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PvZ: 6 gate opening - Page 3

Forum Index > Brood War Strategy
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CTStalker
Profile Blog Joined November 2004
Canada9720 Posts
March 31 2005 21:45 GMT
#41
I suppose that's true, but the z would have the same control over you as when you 9/10, except that this way you're safer against the rush.
By the way, my name is Funk. I am not of your world
MPXMX
Profile Joined December 2002
Canada4309 Posts
March 31 2005 22:09 GMT
#42
I think when you 9/10 vs 9 pool, you get the better cut of the deal. Zerg won't be able to keep up lings with your zeal numbers and will probably have to make sunkens and not be able to expand too quickly.
jtan
Profile Blog Joined April 2003
Sweden5891 Posts
March 31 2005 22:23 GMT
#43
Great. That is like 8 rax terran and 4pool zerg. Finally some protoss rush
Enter a Uh
MPXMX
Profile Joined December 2002
Canada4309 Posts
April 01 2005 01:29 GMT
#44
Yes and it took a genius to figure it out
SCFraser
Profile Joined May 2003
Canada1534 Posts
April 01 2005 02:16 GMT
#45
with a build like this you might as well proxy..
at least i think so.
If he 12 pools you're fucked anyway
might as well make sure u do as much damage as possible vs the expo build.
I want something good to die for, to make it beautiful to live.
stimpack[pG]
Profile Joined November 2004
Philippines88 Posts
April 01 2005 04:07 GMT
#46
bad strat, too much sacrifice on economy just to get 1 zealot faster.. your economy will be very much affected... and your 2nd gate will be much too late unless you cut probe production... and besides a single zealot can't do that much against a decent zerg(he will just stack his drones at one mineral patch and u cant kill a single drone while he is waiting for his lings to come out) plus you only have 1 gate for reinforcement coz your 2nd gate is late... and the zerg has just plenty of time to react to your stupid build(esp if your bases are far from each other)...
you know why this only works tvz bec of the bunker, you can easily repair it.. but zealots? never! and 1 more thing scvs life is a lot higher so that cheese rush pvz is 99.9% ineffective... just considering all the travelling time...
RedMeat
Profile Joined September 2002
United Kingdom490 Posts
April 01 2005 04:07 GMT
#47
I love the way people answer a huge strategy guide with one or two sentences. You aren't fucked vs nine pool as it's low economy build anyways and if he tries to gay you with a four pool then you own his ass. Vs nine pool you don't have the strength you do with a later gateway but you're a long way from losing the game and you will have chances, if this was the only build worth using everyone would be doing nothing but this right? It's just an idea...
I am the mirror, I am the destiny, I am the herald that points the way...
SainT
Profile Joined February 2005
Chile1067 Posts
April 01 2005 05:19 GMT
#48
i've done this but with 5 gat ... i mean i find it pretty hard with 6 :ayz:
Well i'm a lucky man...
uhjoo
Profile Joined October 2004
Korea (South)1740 Posts
April 01 2005 06:17 GMT
#49
On April 01 2005 13:07 stimpack[pG] wrote:
bad strat, too much sacrifice on economy just to get 1 zealot faster.. your economy will be very much affected... and your 2nd gate will be much too late unless you cut probe production... and besides a single zealot can't do that much against a decent zerg(he will just stack his drones at one mineral patch and u cant kill a single drone while he is waiting for his lings to come out) plus you only have 1 gate for reinforcement coz your 2nd gate is late... and the zerg has just plenty of time to react to your stupid build(esp if your bases are far from each other)...
you know why this only works tvz bec of the bunker, you can easily repair it.. but zealots? never! and 1 more thing scvs life is a lot higher so that cheese rush pvz is 99.9% ineffective... just considering all the travelling time...


did you watch the replays before replying?
i want bubbles the warrior monkey back
Knickknack
Profile Joined February 2004
United States1187 Posts
April 01 2005 06:25 GMT
#50
times 1st zeal pops out:
5p5g=2:02
6p6g=2:06
7p7g=2:12

To sum up:
this can be very effective vs a 12 hatch build.
Somewhat effective agaist a early hatch.
12pool your behind significantly.
Break even against a 9pool.
beats 4pool.
| www.ArtofProtoss.vze.com |
Moggle
Profile Blog Joined November 2004
Canada327 Posts
Last Edited: 2005-04-01 11:07:40
April 01 2005 10:49 GMT
#51
I'll be checking the replay very soon but I think a 9 overlord 9 pool build would counter it? The build I mentioned usually allows me to ling all the way to 11 supply where I have money for a hatchery and ling again until 15 supply for a 3rd hatchery. I'll edit once I watch the replays.

[Edit] I still stand on my original post. I'm pretty sure that 9 overlord 9 pool would counter the initial zealot pressure since there is no hatchery to make him cancel that early.
Moggle @ USWest. I hate Spore Colonies!
jtan
Profile Blog Joined April 2003
Sweden5891 Posts
April 02 2005 02:00 GMT
#52
On April 01 2005 13:07 stimpack[pG] wrote:
bad strat, too much sacrifice on economy just to get 1 zealot faster.. your economy will be very much affected... and your 2nd gate will be much too late unless you cut probe production... and besides a single zealot can't do that much against a decent zerg(he will just stack his drones at one mineral patch and u cant kill a single drone while he is waiting for his lings to come out) plus you only have 1 gate for reinforcement coz your 2nd gate is late... and the zerg has just plenty of time to react to your stupid build(esp if your bases are far from each other)...
you know why this only works tvz bec of the bunker, you can easily repair it.. but zealots? never! and 1 more thing scvs life is a lot higher so that cheese rush pvz is 99.9% ineffective... just considering all the travelling time...

I disagree

After trying the strat once...it really feels not-so-bad for your eco. also getting one zeal+probe to z mineralline fast does cost the zerg a lot.Just trying to run away with drones causes enough loss of mining-time so thats just stupid, so you have to try to attack the zealot and run wounded drones away etc. However a skilled protoss most likely get a few kills. The author just calims its needed to kill about 2 drones to do decent damaga too, and thats really possible to do.
Enter a Uh
8882
Profile Blog Joined December 2003
2718 Posts
April 02 2005 02:54 GMT
#53
On April 01 2005 07:23 jtan wrote:
Great. That is like 8 rax terran and 4pool zerg. Finally some protoss rush


omg, you didnt ever figure out this build?

on the other hand many protoss players 1 year ago made only zealots+goons and forgot observers...
and nal_ra had to come and show them how to play

Im really shocked that you never thought of this.
I have returned
bburn
Profile Joined September 2004
United States1039 Posts
Last Edited: 2005-04-02 03:07:27
April 02 2005 03:02 GMT
#54
The greatest value of the build appears to be psychological, simply because, it generally ruins any of the initial plans of the zerg and messes up the zergs drone timing, which I have noticed seems to be the most effective thing to do to a zerg disrupt there drone timing.

While I think about it how does this compare at killing/making zerg cancel expo with the gate/cannon rush build
banana[AfO]
decafchicken
Profile Blog Joined January 2005
United States20063 Posts
April 03 2005 06:21 GMT
#55
So, have the zergs figured out the most effective counter yet? I really dont wanna get screwed over by this :-p
how reasonable is it to eat off wood instead of your tummy?
maleorderbride
Profile Joined November 2002
United States2916 Posts
April 03 2005 09:39 GMT
#56
just scout with 9th drone and do 11 pool or so..earlier if scouted earlier. 1 sunk in main to be safe. if toss does no damage then id say hes in for a bad way since his tech is SLOW.

ie. zerg might not win early game, but you could very well be digging a mid game grave. lurk contain with nat+2nd nat or main and your toast. toss wont be able to get an expo up +cannons in time on lt to stop that. Unless he does alot of lots with slow tech and zerg doesnt respond correctly.

seems ok early game, poor mid game vs skilled players.
Some cause happiness wherever they go; others, whenever they go.
jtan
Profile Blog Joined April 2003
Sweden5891 Posts
April 03 2005 17:38 GMT
#57
On April 02 2005 11:54 8882 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 01 2005 07:23 jtan wrote:
Great. That is like 8 rax terran and 4pool zerg. Finally some protoss rush


omg, you didnt ever figure out this build?

on the other hand many protoss players 1 year ago made only zealots+goons and forgot observers...
and nal_ra had to come and show them how to play

Im really shocked that you never thought of this.

lol

yes

but I also thought of other stupid strats, this is like more or less proven useful now
Enter a Uh
RedMeat
Profile Joined September 2002
United Kingdom490 Posts
Last Edited: 2005-04-03 19:35:05
April 03 2005 19:31 GMT
#58
On April 03 2005 18:39 maleorderbride wrote:
seems ok early game, poor mid game vs skilled players.


Only if they aren't trying to fast expo or gay you with some kind of rush and how many zergs do you play who don't do one of those two things? Lateish pool first is about the only thing that doesn't give at least equal chances both sides and in practice not that many zergs stick with a solid pool/hatch build. The main point of the build is not having to worry so much about being disadvantaged from the start by a fast expand or killed completely by a four/five pool and you can't balance that with being good vs solid play, hardly anyone plays eleven or twelve pool anyways.

EDIT: Not saying this strat is unbeatable or whatever but for ladder play it's as good as anything else.
I am the mirror, I am the destiny, I am the herald that points the way...
starofNC
Profile Joined July 2004
United States1340 Posts
Last Edited: 2005-04-05 00:23:50
April 05 2005 00:23 GMT
#59
this is pretty good opening..

here is a good example for people of what u can do with this opening even when not successful with the first few zealots

HyoJa[FlaSh] vs GGPlay[GsP]

although ultimately unsuccessful this time.. I think that is a good example of what u can do with 6 gate

thx to yg
alphaentity
Profile Joined August 2005
United States525 Posts
October 24 2005 07:21 GMT
#60
Dude starofnc, the protoss got OWNED after failing with the first zlots.

The zerg was so ahead economically, the shuttle/reaver harrass and that attack (which killed the mineral hatch) was not nearly enough to balance the game.

That replay shows the weakness of the 6 gate build, not the strength.
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