EPT![[image loading]](https://liquipedia.net/commons/images/c/c4/Transistor.jpg)
and neo transistor
![[image loading]](https://i.imgur.com/WnRlWIz.jpg)
edit: changes i can see so far
- less minerals in main and expansion
- shorter bridges
- extra ramp at platform and more general space to manuever
- filled space near expansions
Information from Korea - Page 107
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GTR
51644 Posts
and neo transistor edit: changes i can see so far - less minerals in main and expansion - shorter bridges - extra ramp at platform and more general space to manuever - filled space near expansions | ||
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Wonk
546 Posts
Now I was just playing about with Labyrinth, and the Flag doodad which I'm unfamiliar with, so forgive me if this stuff is obvious. -getting into the base without picking up the flag on the ramp is impossible -Once you've picked up the flag on the ramp, your workers are unable to mine or mineral walk or pick up any other flags, though they can still build (if there's a way to drop the flag apart from killing them I haven't figured it out) -This means that you're limited to scouting one position per worker, as they're blocked from getting into a second base after scouting their first Now, provided this isn't just a temporary thing left in by the map makers (though I don't think so, because why else would there be an extra blocked ramp) This adds an interesting spin on early aggression in this map, seeing as you have to be very economical with using your workers to scout. If you scout wrongly you could end up essentially wasting multiple workers. So my guess is this is an anti-rush map? | ||
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prosatan
Romania8958 Posts
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prosatan
Romania8958 Posts
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Qikz
United Kingdom12042 Posts
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razorsuKe
Canada2040 Posts
Is everyone overlooking the 2 geysers on Labyrinth? It's more reminiscent of the 2v2 map Hannibal + Show Spoiler [Hannibal] + ![[image loading]](https://liquipedia.net/commons/images/a/ae/176_Hannibal.jpg) | ||
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TT1
Canada10045 Posts
On July 22 2018 18:33 razorsuKe wrote: Am I trippin'? o_O Is everyone overlooking the 2 geysers on Labyrinth? It's more reminiscent of the 2v2 map Hannibal + Show Spoiler [Hannibal] + lmao i actually missed that. ok map isnt all that standard anymore, i dunno how the ramps work either | ||
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Wonk
546 Posts
On July 22 2018 18:33 razorsuKe wrote: Am I trippin'? o_O Is everyone overlooking the 2 geysers on Labyrinth? It's more reminiscent of the 2v2 map Hannibal + Show Spoiler [Hannibal] + er, yeah. not sure how i missed that, guess I was so interested in the flags I didn't even think to look for more than one gas. Definitely going to be an odd map. | ||
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mishimaBeef
Canada2259 Posts
nice to see asl shaking things up once again | ||
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BlackJack
United States10574 Posts
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Cryoc
Germany912 Posts
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Freakling
Germany1534 Posts
A new Waldstein map: Autobahn looks like a solid, albeit not particularly unique, two player map. The mineral block at the nat backdoor is only a 20x0m stack, so a scout worker can mine it out relatively quickly if you let it. The Psi Disruptors are stacked 6x, so you better bring some splash for those. The use of cliff spam instead of some very simple adjustment to symmetry is a bit disappointing, and only compensates half of the building space discrpency between the mains anyway, but it's just one of those things that Korean map makers seem not to have caught on to yet. Syliphide – not my favourite LatiAs map, but it's definitely worth pointing it out as an example what maps can and should be. Look at all the custom terrain editing, some of which I don't like, but of which is excellent. Yes, most of it is completely unneeded as far as pure playability goes and hidden away in some corners where it'll hardly ever even be seen during matches, but it shows the level of work, thought and love for detail that went into creating it. Neo Transistor seems to mostly be an attempt to open up the map and counteract the relative linearity of the closest path, an inherent drawback of this kind of layout, so that's alright I guess. The Kaydarin Crystals in the mains still seem like utter buggy bullshit to me, though. No idea why they don't replace them with disabled Installation doors, which would avoid the stack bug… Labyrinth just looks like complete and utter bullshit to me, in pretty much every aspect. The hill in the middle with the tree sprites is just confusing (only the area within the tree sprites is actually high ground). Those tree sprites around the center do not actually serve any purpose, except to visually hide units, I guess, and to delineate the border of the high ground, which could have been better done just using ramps, which would have made the terrain much better readable for players. The mains are very small (so you are definitely expected to build most of your stuff in the natural) and so awkwardly shaped like this is some Blizzard map from 1998. I actually suspect all the convoluted layout elements, weird design choices and "new" special mechanics are mostly just there to brush over the relative lack of understanding for symmetry and layout planning that prevented the map maker (actually seems to be Earthattack, by the way) from designing a proper 5 spawn map. The double ramps are also very meh. Overall units just tend to get stuck at the Installation gate unless microed down the other ramp erxplicitely in most locations. The flags seem to be the main "attraction" of this map. But its not a new idea at all and the reason why it hasn't been seen i in any serious maps yet is probably more that it's got so much bullshit potential. Flag carrying workers are revealed to every one and cannot carry any other powerups (so they are useless for mining). So you basically cannot use that worker for anything else than scouting your opponent's base any more (anything else would just give them free scouting info). So the best thing to do is to get rid of that flag. Zerg can do that by morphing the carrying Drone into a building (which will instantly transport the flag back to where it was picked up, so by default the ramp where it spawned). The only other possibility is to have the worker killed, which will drop the flag on the Spot where it died (unless it cannot not fit there, in which case it is also "teleported" back to the pickup point). Now the issue is that you can pretty much expect players just bum-rushing their flag-bearing workers into enemy mineral lines. Either they kill something or they disrupt mining, and if they get killed they drop the flag which will inevitably be picked up by an enemy worker, which is effectively even better than killing a worker, as it still takes up supply without doing much and gives you free scouting info. Overall 3 out of 4 is better than most previous ASLs at least, even though the odd one out is probably as much of a complete miss as it could possibly be… It's a bit disheartening though that Afreeca seems to have gone back completely from at least partially public map submissions to behind-the-door selection of, well, whatever is at hand, I guess… | ||
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Alpha-NP-
United States1242 Posts
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Qikz
United Kingdom12042 Posts
Flag carrying workers are revealed to every one and cannot carry any other powerups (so they are useless for mining). So you basically cannot use that worker for anything else than scouting your opponent's base any more (anything else would just give them free scouting info). So the best thing to do is to get rid of that flag. Zerg can do that by morphing the carrying Drone into a building (which will instantly transport the flag back to where it was picked up, so by default the ramp where it spawned). The only other possibility is to have the worker killed, which will drop the flag on the Spot where it died (unless it cannot not fit there, in which case it is also "teleported" back to the pickup point). Now the issue is that you can pretty much expect players just bum-rushing their flag-bearing workers into enemy mineral lines. Either they kill something or they disrupt mining, and if they get killed they drop the flag which will inevitably be picked up by an enemy worker, which is effectively even better than killing a worker, as it still takes up supply without doing much and gives you free scouting info. This doesn't seem like a bad thing, because it leads to more options in the long run and more little tactical plays. | ||
BigFan
TLADT24920 Posts
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TopRamen
United States96 Posts
Because of some of the weird mechanics that Freakling has mentioned, i.e. the flag teleporting when you morph a drone, you can take an expansion at a main with ease. Send a drone over to your desired main expo, take the flag, morph into a hatch, flag reappears at ramp. I thought if you could figure out where your opponent spawns, you could be terribly annoying by taking your flag to their natural, but maybe not that annoying for Zerg players. One last thought I had, as a Terran player, you can wall off the ramp that has the installation doodad. There's 4-5 squares of untraversable terrain that jut out from the side of the map to that ramp. A supply depot fits perfectly between those squares and the edge of the ramp and would create a solid wall off. EDIT: Opponents get vision of the flag when it's held by your worker. | ||
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mishimaBeef
Canada2259 Posts
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razorsuKe
Canada2040 Posts
On July 23 2018 05:01 TopRamen wrote: On Labyrinth, my friend who mains Zerg just mentioned this: Because of some of the weird mechanics that Freakling has mentioned, i.e. the flag teleporting when you morph a drone, you can take an expansion at a main with ease. Send a drone over to your desired main expo, take the flag, morph into a hatch, flag reappears at ramp. I thought if you could figure out where your opponent spawns, you could be terribly annoying by taking your flag to their natural, but maybe not that annoying for Zerg players. One last thought I had, as a Terran player, you can wall off the ramp that has the installation doodad. There's 4-5 squares of untraversable terrain that jut out from the side of the map to that ramp. A supply depot fits perfectly between those squares and the edge of the ramp and would create a solid wall off. that's actually kind of awesome kinda like Troy with the destructible refineries | ||
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Freakling
Germany1534 Posts
On July 23 2018 04:04 Alpha-NP- wrote: Yo Freakling I appreciated your posts but you should point out the positive aspects as well. Even last season’s weird maps had their merits and had good games. I like that they seriously considered island maps and used some advanced mechanics to try and make them more balanced (which was not a complete success yet, mostly due to Sparkle's basic layout being way too old-school island like and thus still P favoured, but I hope the idea does not get completely burrowed again). The maps that ended up actually being used in last ASL were actually quite good overall, and had received some proper updates to be mostly bug-free, which is a major improvement over previous installments. The handling of the public submission and map selection process, the maps that actually got into the early selection (some of which had garbage quality and obvious issues) and the combination of a ton of heavily nonstandard maps into the same map pool were actually quite the clusterfuck, though. | ||
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Freakling
Germany1534 Posts
On July 23 2018 04:26 Qikz wrote: This doesn't seem like a bad thing, because it leads to more options in the long run and more little tactical plays. Well, the question is: Where do players begin to fight more against the map than against their opponent and turn the game more into some weird UMS of little tricks than a proper melee game. I experimented with this kind of stuff maybe 10 years ago and results where always hilarious, but nothing to be considered a serious and proper melee game. This map might still be in the safe zone in that regard, simply because the number of available flags is so limited, but there was a map briefly considered in the pre-selection for ASL4 that had about a dozen or so powerups placed all around the map. That's defintely where it gets just stupid. A Terran SCV-rushing you with powerup-laden SCVs is a complete bane for your worker line, even if you defend successfully. | ||
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