Samsung Khan’s Shine, formerly of WeMade Fox, is a Zerg player who most people are familiar with but is often seen with indifference at best and animosity at worst. This is a result of his generally cheesy playstyle, unspectacular results, and oddly frequent wins over Bisu and Stork. Still, perhaps because of my personal love of cheese, he is one of my absolute favourite players.
By way of introduction to the world of Shine, I’ll be bringing you a Battle Report of a game between Shine and Flash from their recent tving OSL series. I was very hyped for this series because I felt that Flash winning would be the perfect ending for the Brood War OSL and that Shine winning would be the funniest. Unfortunately it didn’t quite pan out the way I wanted it to but it was still a fun series. The beauty of being a writer is that I can take the seven games Flash and Shine have ever played and only show you the one he won. This is that -
Shine is in the bottom left in white and Flash is in the bottom right in orange. Contrary to what you might imagine, the game starts very normally with a 1 Rax CC against a 12 Hatch.
Flash probably considered going CC first before remembering he’s against Shine and therefore getting cheesed (probably)
Shine decides to stop a few steps shy of cheese and just go for a standard but aggressive 2 hatch Lair of some sort.
The beauty of Shine is that you know he’s gonna come trying to kill you but you don’t know when.
Shine pretty quickly takes a third hatch at his backdoor mineral only. We see that Shine will be going for 2 Hatch Muta rather than the less standard (but just as Shiny) 2 Hatch lurker.
Flash sees it too. Like, immediately. Still, given that it’s Shine, it could still be a mass Scourge rush to kill a Command Center if it lifts for some reason, so Flash can’t assume anything
Meanwhile, Shine has brought two Drones to the back of Flash’s base to try to glitch them past the neutral building.
Flash really should be scouting for this. If there’s a back entrance of some kind, it’s pretty safe to assume Shine is trying to get through it at any given moment.
Shine is having trouble getting the Drone through and has failed twice. Unfortunately, his efforts are rudely interrupted by Flash’s Vulture killing all his things.
Very very rude of Flash, Kespa should disqualify him imo.
Finally Shine manages to squeeze the Drone up the ramp and soon after kills the Vulture, but not before it gets 7 kills.
”So what if your Vulture got 7 kills, I have a Drone in your back base! I can use it to, um, something. Probably. Yeah, definitely something probably.” - Smartest Zerg player ever
Shine starts to harass with his Mutalisks but can’t accomplish a ton because there are Turrets and Goliaths ready to pewpew. Not to be discouraged, Shine has a pretty quick Queens Nest ready to go.
Remember kids, more than 2 gas for a Hive is just stupid and unnecessary.
Flash’s Goliaths start to move out onto the map and Shine’s Mutalisks do remarkably little to stop them. Flash has also been building a bio army that will soon be joining up with the Goliaths.
But screw all that, there’s a base in his base.
Flash’s giant army makes it over to Shine’s natural. Seeing there are a ton of Sunken Colonies, he decided to just take his army up to the north to kill Shine’s bases up there.
Yes, kill the bases up there. The bases that he surely has because it wouldn’t make any sense if he didn’t!
The Terran army sees there’s nothing in the top left and an SCV sees there’s nothing at the top right. In short, Flash sees that there’s absolutely nothing anywhere.
Except that. But don’t worry about that.
Finally, Flash gets a very subtle hint of what’s going on. But can he figure it out on time? This is the hint that something might be amiss:
See Flash, I told you that you would be cheesed! But you just can’t know when!
Flash runs his army back as soon as he sees it but its too late, the Swarms and Lurkers are already set up beautifully and eating his production. He valiantly tries to hold it back and even tries to just turtle up in his natural with tanks and mines but it isn’t enough. Eventually he gets ran over and has to concede the game.
Picking your nose can’t save you now!
And with that, Shine wins his only ever game against Flash, rounding up his 1-6 record nicely. And in the process, he proved that if you cheese enough times, one will prevail eventually and somebody will write about you.
I’m fully aware that the task of converting people into Shine fans may not be an easy one but I am hopeful by the end of this, I will not be Shine’s only fan!
History of Shine
Disclaimer:This section is full of those nasty things called statistics. I won’t judge you if you want to skip over it, there are a ton of names and numbers and not very many jokes. The cliffsnotes are as follows:
bad -> mediocre -> pretty freaking good -> mediocre -> bad -> good
Shine started his career in 2008 playing for WeMade Fox with rather limited success. Still, he achieved a respectable record of 6-1 in the Minor League, managed to qualify for the 2008 Batoo OSL before losing 1-2 to Upmagic, and played in the second season of the GomTV Classic - winning two rounds before falling to Jangbi 1-2. In 2009, he began to make the climb from bad to mediocre, becoming a regular for his team in Proleague. He went 7-9 overall with an abysmal 1-6 record in ZvT but a decent ZvP record of 4-2, including wins over two Dragons in Jangbi and Kal. This air of mediocrity followed him into the Winners League, where he went 5-6, and the 2009 Bacchus OSL where he once again qualified but lost in the first round, this time 1-2 to Lomo.
Finally, Shine would have his major breakthrough in the 2009-2010 Ever OSL where he would ultimately make the semifinals. To get there, he had to first get through his ro36 opponents - Really and Bisu. Against all odds, Shine managed to beat both of them with a score of 2-1 to simultaneously swim in oceans of tears, acquire countless anti-fans, and advance to the group stages in the ro16. He found himself in a group with the monstrous Effort, Fantasy, and Calm, once again put in a position where he would have to upset players and fans alike to move on. Naturally, he accomplished this handily by losing to Calm but defeating both Effort and Fantasy. The tears continued to flow in, but Shine was not yet satisfied. He could sense that there were still some dry eyes left in South Korea so he aimed to correct this in his next round against Stork. With a score of 2-1, he succeeded. Unfortunately, that would be the end of his fairy tale as his semifinal opponent Movie proved to be too much and Shine fell 1-3.
Though his success didn’t follow him into the Nate MSL, Shine was at the helm of one of the most underrated Proleague performances of the 2009-2010 season. With a record of 23-12, Shine exhibited a win percentage similar to that of Effort, Bisu, and Fantasy - albeit with less games. Still, Shine played an instrumental role in WeMade’s 4th place finish for the season. Particularly notable was his 14-3 record in ZvZ that formed part of his 12 game ZvZ win streak, a record that still stands today.
In the Individual Leagues, however, Shine was unable to replicate his success in the 2009 Ever OSL. Throughout 2010 and 2011, he failed to make any strides in the OSL or MSL with the exception of another victory over Bisu in the 2010 Bacchus OSL before falling in the ro16 group stages to Mind and Stork. Still, he maintained a decent 14-8 record in the 2010-2011 Proleague season and was 5-2 in ZvZ.
In 2012, Shine has been showing signs of getting back on his feet. At the time of writing, he is 5-0 in Brood War for the second season of Proleague and 2-1 in Sc2. In the last true BW OSL, the tving OSL, Shine managed to put up another respectable performance. With wins over Last and Soulkey, he passed his ro24 group to advance to the ro16. Faced with a pure ZvZ group of himself, Soulkey again, Hydra, and Hyvaa, Shine giggled maniacally to himself and 3-0’d the group. In the quarterfinals, he ran into the Ultimate Weapon and cheesed like it was his job (because it kind of is). This wasn’t particularly successful and Shine was knocked out with a score of 1-3.
Shine’s ZvP
Though far from his best match up, Shine is possibly best known for his Zerg vs Protoss. Because he’s so inclined to try to bust in some way in nearly every game, he has become very feared by even the best Protoss. The beauty behind his style is the breadth of his busts (alliteration!). Even though you might know he will try to kill you, the difficulty in defense comes from knowing exactly when and from what angle he will come at you from..
With so many types of busts, it is very difficult for Protoss to prepare their defense.
Another interesting aspect of Shine’s ZvP is his proclivity to seemingly reactively go for Mutalisks and Scourge against heavy Corsair openings. Though he’s not always able to shut down the Corsairs with his own air, he typically does decently and manages to come out on rather even footing even if it doesn’t work entirely as planned.
The final interesting tidbit I’d like to share is Shine’s use of fourth bases. When taking my notes on the games I watched, at first I would write “Hydras!” when Shine started to maraud around the map with his hydralisks and try to smash things. Before long, however, I began to reserve exclamation points for when Shine took a fourth base because that was much more rare than giant hydra blobs. When Shine actually does take a fourth base, he has a rather unconventional use for it. Rather than going up to Hive and trying to win with Defilers and Ultras like a normal person, he uses the extra income to make even more tier 2 units! This is because “screw it why not?”
My next battle report will be of Shine’s infamous game against Bisu on Eye of the Storm in his Ever OSL run.
Bisu will be rocking the red pieces in bottom right while Shine will be yellow in bottom left. It starts with a conventional Forge FE against an Overpool because Shine doesn’t want to try to kill Bisu just yet.
See?! Bisu started it! It’s all his fault!
Bisu makes a second cannon because he sees 6 lings and you can never be sure how many hundred more lings are behind them. In this case, its none. Shine has gone for a perfectly normal 3 Hatch Spire with 3 base. Still, after a little while and with no scouting information yet, Bisu throws down a third cannon blindly.
”No ling all in eh? Then surely the Hydra all-in must be coming any second!” - a surprisingly very reasonable thought process
Bisu’s first Corsair gets out and sees everything there is to see before coming home. Near his natural, Shine some more Scourge hoping to come in for the sandwich. It turns out Bisu is pretty good so he manages to dodge and get to the safety of his cannons.
Bisu Corsairs are very different from those of a certain team mate.
Bisu has made about 6 Corsairs at this point. Knowing this, Shine makes the only logical decision and begins producing Mutalisks. He attacks Bisu’s third that is starting to come up but there are a bunch of Corsairs, an Archon, and soon to be three Cannons.
Shockingly, it doesn’t work.
Not a complete failure, some Scourge come in and manage to take out a couple of Corsairs after all. In the tradition of great surprises, Shine is working up to 7 hatches on his three base. He places an 8th hatch at his fourth base, presumably so he can support 10 hatch Hydralisk. Bisu finds it, kills the small ling defense there with some Zealots and a Dark Templar, and begins to work on the Hatch.
Naturally, Bisu first had to get over the emotional shock of the sight before he could start to kill it.
Shine has to cancel his fourth base but his march begins!
Pictured Above: “Blob and Trail” minimap seen in all Shine ZvPs.
Shine first goes for the third base. He kills a lot of units and intercepts some incoming reinforcements but when Bisu retreats up his ramp, Shine sets his sights on the natural.
A minor setback, but one Templar will not deny the yellow Blob and Trail.
Ultimately Shine manages to smash down the front of the natural. But Bisu is still making a lot of units out of his Gateways and manages to stay pretty even with the Blob for a pretty long time. Meanwhile, his Corsairs are still alive and they have ran over to Shine’s base to kill every Overlord ever.
Shine lets this happen for a long time because Overlords are not Hydralisks so he doesn’t care about them.
Now that Overlords are, at best, an endangered species, a lone Dark Templar runs into the third.
Take a good look, because everything you see here will die at the hands of that DT.
Meanwhile, Shine has done a rather large drop with Hydras and Underground Super Hydras into Bisu’s main - pretty much stopping production.
Bisu should just bring home Captain DT to defend. Surely he’s swinging for 200 damage a shot after all this exercising he’s been doing.
More units swing in through the front and Bisu’s looking increasingly dead. While he’s dying, Captain DT has moved onto Shine’s natural because it ran out of things to kill at the third.
Invisible units are nice but they can only do so much. In this case, “so much” is kind of a lot.
Despite the DT’s tremendous efforts, Bisu is forced to type out.
Fixing your hair can’t save you now!
That was a very normal Shine game and is very indicative of his typical ZvPs, though this was quite a bit longer than Shine would usually prefer. It also marked Shine’s first victory against Bisu. Today, their head to head record in 5-5 with Bisu having won the more recent two but Shine having knocked Bisu out of two OSLs.
Shine’s ZvT
Shine typically plays his Zerg vs Terran in a more conventional manner than his ZvP. Though he’s still not one to shy away from early pressure or straight up cheese. Much unlike his ZvP, however, he’s also more than willing to tech to Hive and play later game. Perhaps this is why his ZvT is his worst match up!
That said, Shine is still a fan of aggressive openings. For example, he often favours two hatch plays over three hatch, opens Lurkers instead of Mutas more than most other Zerg players, and frequently does big counter-attacks. Other aggressive options he frequently exercises are 9 Pool Speed openings and early game ling all-ins (that often seem to hit just a few seconds after the first two Firebats come out).
If interested, here are some games where Shine exhibits his trademark early aggression:
But when Shine does tech to Hive, there are a number of things he can do with it. As we saw earlier, he might even just be going for a Nydus Canal rush! In addition to traditional Defiler play, which Shine can play decently though unremarkably, he also is a big fan of Guardians. Rather than make a handful of Guardians from leftover Mutalisks and cowardly attack a base from a cliff, Shine likes to make a bunch in his normal army composition and use them to push. If you recall the earlier Brood War Day9 Dailies, you may know that such moves would have made Day9 happy in the pants.
Again, here are some example of his later game ZvT.
Really normal macro game with Hive, featuring Shine’s favoured Counter-Attacks + Show Spoiler +
Another Hive game, showing some of Shine’s suave Guardian pushing. + Show Spoiler +
The game we’ll be looking at for the ZvT Battle Report will also feature an example of Shine’s Guardian play. It is a match between Shine and Reality on Monte Cristo.
Shine in red at the top left, Reality in yellow at the bottom right. A nice 1 Rax FE from Reality but not as baller as Shine’s 3 Hatch (3 base) before Pool.
After making his Pool, he cancelled his third hatch and remade it to make sure he had all the disadvantages of 3 Hatch before Pool without any of the perks. All in the name of fairness.
Barring that weirdness, the game continued normally with Shine getting his gas and teching to Lair. Instead of the traditional Mutalisks, he’ll be opening with a Hydra Den.
Pictured Above: A Zerg Hydralisk Den. For Serious.
Reality will be going for 4 Barracks before Factory with a quick +1 on his infantry, looking to bring some pain against the Mutalisks that won’t exist. Shine gets a really fast Queens Nest. It’s not long before Reality has a giant army out on the map and is looking pretty frightening as Shine doesn’t really have any units.
Just kidding, he has 4 supply worth of units up a ramp!
It’s not long before we see Shine’s plan become clear.
[cemter] A really old rotting nasty tree! I mean, not that!
Meanwhile, realizing that Lurkers on a ramp are invincible, Reality notices he has only two choices: Start making mech units or quit the game and switch to Tetris.
He chooses the former. For now.
Shine’s Greater Spire finishes but he actually doesn’t morph to Guardians right away. He noticed a distinct lack of Shootalisk Towers by the mineral lines so he goes in and kills a bunch of SCVs first.
At one point Reality tries stacking his workers to the bottom of the mineral field as far from his Bunker as possible. It wasn’t particularly successful.
Eventually Shine backs away and morphs the Guardians in a safe position. Unfortunately, his safety doesn’t last very long.
The group of Kinglers manages to get away pretty safely with only one death. It’s okay though, that one was Krabby.
But now its time for the fun! One of the stupidest looking armies known to Brood War very slowly blobs itself towards Reality.
The Hydralurkerguardianoverlord will be its own distinct unit by Sc2’s final expansion and look exactly like that. But in HD!
Reality manages to put up a bit resistance but not much. Before long, the death cloud is in his natural.
And it is deathing things.
Finally, Reality is forced to call GG.
Your toothless old man impression can’t save you now!
[/center]
Though ZvT is probably Shine’s weakest match up and the statistics back this up, it is my favourite match up of his to watch. He has such variety in his play and I think that makes him a rather imposing figure, even if his play isn’t the most solid out there. His ability to play out a number of different styles in any stage of the game make him a very interesting player.
Shine’s ZvZ
Unlike Shine’s other match ups which required a bit of a hyping hand, in Zerg vs Zerg, his results speak for themselves. Not only does he hold a 66% overall winrate in ZvZ with a record of 37-19, he holds the longest ever ZvZ win streak with 12 straight games! To be sure, it takes a tremendous amount of blind luck skill to pull off such a feat. Granted, Effort and Jaedong both came close with 11 each but those are some of the best ZvZ players of all time and they still fell short!
As part of my undying commitment and questionable time management, I sat down and watched all 12 of these ZvZs in a row, as well as his combo breaker against Zero. Though a TvT marathon is surely the greater test of endurance, a ZvZ marathon is a test of sanity. I definitely failed.
Shine seems to have a focus on unpredictability. Of the 13 games, his most common openers were 12 Hatch and 9 Pool with gas, with four instances of each. Somewhat contrary to his other match ups, Shine seems to get stronger in ZvZ the longer the match goes. He’s really strong in air wars but seems more fallible in Zergling wars. Further, he’s quite adept at recovering from any disadvantages he might experience in the game’s opening stages, as well as maintaining advantages he may get.
It is when the game gets into the air battles that Shine really gets to shineoutfox display his ZvZ prowess. This seemed weird to me at first since his Mutalisk/ Scourge micro, though certainly above average, isn’t really anything to write home about. Upon closer analysis, I believe I have found some of the things that make Shine so great. Some of these things will be discussed in greater detail during this section’s Battle Report but to quickly list them up front:
- Good scouting - Good positioning - Good drone timing even into the game’s later stages - Good game sense (when to make which defenses, when to make Scourge versus Mutas, etc) - Truly exceptional use of zerglings well into air battle phase of the game
I feel that the last point is one of Shine’s greatest features in the ZvZ match up. If there’s any timing window and any location where the opposing player might be out of position to defend, Shine is great at finding that window, slipping some lings in, and killing a couple of drones. Through the use of the five things I’ve listed above, Shine manages to chip away small advantages for himself and ultimately compound them into a win by choosing a good fight and microing well.
With all that said, let’s get into our final Battle Report. This is a game between Shine and CJ’s Hydra on Polaris Rhapsody that exhibits many of the qualities I was just discussing.
Shine is in white in the bottom right and Hydra in orange in the top left. Shine starts with a 12 Hatch in his natural while Hydra opens 9 Pool straight into Ling Speed.
Pictured: Death, usually
The Lings manage to avoid being scouted until they get to Shine’s base. Shine has to cancel his very quick Lair to get ling speed ASAP, then pulls out of gas to get as many lings out as he can. Still, his position looks a bit rough.
I read somewhere on the forums that more zerglings are usually stronger than less zerglings.
Shine takes a lot of damage on his natural Hatchery but his greater production ultimately allows him to push back Hydra’s lings, with the help of a couple drones. The first problem is now dealt with, but Shine now faces a second problem - Hydra’s Spire is about to finish and Shine hasn’t started his Lair.
I also read that Lings have a hard time defending against Mutalisks.
Shine resorts to the usual tactics when trying to avoid death my Mutalisks - Spore Colonies and sneaky Ling run-arounds.
Lings are better against drones than they are against Mutas. In fact, they’re better against drones than they are against most things. (Y’all can edit that into the Liquipedia if you’d like, it’s quality information imo)
Finally Shine starts working towards Mutalisks of his own and Hydra takes his second base. Hydra of course has the giant head start but Shine will have the quicker second gas to try to catch up with. Also, he has a few more drones because of some Ling runbys and having two Hatcheries for so long. Finally, going into the air wars, he’ll have the advantage of already having Spore Colonies at his bases. At long last, Shine is rocking flying units!
And already they’re out finding and killing things. Shine is very violent!
Shine has a whopping 5 drones mining in his natural (no sarcasm, this is a ZvZ!) so he buys a third Hatchery for his natural expansion.
More important than the extra production is the Feng Shui
Shine, being some sort of batman, has 4 lings out on the map doing a little patrol. Together, they have vision of a giant line straight through the map. It will be difficult to sneak anything by them!
Still images make it hard to see patrolling. I’m afraid you will have to trust me.
For a long time, not too much happens. Lings casually wander around the map looking for things to sleep with, and Mutalisks slowly rock back and forth. Both players have +1 carapace on their air units. Shine decided to get brave and go for the legendary third base in ZvZ which is scouted before too long. Figuring the new base would be the likely target of aggression, Shine idles his units there and even builds a Spore there. After what seemed like forever, it looks like things are going to happen!
Things!
I suspect Hydra forgot to check on Shine’s upgrades right before he engages as I doubt he would have taken that fight had he known +2 finished for Shine. Whether he knew or not, the battle commences.
I really don’t know
It turns out Hydra got absolutely mauled in the fight and Shine leaves with what looks to be about 20 Mutalisks. While that battle was happening, some lings slipped into Hydra’s main and did some respectable drone damage.
This would prove to be very important if Hydra turned out to have a secret stash of 24 Mutalisks hidden in a corner somewhere. (He didn’t)
Hydra continued to play the game for at least another minute. Eventually he realized there was no amount of micro that would allow his 3 Mutas to kill the 24~ of Shine and conceded the match.
Consuming the inside of your face can’t save you now!
That ZvZ showcases why Shine is so good at this match up. He survives attack after attack that many lesser Zerg players may have died to. He figures out where his advantages and disadvantages lie and always finds a way to stabilize. And when it reaches the air battle phase, Shine’s skillset allows him to get into as nice a position as he can and maximize his chances of taking the final engagement.
Conclusion
It would be difficult for me to say I can’t understand where hate on Shine comes from. If you strongly dislike aggressive and often downright cheesy play, I can never expect you to like him. But even though he may not be the strongest Zerg in the late game or the most mechanically solid, he’s certainly one of the more interesting and unique players in the scene. As said right from the beginning, I fully understand that I can never convert the true Shine haters into fans. But I also know that many people were simply on the fence or downright unaware of him and his play and hopefully my work here will allow you to like him a bit more.
Next time you see him play, give a little cheer. But make sure to run and hide as soon as possible, because the Hydralisks are coming. Cheers.
If you speak Korean, or even if you don’t and just want to support Shine in some minor way, go ahead and follow him on Twitter at www.twitter.com/lyh6988
Could you explain the context of that real quick? I watched that game during my research for this and even have "Shine breaks front with really pathetic amount of units" written in my notes. Definitely thought it was really weird.
"Restroom timing attack" something to do with the post game interview I imagine ?
edit: Dfgj, thats one eyedropper more than I could ever expect :D
Could you explain the context of that real quick? I watched that game during my research for this and even have "Shine breaks front with really pathetic amount of units" written in my notes. Definitely thought it was really weird.
"Restroom timing attack" something to do with the post game interview I imagine ?
edit: Dfgj, thats one eyedropper more than I could ever expect :D
he needed to go to the restroom
so he all-in'd at what you could label an "interesting timing"
so interesting that sea didn't have enough units to block the attack
Could you explain the context of that real quick? I watched that game during my research for this and even have "Shine breaks front with really pathetic amount of units" written in my notes. Definitely thought it was really weird.
"Restroom timing attack" something to do with the post game interview I imagine ?
edit: Dfgj, thats one eyedropper more than I could ever expect :D
he needed to go the restroom
so he all-in'd at what you could label an "interesting timing"
so interesting that sea didn't have enough units to block the attack
classic Shine
Haha yea that's Shine alright. Thanks for explaining :D
And Essbee! Still rocking the WeMade icon like a boss. ^_^
This is true! I mean there has to be some bias because he plays for Khan now (good thing too :>), but Shine has gone from pissing me off royally to...well...hm not bad. Great write up, Shine has done some awesome stuff recently which has somewhat redeemed him in my eyes ^__^
Could you explain the context of that real quick? I watched that game during my research for this and even have "Shine breaks front with really pathetic amount of units" written in my notes. Definitely thought it was really weird.
"Restroom timing attack" something to do with the post game interview I imagine ?
edit: Dfgj, thats one eyedropper more than I could ever expect :D
Even tho I'm a KT fan, I'm still a fan of Bisu and Shine. I just don't like when Hydra and Great made a group of death consist of bisu , jaedong, flash and sea. =[
Could you explain the context of that real quick? I watched that game during my research for this and even have "Shine breaks front with really pathetic amount of units" written in my notes. Definitely thought it was really weird.
"Restroom timing attack" something to do with the post game interview I imagine ?
edit: Dfgj, thats one eyedropper more than I could ever expect :D
Could you explain the context of that real quick? I watched that game during my research for this and even have "Shine breaks front with really pathetic amount of units" written in my notes. Definitely thought it was really weird.
"Restroom timing attack" something to do with the post game interview I imagine ?
edit: Dfgj, thats one eyedropper more than I could ever expect :D
Very nice post, thanks for writing! I didn't really know anything about Shine except for him being the asshole who knocked Stork out. It's nice to be able to associate more than one game to a progamer. I had no idea he was any good at zvz. I've always had a great deal of respect for players good at their mirror matchup. It'll be interesting to see what he does with his creative talent in sc2.
Could you explain the context of that real quick? I watched that game during my research for this and even have "Shine breaks front with really pathetic amount of units" written in my notes. Definitely thought it was really weird.
"Restroom timing attack" something to do with the post game interview I imagine ?
edit: Dfgj, thats one eyedropper more than I could ever expect :D
Could you explain the context of that real quick? I watched that game during my research for this and even have "Shine breaks front with really pathetic amount of units" written in my notes. Definitely thought it was really weird.
"Restroom timing attack" something to do with the post game interview I imagine ?
edit: Dfgj, thats one eyedropper more than I could ever expect :D
Never hated Shine even when he beat my favorite player Stork. He was the player that crushed Bisu and made all SKt1 fans rage and cry so thats a plus in my book
Hes been pretty much the Boxer of Zerg .... how can you hate a player like that ? I still dont get it why ppl orgasm when Boxer rushes 90% of games and he is a genius aparently and then when protoss and zerg cheese they are terrible cheesy noobs.
On August 19 2012 15:37 SkelA wrote: Never hated Shine even when he beat my favorite player Stork. He was the player that crushed Bisu and made all SKt1 fans rage and cry so thats a plus in my book
Hardcore SKt1 and Bisu fans are the worst. Sometimes I get peeved when Shine beats awesome players. Whenever he wins I almost yell "OH COME ON," at my monitor, but I respect him. He's good. + Show Spoiler +
A-hole cheeser.
^_^ And that crossed out "blind luck" made me laugh really hard. :D
Hmm... you actually did make me hate him slightly less.
Anyway, it was definitely an interesting read, very well written and well worth the time reading through it (This doesn't mean I've forgiven him for what he did to Stork though)
You are one of my favourite posters OP. This only further cements that!
I've always admired Shine. It takes a rather particular set of skills and gamesense to actually pull off these offhand tactics, or even just play with this rather hyper-aggressive style. It takes a mad amount of good army control. In fact, I try to model my own play style after Shine's, but as I said, it takes absolutely brilliant army control to pull the sorts of attacks his strategies require. So yea, I've always been a fan hehe. Helps that I'm not a protoss player!
On August 19 2012 11:30 MountainDewJunkie wrote: The only thing you need to know about Shine's TvZ is his that he beat Flash with a hidden offensive nydus canal.
In seriousness, I love Shine, and he has proved to be great for Khan.
On August 19 2012 11:30 MountainDewJunkie wrote: The only thing you need to know about Shine's TvZ is his that he beat Flash with a hidden offensive nydus canal.
In seriousness, I love Shine, and he has proved to be great for Khan.
oh god i remember this.
you... remember one of the games which was battle-reported in the OP? good job? XDD
On August 20 2012 01:44 SandwichApoc wrote: Still have to hate him.
He flushed my FPL team down the toilet.
And I had money on the line against my friend.
Why I kept putting him on my Anti-team, I will never know...
shine + roro: the ultimate pair of wemade zerg anti-team killers
I dont think Shine ever got me, but Roro definitely did at least once. I may even have been one of those jackasses who made the mistake more than once!
my favorite shine quote - "I had prepared for a long macro game but after the game had started I really had to go to the bathroom, so I allin-ed him." hahahaha dont forget about his gramma too, she's at most of his matches cheering her grandson on amidst the crowd
Amazing write up. I was actually going to write one like this next week but you did it better than I ever could. -.-;; I would like to add this game to the shine shrine because it has forever inspired me for lategame ZvP
This thread, and the discussion it caused, made me realize how much I like the Brood War Teamliquid forums. It's a really pleasant community. Great website, great discussion!
Edit: You have to love how Shine, who is known for going all in, 4 pooled a guy who was playing his last match before retirement... and then he says he did it because he had to go to the toilet, rofl.
I'd have let you do it Xenocide_Knight, I didn't know until someone said it you were such a big Shine fan. :D
And vOdToasT, which player was that? For someone who spent a bunch of hours researching Shine's games and writing this, I seem pretty out of the loop on all the fun Shine stories T_T
When I first started watching sc1 about three years ago Shine was one of the first players that caught my eye. Normal response to corsairs? Make a few scourge and lots of hydras. Shine's response to corsairs? Make more mutas and scourge and have amazing micro and flanks to win.
I've always had a special thing for Shine after that time he made the power rank solely on the basis of knocking out Bisu or Stork or whatever happened in that OSL and everyone flipped shit over it.
On August 20 2012 06:46 heyoka wrote: I've always had a special thing for Shine after that time he made the power rank solely on the basis of knocking out Bisu or Stork or whatever happened in that OSL and everyone flipped shit over it.
I can't particularly remember that but it was probably the OSL where he beat Bisu and Stork as well as passing the group with himself, Fantasy, Effort, and Calm. :D
On August 20 2012 05:49 Bibbit wrote: I'd have let you do it Xenocide_Knight, I didn't know until someone said it you were such a big Shine fan. :D
And vOdToasT, which player was that? For someone who spent a bunch of hours researching Shine's games and writing this, I seem pretty out of the loop on all the fun Shine stories T_T
[Oops]Cloud, if I remember correctly. I believe the map was Fortress.
On August 20 2012 05:49 Bibbit wrote: I'd have let you do it Xenocide_Knight, I didn't know until someone said it you were such a big Shine fan. :D
And vOdToasT, which player was that? For someone who spent a bunch of hours researching Shine's games and writing this, I seem pretty out of the loop on all the fun Shine stories T_T
I'll try and think of something that won't overlap with your post ^^ btw I want to point out that Shine is an awesome dude in person unlike a certain Khan Protoss player.
I'll concede this, I like your portrayal of him, your thread was very informative and funny.
However what he has done to Bisu cannot be forgiven. I respect his skills as a player but not as a player. Roro and hyvaa both fall in the same category
On August 20 2012 05:49 Bibbit wrote: I'd have let you do it Xenocide_Knight, I didn't know until someone said it you were such a big Shine fan. :D
And vOdToasT, which player was that? For someone who spent a bunch of hours researching Shine's games and writing this, I seem pretty out of the loop on all the fun Shine stories T_T
I'll try and think of something that won't overlap with your post ^^ btw I want to point out that Shine is an awesome dude in person unlike a certain Khan Protoss player.
Sounds nice. We'll have to make sure to get them both on the sidebar at the same time to make sure any newcomers think Shine is the absolute biggest thing in BW :D
I was always indifferent towards Shine. People dislike him not only for his cheesy playstyle, but also due to the means in which his matches play out. They're very unsatisfying and you end up feeling more frustrated with Shine's opponent than impressed with his actual gameplay. But even so, I'm a firm proponent of playing to your strengths. If you don't have the skill to survive the late game, then by all means, do whatever you can to end the game as quickly as possible. After all, cheesing isn't against the rules.
My opinion, however, changed during Shine's second game against Flash in the OSL. For those of you who are unaware, Shine requested a PPP due to keyboard issues, which later resulted in a regame.
There were only two possible explanations for that incident: 1) His keyboard had malfunctioned all game long, but Shine decided to keep it quiet as it wasn't affecting his gameplay (too much), or 2) in an incredible stroke of luck and miraculous timing, his keyboard decided to malfunction only after he completely botched the game and was obviously going to lose. Yeah, that... totally could have happened. He should have requested a PPP at the start of the game or waited until after the game ended.
But either way, Shine should not have accepted a regame. He should have done the honorable thing and conceded a loss. He should have known that such a bullshit decision was likely to affect Flash's mentality. But then... that's probably why Shine did it to begin with . We all know Shine is a very smart player. Do you really think he requested a PPP with good intentions? Like, fixing a minor keyboard issue was somehow going to get him back into the game? And the game file getting corrupted was also totally a coincidence. Eeee yeeeaah...
Anyone remember Power Outage vs. Flash and Jaedong in the NATE MSL? The outcome of that game was also predictable. It was pretty clear that Jaedong had a solid advantage, but the KeSPA refs were unsure as to whether they should do a regame or give Jaedong the win. During the commotion Flash was stressed and insisted on a regame, but what did Jaedong do? He showed his true colors and class by telling the refs that he actually didn't feel comfortable with being awarded a win.
Yeah, that's the difference between a scrub like Shine and a genuinely talented, honest player like Jaedong. If you dig Shine for his cheesy cheesiness, great! But if anything, you should totally hate Shine more after that bullshit stunt.
On August 30 2012 02:10 Masheyoon wrote: Yeah, that's the difference between a scrub like Shine and a genuinely talented, honest player like Jaedong. If you dig Shine for his cheesy cheesiness, great! But if anything, you should totally hate Shine more after that bullshit stunt.
If you're going to hate a player for him getting a regame after a convenient and well timed equipment failure, then you'll find you have to hate a lot of players. EffOrt and Flash spring to mind.
I don't want to hate him less... because I don't hate him, nor do I like him, nor do I love him. I just don't care for him. As such this post doesn't pertain to me does it?
On August 30 2012 05:17 3FFA wrote: I don't want to hate him less... because I don't hate him, nor do I like him, nor do I love him. I just don't care for him. As such this post doesn't pertain to me does it?
...I feel left out
Ah, probably should have read the intro, the conclusion, some of the parts in the middle, or some of the comments. A lot of people feel pretty indifferent towards Shine and that's been mentioned more times than I care to count.
On August 30 2012 02:10 Masheyoon wrote: Yeah, that's the difference between a scrub like Shine and a genuinely talented, honest player like Jaedong. If you dig Shine for his cheesy cheesiness, great! But if anything, you should totally hate Shine more after that bullshit stunt.
If you're going to hate a player for him getting a regame after a convenient and well timed equipment failure, then you'll find you have to hate a lot of players. EffOrt and Flash spring to mind.
Ugh, Effort... To this day I doubt him... The game was out of hand, and a minute or so later he claims there's a problem with his mouse. Could be legitimate, but watching that VOD (and live), I just....
On August 19 2012 11:30 MountainDewJunkie wrote: The only thing you need to know about Shine's TvZ is his that he beat Flash with a hidden offensive nydus canal.
In seriousness, I love Shine, and he has proved to be great for Khan.
AFTER tilting the hell out of Flash with a disconnect/corrupt replay, regame. God that series was funny
EPT![[image loading]](http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft/images2/thumb/a/aa/ShineLeeYoungHan.jpg/220px-ShineLeeYoungHan.jpg)
Shine, formerly of WeMade Fox, is a Zerg player who most people are familiar with but is often seen with indifference at best and animosity at worst. This is a result of his generally cheesy playstyle, unspectacular results, and oddly frequent wins over Bisu and Stork. Still, perhaps because of my personal love of cheese, he is one of my absolute favourite players. ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/apkva.png)
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