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On March 19 2021 17:02 LaStScan wrote:
I didn't read all the comments and i want to say something about lag issue. Find a person who lives in west coast(like California) or hire a person to do the observer for the streamer. I figured AfreecaTV sends out cleanfeed(only screen+sound) to ENG, ESP casters when they are doing ASL S10 commentary(so they don't get mixed up with Korean commentary)
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I also watched Yabsab vs Ample, it is absolutely terrible to play on TR14 for sure.
I get that your account cannot be shared with anyone. I'm just leaving a solution comment for your future plans.
I agree with this. For what it's worth the Yabsab vs Ample game was the most non-series I've watched in a while; they were barely playing starcraft. You could tell that both light and best were extremely annoyed by the lag and it affected their play, but obviously they aren't going to complain when you're paying them hefty amounts lol.
Nothing wrong with sponsoring pro Koreans, but if you want a continued positive relationship with them the solutions are quite obvious and simple imo.
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The opportunity for foreigners to organize pro-game showmatches with a Korean observer and foreign casters has existed for two decades now. Let's make it happen. But the onus is not on me.
Sva - I have dedicated enough of my precious time and money on the wonderful BW community (including not only 400+ showmatches featuring players but also things that have supported mappers, casters and graphic designers). Time for you and other backseat organizers to step up.
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Why should foreigners organize showmatches with progamers? Progamers are already showcased in literally the biggest bw tournaments that exist, as well as daily sponsored showmatches from their Korean viewers, all of which have no issues whatsoever with latency, observers, scheduling, etc.
I appreciate the work you're putting in, but I'd much rather see it directed towards boosting the foreign scene personally.
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Couldn't agree more.
Trovo insisted on a pro-gamer showmatch. I let them know about the latency issue and my streaming/observing aspirations (in case they wished to extend the opportunity to someone more "qualified") but they wanted us to do it so long as the pro-gamers approved, which they did and so we had our fun event, despite all the shortcomings. No point crying over milk that has not even spilled.
This event was also aimed at paving the way for more Brood War related content on Trovo and to persuade various players, casters and organizers to consider moving their wonderful events onto Trovo in order to potentially benefit from their streaming program.
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On March 20 2021 08:10 littlechava wrote:
Why should foreigners organize showmatches with progamers? Progamers are already showcased in literally the biggest bw tournaments that exist, as well as daily sponsored showmatches from their Korean viewers, all of which have no issues whatsoever with latency, observers, scheduling, etc.
I appreciate the work you're putting in, but I'd much rather see it directed towards boosting the foreign scene personally.
Because the levels that Korean pros play at is much higher than any foreigner is able to perform at. It's a fairly basic concept.
It's normal that there would be an attraction to organize a showmatch between those guys for a foreigner audience.
It happens in sports all the time and it will continue to happen for sure.
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On March 20 2021 08:23 ox.tQ wrote:Couldn't agree more. Trovo insisted on a pro-gamer showmatch. I let them know about the latency issue and my streaming/observing aspirations (in case they wished to extend the opportunity to someone more "qualified") but they wanted us to do it so long as the pro-gamers approved, which they did and so we had our fun event, despite all the shortcomings. No point crying over milk that has not even spilled. This event was also aimed at paving the way for more Brood War related content on Trovo and to persuade various players, casters and organizers to consider moving their wonderful events onto Trovo in order to potentially benefit from their streaming program.
That's fair.
On March 20 2021 08:27 oxKnu wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2021 08:10 littlechava wrote:
Why should foreigners organize showmatches with progamers? Progamers are already showcased in literally the biggest bw tournaments that exist, as well as daily sponsored showmatches from their Korean viewers, all of which have no issues whatsoever with latency, observers, scheduling, etc.
I appreciate the work you're putting in, but I'd much rather see it directed towards boosting the foreign scene personally. Because the levels that Korean pros play at is much higher than any foreigner is able to perform at. It's a fairly basic concept. It's normal that there would be an attraction to organize a showmatch between those guys for a foreigner audience. It happens in sports all the time and it will continue to happen for sure.
I'm honestly confused by this take. I've never found it a challenge to access and watch the constant stream of the absolute highest level of competition from Korean pros and semipros. The only thing that makes it less accessible is the timezone, which made this event just as inaccessible as anything else (for me).
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On March 20 2021 08:43 littlechava wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2021 08:23 ox.tQ wrote:Couldn't agree more. Trovo insisted on a pro-gamer showmatch. I let them know about the latency issue and my streaming/observing aspirations (in case they wished to extend the opportunity to someone more "qualified") but they wanted us to do it so long as the pro-gamers approved, which they did and so we had our fun event, despite all the shortcomings. No point crying over milk that has not even spilled. This event was also aimed at paving the way for more Brood War related content on Trovo and to persuade various players, casters and organizers to consider moving their wonderful events onto Trovo in order to potentially benefit from their streaming program. That's fair. Show nested quote +On March 20 2021 08:27 oxKnu wrote:On March 20 2021 08:10 littlechava wrote:
Why should foreigners organize showmatches with progamers? Progamers are already showcased in literally the biggest bw tournaments that exist, as well as daily sponsored showmatches from their Korean viewers, all of which have no issues whatsoever with latency, observers, scheduling, etc.
I appreciate the work you're putting in, but I'd much rather see it directed towards boosting the foreign scene personally. Because the levels that Korean pros play at is much higher than any foreigner is able to perform at. It's a fairly basic concept. It's normal that there would be an attraction to organize a showmatch between those guys for a foreigner audience. It happens in sports all the time and it will continue to happen for sure. I'm honestly confused by this take. I've never found it a challenge to access and watch the constant stream of the absolute highest level of competition from Korean pros and semipros. The only thing that makes it less accessible is the timezone, which made this event just as inaccessible as anything else (for me).
You interpreted that the wrong way.
Making it a show special for foreigner audiences makes it more special...for foreigner audiences.
Admittedly, I don't care that much about it from that point of view but I definitely see why others might do.
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Fair enough. It just aggravates me because I love what TQ is doing and I want them to keep doing it -- but I want them to do it for foreigners in particular. If Koreans are involved I'd like to see them vs Non-Koreans at the very least. I want to build up the Non-Korean scene. I didn't realize it was a deal with Trovo, though that should've been obvious.
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The real issue (for me at least) was the time of the event. Unfortunately, several pros whom we contacted weren't available at a better time, when non-Koreans would be available (even working Koreans were not available at that time). Pros have their own busy schedules so it's understandable.
Maybe next time (if there is one) we can ask for the games to be freshly preplayed and then stream/cast those replays. And ask for those games not to be streamed by the individual streamers but that may be a non-starter for them. Not as hype as a live match, I know.
Everyone is welcome to make things happen with Trovo by the way. So feel free to reach out to them. I shared the plug. But I would definitely make sure the observer in game is experienced. That's a skill area that seems to be relatively underdeveloped in my opinion. I prefer observing that isn't similar to gamers watching their own replays, where they sporadically scroll the screen with a mouse cursor and keyboard arrow keys, clicking on everything. I think observing using the cursor in the mini-map with single frame changes creates a much more cinematic experience, especially when done methodically some how. Although mistakes are bound to happen with observing just as with casting and playing the game.
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The games look almost thrown, but with the prize structure as it is, I imagine they just cheesed to get it over with.
> Game 2 Light scanned a carrier build and hit it with a timing push, exactly as he's meant to do. Zero cheese involved.
This game in particular is suspicious, a 2800 player would know 3 base into carrier doesn't work vs 6 factory, so maybe he just gambled on it to avoid a long game.
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I think I got a bit more heated than I needed to.
Just wanted to go ahead and reiterate that I do really appreciate all of these events that are being hosted by Team Think Quick. They are great to tune into, but I was frustrated by the two showmatches on Trovo.
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Dunno if anyone mention it. But if you are having a showmatch with 2 korean progamers just find another player from Korea that can obs the games and share it with you on discord.Maybe is a lot to ask but is better than having 2 progamers playing with bad latency.
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EPT
