EPTOn March 31 2017 22:48 probelife66 wrote:
As soon as I read you wanted to change the balance of the game I disregarded your whole post.
Show nested quote +
On March 31 2017 19:20 quirinus wrote:
first, I'd like to say thank you for not allowing obs to change latency! finally :D
Here we go:
- Fix starting positions for "one on one" not being random. maybe it's like that in other game modes too.
- Ally chat doesn't work. (apparently everyone can see it, or maybe only if it's from obs. haven't tested.)
- Tab doesnt switch to other input elements.
- Shift adding to control groups dosent work. (haven't tested myself)
- I'm not sure if it's just me, but when I alt tab from BW to windows, my google chrome is not maximized, and becomes 640x480 in the top left corner.
- Alt+n or alt+v doesn't work anymore in chat channels (or is that just an iccup server feature?) it used to be that if you clicked on a user and pressed it, it would paste the user's name in the chat input box.
- Turn on framerate cap by default. processors are overheating even in the menu... for no reason at all. 200 FPS is too much btw, cap it at like 60 at most.
- Full screen by default (or even windowed). Not windowed full screen, because it laggs for most people and is pixelated, and we don't want people logging in and immediately having lag and seeing pixels.
- Let us chat while there's a drop screen. Let us be able to quit too (in that case show a leave msg if a player leaves)
- Improve reconnecting when the drop screen shows up. currently if you disconnect and reconnect to the internet, it almost never reconnects you back to the game (like 98% of the time).
- Add icons in the hotkey customize menu. people will complain a lot less if they could actually see the icon of the action, because pictures are easier to discern from each other than text. it'll also be a lot easier to find what you're looking for. (while you're at it, organize them into groups)
- Hide replay progress bar option. Maybe a "[ ] Hide" checkbox next/under it. remember it between games/sessions.
- replay rewind hotkeys: shift+← (rewind 5s) and/or ctrl+← (rewind 10s). then also keep last 5 & 10 s buffered for smooth rewind.
- Close all obs slot: maybe just make it a dropdown next to the "Observers" label? Offer options "On/Open (all)", "Off/Close(d) (all)", "Close all (kick)/Forced close", "Always off/close(d)". if it's always closed, remember it between games/sessions. allow opening even if always off is selected.
- if some slots are closed, when selecting Open, open all closed slots. if there's some open slots, if you select Close, close all open slots. when doing this, don't kick the obs if some slots are taken. when choosing Forced close, kick all obs, and close all slots.
- Close all player slots: add a dropdown or something at the top. that closes all open/unused player slots. this is not very important and might clutter the pre-game lobby, but it could be useful to a few people.
- map/replay browser. show tileset as an icon in front of the map/replay name (![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/images/maps/tilesets/ashworld.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/images/maps/tilesets/twilight.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/images/maps/tilesets/spaceplatform.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/images/maps/tilesets/jungleworld.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/images/maps/tilesets/badlands.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/images/maps/tilesets/desert.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/images/maps/tilesets/ice.jpg)
), or 1 letter for the tileset (J) - jungle. after that, show the number of players as "(X)" or "[X]" or a number in a box.
- Autosave replays:
- 2 players (one on one, melee): show races (icon or 1 letter), and opponent name. map name is less important (you can use the terrain icon), if people want to see the map, they can click on the replay and see the preview.
- 4 players (top vs bot, team melee): show race teams (ZTvsZP), and a few letters of each name, not own name (or show longer file names)
- 6/8 players (top vs bot, team melee): show race teams (ZTvsZP), and a few letters of each name, not own name (or show longer file names)
- otherwise: show map name (this is for hunters/ums/fastest/ffa/etc.), tileset, maybe list races.
- maybe use table columns to better organize/align this
- race icons that were used in bw liquipedia (no idea if using sc2 icons is better or not): http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft/Template:RaceIconSmall
- Invite to game: in chat screen player list, select players whom to invite to the game with shift click to select multiple people. then in the create game window add a checkbox "[ ] Invite selected players". (or an input box to type the player name(s))
- please make game creator name more noticeable in the game list preview. we should be able to see it at a glance. either move it somewhere, or color it.
- Whisper to a player by ctrl clicking user/friend name? I assume they're already doing something similar, maybe a dropdown menu when right clicking on a user, for various things to do.
now, for a few more controversial suggestions:
- maybe change high ground 50% miss chance to -50% dmg instead instead? it's probably better for the competitive play, to reduce randomness. on the other hand, people are used to it and some viewers like the thrill of uncertainty. (also, maybe remove the 1/256 missile miss chance, and don't forget about 50% miss chance when under doodoads like trees).
- allow queuing units even when no supply? (currently you can do this if you queue up a unit after another one has already been queued up, even if you don't have supply for it)
did you change the network code? is it no longer p2p, but trough a server? that's probably for the better. maybe check if p2p or trough the server is faster, and use the faster connection.
copy of my previous posts (less organized):
+ Show Spoiler +
I could go on...
first, I'd like to say thank you for not allowing obs to change latency! finally :D
Here we go:
- Fix starting positions for "one on one" not being random. maybe it's like that in other game modes too.
- Ally chat doesn't work. (apparently everyone can see it, or maybe only if it's from obs. haven't tested.)
- Tab doesnt switch to other input elements.
- Shift adding to control groups dosent work. (haven't tested myself)
- I'm not sure if it's just me, but when I alt tab from BW to windows, my google chrome is not maximized, and becomes 640x480 in the top left corner.
- Alt+n or alt+v doesn't work anymore in chat channels (or is that just an iccup server feature?) it used to be that if you clicked on a user and pressed it, it would paste the user's name in the chat input box.
- Turn on framerate cap by default. processors are overheating even in the menu... for no reason at all. 200 FPS is too much btw, cap it at like 60 at most.
- Full screen by default (or even windowed). Not windowed full screen, because it laggs for most people and is pixelated, and we don't want people logging in and immediately having lag and seeing pixels.
- Let us chat while there's a drop screen. Let us be able to quit too (in that case show a leave msg if a player leaves)
- Improve reconnecting when the drop screen shows up. currently if you disconnect and reconnect to the internet, it almost never reconnects you back to the game (like 98% of the time).
- Add icons in the hotkey customize menu. people will complain a lot less if they could actually see the icon of the action, because pictures are easier to discern from each other than text. it'll also be a lot easier to find what you're looking for. (while you're at it, organize them into groups)
- Hide replay progress bar option. Maybe a "[ ] Hide" checkbox next/under it. remember it between games/sessions.
- replay rewind hotkeys: shift+← (rewind 5s) and/or ctrl+← (rewind 10s). then also keep last 5 & 10 s buffered for smooth rewind.
- Close all obs slot: maybe just make it a dropdown next to the "Observers" label? Offer options "On/Open (all)", "Off/Close(d) (all)", "Close all (kick)/Forced close", "Always off/close(d)". if it's always closed, remember it between games/sessions. allow opening even if always off is selected.
- if some slots are closed, when selecting Open, open all closed slots. if there's some open slots, if you select Close, close all open slots. when doing this, don't kick the obs if some slots are taken. when choosing Forced close, kick all obs, and close all slots.
- Close all player slots: add a dropdown or something at the top. that closes all open/unused player slots. this is not very important and might clutter the pre-game lobby, but it could be useful to a few people.
- map/replay browser. show tileset as an icon in front of the map/replay name (
), or 1 letter for the tileset (J) - jungle. after that, show the number of players as "(X)" or "[X]" or a number in a box.- Autosave replays:
- 2 players (one on one, melee): show races (icon or 1 letter), and opponent name. map name is less important (you can use the terrain icon), if people want to see the map, they can click on the replay and see the preview.
- 4 players (top vs bot, team melee): show race teams (ZTvsZP), and a few letters of each name, not own name (or show longer file names)
- 6/8 players (top vs bot, team melee): show race teams (ZTvsZP), and a few letters of each name, not own name (or show longer file names)
- otherwise: show map name (this is for hunters/ums/fastest/ffa/etc.), tileset, maybe list races.
- maybe use table columns to better organize/align this
- race icons that were used in bw liquipedia (no idea if using sc2 icons is better or not): http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft/Template:RaceIconSmall
- Invite to game: in chat screen player list, select players whom to invite to the game with shift click to select multiple people. then in the create game window add a checkbox "[ ] Invite selected players". (or an input box to type the player name(s))
- please make game creator name more noticeable in the game list preview. we should be able to see it at a glance. either move it somewhere, or color it.
- Whisper to a player by ctrl clicking user/friend name? I assume they're already doing something similar, maybe a dropdown menu when right clicking on a user, for various things to do.
now, for a few more controversial suggestions:
- maybe change high ground 50% miss chance to -50% dmg instead instead? it's probably better for the competitive play, to reduce randomness. on the other hand, people are used to it and some viewers like the thrill of uncertainty. (also, maybe remove the 1/256 missile miss chance, and don't forget about 50% miss chance when under doodoads like trees).
- allow queuing units even when no supply? (currently you can do this if you queue up a unit after another one has already been queued up, even if you don't have supply for it)
did you change the network code? is it no longer p2p, but trough a server? that's probably for the better. maybe check if p2p or trough the server is faster, and use the faster connection.
copy of my previous posts (less organized):
+ Show Spoiler +
- game join screen: move the lock to the right of the ping bars, so that the names/player numbers are lined up. maybe even move the player number between the game name and the bars, and align them.
- how do people feel about more than 3 function keys? F2 F3 F4 and more (F5 F6 ...)?
- double clicking on the gateway name doesn't connect you to it
- can you fix the music starting from the beginning when you mute/unmute? (this is present pre 1.18 too) ctrl+m. just save the song time position and continue from there
- if the user list is going to be so big, move it to the left, and the chat to the right. people are used to looking to the right (or center), and most important things should be on the right, not left.
- in the user list in the chat screen, the scrollbar hides when it's not needed, but when you open the channel list window, it's there even if not needed. make it one or the other way, so it's consistent.
- when you add /f l, add /f o too. (F)riends (o)nline, which shows just the logged in friends, not all.
- some maps don't show map preview.
- down/up arrow buttons don't move you to the next/previous game/map, but scroll the scrollbar instead, change that. or at least make it tab for next, and shift+tab for previous game/map.
- when you click anywhere else, the search game/map input area loses focus, game lobby chat loses focus, etc. inputs should never lose focus. this is not a browser.
- the font should probably be a bit thicker in the menu buttons?
- the font in chat should have more spacing between letters, you can't have letters sticking to each other and overlapping.
- the green/yellow/red connection/ping bars are a bit too bright (or too much saturation?)
- the game speed radio-slider graphics don't match to the actual clickable area. make the clickable area wider than the graphics.
- imo, you could just remove the game speed option and just make fastest the default one. anything else doesn't make sense from today's perspective. (I hope fastest is set as default, at least)
- when clicking on stuff, the map preview blinks. when changing menu screens, stuff can be seen for a few miliseconds.
- the "Using UDP port 6112." msg is unneccessary. you can log that somewhere, or show it if the game is started from the console.
- the font doesn't look as glossy.
- if you leave the game, it doesn't select the same game when you go back to the join window.
- add an option to show/hide games that only have obs spots open. when I want to play I don't want to see/join games where there's only obs slots open, when I want to obs, I don't want to join games that have obs slots closed. also add an option to have the obs slots closed by default when creating games. have the game remember both of these preferences.
- don't make long game names wrap in a new line. make them show "..." at the end. or remove game type to give more space to game names. ideally, we'd have all 3 of these if you added a game type dropdown select, and made the names use ... if they're too long. people can see the full name by selecting the game anyway, if they really want.
- the game list could maybe be expanded downwards, so we can see more games, but not sure if it would look good without actually seeing it.
- maybe add an option to hide games with non-english characters? sometimes the koreans can overwhelm the game list with their games.
- option to hide passworded games, either for the creator, or the people browsing for games. (I guess you can't hide it currently, because you removed the option to type in the game name manually)
- bring back the ability to type in the game name manually, instead of having to search the 234234 games from the games list. or maybe a /game <name> <password> command from chat, which would directly put you in the game lobby of a game.
- in the chat channel, your own name should always be first.
- sort games by current number of players in it.
- game lobby: the font has to have some space between letters. the red edges should have round corners. but I guess this is still work in progress.
- log in window where you type the password has a gray bg, while other windows have black.
- add option for the host to mute/unmute obs. sometimes you don't want the obs talking and spoiling what's going on in the game, but in relaxed friendly matches you want to chat with them.
- ingame drop screen: allow us to exit the game instead of having to wait 50s for it to count down.
- after I kick someone from the pre-game lobby, it still shows the map dl %.
- why does the game go darker and then back to normal when I go into the video settings and cancel out?
- auto saved replays don't show the preview
- make the game play the join sound when someone joins the game and you are alt tabbed. same for game starting, make us hear the countdown.
- would be cool if the replay game creation lobby showed some more info about the replay, like the players/races (maybe even colors and/or starting positions), and if the replays could be filtered by player name/map name/races/matchups...
- would be cool to see the number of specific units a player has when obsing/replay. being able to select multiple units, just like in a normal game. being able to check their control groups, as if they were yours (select a unit of the desired player, then just press 1 2 3 4... to see the control group). being able to see what's in a dropship/shuttle/overlord when obsing. being able to see the energy of casters while obsing. (not sure if it's implemented yet, but being able to toggle vision as obs).
- increase sprite/unit limit (not just allowing valk missiles to bypass it). team, and especially ums games can suffer greatly because of those limits.
- if you're fixing the dragoon stop shooting bug, fix it for all units. (make sure it stays for lurkers, because the easiest way to do the stop lurker trick is attacking a building in the fog of war). or better yet, don't touch it at all, for any unit.
- love the auto-refreshing on the games list.
- love the fact that we can go back/forward in the replay. (would be cool if a tooltip showed the time when hovering over the replay progress bar, or even being able to type in the time manually)
- love the fact that you don't have to mess with your ports anymore to be able to host.
are they using some kind of a browser engine to power this? like electron?
btw, I'm using win7 x64 and it's working for me...
- how do people feel about more than 3 function keys? F2 F3 F4 and more (F5 F6 ...)?
- double clicking on the gateway name doesn't connect you to it
- can you fix the music starting from the beginning when you mute/unmute? (this is present pre 1.18 too) ctrl+m. just save the song time position and continue from there
- if the user list is going to be so big, move it to the left, and the chat to the right. people are used to looking to the right (or center), and most important things should be on the right, not left.
- in the user list in the chat screen, the scrollbar hides when it's not needed, but when you open the channel list window, it's there even if not needed. make it one or the other way, so it's consistent.
- when you add /f l, add /f o too. (F)riends (o)nline, which shows just the logged in friends, not all.
- some maps don't show map preview.
- down/up arrow buttons don't move you to the next/previous game/map, but scroll the scrollbar instead, change that. or at least make it tab for next, and shift+tab for previous game/map.
- when you click anywhere else, the search game/map input area loses focus, game lobby chat loses focus, etc. inputs should never lose focus. this is not a browser.
- the font should probably be a bit thicker in the menu buttons?
- the font in chat should have more spacing between letters, you can't have letters sticking to each other and overlapping.
- the green/yellow/red connection/ping bars are a bit too bright (or too much saturation?)
- the game speed radio-slider graphics don't match to the actual clickable area. make the clickable area wider than the graphics.
- imo, you could just remove the game speed option and just make fastest the default one. anything else doesn't make sense from today's perspective. (I hope fastest is set as default, at least)
- when clicking on stuff, the map preview blinks. when changing menu screens, stuff can be seen for a few miliseconds.
- the "Using UDP port 6112." msg is unneccessary. you can log that somewhere, or show it if the game is started from the console.
- the font doesn't look as glossy.
- if you leave the game, it doesn't select the same game when you go back to the join window.
- add an option to show/hide games that only have obs spots open. when I want to play I don't want to see/join games where there's only obs slots open, when I want to obs, I don't want to join games that have obs slots closed. also add an option to have the obs slots closed by default when creating games. have the game remember both of these preferences.
- don't make long game names wrap in a new line. make them show "..." at the end. or remove game type to give more space to game names. ideally, we'd have all 3 of these if you added a game type dropdown select, and made the names use ... if they're too long. people can see the full name by selecting the game anyway, if they really want.
- the game list could maybe be expanded downwards, so we can see more games, but not sure if it would look good without actually seeing it.
- maybe add an option to hide games with non-english characters? sometimes the koreans can overwhelm the game list with their games.
- option to hide passworded games, either for the creator, or the people browsing for games. (I guess you can't hide it currently, because you removed the option to type in the game name manually)
- bring back the ability to type in the game name manually, instead of having to search the 234234 games from the games list. or maybe a /game <name> <password> command from chat, which would directly put you in the game lobby of a game.
- in the chat channel, your own name should always be first.
- sort games by current number of players in it.
- game lobby: the font has to have some space between letters. the red edges should have round corners. but I guess this is still work in progress.
- log in window where you type the password has a gray bg, while other windows have black.
- add option for the host to mute/unmute obs. sometimes you don't want the obs talking and spoiling what's going on in the game, but in relaxed friendly matches you want to chat with them.
- ingame drop screen: allow us to exit the game instead of having to wait 50s for it to count down.
- after I kick someone from the pre-game lobby, it still shows the map dl %.
- why does the game go darker and then back to normal when I go into the video settings and cancel out?
- auto saved replays don't show the preview
- make the game play the join sound when someone joins the game and you are alt tabbed. same for game starting, make us hear the countdown.
- would be cool if the replay game creation lobby showed some more info about the replay, like the players/races (maybe even colors and/or starting positions), and if the replays could be filtered by player name/map name/races/matchups...
- would be cool to see the number of specific units a player has when obsing/replay. being able to select multiple units, just like in a normal game. being able to check their control groups, as if they were yours (select a unit of the desired player, then just press 1 2 3 4... to see the control group). being able to see what's in a dropship/shuttle/overlord when obsing. being able to see the energy of casters while obsing. (not sure if it's implemented yet, but being able to toggle vision as obs).
- increase sprite/unit limit (not just allowing valk missiles to bypass it). team, and especially ums games can suffer greatly because of those limits.
- if you're fixing the dragoon stop shooting bug, fix it for all units. (make sure it stays for lurkers, because the easiest way to do the stop lurker trick is attacking a building in the fog of war). or better yet, don't touch it at all, for any unit.
- love the auto-refreshing on the games list.
- love the fact that we can go back/forward in the replay. (would be cool if a tooltip showed the time when hovering over the replay progress bar, or even being able to type in the time manually)
- love the fact that you don't have to mess with your ports anymore to be able to host.
are they using some kind of a browser engine to power this? like electron?
btw, I'm using win7 x64 and it's working for me...
I could go on...
As soon as I read you wanted to change the balance of the game I disregarded your whole post.
Don't worry, I disregarded your 20-postcount-no-content-no-brain post just as easily.
Now is the only right time to discuss possible changes, if we don't discuss various things, no matter how small or big they are, they will stay like this forever. Only idiots like you discourage discussion when it is constructive, and inject desctructive no-content insult comments that don't benefit anyone, which is actually detrimental to a free discussion. Go away, and next time don't post posts that don't contribute anything, or you won't be here on TL for long.
If you were talking about the miss chance, that doesn't have anything to with blance (directly), so you're wrong in calling it a balance change. A -50% damage is better than 50% miss chance. Miss chance can ruin a player's tournament - there's no room for randomness in competitive play, as it is detrimental to equality and planning. The problem is that people are used to the miss chance and won't want to change it, there would be problems with backwards compatibility, and it's less exciting. So I assume it won't be changed, but I wanted to hear people's opinion on it.
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/Fbrwoku.png)
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/YgWR7Ex.png)
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![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/iphXYsK.png)
