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On March 25 2012 15:25 ghostnuke1234 wrote:Show nested quote +On March 25 2012 11:13 Seraphic wrote:
Why is Blizzard pushing so hard on this? Why can't they just let BW be? (If it was indeed Blizzard's idea.) It's KESPA and OGN that want to broadcast SC2. Obviously, there are issues with sponsorship and a dwindling fan base in BW so KESPA/OGN are preparing to add SC2 to their broadcast. If BW were growing, bringing in new sponsors, and the fan base was growing, I doubt KESPA/OGN would bother with these negotiations. You should know this already though - MBC leaving the BW scene was a hint at what is happening to BW in Korea.
MBC leaving the scene because executives wants more money to be made out of the K-PoP hype that is mushrooming in Korea right now and it's quite logical actually . It's not because the fan is dwindling or what ever, If you read mbc star commentator he even stated that MBC was doing fine until the execs pull the plug and decided to change their business model.
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On March 25 2012 15:35 Sawamura wrote:Show nested quote +On March 25 2012 15:25 ghostnuke1234 wrote:On March 25 2012 11:13 Seraphic wrote:
Why is Blizzard pushing so hard on this? Why can't they just let BW be? (If it was indeed Blizzard's idea.) It's KESPA and OGN that want to broadcast SC2. Obviously, there are issues with sponsorship and a dwindling fan base in BW so KESPA/OGN are preparing to add SC2 to their broadcast. If BW were growing, bringing in new sponsors, and the fan base was growing, I doubt KESPA/OGN would bother with these negotiations. You should know this already though - MBC leaving the BW scene was a hint at what is happening to BW in Korea. MBC leaving the scene because executives wants more money to be made out of the K-PoP hype that is mushrooming in Korea right now and it's quite logical actually . It's not because the fan is dwindling or what ever, If you read mbc star commentator he even stated that MBC was doing fine until the execs pull the plug and decided to change their business model.
yeah..
fucking shame.. -.-
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And they massively failed at letting probably one of the greatest finals of our time happen uninterrupted and drama free...
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1019 Posts
On March 25 2012 14:35 Plexa wrote:Show nested quote +On March 25 2012 12:12 VictorJones wrote:
I can't believe this is how they will implement sc2. Mixing the games? ... What? Whose bright idea.. If you think about it, it makes a lot of sense to do it. If you look at the majority of Korean BW fans you see that they aren't necessarily fans of the game first, rather they are fans of the players first. For instance, Reach playing BW is the same as Reach playing SC2 for a lot of people - they don't care what he is playing, rather that he is playing. Sure there might have been a time when playing BW and being a BW celebrity were one in the same, but we passed that time a long time ago. Following this train of thought, if you can get the current BW fans to watch their favorite players play SC2 then you will start to see a natural transition of BW to SC2 without losing the majority of the fanbase. Hence, SC2 succeeds BW and everyone* is happy. *everyone except people who are fans of the game first, which a lot of foreigners are
Do you have some kind of proof that suggests that korean BW fans are fans of the players first and then the fans of the game?
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OrangeMilkis Wooju Lee
Someone got some hard numbers regarding TV ratings for OGN and MBC Game... it doesn't look good. (70th and 60th respectively).
OrangeMilkis Wooju Lee
Basically: OGN has a sixth of the rating they had in 2007, MBC has a third of what they had in 2007.
TV rating plays a part though eventhough it's not everything.
Decline in TV rating also might not be 100 percent due to declining interest in BW but just mistake in marketing point of view. Although it's undeniable that BW is no longer in its golden age in terms of popularity.
Personally i dislike the playoff format and i have said this over and over, it's really weird that the no1 team in the league (best team who is usually the most popular team) only plays ONCE in the playoff. That's stupid from a marketing POV. To add insult to injury, it was also BO1 Grandfinal. Usually, the strongest team is the team that fans want to watch the MOST. Be it casual fans or hardcore fans.
Some of the more casual team fans then will only watch the finals. That's why the number for grand final is staggeringly high. But the number for regular season/normal playoff, not so much. Combined with the fact that last season was bo7 with double winners league. The regular season become too long and tiring for people to follow. Some of the matches become insignificant.
And the playoff ( which is the most important part of the regular season , when things actually matter and when people were actually really interested) was very very short.
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On March 25 2012 14:35 Plexa wrote:Show nested quote +On March 25 2012 12:12 VictorJones wrote:
I can't believe this is how they will implement sc2. Mixing the games? ... What? Whose bright idea.. If you think about it, it makes a lot of sense to do it. If you look at the majority of Korean BW fans you see that they aren't necessarily fans of the game first, rather they are fans of the players first. For instance, Reach playing BW is the same as Reach playing SC2 for a lot of people - they don't care what he is playing, rather that he is playing. Sure there might have been a time when playing BW and being a BW celebrity were one in the same, but we passed that time a long time ago. Following this train of thought, if you can get the current BW fans to watch their favorite players play SC2 then you will start to see a natural transition of BW to SC2 without losing the majority of the fanbase. Hence, SC2 succeeds BW and everyone* is happy. *everyone except people who are fans of the game first, which a lot of foreigners are
It's not one or the other. A person's continued interest in BW might depend on the players, but his or her willingness to sit down and watch a videogame being played for hours and hours could still depend on having love for that game. Maybe this person stays a fan, but because she doesn't find the spectator experience as compelling she's now okay with checking results online until only the most important matches. You run the risk of turning fans of players first into fans of the players only.
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United Kingdom1704 Posts
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Ughhh, I'd love to see SC2 pro-league, but not at the expense of BW PL. I'm hoping that they both end up coexisting, but I don't see it happening...
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On March 25 2012 15:42 white_horse wrote:Show nested quote +On March 25 2012 14:35 Plexa wrote:On March 25 2012 12:12 VictorJones wrote:
I can't believe this is how they will implement sc2. Mixing the games? ... What? Whose bright idea.. If you think about it, it makes a lot of sense to do it. If you look at the majority of Korean BW fans you see that they aren't necessarily fans of the game first, rather they are fans of the players first. For instance, Reach playing BW is the same as Reach playing SC2 for a lot of people - they don't care what he is playing, rather that he is playing. Sure there might have been a time when playing BW and being a BW celebrity were one in the same, but we passed that time a long time ago. Following this train of thought, if you can get the current BW fans to watch their favorite players play SC2 then you will start to see a natural transition of BW to SC2 without losing the majority of the fanbase. Hence, SC2 succeeds BW and everyone* is happy. *everyone except people who are fans of the game first, which a lot of foreigners are Do you have some kind of proof that suggests that korean BW fans are fans of the players first and then the fans of the game?
I am the living proof ^^, although i'm not korean. I'll watch whatever game Bisu play and won't watch games that he doesn't play.
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On March 25 2012 19:09 kamikami wrote:Show nested quote +On March 25 2012 15:42 white_horse wrote:On March 25 2012 14:35 Plexa wrote:On March 25 2012 12:12 VictorJones wrote:
I can't believe this is how they will implement sc2. Mixing the games? ... What? Whose bright idea.. If you think about it, it makes a lot of sense to do it. If you look at the majority of Korean BW fans you see that they aren't necessarily fans of the game first, rather they are fans of the players first. For instance, Reach playing BW is the same as Reach playing SC2 for a lot of people - they don't care what he is playing, rather that he is playing. Sure there might have been a time when playing BW and being a BW celebrity were one in the same, but we passed that time a long time ago. Following this train of thought, if you can get the current BW fans to watch their favorite players play SC2 then you will start to see a natural transition of BW to SC2 without losing the majority of the fanbase. Hence, SC2 succeeds BW and everyone* is happy. *everyone except people who are fans of the game first, which a lot of foreigners are Do you have some kind of proof that suggests that korean BW fans are fans of the players first and then the fans of the game? I am the living proof ^^, although i'm not korean. I'll watch whatever game Bisu play and won't watch games that he doesn't play.
Im a huge Bisu fan, but even he won't be able to make me waste ~12 hours a week. =/
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Regardless of the players-over-game thing and whichever game someone happens to like (more), I think the way they're going around it is going to be really painful for the viewers. Even if you absolutely love both games (which let's be honest, isn't very common), you still kind of get in the zone for watching one game, and it will almost certainly feel like you're constantly being interrupted by another, it completely breaks up the flow of the match.
Imagine playing a ladder where one game you'd have to play BW and the other SC2. In fact take your two favorite activities/shows in the world and it'll probably be frustrating to do them or watch them in alternating 20 minute periods.
I don't see why either side would be happy with this arrangement or why KeSPA/broadcasters would think it would make their viewers happy as a whole. They're obviously set on switching to SC2 and this seems more of an appeasement to BW audience and a way to slowly bring their current viewers into the new game, but I think they underestimate BW fans by quite a bit. I can't imagine a more painful way to watch BW, and at the end of the day the end result of every match will be influenced by another game which will make it even more frustrating for team fans when their team loses because of it.
They should stop pretending that they give a shit and just pull the plug and run SC2 if they don't want to support BW events properly. I don't know what their plans for future OSLs are though.
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i would rather get to see current bw players play sc2 rather than not seeing them play at all. as a bw player myself, i would say its not the most desirable outcome but hey, i guess you gotta go where the money is.
i doubt that bw has been doing well over the past year or two considering how two teams had already closed and how finding sponsors has been proving to be a difficult task for kespa. i think if you honestly would support esports, you would support the players that you had faithfully followed through all these years to a new era and platform where they would be moved to. but of course, bw will forever be immortalized. we had a great run. if its time to move on, then its time.
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According to this guy ...
On March 25 2012 18:48 acrylicjoker wrote:
YEEESSSS. HOEJJA, THE GREATEST KT CLUTCH.
I was there for the game, albeit on khan side. Still got to watch an amazing series.
I talked to Hoejja after the game in the fan meet, he said that the players are pretty much sure that sc2 will go into rotation in the proleague. They say that they will field their own bw roster during the sc2 games if it does happen. Regardless of all this, kt and hoejja fightinguuuu
I don't know how it's going to work, but what if he said is true the korean fans will definitely see the flaw of sc2 if the games played were totally horrible . Sc2 as a spectator spot is not as good as bw .
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oh wow so if i didn't misunderstand that, KT will still field the BW roster ( Stats, Flash, Hoejja, Action) during the sc2 games instead of recruiting sc2 player with experience.
That's really ballsy. Then again, Flash with a month experience is probably better than any sc2 players they can find. ( this is not intended as an insult to current SC2 players but rather as an acclaim to Flash's superhuman powers so please don't take this the wrong way).
I hope other teams follow suit then if sc2 does make it into the proleague ( not recruiting experienced sc2 players but rather still fielding their old BW roster). It will be quite fun to see who pick the games up at the faster rate and whether they can do it without compromising their BW training time.
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classic tactic, if you want to bring two hostile parties together, give them a common enemy.
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On March 25 2012 21:13 dtz wrote:
oh wow so if i didn't misunderstand that, KT will still field the BW roster ( Stats, Flash, Hoejja, Action) during the sc2 games instead of recruiting sc2 player with experience.
That's really ballsy. Then again, Flash with a month experience is probably better than any sc2 players they can find. ( this is not intended as an insult to current SC2 players but rather as an acclaim to Flash's superhuman powers so please don't take this the wrong way).
I hope other teams follow suit then if sc2 does make it into the proleague ( not recruiting experienced sc2 players but rather still fielding their old BW roster). It will be quite fun to see who pick the games up at the faster rate and whether they can do it without compromising their BW training time.
I'd much rather a separate sc2 team was recruited rather than making their BW roster split training time. You can't play BW at a high level with any less practice time than the players currently put in playing the game full time, and they can't catch up to the current sc2 players practicing that game half as much.
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On March 25 2012 21:13 dtz wrote:
oh wow so if i didn't misunderstand that, KT will still field the BW roster ( Stats, Flash, Hoejja, Action) during the sc2 games instead of recruiting sc2 player with experience.
That's really ballsy. Then again, Flash with a month experience is probably better than any sc2 players they can find. ( this is not intended as an insult to current SC2 players but rather as an acclaim to Flash's superhuman powers so please don't take this the wrong way).
I hope other teams follow suit then if sc2 does make it into the proleague ( not recruiting experienced sc2 players but rather still fielding their old BW roster). It will be quite fun to see who pick the games up at the faster rate and whether they can do it without compromising their BW training time.
Then you will have a segregation between KeSPA/GOM, and bad quality games in SC2 KeSPA Proleague, which will not help SC1 fans to appreciate it, and decreased quality of SC1 games, too, because they will be practicing SC2...
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Yea that is a very valid point. I'm sure they have considered that.
But if they are still going down this path, this probably confirm the fact that they ( kespa and the teams) think fans will follow the players and not the games. So what they hope for is that fans will still follow the BW household names as they transition.
Keeping the fans are probably their main target here
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Man, maybe I shouldn't have said anything.
The more I think the more I believe that something like this shouldn't be said so casually. Hopefully players don't get into trouble for talking about it if it's meant to be something under the wraps or something
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EPT![[image loading]](http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/403/cjlovebw.jpg/)
