Our beloved gasp zerg, ggaemo is making his first appearance since that epic game where his hydras got owned by that mine. Look forward to seeing some more ggaemo failures as he lets Jaedong down once again. Poor Jaedong. Unless Backho or =O zerg can pull off some miracle, 3-0 KT incoming
On December 09 2009 06:29 DreaM)XeRO wrote: BackHo < Neo Heartbreak Ridge > Violet Violet is 9-0 in PL. BackHo hasnt played yet.. -____-
Wrong on both counts!
But this does seem like a likely 3-0.
- 815 always impresses when I see him, I never know why he doesn't get sent out more. Minesweeper Zerg is loveable, but not that good. - Flash is himself - Violet is very strong in proleague, sorta the protoss version of Sea.
Even though 815, Flash, and Violet are all the favorites in their matchups, I hope that one of them (not Flash) fumbles their game, Jaedong wins his game, and we go to ace.
Tornado was always decently TvZ balanced (and hopefully Neo Tornado is, too), so there's a good chance (unless the coaches hate Starcraft fans) that we'll get to see a Flash vs Jaedong ace match.
I'm going to be extremely disappointed if there's no Flash vs JD ace tonight.
On December 09 2009 06:29 DreaM)XeRO wrote: BackHo < Neo Heartbreak Ridge > Violet Violet is 9-0 in PL. BackHo hasnt played yet.. -____-
Wrong on both counts!
But this does seem like a likely 3-0.
- 815 always impresses when I see him, I never know why he doesn't get sent out more. Minesweeper Zerg is loveable, but not that good. - Flash is himself - Violet is very strong in proleague, sorta the protoss version of Sea.
ami wrong? Backho hasnt played in this current season and Violet i thought was 9-0
On December 09 2009 06:29 DreaM)XeRO wrote: BackHo < Neo Heartbreak Ridge > Violet Violet is 9-0 in PL. BackHo hasnt played yet.. -____-
Wrong on both counts!
But this does seem like a likely 3-0.
- 815 always impresses when I see him, I never know why he doesn't get sent out more. Minesweeper Zerg is loveable, but not that good. - Flash is himself - Violet is very strong in proleague, sorta the protoss version of Sea.
ami wrong? Backho hasnt played in this current season and Violet i thought was 9-0
On December 09 2009 06:29 DreaM)XeRO wrote: BackHo < Neo Heartbreak Ridge > Violet Violet is 9-0 in PL. BackHo hasnt played yet.. -____-
Wrong on both counts!
But this does seem like a likely 3-0.
- 815 always impresses when I see him, I never know why he doesn't get sent out more. Minesweeper Zerg is loveable, but not that good. - Flash is himself - Violet is very strong in proleague, sorta the protoss version of Sea.
ami wrong? Backho hasnt played in this current season and Violet i thought was 9-0
even though kt is favored for the first three matches there's a good chance at least one of them will drop their game, meaning an epic killer v flash match on tornado
On December 09 2009 07:11 Tyxiquale wrote: there's absolutely no reason to send out anyone other than flash for ace.
On that line of thought, there's no one on oz other than JD with an ounce of chance against flash. Fingers crossed that's what we get.
The thing is, jaedong has to play movie tonight, so maybe the coaches didn't ask him to practise for the ace match..
That match with movie doesn't matter, they are both already qualified for round of 8, so doubt he practiced too much for it. And besides JD always puts PL higher priority.
On December 09 2009 06:29 DreaM)XeRO wrote: BackHo < Neo Heartbreak Ridge > Violet Violet is 9-0 in PL. BackHo hasnt played yet.. -____-
Wrong on both counts!
But this does seem like a likely 3-0.
- 815 always impresses when I see him, I never know why he doesn't get sent out more. Minesweeper Zerg is loveable, but not that good. - Flash is himself - Violet is very strong in proleague, sorta the protoss version of Sea.
ami wrong? Backho hasnt played in this current season and Violet i thought was 9-0
On December 09 2009 07:11 Tyxiquale wrote: there's absolutely no reason to send out anyone other than flash for ace.
On that line of thought, there's no one on oz other than JD with an ounce of chance against flash. Fingers crossed that's what we get.
The thing is, jaedong has to play movie tonight, so maybe the coaches didn't ask him to practise for the ace match..
That match with movie doesn't matter, they are both already qualified for round of 8, so doubt he practiced too much for it. And besides JD always puts PL higher priority.
It does matter.. a little.
If Jaedong wins against movie, he'll advance as A1, and will play C2. Assuming flash advances as D2 (cos he lost against stork, and will most likely win against type-B), Jaedong will play flash in the finals.
If Jaedong loses against movie, he'll advance as A2, and will play against C1. Assuming flash again advances as D2, they'll play each other in the semis.
I guess what i'm trying to say is that jaedong would rather play against flash in the finals than semi finals.
This is going to be such a disappointing match. I've got no faith left in Backho's skill, and Hiya vs. Flash... please.
We'll know whether the match will have a chance at going to ACE after the first game. If ggaemo pulls out a win, we may actually have a match here. If not... we go to bed early.
On December 09 2009 07:11 Tyxiquale wrote: there's absolutely no reason to send out anyone other than flash for ace.
On that line of thought, there's no one on oz other than JD with an ounce of chance against flash. Fingers crossed that's what we get.
The thing is, jaedong has to play movie tonight, so maybe the coaches didn't ask him to practise for the ace match..
That match with movie doesn't matter, they are both already qualified for round of 8, so doubt he practiced too much for it. And besides JD always puts PL higher priority.
It does matter.. a little.
If Jaedong wins against movie, he'll advance as A1, and will play C2. Assuming flash advances as D2 (cos he lost against stork, and will most likely win against type-B), Jaedong will play flash in the finals.
If Jaedong loses against movie, he'll advance as A2, and will play against C1. Assuming flash again advances as D2, they'll play each other in the semis.
I guess what i'm trying to say is that jaedong would rather play against flash in the finals than semi finals.
I don't think Jaedong cares that much. Finals, semifinals, it's still a Bo5. Sure, it'd be more epic for him to crush Flash 3-0 in the finals rather than the semis But what matters is that they'll play each other; Flash will have his chance to stop Jaedong from making history, and that's what matters.
On December 09 2009 07:31 NicolBolas wrote: This is going to be such a disappointing match. I've got no faith left in Backho's skill, and Hiya vs. Flash... please.
We'll know whether the match will have a chance at going to ACE after the first game. If ggaemo pulls out a win, we may actually have a match here. If not... we go to bed early.
On December 09 2009 07:11 Tyxiquale wrote: there's absolutely no reason to send out anyone other than flash for ace.
On that line of thought, there's no one on oz other than JD with an ounce of chance against flash. Fingers crossed that's what we get.
The thing is, jaedong has to play movie tonight, so maybe the coaches didn't ask him to practise for the ace match..
That match with movie doesn't matter, they are both already qualified for round of 8, so doubt he practiced too much for it. And besides JD always puts PL higher priority.
It does matter.. a little.
If Jaedong wins against movie, he'll advance as A1, and will play C2. Assuming flash advances as D2 (cos he lost against stork, and will most likely win against type-B), Jaedong will play flash in the finals.
If Jaedong loses against movie, he'll advance as A2, and will play against C1. Assuming flash again advances as D2, they'll play each other in the semis.
I guess what i'm trying to say is that jaedong would rather play against flash in the finals than semi finals.
I don't think Jaedong cares that much. Finals, semifinals, it's still a Bo5. Sure, it'd be more epic for him to crush Flash 3-0 in the finals rather than the semis But what matters is that they'll play each other; Flash will have his chance to stop Jaedong from making history, and that's what matters.
Pppllleeeaaassseee, your hopeless dream of Jaedong 3-0 over Flash is just that... a hopeless dream.
On December 09 2009 08:07 skronch wrote: I'd love to see JD vs. flash ace here. someone needs to put his TvZ streak to the test. Its impressive, but he hasn't run into true s-class zvt yet
Well, if you consider Effort's ZvT as S Class, he kind of has by crushing Effort 2-0 at WCG.
On December 09 2009 08:17 atm0sphere33 wrote: Lets hope one of the 3 scrubs of Oz can steal a victory so we can see JD play and possibly JAEDONG FLASH ACE MATCH?!?!?!?!?!
On December 09 2009 08:17 atm0sphere33 wrote: Lets hope one of the 3 scrubs of Oz can steal a victory so we can see JD play and possibly JAEDONG FLASH ACE MATCH?!?!?!?!?!
Also who said backho has good early game? lol
its true. His PvP is..... his "best" MU best as ZvZ is Hyuk's "best" MU
Backho can hang with the big boys.. eh when it comes to PvP
On December 09 2009 08:07 skronch wrote: I'd love to see JD vs. flash ace here. someone needs to put his TvZ streak to the test. Its impressive, but he hasn't run into true s-class zvt yet
Well, if you consider Effort's ZvT as S Class, he kind of has by crushing Effort 2-0 at WCG.
Effort burned himself out on Proleague playoffs (including his epic 3-0 victory over Samsung Khan) and didn't recover until the off season. He also lost 0-3 to Iris... the same Iris who lost to Kwanro in one of the worst series of all time.
If this series makes it to the ace match, I think it will depend on who was sent out in the last Oz ace match on whether Jaedong plays or not. I forgot which thread it was in, but someone made a good point that maybe there are details in Jaedong's new contract that limits his amount of play. Seeing as we get little to no information on the players' contract, I think it is unlikely to learn about any of the special agreements.
On December 09 2009 08:07 skronch wrote: I'd love to see JD vs. flash ace here. someone needs to put his TvZ streak to the test. Its impressive, but he hasn't run into true s-class zvt yet
I would like to know that besides Jaedong, who are the other s-class ZvT? Everyone kept on saying FlaSh needs to beat true s-class ZvT but I don't know who else have s-class ZvT.
On December 09 2009 08:07 skronch wrote: I'd love to see JD vs. flash ace here. someone needs to put his TvZ streak to the test. Its impressive, but he hasn't run into true s-class zvt yet
I would like to know that besides Jaedong, who are the other s-class ZvT? Everyone kept on saying FlaSh needs to beat true s-class ZvT but I don't know who else have s-class ZvT.
Flash has been playing lights out in the matchup without a doubt. I think people would like to see him against not necessarily s-class ZvT players, but top zerg players in general. During this streak, I think the best zergs he faced were the hite zergs yellow and hogil, along with Effort, who had been drained as previously mentioned. I think a showdown with either Jaedong, a fresher Effort, or even Zero would satisfy the fans.
On December 09 2009 08:07 skronch wrote: I'd love to see JD vs. flash ace here. someone needs to put his TvZ streak to the test. Its impressive, but he hasn't run into true s-class zvt yet
I would like to know that besides Jaedong, who are the other s-class ZvT? Everyone kept on saying FlaSh needs to beat true s-class ZvT but I don't know who else have s-class ZvT.
Mostly it's just Jaedong, because people keep claiming Flash looks 'unbeatable' and is the favorite in a best of 5 against anybody. (*cough*Stork/Bisu/Jaedong*cough*)
Effort, Calm, and Yarnc are the obvious next choices for S class ZvT, but Yarnc's vs. T record is very bad this season, so the best substitute would be Zero (the next ZvT ELO). Flash has not played Calm or Zero in a while (and he lost the last game against each). He trounced Effort in WCG, but Effort was clearly burned out from Proleague finals (lost 0-3 to Iris and so forth). He has not played Effort since Effort's recovery.
Flash is owning A-level Zergs, which stands him in good stead against Effort, Calm, Zero, and even Jaedong... but until he actually plays the best players in the matchup (preferably Jaedong, since he looks a lot stronger than the others) he's untested against S class ZvT.
i just want the game to go to Ace so we can have at least one non-mirror match....although i am looking forward to a hopefully good TvT between Flash and Hiya.
If I remember right, last time Flash vs Hiya was a surprisingly good game. Hiya tried a 2fac timing attack, Flash rolled it over with assistance from his SCVs, it looked like Hiya was making a comeback, then wraiths came out for Flash and it was all over.
But Flash isn't allowed to have his TvT streak broken at least until he meets Sea.
Hiya is one of the terrans I'd give Flash a chance of losing to... but I don't know... he needs to have a build planned like he did on Medusa to win more like 10% of the time
Can't argue with the 3-0. 815 vs Ggaemo is a bit of a tossup but Flash and Violet have been on fire in their respective matchups. Although if it does go to a 4th, I think Jaedong is the clear winner over Luxury. And then, we'd get to see a Flash vs Jaedong ace match! :D
Not enough credit for Backho in this thread imo. Violet is a young upstart who's 0-1 against Backho. Furthermore, Violet is 0-2 against players with -ho in their ID.
Backho is a veteran who's faced the best Protoss in the world over and over again, and even won some of the time. I'd say Backho has a 99% of winning this unless Violet does some insane cheese.
On December 09 2009 11:01 Slow Motion wrote: Not enough credit for Backho in this thread imo. Violet is a young upstart who's 0-1 against Backho. Furthermore, Violet is 0-2 against players with -ho in their ID.
Backho is a veteran who's faced the best Protoss in the world over and over again, and even won some of the time. I'd say Backho has a 99% of winning this unless Violet does some insane cheese.
....? Forget the past Violet was horrifail and backho was decent. Now, backho is horrifail and Violet is KT's Protoss ace with a 7-1 record this season.
On December 09 2009 11:01 Slow Motion wrote: Not enough credit for Backho in this thread imo. Violet is a young upstart who's 0-1 against Backho. Furthermore, Violet is 0-2 against players with -ho in their ID.
Backho is a veteran who's faced the best Protoss in the world over and over again, and even won some of the time. I'd say Backho has a 99% of winning this unless Violet does some insane cheese.
lol, i almost thought you were being serious there.
On December 09 2009 11:01 Slow Motion wrote: Not enough credit for Backho in this thread imo. Violet is a young upstart who's 0-1 against Backho. Furthermore, Violet is 0-2 against players with -ho in their ID.
Backho is a veteran who's faced the best Protoss in the world over and over again, and even won some of the time. I'd say Backho has a 99% of winning this unless Violet does some insane cheese.
lol, i almost thought you were being serious there.
Well I am serious that Backho will win. Just wait and see.
On December 09 2009 11:01 Slow Motion wrote: Not enough credit for Backho in this thread imo. Violet is a young upstart who's 0-1 against Backho. Furthermore, Violet is 0-2 against players with -ho in their ID.
Backho is a veteran who's faced the best Protoss in the world over and over again, and even won some of the time. I'd say Backho has a 99% of winning this unless Violet does some insane cheese.
lol, i almost thought you were being serious there.
Well I am serious that Backho will win. Just wait and see.
For a second I also thought this post (along with your last) was serious. Backho has been around for a bit (wouldnt say veteran, and come on, everyones faced bisu and stork -_-) but hes consistently been mediocre, especially this year where hes like 0-3. The fact that he doesnt get a consistent spot on the lineup of a team composed of 1 S-class player and a bunch of mediocre players tells u something. But hey, I want this to go to ACE so i'd love if i was proved wrong
im gonna go for the record and predict 3-0 for oz...
gaemo >>> 815, should be expected when you practice with the best zvzer and player in the world hiya >>> flash, his got flash's number backho >>> backho, the guy is amazing simply
while it looks like KT will win 3-0, if we assign KT players individually a win percentage of 80% in the first 3 matches (this is very generous since its much higher win % than their records indicate for mirror matches), KT still only has a 51.2% chance of avoiding Jaedong all together.
On December 09 2009 11:01 Slow Motion wrote: Not enough credit for Backho in this thread imo. Violet is a young upstart who's 0-1 against Backho. Furthermore, Violet is 0-2 against players with -ho in their ID.
Backho is a veteran who's faced the best Protoss in the world over and over again, and even won some of the time. I'd say Backho has a 99% of winning this unless Violet does some insane cheese.
lol, i almost thought you were being serious there.
Well I am serious that Backho will win. Just wait and see.
This guy is in an awesome position. If Violet loses, he'll be the smuggest person in this thread and if Backho loses he can join in with everyone else and go "Well, Backho is Failho" or "Fuck you Backho".
But he has a point. Backho is a good player: he should win if Violet lets him cut and paste whatever he's prepared in the Oz practice room. However if Violet forces Backho to actually think, Violet's won the game simply because Backho's decision making is amazingly poor.
so Oz fans, who do we think has the best chance of winning this and letting Jaedong play, ggaemo, HiyA or BackHo?
BackHo hasn't been playing well recently, HiyA has but he's playing FlaSh. I really like ggaemo but 815 is a decent player so I think he'll have a hard time
I really think I'm pinning my hopes on HiyA to do something somehow. It could be a rough night for Oz though...
On December 09 2009 11:49 Beside_kr wrote: so Oz fans, who do we think has the best chance of winning this and letting Jaedong play, ggaemo, HiyA or BackHo?
BackHo hasn't been playing well recently, HiyA has but he's playing FlaSh. I really like ggaemo but 815 is a decent player so I think he'll have a hard time
I really think I'm pinning my hopes on HiyA to do something somehow. It could be a rough night for Oz though...
I'd say Backho has the best chance. He's always had solid PvP and has been able to take down even the best PvPers.
EDIT: Oh jeez, JD has another game tonight. It's against a decent player too, Movie....they'll probably have someone else practicing for ACE so JD doesn't get burned out. Meaning Oz'll lose because no one but JD has a ghost of a chance against Flash...-.-....Well, still, can't do anything but hope! Go Oz!
On December 09 2009 12:20 XThunderyX wrote: I'm pretty sure one of the three before JD can take a game, and JD will definitly take a game. This'll probably go to ACE, hellz yeah!
EDIT: Oh jeez, JD has another game tonight. It's against a decent player too, Movie....they'll probably have someone else practicing for ACE so JD doesn't get burned out. Meaning Oz'll lose because no one but JD has a ghost of a chance against Flash...-.-....Well, still, can't do anything but hope! Go Oz!
At least this time there will be a legit reason for sending Killer out as ACE.
On December 09 2009 12:20 XThunderyX wrote: I'm pretty sure one of the three before JD can take a game, and JD will definitly take a game. This'll probably go to ACE, hellz yeah!
EDIT: Oh jeez, JD has another game tonight. It's against a decent player too, Movie....they'll probably have someone else practicing for ACE so JD doesn't get burned out. Meaning Oz'll lose because no one but JD has a ghost of a chance against Flash...-.-....Well, still, can't do anything but hope! Go Oz!
At least this time there will be a legit reason for sending Killer out as ACE.
Haha I'm okay with that too, because on the off chance Killer beats Flash I STILL get FPL points! ;P
On December 09 2009 13:04 Redshirt wrote: Seriously clutch zerglings from 815. They basically kill not only all the zerglings but most of ggaemo's economy.
It's not hard when you've got significantly more zerglings
On December 09 2009 13:15 XThunderyX wrote: Backho has a legitimate chance, HiyA has a chance, but tbh it's not a high one. Let's hope HiyA can pull one off for the team, shall we?
Games like this makes you wonder whether Flash will ever lose a TvT again. I mean, he's just invincible in straight up play, and he also seems to be immune to gayness as well.
On December 09 2009 13:37 Holgerius wrote: Games like this makes you wonder whether Flash will ever lose a TvT again. I mean, he's just invincible in straight up play, and he also seems to be immune to gayness as well.
I'd love to see a Bo5 Flash vs Sea. I bet Sea can take a game or two off him
On December 09 2009 13:37 Scaramanga wrote: did flash rebreak his elo peak?
I don't think Hiya is worth 5 points. He may have retied it.
If he beats Type-b, which he has to to A) Keep his goal of beating Oov's TvZ streak, B) to mostly assure he makes it out of group stages, C)wants to continue until he breaks Oov's tvz elo, he'll rebreak his regular Elo peak.
How funny is it that Flash's last 4 official losses have come against toss? can anyone calculate what his ELO would be if you took out those 4 games? seems Best, Stork, and Bisu are the only ones keeping him from ~2400 by now
Basically, Flash is so far ahead of every single player that isn't S-class that it's bonjwa-esque, it's just he struggles more with s-classers than other s-classers seem to.
If he were as good as, say, Jaedong at beating top tier players he just may have been Bonjwa, but Jaedong/Bisu/Stork seem to stand in his way alot (though Stork is how he got his amazing kickstart).
On December 09 2009 13:45 Chen wrote: How funny is it that Flash's last 4 official losses have come against toss? can anyone calculate what his ELO would be if you took out those 4 games? seems Best, Stork, and Bisu are the only ones keeping him from ~2400 by now
the bo5 against JD is was what kept Bisu from doing an insane all time high
Oddly enough, Backho will win if Violet cannot secure another base seeing how he was not mining from his 3rd. But he has so many chances to mess up. =[
Our beloved gasp zerg, ggaemo is making his first appearance since that epic game where his hydras got owned by that mine. Look forward to seeing some more ggaemo failures as he lets Jaedong down once again. Poor Jaedong. Unless Backho or =O zerg can pull off some miracle, 3-0 KT incoming
On December 09 2009 14:06 skronch wrote: this is immensely entertaining, do not understand how backho has managed to keep himself in this
Backho opened dt, so he was able to expand quicker than violet because violet had to hold back, and backho controlled the map. So it was a very defensive mindset from both players. Backho lost his pylon that was supposed to scout that nexus snipe. Therefore, his 3rd nexus was sniped.
Backho recovered by doing a desperation attack. If that attack failed, he would lose. However, he got lucky and violet's reavers were in the front and together, so 2 storms on those = gg reavers. Backho, in this battle, had amazing positioning. He stormed almost all of violets zealots, and his zealots seperated violet's army. It was sex.
Backho was in this game after that. More, actually. Violet was behind at this point, if anyone. Both players took their 4th, and then a 5th. Violet caught backho off guard slightly. More specifically, he used about 3 templar to shoot at his army, and backho, thinking "free killz lol", attacks, and gets stormed like hell, and pulls back, completely ruining his positioning. In the final battle, backho fought in a less than favorable terrain, had terrible positioning, and lost all of his units instantly.
Backho played a very strong game despite such unfortunate happenings, but in the end, he just didnt have the observers he needed, imo.
i dunno why people are getting so hyped about unit composition, the real reason backho lost was because he spent a ton of resources building a nexus and cannons at his 5th, which is like 8 less zealots
i can't see how jaedong is not regretting his decision to stay on OZ. i call him leaving OZ in '10-11. it fucking sucks to see his teammates not making any significant gains. Pull your weight you fucking scrubs.
On December 09 2009 14:16 iamho wrote: i dunno why people are getting so hyped about unit composition, the real reason backho lost was because he spent a ton of resources building a nexus and cannons at his 5th, which is like 8 less zealots
MORE zlots would not have made a difference.... Violet had like 4 archons and 20-30 goons at teh end of the fight. Backho lost cause his entire army was zlots, so 1/2 his army had to mill around while all of Violets goons and archons could wail on the frontline units.
On December 09 2009 14:19 intoyourrainbOW wrote: i can't see how jaedong is not regretting his decision to stay on OZ. i call him leaving OZ in '10-11. it fucking sucks to see his teammates not making any significant gains. Pull your weight you fucking srubs.
im pretty sure his reason is because he likes the players/coach and didnt want to go to another team because he enjoyed being there. they may be fun guys, which is fine, but they are garbage at sc (garbage relative to the other teams, as they would obviously all own me) so they lose a lot. if jaedong was serious about winning every match, im sure he would negotiate with a deeper team
On December 09 2009 14:19 intoyourrainbOW wrote: i can't see how jaedong is not regretting his decision to stay on OZ. i call him leaving OZ in '10-11. it fucking sucks to see his teammates not making any significant gains. Pull your weight you fucking scrubs.
Well, to be fair. Ggaemo played better than most zergs when facing a 12 pool into spore when opening a 9 pool. And HiyA's cheese was vulnerable to a wraith before CC build. Backho, I have nothing to say for him.
Not to mention they did break even this weak, so really, stfu and stop spewing stereotypes. (w/o a strong argument)
On December 09 2009 14:16 iamho wrote: i dunno why people are getting so hyped about unit composition, the real reason backho lost was because he spent a ton of resources building a nexus and cannons at his 5th, which is like 8 less zealots
no the real reason violet won was on that last push he had around 2 and a half control groups of goons and backho had maybe one dragoon total
Well, losing to Flash in TvT is a default option now. You go into the game knowing that most probably you will be raped. I can only see Sea or Skyhigh challenging Flash in TvT now. But even against these two my money would be on Flash...
On December 09 2009 14:19 intoyourrainbOW wrote: i can't see how jaedong is not regretting his decision to stay on OZ. i call him leaving OZ in '10-11. it fucking sucks to see his teammates not making any significant gains. Pull your weight you fucking srubs.
im pretty sure his reason is because he likes the players/coach and didnt want to go to another team because he enjoyed being there. they may be fun guys, which is fine, but they are garbage at sc (garbage relative to the other teams, as they would obviously all own me) so they lose a lot. if jaedong was serious about winning every match, im sure he would negotiate with a deeper team
Maybe that was his thought process during the negotiations, but a line has to be drawn eventually. How much longer can Jaedong stand to see his teammates losing, and costing the team PL wins? Sooner or later he has to stop being the sole breadwinner for OZ.
Flash was in the same position as jaedong is in right now for 2 seasons. What did he do? He stuck by his teamates, coaches and team. He had faith that the team will turn itself around. Look at them now. Kt is owning.
Perhaps that'd what jd is thinking as well, just a little faith.
On December 09 2009 14:14 pieisamazing wrote: only support oz because of how hard jaedong works for the team, even though the rest of them are trash
atleast you guys got to finals
We have 3 gold medalist and we still couldnt get to finals.
1 guy with 5 gold medals > 3 guys with 5 gold medals together
who has 5 gold medals in oz? I know jaedong has 4, 3 osl and 1 msl
kt is 3 gold with flash, luxury, forgg
Pretty sure he was referring to Jaedong's WCG gold.
Not quite as prestigious as the other tournaments granted, but still a very impressive feat.
then what about kt's 4th gold? the gom. if you include that, then jaedong has 6. but really, when you say gold, its usually osl or msl
Much more difficult to count gom, as it hasn't been around for that long and has already been disestablished.
Easy to discount WCG, but the qualifiers alone are fiendishly difficult. Follow this up with wins against, theoretically, the worlds best players (obviously most of the challenge comes from your fellow koreans) and you've got yourself a victory to be proud of.
Back to the old days it seems. We had enough fun for this week, it was time to return the favour. No matter, OZ doesn't deserve playoff spot this season, JD won't carry the whole team forever. Gratz KT
On December 09 2009 14:49 zdubius wrote: Back to the old days it seems. We had enough fun for this week, it was time to return the favour. No matter, OZ doesn't deserve playoff spot this season, JD won't carry the whole team forever. Gratz KT
Naw Oz will still make it. Being 3-0'ed by KT I don't think is a big deal here since they are pretty much dominating everyone except CJ
On December 09 2009 14:46 TwoToneTerran wrote: If you want to include tournaments that are really hard but not kespa sanctioned then you should include GSI, too, which Flash won.
On December 09 2009 14:14 pieisamazing wrote: only support oz because of how hard jaedong works for the team, even though the rest of them are trash
atleast you guys got to finals
We have 3 gold medalist and we still couldnt get to finals.
1 guy with 5 gold medals > 3 guys with 5 gold medals together
who has 5 gold medals in oz? I know jaedong has 4, 3 osl and 1 msl
kt is 3 gold with flash, luxury, forgg
I counted gom
uh... no, it doesn't add up then
jaedong: 3 osl, 1 msl, 1 wcg, 1 gom
flash: 1 osl, 1 gom forgg: 1 msl luxury: 1 msl (dam u for taking jangbi's gold)
you said jaedong had 5 gold including gom when he has 6 including wcg and kt players have 4 total, u said kt had 5, unless i'm missing someone from kt
i didnt count wcg obvi lol and flash has 2 goms, GSI and GSL S3
so yeah if you want to count WCG AND gom its 6-5. if you want to count neither then its 4-3.
and honestly I dont know why you wouldnt count GSI, that was basically a Ro16 comprised of nothing but S-class players (and also boxer and anytime lol)
On December 09 2009 14:46 TwoToneTerran wrote: If you want to include tournaments that are really hard but not kespa sanctioned then you should include GSI, too, which Flash won.
GSI was invitational, and not institutionalized.
All tournaments are invitational to a degree, considering OSL and MSL both have seeds.
GSI was a much more impressive tournament than every GOM season.
On December 09 2009 20:00 pripple wrote: really saw this coming since seeing the lineups, it still hurts nonetheless ;< damn please put JD in the first 3 sets.
This. I really don't understand why they aren't doing this always. It gives a MUCH higher probability of getting an extra game, which leads to an extra shot for one of the other Oz guys to get a win and get the match to ace, where JD is the best player in the world to have on your team.
On December 09 2009 20:00 pripple wrote: really saw this coming since seeing the lineups, it still hurts nonetheless ;< damn please put JD in the first 3 sets.
This. I really don't understand why they aren't doing this always. It gives a MUCH higher probability of getting an extra game, which leads to an extra shot for one of the other Oz guys to get a win and get the match to ace, where JD is the best player in the world to have on your team.
Who cares if it is 0-3 or 1-3 anyway? Seriously, assuming jaedong wins his game, 1 of the other 3 players has to win a game, too. But it really doesn't matter if it is on #1, #2, #3 or #4. And ya, it sucks for many FPL teams, but that's it. Even better, when all the other players lose, jaedong does not have to play for nothing and burn out that fast.
Anyway. Hurts alot to see OZ losing again that hard. Well, with the new Oz uniforms coming to us, we hopefully have a new lucky charm soon and OZ can start raping again.
On December 09 2009 22:22 SilverSkyLark wrote: Hmm, iirc jaedong is supposed to play in either of the first 3 sets then backho will win the 4th...then jaedong takes ace....
it was mostly that way..
...k but now you're assuming that backho will win if he plays in the fourth instead of the third. That's dumb.
On December 09 2009 20:00 pripple wrote: really saw this coming since seeing the lineups, it still hurts nonetheless ;< damn please put JD in the first 3 sets.
This. I really don't understand why they aren't doing this always. It gives a MUCH higher probability of getting an extra game, which leads to an extra shot for one of the other Oz guys to get a win and get the match to ace, where JD is the best player in the world to have on your team.
Who cares if it is 0-3 or 1-3 anyway? Seriously, assuming jaedong wins his game, 1 of the other 3 players has to win a game, too. But it really doesn't matter if it is on #1, #2, #3 or #4. And ya, it sucks for many FPL teams, but that's it. Even better, when all the other players lose, jaedong does not have to play for nothing and burn out that fast.
Anyway. Hurts alot to see OZ losing again that hard. Well, with the new Oz uniforms coming to us, we hopefully have a new lucky charm soon and OZ can start raping again.
There are pro and cons ofc. It is not unheard of that teams tie wins at the end of season 5 and map difference comes in to play which promotes an earlier placement of JD. However, to me it seems that it is still more logical to put him fourth as to save his energy when the matches are lost by his team-mates anyway, especially as long as he is in both leagues.
You never want to put your ace fourth, because if it's 1-2 when it gets to him, he has to play back to back with little rest, and it also puts extra pressure to not only get himself to ace, but to win ace as well, which is why it's doubly nice to put your ace in 1st or 3rd (1st for momentum and rest, 3rd to make sure he plays and to take the pressure off the first 2 players).
Obviously there's exceptions depending on what map it is and who you need your ace to play on the other team.
On December 10 2009 00:37 TwoToneTerran wrote: You never want to put your ace fourth, because if it's 1-2 when it gets to him, he has to play back to back with little rest, and it also puts extra pressure to not only get himself to ace, but to win ace as well, which is why it's doubly nice to put your ace in 1st or 3rd (1st for momentum and rest, 3rd to make sure he plays and to take the pressure off the first 2 players).
Obviously there's exceptions depending on what map it is and who you need your ace to play on the other team.
coaches often send the ace player out in the 4th set, if the maps are reasonable for it, on purpose. its worth far more to be warmed up than the slight cost of having already played a game. in very rare cases, like you have an hour and a half long tvt or something, it might not be worth it, but most of the time its beneficial to have the back to back games.
Well hell most of the time I see Jaedong and Flash sent first and third and some of the interviews confirmed it -- I mean hell Effort was sent first vs KT and third vs SKT, etc, but kind of hard to argue with someone who's actually there. :x
On December 10 2009 00:37 TwoToneTerran wrote: You never want to put your ace fourth, because if it's 1-2 when it gets to him, he has to play back to back with little rest, and it also puts extra pressure to not only get himself to ace, but to win ace as well, which is why it's doubly nice to put your ace in 1st or 3rd (1st for momentum and rest, 3rd to make sure he plays and to take the pressure off the first 2 players).
Obviously there's exceptions depending on what map it is and who you need your ace to play on the other team.
coaches often send the ace player out in the 4th set, if the maps are reasonable for it, on purpose. its worth far more to be warmed up than the slight cost of having already played a game. in very rare cases, like you have an hour and a half long tvt or something, it might not be worth it, but most of the time its beneficial to have the back to back games.
Indeed. When the format was Winner's League, several players also said riding on the momentum of a win into the next match, back to back, strongly outweighed whatever fatigue they would be experiencing from playing without a break. As such, they were able to perform well in several matches in a row.
On December 11 2009 08:13 sung_moon wrote: fuck yea KT
although no watching JD sucks
btw what game is that backho gif from? did he like storm his own probe line or soemthing? ^^
ahaha Canata vs Backho
Backho went for some crazy double shuttle bulldog
Canata SCANNED the shuttles perfectly and picked them off with a wraith the shuttles dropped 1 reaver which didnt get a single kill at all and the goons that were trying to assault the nat got destroyed
EPT
![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/staff/keit/Proleague0910.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://img101.imageshack.us/img101/975/32780657.jpg)
ggaemo < Outsider SE > 
HiyA < Neo Moon Glaive > 
BackHo < Neo Heartbreak Ridge > ![[image loading]](http://i715.photobucket.com/albums/ww151/Selffor/Owned.gif)
But what matters is that they'll play each other; Flash will have his chance to stop Jaedong from making history, and that's what matters.
![[image loading]](http://img257.imageshack.us/img257/539/47120518.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://img15.imageshack.us/img15/1685/11748853.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://www.fomos.kr/board/photo/1260336810_1.jpg)
