Blizzard to cease negotiations with KeSPA - Page 13

On April 25 2010 17:34 Milkis wrote:
Sounds like I was quite correct regarding Blizzard being unreasonable.

Here's a pretty good article that summarizes the terms that KeSPA and Blizzard was dealing with. It's quite old, but I imagine the situation hasn't changed at all.

http://www.thegames.co.kr/main/newsview.php?category=201&subcategory=1&id=142824

Key points

>>블리자드의 배틀넷 통합계정 약관 가운데 e스포츠와 관련해 쟁점이 되고 있는 조항은 제 7조와 14조의 내용들이다.

The articles in the Blizzard's BattleNet Terms of Agreement that has become a controversial point is the 7th and the 14th articles

>>블리자드는 7조에서 게임 내의 대화 내용, 유저의 캐릭터 프로필까지 블리자드의 소유로 규정하고 이와 관련해 블리자드의 동의 없이는 어떤 2차 저작물도 제작할 수 없다고 규정하고 있다.

Blizzard, in the 7th article, states that conversations within the game, to even user's characters profiles are the properties of Blizzard and without the consent of Blizzard, no one is allowed to create any secondary creation using them.

>>7조 1항에 따르면 유저들은 블리자드가 만든 경기 대회 규칙 또는 팬 정책으로 정한 경우를 제외하고는 게임 또는 서비스를 기반으로 한 어떠한 저작물도 만들지 못한다

The 7th article 1st term states that, excluding Blizzard's contest/tournament rules, or other fan policies, users are not allowed to use the game or the service to create any sort of product.

>>블리자드는 또 14조 4항을 통해 한국 e스포츠계와 협상해 온 중계권 문제도 정리해 놓았다. 이 조항에서 블리자드는 ‘방송, 전자 통신을 통한 일반 대중과의 통신, 전시, 수행, 컴퓨터 메모리로의 접속, 사용 및 이용할 권리’ 등을 자사가 소유한다고 밝히고 있다.

Blizzard also used the 14th article 4th term to state their opinion on publishing rights that they were discussing with KeSPA. This term states that Blizzard owns the right to publish and use anything related to SC2. (lazy translation near the end but it's 3:19 AM!)

>>이밖에 유저가 콘텐츠에 대해 가질 수 있는 모든 저작인격권을 포기할 것을 요구하고 있다. 이들 조항을 적용하면 ‘스타2’를 이용해 대회를 열거나 방송중계를 하는 것 모두 블리자드의 허락을 받지 않으면 불가능하게 된다.

Other than these terms, Blizzard also demands that users need to abandon any authorship of anything regarding the contents. If these terms are applied, then blizzard's permission will be needed to hold a contest/tournament or air the matches on TV regarding Starcraft 2

>>블리자드는 그동안 ‘스타2’를 이용해 게임대회를 개최하거나 방송을 중계할 경우 자사의 허락을 받아야 할 뿐만 아니라 저작권료를 지불해야 한다고 주장해 왔다.

Blizzard has been using Starcraft 2 to state that whenever a gaming tournament is held, or whenever matches are aired on TV, not only do users need to gain permission from blizzard, but also need to pay royalties to Blizzard

>>반면 한국 e스포츠계는 대회나 방송중계 등은 저작권의 범위에 속하지 않는다며 기존 ‘스타크래프트’와 같은 방식으로 대회나 중계를 할 수 있도록 해 줄 것을 요청해 왔다.

On the other hand, KeSPA stated that Tournaments and TV Airings do not fall under Blizzard's ownership and requested that Starcraft 2 could be held at a similar format as the original Starcraft.

>>최원제 한국e스포츠협회 사무총장은 “블리자드가 계속 지재권을 주장한다면 방송사나 e스포츠 구단들이 ‘스타2’에 등을 돌리게 될 것”이라며 “국내 e스포츠는 블리자드가 만든 것이 아니라 방송사와 구단들이 만들어 온 것이기 때문”이라고 지적했다.

Choi WonJae, the Secretary General (wtf) of KeSPA stated that "If Blizzard continues to push forth for ownership, then Broadcasting stations and ESports Leagues will turn their backs to SC2" and "Korea's Esports was not made by Blizzard but created by the Broadcasting Stations and the Leagues".

>>e스포츠업계 한 관계자는 “지금의 e스포츠 구단들은 이익을 남기기 위해서가 아니라 사회에 공헌하기 위해 구단을 운영하는 경우가 대부분”이라며 “만약 블리자드가 e스포츠를 이용해 ‘스타2’ 판매를 극대화 하려 한다면 구단들이 팀 운영을 포기하는 사태도 벌어질 수 있다”고 경계했다.

A personnel related to Esports stated that "Many of the Esports leagues do not operate to make a profit but to contribute to society" and that "If Blizzard uses ESports only to increase Starcraft 2 sales, there could be a tragedy where many supporting companies will give up on operating a team"

(As a note there has been many hints that KeSPA does not have that much money in a few of the articles I've read, so this seems to be accurate, especially since iirc SC games are free to go to)

>>-약관상에 언급된 저작권 부분과 ‘스타크래프트2’의 랜을 통한 멀티플레이 미지원을 조합하면 사실상 블리자드의 허락없이는 ‘스타크래프트2’를 통한 e스포츠대회를 개최할 수 없는 것인가.
▲블리자드코리아(이하 블리자드): 블리자드의 입장은 개발사로서 자사의 작품에 대한 저작권을 보호하겠다는 것이다. e스포츠에 대한 부분도 마찬가지다. ‘스타크래프트2’를 통해 토너먼트 대회를 진행하거나 방송 중계를 하기 위해서는 블리자드의 사전 동의나 협의가 필요하다. 동의나 협의 없이는 토너먼트 대회나 방송 중계를 할 수 없다.

(Basically a Korean Blizzard Representative states that Blizzard removed LAN to limit eSports so that they need to get Blizzard's permission.)

>>▲블리자드 : 블리자드는 모든 작품을 통합 계정을 통해 이용하도록 할 생각인 것은 맞다. ‘스타크래프트’ 역시 통합 계정을 이용해 배틀넷을 이용하게 될 것이다. 하지만 현재로서는 ‘스타크래프트’의 향후 계획에 대해 말할 수 있는 것이 없다. 기본 입장은 우리 작품에 대한 저작권을 보호하겠다는 것이다.

(Even Starcraft will be held over Blizzard's Battlenet (but, the employee then states that he cannot talk about the issue atm))

(AKA: KeSPA needs to agree to Blizzard's term regarding Starcraft in addition to Starcraft 2)
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So, any wonders why KeSPA is disagreeing with Blizzard? Blizzard attempting to centralize eSports is probably going to kill it faster than anything else ever -- just imagine playing Starcraft without ICCUP!

Simply put, I don't see any reasonable company agreeing to these terms, nor any Broadcasting Station. Good luck, Blizzard!

On April 25 2010 23:19 Senx wrote:
(...) they were the organization that pretty much created the pro scene and helped SC:BW live for many more years than it originally would have.

On April 25 2010 23 begin_of_the_skype_highlighting              25 2010 23      end_of_the_skype_highlighting begin_of_the_skype_highlighting              25 2010 23      end_of_the_skype_highlighting:39 hypercube wrote:
It's not clear to me that you actually need Blizzard's permission to organize BW tournaments. I guess it's for the courts to decide.

More importantly the interests of Teamliquid and the community in general are firmly aligned with KeSPA. Blizzard doesn't ask for licensing fees for community tournaments at the moment but there's no guarantee they won't in the future, especially if they plan to develop their own scene.

There are many reasons to hate KeSPA, from their own monopolistic tendencies to their mistreatment of progamers but that doesn't mean every time KeSPA loses we win.

On April 25 2010 12:30 J1.au wrote:
Blizzard and KeSPA are both greedy companies. However if Blizzard stops BW tournaments I will never buy another of their games again.

EDIT: Also, stop hating on just KeSPA. Without them Korean BW would be nothing. They're the ones who bring stability to the scene and make it attractive to corporate sponsors.

On April 25 2010 23:43 Shikyo wrote:
Teamliquid isn't televising their tournaments and making millions off advertising, it's quite different.

On April 25 2010 23:37 thedeadhaji wrote:
relating to the post above ^
iirc was there something that forbids players from forming an union?

If such a stipulation exists... guess who is to blame lol
(iirc players aren't allowed to have agents right lololol)

Blizzard and KeSPA are both greedy companies. However if Blizzard stops BW tournaments I will never buy another of their games again.

EDIT: Also, stop hating on just KeSPA. Without them Korean BW would be nothing. They're the ones who bring stability to the scene and make it attractive to corporate sponsors.

On April 25 2010 14:40 .risingdragoon wrote:
People still think kespa's some governing body like the fed or something, and that proteams can operate without them.

Kespa is SKT1, it's Samsung, it's OGN/MBC, it's made up of all these big corps that have sponsored and financed esports all these years and made it possible while Blizzard sold 3+ million copies of SC in S.K. That's why they feel they can't budge. If someone took the paper that you made and did wonderful things with it, wouldn't they lay claim to the creation?

Without these big corporate money and with just Blizz itself funding it SC2 scene would just be pitiful. It'd definitely roll back esports to small lan party tournies unless kespa can find another game for pros to play, or negotiate something that works for both sides.

I'm interested in the terms proposed by Blizzard, and Kespa's counter. But I guess that'd take a long time...

On April 25 2010 23:19 Senx wrote:
Hate KeSPA all you want for their terrible decisions and what not, but in the end, they were the organization that pretty much created the pro scene and helped SC:BW live for many more years than it originally would have.

With them out of the picture for SC2, i'm not exactly optimistic about any sort of pro scene for SC2.

One can still hope though, right?

On April 25 2010 17:08 StarcraftMan wrote:


ROFL, what tournaments? Name one SC2 tournament that pays $40K for first place (nevermind the prize money for 2nd, 3rd place, etc) and has thousands of live fans watching in a huge auditorium with significant media coverage and sponsors.

THERE ARE NONE.

On April 25 2010 23:49 neVern wrote:So, companies that seek profits are greedy?
Where does that logic come from?

I thought companies sole purpose was to maximize profits. I guess everything I have learned in my business classes are dead wrong. Can you right a textbook or something illustrating the truth so you can inform people in such tough economic times around the globe?

On April 25 2010 23:43 [X]Ken_D wrote:


I LOLed. How naive and misguided. Korean BW league existed long before KeSPA. Ask anyone here who has been in the scene long enough!

On April 26 2010 00:04 TheTuna wrote:


It's still in beta...

On April 26 2010 00:31 Polis wrote:


Companies belong to people, so they purpose depend on what those people want. You believe that companies are separate beings with they own purpose? How would you define greed then? You can't be greedy when you own a company? All companies are greedy>they aren't greedy becouse all companies are like that, nice circulated logic sir.

On April 26 2010 00:38 J1.au wrote:

But if there had been no KeSPA would Korean BW have continued this long? I doubt it.