Terran is imba, cuz it have a SV raping all Zerg units. Terran is imba, cuz it have more effective cheese strats Terran is imba, cuz it have m&m's, firebats- the most heroic units ever, and imba siege tanks raping shit Terran is imba, cuz it have 1000000 strats that can work, that even a "scrub" like fantasy, who suck against Zergs, can defeat JD if he is lucky enough. Terran is imba, cuz its defence is the most crushing shit ever Terran is imba, cuz it had 4 Bonjwas
AND
Zerg is NOT imba despite the swarm and plague (makes terran units paper planes) and consume. Zerg is NOT imba despite its ling able to rape shit, being defiler food and costing only 50 mins. Zerg is NOT imba despite scourges are effective soft couter for almoust all terran air. Zerg is NOT imba despite ultras being nightmare in late game for any bionic Zerg is NOT imba despite a doom drops - once succesfull, almoust always ending a game. Zerg is NOT imba despite it had 2 zerg exclusive finals last year and taken 1/2 of the trophies this year. Zerg is not imba, who cares about CLAM taking the MSL despite he suck against Terran.
On May 29 2010 19:40 link18 wrote: Very dissapointed in JD decision making, going 12 hatch every game. Bad scourge micro and TERRIBLE decisions in game 2(should have went muta ling in Flash natural and turtle with sunks and lurks).
Game one also pretty much retarded build, it almost never works when you skip mid game units.
And game 3 was just painful to watch-JD throwing away 20+ hyrdras on 2 bunks.If you watch game 3 again you can notice that Jd even came close to killing that push when tanks sieged below natural.
If he had those hydras he wasted he would have easily killed that push.Just abuse mech immobility and snipe tank or a couple of gols, and when tanks siege just move back.Repeat.
I really dont know what was JD thinking.Overall just poor games by him.
Of course props to Flash for making well executed builds, i really liked the build in the first game, fast vessel play. I want a PvZ finals again for once.That would be epic.
I don't think Flash would have pushed out at that point had Jaedong not thrown away more hydras.
Then just proceed to macro mode and late game?In any case, better then suicide your units and then get steamrolled.
On May 29 2010 19:23 okum wrote: Consensus during OSL finals: 14CC is a terrible autoloss build and Flash is such a retard for sticking to it.
Consensus during MSL finals: 14CC is a totally imba autowin build that ruins Starcraft.
Both statements have some validity - it's an economic cheese, so it's autoloss to an early rush and produces a heavy advantage against standard play. It tends to shorten games, which frustrates a lot of fans.
I love jockeying for build order advantages, so although I'm disappointed, it's hard to fault Flash; fast scouting --> fast CC, or fast nexus or fast double hatchery, isn't cheesy on a two-player map. Although waiting until after you scout to put up your first barracks/pool/gateway will probably cause your death against an all-in rush. (4pool, or proxy double rax/gateway.)
I think Jaedong should've 4-pooled in the first two matches, out of disdain for the map pool and to dissuade Flash from econ-cheese... but countering with his own econ cheese (which he did in game two) would've also worked, had Jaedong played better.
Jaedong lost because he was unable to predict that Flash would go every game for an economic build. Doesn't go further than that. If he had 9 pooled he would have won, if he had 4 pooled, he would have won, if he had 7 pooled, he would have won.
On May 29 2010 18:49 Lebesgue wrote: People forget that last season Flash raped Jaedong hard in OSL before the MSL final. However, before MSL Jaedong had plenty of time and opportunity to study Flash's build. He was the better player that night but the difference was stark mainly in the build order advantege. This time Flash prepared a new bunch of strats and raped Jaedong again.
I see, so when Jaedong wins it's because of build order advantage, when Flash wins it's because he's so much better and just "rapes" jaedong... right, that's great logic!!!
Never said so. Please don't read between the lines.
All I meant that Flash this timebrought new strategies into the table and won. Last time it was Jaedong's turn. But when they first time met when Flash started dominating in Bo3 in OSL their games looked very similar to games tonight.
Both are great players and it is obvious that having an upper hand in build orders leads to a domination of one or the others
someone needs to quote all the Flash fans in the OSL Finals thread and replace "bullshit zerg cheese" with "bullshit 14cc cheese" because the exact same arguments can be made about this series lol
On May 29 2010 19:43 StarStruck wrote: Why in the blue hell would you let Flash do 14cc without punishing him Jae? He pretty much gave him a free win, lol.
He didn't play his game. Instead you played into Flash's. Wow, just wow.
3 hatch before pool and hydra all-in are both counters, they just failed.
On May 29 2010 19:42 hitthat wrote: Terran is imba, cuz it have a SV raping all Zerg units. Terran is imba, cuz it have more effective cheese strats Terran is imba, cuz it have m&m's, firebats- the most heroic units ever, and imba siege tanks raping shit Terran is imba, cuz it have 1000000 strats that can work, that even a "scrub" like fantasy, who suck against Zergs, can defeat JD if he is lucky enough. Terran is imba, cuz its defence is the most crushing shit ever Terran is imba, cuz it had 4 Bonjwas
AND
Zerg is NOT imba despite the swarm and plague (makes terran units paper planes) and consume. Zerg is NOT imba despite its ling able to rape shit, being defiler food and costing only 50 mins. Zerg is NOT imba despite scourges are effective soft couter for almoust all terran air. Zerg is NOT imba despite ultras being nightmare in late game for any bionic Zerg is NOT imba despite a doom drops - once succesfull, almoust always ending a game. Zerg is NOT imba despite it had 2 zerg exclusive finals last year and taken 1/2 of the trophies this year. Zerg is not imba, who cares about CLAM taking the MSL despite he suck against Terran.
can't we all just get along and agree that protoss sucks?
On May 29 2010 19:41 jonich0n wrote: This title is Flash's. Yes, he just lost OSL to EffOrt, but he lost because EffOrt played like a newbie. The complete randomness of EffOrt's play caused Flash to lose, not Flash slumping or burning out. Flash has to be insanely upset at this loss to a much inferior player. I believe he will bring everything he has to the MSL finals, and even Jaedong will be hard pressed to stand up to that.
Don't pull an Idra to take away Effort's achievement. Effort outplayed Flash on that day, easy as that, JD today didnt.
On May 29 2010 19:44 Hot_Bid wrote: someone needs to quote all the Flash fans in the OSL Finals thread and replace "bullshit zerg cheese" with "bullshit 14cc cheese" because the exact same arguments can be made about this series lol
how things change in one week!
Make a list of the people who complained in OSL. Most of them aren't here - the rational and loyal Flash fans didn't blame Zerg....
On May 29 2010 19:43 StarStruck wrote: Why in the blue hell would you let Flash do 14cc without punishing him Jae? He pretty much gave him a free win, lol.
He didn't play his game. Instead you played into Flash's. Wow, just wow.
He did. He went all-in hydra game 3. He failed in the execution because Flash was repairing the bunker. He could've taken out the two supply depots + barracks ezpz and the contained Flash while he secured 3/4 bases. Instead, he focused down the bunker losing six or so hydras. Then he took down the supplies and barracks. Flash rebuilt it all and sieged a tank, and JD forced the issue by throwing away twelve hydras on two tanks and two bunkers. After that Flash had it.
I think the losses to Baby and now Flash proves that JD peaked a while back and he's fast becoming a "veteran". A Bisu for the zerg. Seeing JD lose 0-3 reminds me how frustrating SC can be no matter what your skill level is.
On May 29 2010 19:23 okum wrote: Consensus during OSL finals: 14CC is a terrible autoloss build and Flash is such a retard for sticking to it.
Consensus during MSL finals: 14CC is a totally imba autowin build that ruins Starcraft.
Both statements have some validity - it's an economic cheese, so it's autoloss to an early rush and produces a heavy advantage against standard play. It tends to shorten games, which frustrates a lot of fans.
I love jockeying for build order advantages, so although I'm disappointed, it's hard to fault Flash; fast scouting --> fast CC, or fast nexus or fast double hatchery, isn't cheesy on a two-player map. Although waiting until after you scout to put up your first barracks/pool/gateway will probably cause your death against an all-in rush. (4pool, or proxy double rax/gateway.)
I think Jaedong should've 4-pooled in the first two matches, out of disdain for the map pool and to dissuade Flash from econ-cheese... but countering with his own econ cheese (which he did in game two) would've also worked, had Jaedong played better.
Jaedong lost because he was unable to predict that Flash would go every game for an economic build. Doesn't go further than that. If he had 9 pooled he would have won, if he had 4 pooled, he would have won, if he had 7 pooled, he would have won.
that's kinda dumb... zergs rarely even go <9pool these days against T, especially on the 3 maps we saw today.
and 9pool was not an autowin anyway... especially since Flash scouted before putting down a CC at 14.
I see, so when Jaedong wins it's because of build order advantage, when Flash wins it's because he's so much better and just "rapes" jaedong... right, that's great logic!!!
well, Flash has made it to all of the last 4 starleague finals. you have to admit that is alot of pressure and practicing. where as JD got alot more time to prepare.
lets admit it, flash got better elo and kespa ranking that the dong. so we know, statistically, flash is the better player going into the finals.
EPT
