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On February 10 2026 22:03 goody153 wrote:apparently not kinda sad we dont have at least one island or semi-island map. ngl like meta was developing into people starting to experiment with air units regularly And now we back to the usual
I am actually happy we dont have an odd map.
Jane Doe is the perfect amount of odd and standard.
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On January 20 2026 08:49 Kraekkling wrote:lol they were playing on the new maps today and there is a bug on the ash map where one spawn gets 4 eggs instead of 2 it was relevant to the game because the resulting choke is much smaller the bug is something which can happen quite easily in the map editor. when you place the eggs it's very easy to accidently place more than one at a time, and they remain stacked in the editor. it only becomes apparent in-game, because they spawn unstacked. but this also means that no one bothered to check the map in-game before it got uploaded?? super lazy wtf
I created a local lobby with MatchPoint 1.4 and I saw 3 spawn locations instead of 2 (for a 2 players map). IDK if this is a bug similar to the egg spawn lol. Very new to this problem. I even wondered if I did something wrong creating the lobby (which didn't happen before).
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On February 10 2026 23:39 seRapH wrote:Did you download the sandbox version(s)? https://910map.tistory.com/238 is right link to download the 1v1 and obs, 239 are the sandbox versions.
Oh LoL that's the reason. I mean the link of OP is a broken link so I downloaded the first one I saw. I didn't notice that was the sandbox verison. Thanks a lot!
p/s: Seems like the map "Match Point" is good for some cheesy strats like proxy or gas steal?
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Gas steals aren't cheesy in PvT anymore, they're pretty common. Doing it just forces terran to rax fe.
Early game proxy in 2p maps are surprisingly less common than on 4p in pro play, since opponent can scout you right away. Back in the day I've definitely put two gateways behind the min-only but you'll basically never see that nowadays lol.
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On February 10 2026 23:51 IceWall wrote:Oh LoL that's the reason. I mean the link of OP is a broken link so I downloaded the first one I saw. I didn't notice that was the sandbox verison. Thanks a lot! p/s: Seems like the map "Match Point" is good for some cheesy strats like proxy or gas steal?
2p gas steal is common enough where it's no longer considered cheese, but just a natural part of the game that Terrans have to deal with at this point. Jane Doe removes this problem with the ramp block funny enough.
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On Jane Doe in PvZ, Protoss tend to go for 3 super quick nexuses quite often. Like, at 7 minutes they make their 3rd nexus. I don't think we've seen quicker third bases by Protoss in this matchup on any other map.
Why didn't we see this on Kick Back? I remember thinking that P will surely go for three quick nexuses there, but it pretty much never happened. That map seemed like it was suited even better for this.
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On February 11 2026 07:45 Kraekkling wrote:
On Jane Doe in PvZ, Protoss tend to go for 3 super quick nexuses quite often. Like, at 7 minutes they make their 3rd nexus. I don't think we've seen quicker third bases by Protoss in this matchup on any other map.
Why didn't we see this on Kick Flip? I remember thinking that P will surely go for three quick nexuses there, but it pretty much never happened. That map seemed like it was suited even better for this.
Not the same type of map. Remember Protoss can expand freely on Jade doe compared to Kick Back ? If you watch games from Loki II . Central Plains Crossing field then you will see this playstyle with a very fast eco from Protoss and Terran specially. This type of map always tends to hard punish zerg.
If you want to have a similar experience for Kick Back do you need to watch games on Arcadia i guess. But Obviously the resources management is insanely different and map layout is way more interesting for Arcadia.
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But why is it different? Kick Back has 3 bases guarded by a single choke, same as Jane Doe.
Not the same type of map.
how would you classify Kick Back and Jane Doe?
kick back:
+ Show Spoiler +
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Jane Doe looks like a better version of Crossing Field, also it feels a bit like HBR too cus of the backdoor min patch that opens up the top/bottom exps
also 3 top and 3 bottom expos like on HBR, cool map
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On February 11 2026 11:14 Kraekkling wrote:But why is it different? Kick Back has 3 bases guarded by a single choke, same as Jane Doe. how would you classify Kick Back and Jane Doe? kick back: + Show Spoiler +
Do you have a ramp to hold and dont need defense instantly compared to kick back that is just a flat entry. Press attention how fast Protoss sair is out vs zerg.
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On February 10 2026 22:25 IceWall wrote:Show nested quote +On January 20 2026 08:49 Kraekkling wrote:lol they were playing on the new maps today and there is a bug on the ash map where one spawn gets 4 eggs instead of 2 it was relevant to the game because the resulting choke is much smaller the bug is something which can happen quite easily in the map editor. when you place the eggs it's very easy to accidently place more than one at a time, and they remain stacked in the editor. it only becomes apparent in-game, because they spawn unstacked. but this also means that no one bothered to check the map in-game before it got uploaded?? super lazy wtf I created a local lobby with MatchPoint 1.4 and I saw 3 spawn locations instead of 2 (for a 2 players map). IDK if this is a bug similar to the egg spawn lol. Very new to this problem. I even wondered if I did something wrong creating the lobby (which didn't happen before).
Third spawn is for observers in UMS mode, to add additional observer spots.
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On February 11 2026 07:45 Kraekkling wrote:
On Jane Doe in PvZ, Protoss tend to go for 3 super quick nexuses quite often. Like, at 7 minutes they make their 3rd nexus. I don't think we've seen quicker third bases by Protoss in this matchup on any other map.
Why didn't we see this on Kick Back? I remember thinking that P will surely go for three quick nexuses there, but it pretty much never happened. That map seemed like it was suited even better for this.
Are they immediately going down the ramp with forge FE or are they going gate first and holding the top of their initial ramp? That would be the difference.
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I'm aware of the differences, I'm just surprised to see that these differences are enough to shift the meta from "never happens" to "happens almost every game" in regards to super fast 3rd by Protoss.
In both cases (Jane Doe, Kick Back), the 3rd is taken after Corsair is out, so 973 is ruled out.
It seems like P was safe to take his 3rd on Kick Back once they confirmed Z build - but they never did. Is it simply due to the fact that 973 is basically not viable on Jane Doe, so P can be greedy and cut corners, which they can't on Kick Back?
On Jane Doe there was a game where Bisu cut every single corner and made the 3rd nexus around 6:00. Without as much greed, it goes up around 7:00.
Even if everything is slower on Kick Back and the 3rd would be delayed to like 7:30, its still a much faster third, compared to regular games where it happened after ~10 minutes.
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On February 12 2026 03:16 Kraekkling wrote:
I'm aware of the differences, I'm just surprised to see that these differences are enough to shift the meta from "never happens" to "happens almost every game" in regards to super fast 3rd by Protoss.
In both cases (Jane Doe, Kick Back), the 3rd is taken after Corsair is out, so 973 is ruled out.
It seems like P was safe to take his 3rd on Kick Back once they confirmed Z build - but they never did. Is it simply due to the fact that 973 is basically not viable on Jane Doe, so P can be greedy and cut corners, which they can't on Kick Back?
On Jane Doe there was a game where Bisu cut every single corner and made the 3rd nexus around 6:00. Without as much greed, it goes up around 7:00.
Even if everything is slower on Kick Back and the 3rd would be delayed to like 7:30, its still a much faster third, compared to regular games where it happened after ~10 minutes.
I would identify the sair timings between Jane Doe and Kick Back. Kick Back is much more standard in the sense that you still forge FE/wall then go for sairs afterwards. I haven't seen enough games on Jane Doe yet but you don't need forge and cannons to defend the top of your ramp, which pushes gas and sair timing forward. So you can identify zerg's build much faster and react based upon it.
Can you link some of the games that are being played?
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lol why do they have a neutral marine and medic blocking the ramp on jane doe? BeInG CrEaAtIVe?
that's so gimmicky, it serves no purpose other than making the map more defensive when you already have an inbase expo
also the idea of this backdoor ramp + the corridor from the 3rd to the 4th is a fun idea but the layout isn't the best, first of all the ramp is small and it's behind the 3rds gas/mins so units are gonna bug out a ton trying to go up (they should move the 3rds closer to the main so there's more space around the backdoor ramp for unit movement imo)
i guess it's fine if the goal is just to let you transfer workers/move small units to your 4th.. but that area could also be insanely annoying to deal with vs mass drops/moving big units from that path to your 4th etc.
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When is the new seasons' qualifiers supposed to begin?
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it's to prevent pvt gas steal!!! op strat!! poor terran boys need all help they can get!!!
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On Octagon, the temple ramps which lead to the big center work in a somewhat confusing way imo
I was wondering about this when I first saw the map but then forgot about it, now after watching Artosis recent video on the ASL maps I was reminded to check it
so basically on the top side, everything works as expected and the stripe of grey temple area is high ground
however on the bottom side, most of the high ground is actually on the long side of the stairs, and most of the grey temple area is NOT high ground
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EPT![[image loading]](https://i.ibb.co/SXdgWmtG/Screenshot-20260120-003209-You-Tube.jpg)
![[image loading]](https://i.ibb.co/mCdtSqh5/image.png)
![[image loading]](https://liquipedia.net/commons/images/e/eb/KICK_BACK.jpg)
![[image loading]](https://i.imgur.com/mCvXT3M.jpeg)
![[image loading]](https://i.ibb.co/CKM6HzJN/2323.jpg)
![[image loading]](https://i.ibb.co/tPpgyZ6c/2343.jpg)
