense, both things which he trumpts Fantasy in.
This is what Stork fans have been saying the whole time. Glad you came around to the right point of view, Milkis 
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On January 30 2011 17:13 Turbovolver wrote:Show nested quote +On January 30 2011 16:56 Milkis wrote:
Holy shit, the Stork Interview is HUGE
soooo long. this is like a OSL winner's interview haha
anyway for people bitching about Stork/Fantasy, Stork admitted pretty much how he only learned how to deal with Fantasy's build on the train ride back home so yeah. Stork admits that he got absolutely destroyed by Fantasy -- outplayed in strategies and play so i don't know why the fans are so delusional regarding this :O Exactly, Stork got outplayed in strategies and he lost. Not in mechanics, or in gamesense, both things which he trumpts Fantasy in. This is what Stork fans have been saying the whole time. Glad you came around to the right point of view, Milkis
"Outplayed in strategies AND play"
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On January 30 2011 17:14 AppleTart wrote:
"Outplayed in strategies AND play"
Yeah Fantasy's game 3 was fuckin' awesome.
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On January 30 2011 17:14 AppleTart wrote:Show nested quote +On January 30 2011 17:13 Turbovolver wrote:On January 30 2011 16:56 Milkis wrote:
Holy shit, the Stork Interview is HUGE
soooo long. this is like a OSL winner's interview haha
anyway for people bitching about Stork/Fantasy, Stork admitted pretty much how he only learned how to deal with Fantasy's build on the train ride back home so yeah. Stork admits that he got absolutely destroyed by Fantasy -- outplayed in strategies and play so i don't know why the fans are so delusional regarding this :O Exactly, Stork got outplayed in strategies and he lost. Not in mechanics, or in gamesense, both things which he trumpts Fantasy in. This is what Stork fans have been saying the whole time. Glad you came around to the right point of view, Milkis "Outplayed in strategies AND play"
I would like to add the Starcraft Broodwar is an RTS(real time strategy) and the STRATEGY is the most important aspect of the game. So what if he can triumph Fantasy in mechanics? Those are the little details. Having mechanics and worst strategy doesn't mean that much jack.
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awww cmon we stork fans aren't all that bad, it's mainly storkhwaiting riling u guys up in here, but what else can you expect from a dude who's ID is storkhwaiting lol 
just puttin it out there cause I dont want us to feel the mighty wrath of the T1 fanswarm
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On January 30 2011 17:22 structuralinertia wrote:awww cmon we stork fans aren't all that bad, it's mainly storkhwaiting riling u guys up in here, but what else can you expect from a dude who's ID is storkhwaiting lol just puttin it out there cause I dont want us to feel the mighty wrath of the T1 fanswarm
Well its getting to the point where the KT roflster fans are getting itchy too >_> and you know something is wrong when KT fans defend T1....
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EPT
