EPT2nd Triumvirate - Page 3
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_Grazze_
834 Posts
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Geo.Rion
7377 Posts
On November 12 2008 13:58 Oystein wrote: No that would be Bisu or Stork, and hes not a champion since he hasn't won anything + Kal was closer to winning his MSL finals (really close) than Best was winning his OSL (one sided rape). But great write up! Kal was as close to won that final as Yellow to win the next OSL | ||
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Velr
Switzerland10823 Posts
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koreasilver
9109 Posts
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RamenStyle
United States1929 Posts
Besides, right now, if Best and Stork had to face both Flash and JD in a BO5, I'd give better chances to Stork than Best. He is not there yet. He has to wait for Stork to leave his place as protoss king, and who knows, maybe Best is meant to be part of the next triumvirate as the eldest member(pro elite experience, not age), just like Stork has for this one. | ||
TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On November 12 2008 18:32 baubo wrote: The age is relevant for anyone to make the argument of Best > Stork/Bisu in the near future. One person has to improve greatly, the other two has to maintain their performance. If you're going to tell me that Best, at the age of 20, has plenty of room to improve, why can't we expect Bisu and Stork, who are 20 and 21, to also improve? Or are we going by rankings? In which case I guess Stork is unable to improve because he's #1. And therefore Best will surpass him?!? We're going by the fact that Best is relatively new to the scene. The probability that we've seen the most out of Bisu and Stork is much higher than the probability that we've seen the most out of Best, since he's been around far less than they have. Relative to them, he's very inexperienced. Adding more experience should help him improve more, whereas Bisu and Stork have pretty much seen what there is to see. On November 12 2008 20:01 Velr wrote:In unprepared state Best is probably one of the greatest players, but in BO5's with 1-2 weeks of practice before the actual game he tends to fail. This in my mind, though, is what shows me that Best has potential. His ability to prepare for a set may be lacking compared to more experienced protosses, but that can be trained on as he gains more experience. What makes Best stand out to me is his ability to react to unprepared circumstances. Go watch the 3rd and 4th game of his set against Luxury that you reference. Yes he almost loses, but the fact that he can pick himself up, and find a way to win is what's incredible. His zealot elevator in game 3 is not something he possibly could have prepared for. A similar game would be Best vs. Nada in that same OSL. Best is caught unprepared by Nada's biomech push, and it should be GG, but Best has the nerve to seal his own front door, and find a way to pull out the win. Preparation can be trained with good coaching. Best's INSTINCT and ability to react are what set him apart from others. | ||
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F13
United States38 Posts
On November 12 2008 16:39 MrHoon wrote: seems like your jaedong fanboism is blinding you too much. seems like your Flash fanboyism is blinding you from REAL FACTS. The OP wrote Flash - Jaedong 9 -6 when Avid was pointing out that its the other way around, its actually "Jaedong-Flash 9 -6" because OP made a typo. If you look at their Kespa shit, its 6-6 tie but we also have to remember that they forgot to add in the 3-0 Beating in GOM finals that Jaedong gave to Flash. Thats why its 9-6 And JD should have much higher ELO but KESPA didnt sanction 1st season of GOM Finals where JD went champion (but starts counting 2nd season? wtf.) | ||
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Oystein
Norway1602 Posts
On November 12 2008 23:49 Geo.Rion wrote: Kal was as close to won that final as Yellow to win the next OSL So I just rewatched the Kal-Jaedong series. Kal wins convincingly game1, is ahead in game2 after going mass cair vs muta + killing lots of drones with his first zealforce +2dronekills with his first zealot after 2-3mins. But insted of taking out Jaedongs corner expos like he should have and get a 3 base vs 3base game, he wastes units attacking jaedongs front and have to retreat once he loses obser, had he just taken out the 2 expos ( he killed 1 of them) im certain he would have taken set2, game3 hes in a good spot, after taking out JDs 4th base while warping his own 3rd, once again hes constantly repelled by lack of obsers (great play by jd taking them out all the time) But was damn close to breaking trough several times. Set4 he was raped, but who would knows what would have happened had the game gone to a 5th game. Point is Kal was in good positions in both game 2 and 3, especially game2 were he was firmly ahead. And who knows how game 3,4 and 5 would have turned out if Kal had been 2-0... So if you dont consider that close, you either didnt watch the games or got zero understanding of the game. And judging by your location I am gonna go out on a limb and guess both. | ||
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NiGoL
1868 Posts
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Geo.Rion
7377 Posts
The silver-curse was broken, the royal-roader was defeated, the legend of the fall was re-established and i don't know how many curses and traditions were set or broken by the Dinasaur- toss, Stork. And the only protoss who was about to become the Bonjwa, is kicking ass once again, just made his longest winning streak (12 consecutive wins overall)- Bisu of course. The ever-present mediocre protoss, the definition of the good play-no major results (nor individually nor with team) just made it to the semifinals, and brought his team from the bottom to the middle of the PL standings, non other than Free. And let's not forget about the Devil's apprentice! I feel his win against Flash was the game that brought him back to Earth, not only he was defeated on a T friendly map/balanced, but was beaten by Carriers, a unit that simply dissappeared after Flash came and beat Stork's carriers. (after that loss couple others came, in relatively standard games on good maps, Hero_V_, Free etc) But that doesnt counts, what does is taht Best is still known as the top2 PvT PvP in the world. More players who arent even getting much attention beacuse of their shining breathren from Aiur/Shakuras, but they are tearing everythin apart, Jangbi and Kal. The MSL semifinals are upon us. What we see? 4 protoss/ 4 players. Did this EVER happened? i'm sure it didn't. And look at the OSL, protoss champion, ok, that happened befor, but look at te semifinals. Stork-Best GGplay-Fantasy. Now if the 2 matches were at the same time, i think 80% of ppl would have watched the mirror-match semifinals, even though we all know how unpopular are the mirror MUs. Protoss dominance everywhere, the zergs are nowhere, i mean NOWHERE. We all saw what JD did recently, and we all hope he will be back in his form. The twins? They are who were before, good players who can win consecutive games, win even important games, fight their ways in the SLs, but do you know what wont ever happen? One of them becoming the top zerg of the scene for months, or even weeks, or even days. July? Nobody heard from him. Oh, wait, i now remember, he just played in the GSI, and LOST to a terran whose name isn't even important, cuz we will never see him again taking a game from an established progamer. Don't come with Effort, beating Hwasin 2-1. Holy shit, what an achievment. Who is the player that actually lost to Hwain recently? C'mon... Yes his played looked good, that's not enough, your play most be good for weeks, months, not to beat a decent opponent in convincing fashion and pull out a couple PL wins. Type-b? Winning an ace match against Stork wont put you in... And the terrans? Simply not enough to take down the top5 PvT, even if they arent fully focused, or are facing the greatest pressure in their lifes. The strong terran presence which always was (no matter who was the bonjwa or whatever, there were terrans who could beat him if they got the chanse) now seems to fade away. Flash? Beating terrans, that's what he does. Apparently that's waht every non-toss does, beats his own race and looks strong amongst them, and fails to beat the protoss. No... Not yet, but he can, he got everything what is needed. Fantasy? As the OSL award said "one-hit-wonder" he will fade away as if he wouldn't be. Forgg? Maybe, just maybe, but the fact that he lost to the half-prepared Stork doesnt puths him in a too good light. Others? THERE ARE NO OTHERS. FBH and Nada came closest to reach the PR, untill they eventually got washed up by two -woudnt guess- protoss players. | ||
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Raithed
China7078 Posts
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Geo.Rion
7377 Posts
On November 13 2008 02:36 Oystein wrote: So I just rewatched the Kal-Jaedong series. Kal wins convincingly game1, is ahead in game2 after going mass cair vs muta + killing lots of drones with his first zealforce +2dronekills with his first zealot after 2-3mins. But insted of taking out Jaedongs corner expos like he should have and get a 3 base vs 3base game, he wastes units attacking jaedongs front and have to retreat once he loses obser, had he just taken out the 2 expos ( he killed 1 of them) im certain he would have taken set2, game3 hes in a good spot, after taking out JDs 4th base while warping his own 3rd, once again hes constantly repelled by lack of obsers (great play by jd taking them out all the time) But was damn close to breaking trough several times. Set4 he was raped, but who would knows what would have happened had the game gone to a 5th game. Point is Kal was in good positions in both game 2 and 3, especially game2 were he was firmly ahead. And who knows how game 3,4 and 5 would have turned out if Kal had been 2-0... So if you dont consider that close, you either didnt watch the games or got zero understanding of the game. And judging by your location I am gonna go out on a limb and guess both. Jaedong always looses his first game in a bo5, he likes it this way, he did it like 6 times already. Ok, joking, but eventually that happenes. And i was joking about that final, apparently you have no sense of humor. "So if you dont consider that close, you either didnt watch the games or got zero understanding of the game. And judging by your location I am gonna go out on a limb and guess both." Oh that sounded so cool, now i'm so ashamed, OMG, i'm going in to the corner and cry. (this is a joke too, in case u didn't notice, sarcasm you know). If somebody is talking about Yellow and OSL win, you shoudn't take that as a real comment but a funny/crazy one. note that to yourself, it might help you out inn the future. | ||
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Sentenal
United States12398 Posts
We're going by the fact that Best is relatively new to the scene. The probability that we've seen the most out of Bisu and Stork is much higher than the probability that we've seen the most out of Best, since he's been around far less than they have. Relative to them, he's very inexperienced. Adding more experience should help him improve more, whereas Bisu and Stork have pretty much seen what there is to see. Best is new to the scene, but Bisu still fits better, since its not like hes been around forever. Bisu only made it big in early 2007. About half a year after Bisu started his dominance, Jaedong got good and won the OSL. Really, the only difference here is that Bisu was before Jaedong and Flash, while Best was after. And due to Bisu being a semi-bonjwa, he fits better than Best. | ||
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Avidkeystamper
United States8556 Posts
On November 12 2008 23:49 Geo.Rion wrote: Kal was as close to won that final as Yellow to win the next OSL On November 13 2008 00:50 Velr wrote: So was best. Not if you actually watched the games instead of just looking at the score. Kal gave Jaedong a good run for his money the first 3 games while July made Best look like a utter-no name in all three games. Best was never ahead at any money during the series, while Kal looked to be ahead until the end of game 2. | ||
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Oystein
Norway1602 Posts
On November 13 2008 05:14 Geo.Rion wrote: Jaedong always looses his first game in a bo5, he likes it this way, he did it like 6 times already. Ok, joking, but eventually that happenes. And i was joking about that final, apparently you have no sense of humor. "So if you dont consider that close, you either didnt watch the games or got zero understanding of the game. And judging by your location I am gonna go out on a limb and guess both." Oh that sounded so cool, now i'm so ashamed, OMG, i'm going in to the corner and cry. (this is a joke too, in case u didn't notice, sarcasm you know). If somebody is talking about Yellow and OSL win, you shoudn't take that as a real comment but a funny/crazy one. note that to yourself, it might help you out inn the future. Oh playing the good old irony\sarcasm card when you look like a fool, thats the internet. How are you suppose to take it beside that his chances was slim to none when its used in a setting like that? | ||
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AttackZerg
United States7465 Posts
On November 13 2008 05:14 Geo.Rion wrote: [ Oh that sounded so cool, now i'm so ashamed, OMG, i'm going in to the corner and cry. (this is a joke too, in case u didn't notice, sarcasm you know). If somebody is talking about Yellow and OSL win, you shoudn't take that as a real comment but a funny/crazy one. note that to yourself, it might help you out inn the future. His joke about your location wasn't humor, but your ignorant statements about a finals match are supposed to be funny...... Could just be me ... but I think your the uptight one without a sense of humor. Also alot of the members of this forum who are decent are starcraft sometimes get annoyed with those who aren't. .... its life. | ||
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Geo.Rion
7377 Posts
On November 13 2008 14:42 AttackZerg wrote: His joke about your location wasn't humor, but your ignorant statements about a finals match are supposed to be funny...... Could just be me ... but I think your the uptight one without a sense of humor. Also alot of the members of this forum who are decent are starcraft sometimes get annoyed with those who aren't. .... its life. I don't think i'm bad at starcraft, i'm not talking about mechanics and macro, sure you can be easily better than me in that, i barely reach C-, but i have some understanding for the game, i didn't born with it, i watched many pro reps and pro commentaries, so i can understand what's going on, who's ahead, who is close to win. It's so obvious that the Kal Jaedong match wasnt a one sided rape, and adding the Yellow-OSL "joke" .. i really dont understand how can somebody take that as a real opinion. Ok, you don't find it funny, that might be, no problem with that, but actually answering to it, in a handling mode, how that guy did, you know that's just stupid. I got the joke-insult referring to the country i come from, i answered accordingly, without anger or anything, why to leave it without a comment, when actually he's the one who lacks understanding? | ||
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Geo.Rion
7377 Posts
On November 13 2008 14:34 Oystein wrote: Oh playing the good old irony\sarcasm card when you look like a fool, thats the internet. How are you suppose to take it beside that his chances was slim to none when its used in a setting like that? I look like a fool, when you take it seriously that JD raped easily Kal in the final, and Kal's chanses were as Yellow's to take the next OSL. A) it's obvious it didnt happened B) Yellow winning next OSL. Put that 2 things near each other. that sounds to you as a real opinion. GOD! I dont know, maybe my "joke" wasnt funny, but than you say "That was a lame joke" not answer with proper arguments. Do you want to seem smart by resuming what happened there? Everyobdy saw it, everybody knows it. And when i say- Wake up, you shoudnt took that seriously -you still try to prove that you're right. You know i never been in Norway, but i was told is a really wonderful conutry, and the people there are polite and smart and committed. Is this a misbelief or you're just an exception? Or just had a tough day? PS: in case you were wondering, i'm not a romaninan by origin. But that's the country i live in, so i leave it in my card. | ||
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Oystein
Norway1602 Posts
And in case you didnt understand it, I took your location argument as a joke and I have nothing against Romanians. Anyway I guess its just an misunderstanding then and no point in taking it further. | ||
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Velr
Switzerland10823 Posts
Well... Telling from the reactions you got it obviously wasn't, you just failed at writing. | ||
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