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[I] Valkyrie Use, TvZ. - Page 13

Forum Index > Brood War Strategy
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boxer fan
Profile Joined March 2007
Romania51 Posts
October 16 2008 12:06 GMT
#241
I think the main conclusion is ... after all these years .. after all those pros/trainers that think about strategys in this game ... Boxer comes with an ideea and wins some ... ofc he doesn't have the speed/macro as many other younger players. He can't test it that much either since he is still in the army. But he never stops to amaze us. I think there is only one thing to say about this:
Incredible ...welcome to Boxer land ...
29 fps
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
United States5725 Posts
October 16 2008 12:14 GMT
#242
to the OP

that was some insane marine micro at the hive. i thought he had you, too. what i didn't understand was why he KEPT making mutas despite you having valks.....

hm, since valks take extra gas and stuff, would it be viable to get them after FE?
4v4 is a battle of who has the better computer.
zeks
Profile Blog Joined September 2007
Canada1068 Posts
October 17 2008 18:06 GMT
#243
are valkryies faster than scourge? muta?
"Two roads diverged in a wood, and I-- I took the one less traveled by, And that has made all the difference."
blabber
Profile Blog Joined June 2007
United States4448 Posts
October 17 2008 18:08 GMT
#244
pretty sure scourge is the fastest air unit in the game
blabberrrrr
Eatme
Profile Blog Joined June 2003
Switzerland3919 Posts
October 17 2008 18:41 GMT
#245
On October 18 2008 03:08 blabber wrote:
pretty sure scourge is the fastest air unit in the game

If you dont count interceptor.
I have the best fucking lawyers in the country including the man they call the Malmis.
SilverskY
Profile Joined September 2008
Korea (South)3086 Posts
October 17 2008 18:46 GMT
#246
It would be crazy if you could micro individual interceptors
Graphics
avilo
Profile Blog Joined November 2007
United States4100 Posts
October 18 2008 06:00 GMT
#247
wow this works -.-, thank you iloveoov and fantasy revolutionists ^^, it especially RAPES 2 hatch muta ->

http://www.fighterreplays.com/starcraft/replays/0a1b22
Sup
404.Nintu
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
Canada1723 Posts
October 18 2008 06:36 GMT
#248
I'm happy to see someone bump this thread. I was going to add links to the Fantasy games but I got incredibly lazy. So, I refer to this thread.
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=80595

I was watching with quite a smile on my face as Fantasy continued to use Valkyries. =)
"So, then did the American yum-yum clown monkey also represent the FCC?"
SilverskY
Profile Joined September 2008
Korea (South)3086 Posts
October 18 2008 06:48 GMT
#249
Yo Nintu, do you have some sort of finalized BO that you've been able to make work really well?
Graphics
404.Nintu
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
Canada1723 Posts
October 18 2008 09:20 GMT
#250
On October 18 2008 15:48 SilveR.sKy)ChoseN wrote:
Yo Nintu, do you have some sort of finalized BO that you've been able to make work really well?


No. The time I get to play SC, I just play standard to try and improve. I haven't gotten to experiment with valks as much as people might think. I still think they have a place, and that they can be used to great effect. Sitting down and creating a build order takes a lot of effort.

The games I played with valks I had to play very adaptively, not structured at all. I scouted profusely to see how much defense I would need to prevent any all-ins or pushes from Zerg. When I knew I was safe from any sort of 2 hatch or all-in rushes, I just put a bunker at my natural, stopped marines when I have "enough" to defend from any possible threats, and went 2 port valks. It's as simple as it sounds. The zerg has to be CRAZY about scouting to figure things out in time, it just looks like standard FE terran. Treat it as 2port wraith after FE, but with valks instead. You should have 1-2 when muta's arrive. You can rely on the valks + marines to defend until your 3rd and 4th valk pops, then you're fine. You can completely avoid the e-bay aswell if you're confident you can get them out in time. You surrender map control until 8-10 valks are out with +1 attack, then you can contest it with escorted drops, like Sair reaver, Harass while you grab a third and play very defensively, or depending on how the Zerg reacts, forge a timing push with mech.

Honestly, I have no special build that exists. Just 1-rax FE, get enough marines/bunkers to defend any scouted threats, and the rest you invest in fast 2port with +1 air attack. Skip the e-bay if you plan to go Mech and are confident if you can get your valks before the opponent can destroy you with muts.
"So, then did the American yum-yum clown monkey also represent the FCC?"
Piy
Profile Blog Joined January 2008
Scotland3152 Posts
October 18 2008 10:17 GMT
#251
lol, this threads been approved by pro-gamers now. Nice to finally see valks getting real use in the pro scene.
My. Copy. Is. Here.
Biff The Understudy
Profile Blog Joined February 2008
France8212 Posts
October 18 2008 10:31 GMT
#252
What's even funnier is the only game Fantasy didn't use valks is the only game he lost.

I guess Zerg know how to play vs a standart terran nowaday...
The fellow who is out to burn things up is the counterpart of the fool who thinks he can save the world. The world needs neither to be burned up nor to be saved. The world is, we are. Transients, if we buck it; here to stay if we accept it. ~H.Miller
Februarys
Profile Blog Joined February 2008
Korea (South)259 Posts
October 18 2008 15:47 GMT
#253
Just Theorycrafting here, but wouldn't going Valkyrie + Metal army require a lot of gas? I really doubt T will have enough gas left over for Vessels which is essential for TvZ in a standard 2 base scenario. If they choose to go for a 3rd gas, I think T will have a hell of a time doing that and since Metal army is so slow, Z can constantly attack multiple bases, drop on main, to take advantage of T mobility correct?

Well, this is all assuming that T followed up with Metal units instead of bionic units with Valkirye
Jaedong is the Hope of Zergs.
Purind
Profile Blog Joined April 2004
Canada3562 Posts
October 18 2008 16:15 GMT
#254
Hehe, when I watched the OSL match, all I could think of was you and how Fantasy also reads teamliquid

If Fantasy wins OSL, he only has you to thank, Nintu. You better be cheering for him. Him winning OSL would be like you winning OSL

Nope, there's absolutely no flaw in my logic
Trucy Wright is hot
NuB.xE
Profile Joined September 2008
United States131 Posts
October 18 2008 16:21 GMT
#255
LMFAO HE SAID WOW SUCK MY DICK _____
Pwnage
c_dog
Profile Joined October 2008
Canada5 Posts
October 18 2008 16:24 GMT
#256
yeah i don't think it's possible to pull off valks+tanks against competent zerg players. you just won't have enough gas. i think some early valks are great for countering muta harass and may be a better choice than building turrets. i do like valks a lot and use them occasionally myself, but i think if you're expecting to do more than fight off muta harass and pick off the occasional overlords, you probably won't get that unless you're playing a weak zerg. hydras and scourges can still take them down easily if you overcommit. and i don't think tanks are a good option along side valks. they are just simply not that good against zerg because they're slow and can easily get flanked.
alphafuzard
Profile Blog Joined June 2007
United States1610 Posts
Last Edited: 2008-10-18 19:32:19
October 18 2008 19:31 GMT
#257
On October 18 2008 03:08 blabber wrote:
pretty sure scourge is the fastest air unit in the game

sairs and speed shuttles (?) move the same speed as sairs i think
edit: and those speed scouts can truck pretty fast too
more weight
SilverskY
Profile Joined September 2008
Korea (South)3086 Posts
October 18 2008 19:44 GMT
#258
On October 18 2008 18:20 Nintu wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 18 2008 15:48 SilveR.sKy)ChoseN wrote:
Yo Nintu, do you have some sort of finalized BO that you've been able to make work really well?


No. The time I get to play SC, I just play standard to try and improve. I haven't gotten to experiment with valks as much as people might think. I still think they have a place, and that they can be used to great effect. Sitting down and creating a build order takes a lot of effort.

The games I played with valks I had to play very adaptively, not structured at all. I scouted profusely to see how much defense I would need to prevent any all-ins or pushes from Zerg. When I knew I was safe from any sort of 2 hatch or all-in rushes, I just put a bunker at my natural, stopped marines when I have "enough" to defend from any possible threats, and went 2 port valks. It's as simple as it sounds. The zerg has to be CRAZY about scouting to figure things out in time, it just looks like standard FE terran. Treat it as 2port wraith after FE, but with valks instead. You should have 1-2 when muta's arrive. You can rely on the valks + marines to defend until your 3rd and 4th valk pops, then you're fine. You can completely avoid the e-bay aswell if you're confident you can get them out in time. You surrender map control until 8-10 valks are out with +1 attack, then you can contest it with escorted drops, like Sair reaver, Harass while you grab a third and play very defensively, or depending on how the Zerg reacts, forge a timing push with mech.

Honestly, I have no special build that exists. Just 1-rax FE, get enough marines/bunkers to defend any scouted threats, and the rest you invest in fast 2port with +1 air attack. Skip the e-bay if you plan to go Mech and are confident if you can get your valks before the opponent can destroy you with muts.

Thanks a lot man, I'll give it a shot :D
Graphics
Biff The Understudy
Profile Blog Joined February 2008
France8212 Posts
October 18 2008 22:53 GMT
#259
On October 19 2008 01:24 c_dog wrote:
yeah i don't think it's possible to pull off valks+tanks against competent zerg players. you just won't have enough gas. i think some early valks are great for countering muta harass and may be a better choice than building turrets. i do like valks a lot and use them occasionally myself, but i think if you're expecting to do more than fight off muta harass and pick off the occasional overlords, you probably won't get that unless you're playing a weak zerg. hydras and scourges can still take them down easily if you overcommit. and i don't think tanks are a good option along side valks. they are just simply not that good against zerg because they're slow and can easily get flanked.

blablablablablablablablablablablablablablablablablablablablablablablablablablablablablablablablablablablablablablablablablablablablablablablablablablablabla

Theorycrafting my ass and you haven't read the whole thing (have you read anything else than the title, btw?) and, OBVIOUSLY, you haven't watch Fantasy games vs GGPlay, which are the reason why this thread has been resurrected.

Epic fail is epic.
The fellow who is out to burn things up is the counterpart of the fool who thinks he can save the world. The world needs neither to be burned up nor to be saved. The world is, we are. Transients, if we buck it; here to stay if we accept it. ~H.Miller
blabber
Profile Blog Joined June 2007
United States4448 Posts
October 18 2008 22:59 GMT
#260
On October 19 2008 04:31 alphafuzard wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 18 2008 03:08 blabber wrote:
pretty sure scourge is the fastest air unit in the game

sairs and speed shuttles (?) move the same speed as sairs i think
edit: and those speed scouts can truck pretty fast too

yeah, scourge are a little faster than them I think
blabberrrrr
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