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On October 20 2011 06:22 Kipsate wrote:Show nested quote +On October 20 2011 06:19 bgx wrote:On October 20 2011 05:38 Skilledblob wrote:
I sincerely hope that KeSPA does not get its fingers on SC2 Why ? Any particular reasons? Im actually grateful that such thing as KeSPA ever happened. Who knows what it would be today if not them and 10+ years of BW they kept running and still do. It depends if KeSPA will require SC2 korean progamers to aquire progaming licences and shit and acknowledge SC2 as an E-sport, meaning that they will only be allowed to participate in KeSpA sanctioned events(I could be wrong).
Thats completely different matter, and i think this time Blizzard have upper hand here, so whatever Kespa does it will be allowed by Blizzard, remember there is no "LAN" in sc2, Blizzard has the plug here, and there is really no way to override it unlike BW.
Personally i doubt its gonna happen in near future, even if we see progamer licenses and such things it will be way later when the game will be matured enough to warrant it. Nowadays sc2 brings so much attention worldwide that it may never happen, that is if the world will be able to keep up with Korean skill, otherwise it will be irrelevant as in BW when only handful foreigners were interested in those.
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On October 20 2011 06:22 eviltomahawk wrote:Thinking about the overall term "Proleague"... I don't think SC2 will ever replace BW in Proleague, but perhaps rather be the beginning of more games being added under the "SPL" brand name. I think the "SCBW in Korea" headlines post had a nice article summary about it: Show nested quote +Summary: Director Lee of Eclat Entertainment points out some key issues with the current eSports scene in Korea. In his experience dealing with the Korean Baseball League, arguably the most popular sports league in Korea right now, he experienced how a few broadcasting changes can turn around the viewership and popularity. He is encouraging popular portal sites such as Naver (www.naver.com) to invest in eSports as a partner. He identifies the global appeal of eSports is one of the core strengths that should be more widely utilized than right now. He recommends branding of SPL and that in order for that to be done successfully, more games need to achieve a balance in the scene [right now, it is heavily dependent on SCBW]. Continual investment, partnership, promotion, and dedication will bring only brighter future ahead. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=274673So perhaps this actually means that the term "Proleague" may gravitate away from being a purely BW team league to possibly becoming an umbrella term/brand for multiple leagues for multiple games, kinda like how MLG or IEM have different games in their leagues. So maybe the "Proleague" brand will be expanded to include a BW SPL, SC2 SPL, or perhaps SPLs for other games. Kart Rider SPL? I'm actually not too familiar with these specifics, so correct me if I'm wrong.
No problem about all that, what I'm annoyed about is the possibility of more BW players playing SC2, which would be terrible.
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Not really BW news, why it this here? It's common knowledge that these kind of threads in the BW section always result in silly flame wars.
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I play only SC2 and I hope that we do not, for any reason, out shine or take the spot light from the BW players. This is their league, and they have been through enough drama for one game life time. If both games can be played together without one being more favored than the other than I am happy with this.
Since, I have only seen some Bisu, Flash, and jaedong games I think it would be funny if they played a showmatch against some of the sc2 players and they rofl stomped them.
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On October 20 2011 06:31 Redmark wrote:Show nested quote +On October 20 2011 06:27 McFeser wrote:
I hope I'm not talking out of my ass because I never followed BW and therefore do not have the same amount of respect for it but I think its slow decline should be a bitter sweet thing. I remember what Artosis said on SOTG, that he'd rather it die off immediately. A slow decline would be too painful for him. There is obviously a great level of complexity to BW, something that many BW fans cannot find elsewhere, but I think it is naive to think that SC2 will never reach that stage. Maybe not with the current balance settup but in later installments (HotS). And let's say worst case scenario happens and Kespa throws BW out and puts SC2 in. It won't happen like that - but even the worst case transisition possible would ultimately still be a good thing. Any organization that does not keep up with the times is doomed to fail.
THAT BEING SAID, I personally don't think this is going to inflict BW negatively at all. In fact it might mean people such as myself watch a little BW.
Edit: gave more context to Artosis quote Problem is SC2's supremacy internationally does not necessarily translate to the same in Korea. Sticking with BW might not be not 'keeping up with the times', especially given SC2's poor initial reception in that country.
And the reason why the initial reception wasn't so good was because Kespa influencing mass media to shit on SC2. Not the game's fault.
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I guess it makes sense that they add Starcraft 2 if they are going to add something at this point, since there isn't that many alternatives. SC2 is still better choice than dawn of war 2 IMO. But I don't know why they need to add a new game now. Maybe it's just easier to market to people since it has the same name and developer.
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I really don't want to watch SC2. As long as SC2 stays out of BW scene, it's fine. I really hope it's separate from the bw proleague.
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On October 20 2011 06:33 hellbound wrote:
Not really BW news, why it this here? It's common knowledge that these kind of threads in the BW section always result in silly flame wars.
Yes, I agree. Are the mods using this to bait out potential flamers?
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On October 20 2011 06:27 McFeser wrote:
I hope I'm not talking out of my ass because I never followed BW and therefore do not have the same amount of respect for it but I think its slow decline should be a bitter sweet thing. I remember what Artosis said on SOTG, that he'd rather it die off immediately. A slow decline would be too painful for him. There is obviously a great level of complexity to BW, something that many BW fans cannot find elsewhere, but I think it is naive to think that SC2 will never reach that stage. Maybe not with the current balance settup but in later installments (HotS). And let's say worst case scenario happens and Kespa throws BW out and puts SC2 in. It won't happen like that - but even the worst case transisition possible would ultimately still be a good thing. Any organization that does not keep up with the times is doomed to fail.
THAT BEING SAID, I personally don't think this is going to inflict BW negatively at all. In fact it might mean people such as myself watch a little BW.
Edit: gave more context to Artosis quote
As one of the more balanced posters I've seen on this topic, I salute you. Although I don't really want to think about bw dying 
Also, to be completely honest the main reason I cringe whenever I see any hint of bw/sc2 crossover is I'm afraid I'm going to rage at more "haw haw time to switch bw guys, sc2 is the future" type posts...if people (on both sides, actually) even attempted to talk above ignorance, or tried to figure out how to make both scenes coexist and grow peacefully, then maybe I wouldn't be so hard-set against seeing bw/sc2 news.
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On October 20 2011 06:33 Kybuar wrote:
I play only SC2 and I hope that we do not, for any reason, out shine or take the spot light from the BW players. This is their league, and they have been through enough drama for one game life time. If both games can be played together without one being more favored than the other than I am happy with this.
Since, I have only seen some Bisu, Flash, and jaedong games I think it would be funny if they played a showmatch against some of the sc2 players and they rofl stomped them.
Money speaks, not diehard fans in what happens to BW.
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On October 20 2011 06:36 Apollo_Shards wrote:Show nested quote +On October 20 2011 06:33 Kybuar wrote:
I play only SC2 and I hope that we do not, for any reason, out shine or take the spot light from the BW players. This is their league, and they have been through enough drama for one game life time. If both games can be played together without one being more favored than the other than I am happy with this.
Since, I have only seen some Bisu, Flash, and jaedong games I think it would be funny if they played a showmatch against some of the sc2 players and they rofl stomped them. Money speaks, not diehard fans in what happens to BW.
Yeah, but I can hope.
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The same players playing SC2 now will still be playing it if it transitions to Kespa, so the player level won't go up. It's not like being a Kespa player makes you 100x better automatically. The teams already have pro-houses, they already have team leagues, I can't see much would change, except the market for it would grow, and in a few years the next "Flash" is more likely to be playing sc2 rather than bw. but as has already been mentioned, there's not a lot of promising rookies coming through atm.
Would it be harder for korean players to play in world comps.. depends how they work a deal with gom.
would be harder for foreigners to go to korea.. again mostly on the deal with gom.. but does it matter?
MLG will be getting bigger next year.. NASL is still growing, IPL is growing.
Foreign SC2 is growing and growing, with or without Korea.
I can't see why BW and SC2 can't co-exist providing they don't do mixed tourneys, having both games gives a chance to grow both games audience, all the people new to sc2 will maybe get a chance to see broodwar, and all the korean broodwar fans can see sc2. both can grow, they don't have to compete.
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On October 20 2011 06:38 Kybuar wrote:Show nested quote +On October 20 2011 06:36 Apollo_Shards wrote:On October 20 2011 06:33 Kybuar wrote:
I play only SC2 and I hope that we do not, for any reason, out shine or take the spot light from the BW players. This is their league, and they have been through enough drama for one game life time. If both games can be played together without one being more favored than the other than I am happy with this.
Since, I have only seen some Bisu, Flash, and jaedong games I think it would be funny if they played a showmatch against some of the sc2 players and they rofl stomped them. Money speaks, not diehard fans in what happens to BW. Yeah, but I can hope.
It is a shame. I bought BW a few weeks ago to see why it was so popular and I really enjoyed it. A lot different than SC2. Only problem was the graphics :/
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On October 20 2011 06:34 JiPrime wrote:Show nested quote +On October 20 2011 06:31 Redmark wrote:On October 20 2011 06:27 McFeser wrote:
I hope I'm not talking out of my ass because I never followed BW and therefore do not have the same amount of respect for it but I think its slow decline should be a bitter sweet thing. I remember what Artosis said on SOTG, that he'd rather it die off immediately. A slow decline would be too painful for him. There is obviously a great level of complexity to BW, something that many BW fans cannot find elsewhere, but I think it is naive to think that SC2 will never reach that stage. Maybe not with the current balance settup but in later installments (HotS). And let's say worst case scenario happens and Kespa throws BW out and puts SC2 in. It won't happen like that - but even the worst case transisition possible would ultimately still be a good thing. Any organization that does not keep up with the times is doomed to fail.
THAT BEING SAID, I personally don't think this is going to inflict BW negatively at all. In fact it might mean people such as myself watch a little BW.
Edit: gave more context to Artosis quote Problem is SC2's supremacy internationally does not necessarily translate to the same in Korea. Sticking with BW might not be not 'keeping up with the times', especially given SC2's poor initial reception in that country. And the reason why the initial reception wasn't so good was because Kespa influencing mass media to shit on SC2. Not the game's fault.
Lmao.
You go from trying your damndest to flame this topic to hell and now you swap over to government conspiracies?!
It just keeps getting better and better.
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On October 20 2011 06:35 jellyfish wrote:Show nested quote +On October 20 2011 06:27 McFeser wrote:
I hope I'm not talking out of my ass because I never followed BW and therefore do not have the same amount of respect for it but I think its slow decline should be a bitter sweet thing. I remember what Artosis said on SOTG, that he'd rather it die off immediately. A slow decline would be too painful for him. There is obviously a great level of complexity to BW, something that many BW fans cannot find elsewhere, but I think it is naive to think that SC2 will never reach that stage. Maybe not with the current balance settup but in later installments (HotS). And let's say worst case scenario happens and Kespa throws BW out and puts SC2 in. It won't happen like that - but even the worst case transisition possible would ultimately still be a good thing. Any organization that does not keep up with the times is doomed to fail.
THAT BEING SAID, I personally don't think this is going to inflict BW negatively at all. In fact it might mean people such as myself watch a little BW.
Edit: gave more context to Artosis quote As one of the more balanced posters I've seen on this topic, I salute you. Although I don't really want to think about bw dying Also, to be completely honest the main reason I cringe whenever I see any hint of bw/sc2 crossover is I'm afraid I'm going to rage at more "haw haw time to switch bw guys, sc2 is the future" type posts...if people (on both sides, actually) even attempted to talk above ignorance, or tried to figure out how to make both scenes coexist and grow peacefully, then maybe I wouldn't be so hard-set against seeing bw/sc2 news.
I'm a hardcore BW fan, and I despise SC2 (even if I play it nearly every day).
In my honest opinion, BW has nowhere to go but down from here. I agree completely with what Artosis said. BW needs a quick death rather than a slow one. I really would rather pro BW just end rather than see its content slowly dwindle into nothing.
I hope to god BW doesn't go away, but I just don't see it going back up to its peak.
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I think kespa should stay away from sc2 altogether so that bw or sc2 somehow will overshadow one and another.
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I think it it definitely time for some SC2 team logos in signatures
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On October 20 2011 02:31 Waxangel wrote:
*KeSPA is the governing body of the Korean e-Sports, and is in charge of running the Proleague, Brood War's premiere team level competition that has yearly seasons similar to pro sports leagues around the world.
I'm sorry, I'm not sure I understand this correctly. By e-Sports you mean Brood War only right? And why do you write e-Sports then?
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On October 20 2011 06:39 TheGlassface wrote:Show nested quote +On October 20 2011 06:34 JiPrime wrote:On October 20 2011 06:31 Redmark wrote:On October 20 2011 06:27 McFeser wrote:
I hope I'm not talking out of my ass because I never followed BW and therefore do not have the same amount of respect for it but I think its slow decline should be a bitter sweet thing. I remember what Artosis said on SOTG, that he'd rather it die off immediately. A slow decline would be too painful for him. There is obviously a great level of complexity to BW, something that many BW fans cannot find elsewhere, but I think it is naive to think that SC2 will never reach that stage. Maybe not with the current balance settup but in later installments (HotS). And let's say worst case scenario happens and Kespa throws BW out and puts SC2 in. It won't happen like that - but even the worst case transisition possible would ultimately still be a good thing. Any organization that does not keep up with the times is doomed to fail.
THAT BEING SAID, I personally don't think this is going to inflict BW negatively at all. In fact it might mean people such as myself watch a little BW.
Edit: gave more context to Artosis quote Problem is SC2's supremacy internationally does not necessarily translate to the same in Korea. Sticking with BW might not be not 'keeping up with the times', especially given SC2's poor initial reception in that country. And the reason why the initial reception wasn't so good was because Kespa influencing mass media to shit on SC2. Not the game's fault. Lmao. You go from trying your damndest to flame this topic to hell and now you swap over to government conspiracies?! It just keeps getting better and better.
when I say mass media I mean DES and Fomos.
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On October 20 2011 06:32 gen.Sun wrote:Show nested quote +On October 20 2011 06:22 eviltomahawk wrote:Thinking about the overall term "Proleague"... I don't think SC2 will ever replace BW in Proleague, but perhaps rather be the beginning of more games being added under the "SPL" brand name. I think the "SCBW in Korea" headlines post had a nice article summary about it: Summary: Director Lee of Eclat Entertainment points out some key issues with the current eSports scene in Korea. In his experience dealing with the Korean Baseball League, arguably the most popular sports league in Korea right now, he experienced how a few broadcasting changes can turn around the viewership and popularity. He is encouraging popular portal sites such as Naver (www.naver.com) to invest in eSports as a partner. He identifies the global appeal of eSports is one of the core strengths that should be more widely utilized than right now. He recommends branding of SPL and that in order for that to be done successfully, more games need to achieve a balance in the scene [right now, it is heavily dependent on SCBW]. Continual investment, partnership, promotion, and dedication will bring only brighter future ahead. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=274673So perhaps this actually means that the term "Proleague" may gravitate away from being a purely BW team league to possibly becoming an umbrella term/brand for multiple leagues for multiple games, kinda like how MLG or IEM have different games in their leagues. So maybe the "Proleague" brand will be expanded to include a BW SPL, SC2 SPL, or perhaps SPLs for other games. Kart Rider SPL? I'm actually not too familiar with these specifics, so correct me if I'm wrong. No problem about all that, what I'm annoyed about is the possibility of more BW players playing SC2, which would be terrible.
If the BW players legitimately like playing SC2 more than BW, then they should have the right to switch to SC2 if that is what makes them most comfortable. Likewise, if any SC2 players no longer like playing SC2 and instead want to return to playing BW, then there should be fewer restrictions preventing them from switching back. I would much rather see the pros playing the game they enjoy more rather than brooding endlessly upon the consequences they would face for switching.
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EPT
