EPTThanks everyone for their interest and of course, I appreciate the fact that underlying many of these criticisms lies a positive principle -- genuine passion for the game and respect for the top players.
Think Alpha Series: Light vs Best
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ox.tQ
797 Posts
Thanks everyone for their interest and of course, I appreciate the fact that underlying many of these criticisms lies a positive principle -- genuine passion for the game and respect for the top players. | ||
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Sva3
19 Posts
On March 20 2021 02:12 ox.tQ wrote: Guys I understand a little bit that lag sucks. I don't play the game anymore so I cannot truly sympathize with players or viewers/fans who are much more informed than I am about the impact of high latency on gameplay. And yeah it's too bad that I am in eastern Canada now and no longer in California or the western part of this country. But all foreigners are used to higher than normal latency and don't complain about it as much and the players from the last event welcomed another showmatch in the future if it does happen again so there's not much else that I can say. But I do think such foreign organized showmatches with Korean observers can easily be arranged by others if they wish to make it happen. Thanks everyone for their interest and of course, I appreciate the fact that underlying many of these criticisms lies a positive principle -- genuine passion for the game and respect for the top players. Imagine organizing a basketball event with professional nba players but telling them they have to play on a 9 foot rim instead of 10. "Lot's of people play on it and don't complain so deal with it" is basically what you are saying. I think we all want good games, a good event, and to respect the players. I personally felt like this was 100% about ego to be the observer in a game with pro players. That's just from listening to the words from the observer during the cast. It felt very disrespectful that EGO was more important than the players/games. | ||
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ox.tQ
797 Posts
I have already mentioned the organizer (me) is not interested in content production unless he is observing and streaming the live (and/or preplayed) games. Deal with it or complain about it ad nauseam to your therapist. I am sure she/he will be impressed by your moral superiority. Here's some really good advice: lots of hills in life, try not to don't die on each one, save your emotions for more important things, you will need them! | ||
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FragKrag
United States11563 Posts
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Sva3
19 Posts
On March 20 2021 06:12 ox.tQ wrote: You made an account on TL just to rage about this? You cannot account share on Trovo. It was not possible for someone else to use my account which was advertised to observe and stream the games from. I have already mentioned the organizer (me) is not interested in content production unless he is observing and streaming the live (and/or preplayed) games. Deal with it or complain about it ad nauseam to your therapist. I am sure she/he will be impressed by your moral superiority. Here's some really good advice: lots of hills in life, try not to don't die on each one, save your emotions for more important things, you will need them! Actually my original account on TL was made in 2010 "Sva" but I lost access to it. Feel free to look it up. Here's some good advice, when dealing with professionals you should check your ego at the door. Maybe saying something like "Over my dead body" when it comes to observing on stream isn't a smart look. | ||
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ox.tQ
797 Posts
Generally speaking, I think it’s good to be aware that the content/efforts of others do not have to conform to one’s own personal preferences/opinions. The outside world does not have to bend to one’s expectations, nor does it exist for my own self indulgence. It must be mentally exhausting to incessantly cast judgement on everything and feel the urge to offer one's (unsolicited) advice. FragKrag, I am sorry to disappoint you as well. I am sure I can take a page or two out of your accomplished book. | ||
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sva
United States749 Posts
On March 20 2021 07:27 ox.tQ wrote: So you made an account in 2010 and your most recent posts in however many years have been about a disappointing StarCraft stream event. Impressive. Generally speaking, I think it’s good to be aware that the content/efforts of others do not have to conform to one’s own personal preferences/opinions. The outside world does not have to bend to one’s expectations, nor does it exist for my own self indulgence. It must be mentally exhausting to incessantly cast judgement on everything and feel the urge to offer one's (unsolicited) advice. FragKrag, I am sorry to disappoint you as well. I am sure I can take a page or two out of your accomplished book. Here is this better, now I have more posts than you do? Does this make me valid now? lmao so ridiculous. I'm glad you are making events, and that's awesome. I just wish you put the players before yourself, that's all. Maybe try and understand some cultural aspects of Korea as well. I don't know that the players would ever complain to the person hosting the event, because that is just not culturally normal in Korea. Anyways, best of luck on future events. I hope you can work out how to put the players ahead of your own ego. <3 | ||
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.gypsy
Canada689 Posts
On March 19 2021 17:02 LaStScan wrote: I didn't read all the comments and i want to say something about lag issue. Find a person who lives in west coast(like California) or hire a person to do the observer for the streamer. I figured AfreecaTV sends out cleanfeed(only screen+sound) to ENG, ESP casters when they are doing ASL S10 commentary(so they don't get mixed up with Korean commentary) . I also watched Yabsab vs Ample, it is absolutely terrible to play on TR14 for sure. I get that your account cannot be shared with anyone. I'm just leaving a solution comment for your future plans. I agree with this. For what it's worth the Yabsab vs Ample game was the most non-series I've watched in a while; they were barely playing starcraft. You could tell that both light and best were extremely annoyed by the lag and it affected their play, but obviously they aren't going to complain when you're paying them hefty amounts lol. Nothing wrong with sponsoring pro Koreans, but if you want a continued positive relationship with them the solutions are quite obvious and simple imo. | ||
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ox.tQ
797 Posts
Sva - I have dedicated enough of my precious time and money on the wonderful BW community (including not only 400+ showmatches featuring players but also things that have supported mappers, casters and graphic designers). Time for you and other backseat organizers to step up. | ||
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littlechava
United States7221 Posts
I appreciate the work you're putting in, but I'd much rather see it directed towards boosting the foreign scene personally. | ||
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ox.tQ
797 Posts
Trovo insisted on a pro-gamer showmatch. I let them know about the latency issue and my streaming/observing aspirations (in case they wished to extend the opportunity to someone more "qualified") but they wanted us to do it so long as the pro-gamers approved, which they did and so we had our fun event, despite all the shortcomings. No point crying over milk that has not even spilled. This event was also aimed at paving the way for more Brood War related content on Trovo and to persuade various players, casters and organizers to consider moving their wonderful events onto Trovo in order to potentially benefit from their streaming program. | ||
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oxKnu
1258 Posts
On March 20 2021 08:10 littlechava wrote: Why should foreigners organize showmatches with progamers? Progamers are already showcased in literally the biggest bw tournaments that exist, as well as daily sponsored showmatches from their Korean viewers, all of which have no issues whatsoever with latency, observers, scheduling, etc. I appreciate the work you're putting in, but I'd much rather see it directed towards boosting the foreign scene personally. Because the levels that Korean pros play at is much higher than any foreigner is able to perform at. It's a fairly basic concept. It's normal that there would be an attraction to organize a showmatch between those guys for a foreigner audience. It happens in sports all the time and it will continue to happen for sure. | ||
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littlechava
United States7221 Posts
On March 20 2021 08:23 ox.tQ wrote: Couldn't agree more. Trovo insisted on a pro-gamer showmatch. I let them know about the latency issue and my streaming/observing aspirations (in case they wished to extend the opportunity to someone more "qualified") but they wanted us to do it so long as the pro-gamers approved, which they did and so we had our fun event, despite all the shortcomings. No point crying over milk that has not even spilled. This event was also aimed at paving the way for more Brood War related content on Trovo and to persuade various players, casters and organizers to consider moving their wonderful events onto Trovo in order to potentially benefit from their streaming program. That's fair. On March 20 2021 08:27 oxKnu wrote: Because the levels that Korean pros play at is much higher than any foreigner is able to perform at. It's a fairly basic concept. It's normal that there would be an attraction to organize a showmatch between those guys for a foreigner audience. It happens in sports all the time and it will continue to happen for sure. I'm honestly confused by this take. I've never found it a challenge to access and watch the constant stream of the absolute highest level of competition from Korean pros and semipros. The only thing that makes it less accessible is the timezone, which made this event just as inaccessible as anything else (for me). | ||
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oxKnu
1258 Posts
On March 20 2021 08:43 littlechava wrote: That's fair. I'm honestly confused by this take. I've never found it a challenge to access and watch the constant stream of the absolute highest level of competition from Korean pros and semipros. The only thing that makes it less accessible is the timezone, which made this event just as inaccessible as anything else (for me). You interpreted that the wrong way. Making it a show special for foreigner audiences makes it more special...for foreigner audiences. Admittedly, I don't care that much about it from that point of view but I definitely see why others might do. | ||
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littlechava
United States7221 Posts
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thedeadhaji
39489 Posts
Hopefully we see various concepts being tried and we find something that sticks  | ||
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ox.tQ
797 Posts
Maybe next time (if there is one) we can ask for the games to be freshly preplayed and then stream/cast those replays. And ask for those games not to be streamed by the individual streamers but that may be a non-starter for them. Not as hype as a live match, I know. Everyone is welcome to make things happen with Trovo by the way. So feel free to reach out to them. I shared the plug. But I would definitely make sure the observer in game is experienced. That's a skill area that seems to be relatively underdeveloped in my opinion. I prefer observing that isn't similar to gamers watching their own replays, where they sporadically scroll the screen with a mouse cursor and keyboard arrow keys, clicking on everything. I think observing using the cursor in the mini-map with single frame changes creates a much more cinematic experience, especially when done methodically some how. Although mistakes are bound to happen with observing just as with casting and playing the game. | ||
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LG)Sabbath
Argentina3024 Posts
> Game 2 Light scanned a carrier build and hit it with a timing push, exactly as he's meant to do. Zero cheese involved. This game in particular is suspicious, a 2800 player would know 3 base into carrier doesn't work vs 6 factory, so maybe he just gambled on it to avoid a long game. | ||
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FragKrag
United States11563 Posts
Just wanted to go ahead and reiterate that I do really appreciate all of these events that are being hosted by Team Think Quick. They are great to tune into, but I was frustrated by the two showmatches on Trovo. | ||
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[sc1f]eonzerg
Belgium6868 Posts
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