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Poll: What should be the punishment for these gamers?Confiscate their pro gaming license (67) 44% Sentence them to jail (33) 22% Make them dance naked in a Starleague final (28) 18% Demand a public statement and apology (8) 5% Hang them to death (6) 4% Take away all their money (5) 3% Do nothing (3) 2% Others (please include) (2) 1% 152 total votes Your vote: What should be the punishment for these gamers? (Vote): Sentence them to jail
(Vote): Hang them to death
(Vote): Confiscate their pro gaming license
(Vote): Take away all their money
(Vote): Make them dance naked in a Starleague final
(Vote): Demand a public statement and apology
(Vote): Do nothing
(Vote): Others (please include)
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I suppose Idra can in no way confirm of any investigations of players in the CJ house
Too bad; would be interesting to have an inside perspective.
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On April 13 2010 01:06 Antisocialmunky wrote:Show nested quote +On April 13 2010 01:03 Maynard wrote:On April 13 2010 00:57 Azarkon wrote:
Well, this certainly made me a lot less interested in Korean SC. I guess it's foreigner SC/SC2 for me, now, though I have no doubt it'll be tainted at some point in the future as well. It does create an interesting dilemma for e-sports in general, where tourney money is low enough that players can be easily tempted into illegal gambling, where the profit margin is potentially so much higher. Non-Koreans are also notorious for cheating. Every event has had rampant cheating. This will not end. Cheaters are not hurt in any long term fashion. Look at everyones acceptance of this Testie guy. I can tell you back in the day this guy would even cheat and maphack in fun custom games. Cheating was so ingrained in his soul. That reminds me of that really crappy Azerbijani player that race switched Jaedong at WCG and lost to a all-in zerglin rush.
All-in? I thought it was just 6 lings that destroyed his main lol.
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did anyone actually read the linked articles?
being unable to understand korean i still haven't seen any evidence to suggest that any of this is true
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On April 13 2010 00:44 gngfn wrote:Show nested quote +On April 13 2010 00:18 cognizantfire wrote:
It's quite hard to visualize Jaedong being involved in the scam though, every time he loses a game he looks absolutely disappointed and pissed at himself. He kind of loves winning too much...
Let's just hope the list "under investigation" is just a check on everyone, since according to Korean sites the list is only a small part of the whole, so I'm assuming they are checking on most matches to make sure. I agree with you wholeheartedly that from what we know of Jaedong's personality as it comes through in interviews and facial expressions and stuff, he wouldn't do something like this. But consider it objectively for a moment. Jaedong is possibly the most underpaid progamer at about $160k/yr, supposedly around half of what Bisu makes, and due to KeSPA's ridiculous free agency rules, which require any team that acquires an expensive player to compensate his original team at 2x his original salary, not a single team bid on Jaedong when he declared free agency last year. He ended up staying with OZ with no change in his salary. Meanwhile Jaedong is talking about how he wants to retire at some point and go to college, and there are shady figures offering five-figure sums for him to drop games and/or betting sites where he can bet against himself and make tons by losing. If you're not making the money you deserve to begin with, your own team is screwing you over knowing full well that KeSPA's rules mean there's nothing you can do about it, and you know that as soon as your skills decline you'll be left with no earning potential whatsoever, wouldn't it make sense looking to the future to cash out Savior-style and then quit? What does he owe Hwaseung, which in addition to the stinginess has shown an inability to raise new talent (Perfectman lol) and an unwillingness to acquire good players from other teams to help Jaedong out? They even gave ForGG away to KT right at the peak of his career and are rumored to have basically forced out Anytime, the only other good players on the team! I'm not trying to argue that Jaedong was involved. I don't think he would do it. I guess the point I'm trying to make here is that the existence of such strong incentives for arguably Starcraft's best player for a multi-year period to cheat proves above all else that the pro Starcraft world is incredibly exploitative. If the argument for Jaedong to participate is so persuasive, it's not even remotely shocking that someone like Upmagic would actually go for it.
This post needs more attention.
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On April 13 2010 01:21 3clipse wrote:Show nested quote +On April 13 2010 01:12 Maynard wrote:On April 13 2010 01:07 Azarkon wrote:On April 13 2010 01:03 Maynard wrote:On April 13 2010 00:57 Azarkon wrote:
Well, this certainly made me a lot less interested in Korean SC. I guess it's foreigner SC/SC2 for me, now, though I have no doubt it'll be tainted at some point in the future as well. It does create an interesting dilemma for e-sports in general, where tourney money is low enough that players can be easily tempted into illegal gambling, where the profit margin is potentially so much higher. Non-Koreans are also notorious for cheating. Every event has had rampant cheating. This will not end. Cheaters are not hurt in any long term fashion. Look at everyones acceptance of this Testie guy. I can tell you back in the day this guy would even cheat and maphack in fun custom games. Cheating was so ingrained in his soul. The chances of there being cheating in small tournaments are probably a lot lower. You'd be surprised at the people i know with close to 99.999% certainty cheated. You'd be pretty shocked. I won't say shit tho so don't ask. Lets just say that i wouldn't really trust any gaming tournament. Why protect them? Why even bring it up other than to increase pessimism in the legitimacy of competitive bw and show off your "inside knowledge"?
Why bring up things done a long time ago and call people out? I don't wanna fuck ppl over. Why bring it up? You guys are pretty naive and its annoying. I feel compelled to enlighten and advise in a way.
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United States3824 Posts
On April 12 2010 16:06 29 fps wrote:Show nested quote +On April 12 2010 16:04 MorningMusume11 wrote:On April 12 2010 16:02 LosingID8 wrote:
what i'm wondering is that kespa was clearly aware of these illegal betting sites and yet did not take action until now?
seems kind of weird... I actually think KeSPA had a significant part to do with this, I mean come on now, dq'ing GoRush for some random letter typed in game? KeSPA has the stupid "no tolerance" policy similar to what some schools have. OMG 0.5% alcohol? SUSPENSION!
Not to quote something at the beginning of a thread or anything but .5 is like the world record for BAC. Most people die at .25
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Wow. Well, this has pretty much officially killed pro-gaming in broodwar for me. My interest has been declining lately and now I have no interest in watching pro games if the players are throwing games. Oh well, it's been a good run...
Fuck the cheaters!
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I still love watching the games. This hasn't killed anything for me 
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On April 13 2010 01:22 IdrA wrote:Show nested quote +On April 13 2010 01:21 3clipse wrote:On April 13 2010 01:12 Maynard wrote:On April 13 2010 01:07 Azarkon wrote:On April 13 2010 01:03 Maynard wrote:On April 13 2010 00:57 Azarkon wrote:
Well, this certainly made me a lot less interested in Korean SC. I guess it's foreigner SC/SC2 for me, now, though I have no doubt it'll be tainted at some point in the future as well. It does create an interesting dilemma for e-sports in general, where tourney money is low enough that players can be easily tempted into illegal gambling, where the profit margin is potentially so much higher. Non-Koreans are also notorious for cheating. Every event has had rampant cheating. This will not end. Cheaters are not hurt in any long term fashion. Look at everyones acceptance of this Testie guy. I can tell you back in the day this guy would even cheat and maphack in fun custom games. Cheating was so ingrained in his soul. The chances of there being cheating in small tournaments are probably a lot lower. You'd be surprised at the people i know with close to 99.999% certainty cheated. You'd be pretty shocked. I won't say shit tho so don't ask. Lets just say that i wouldn't really trust any gaming tournament. Why protect them? Why even bring it up other than to increase pessimism in the legitimacy of competitive bw and show off your "inside knowledge"? because hes an attention whoring douchebag with a superiority complex. dont feed him.
You appeared on my radar when someone messaged me 2 years ago saying "omg theres some dude cleaning toilets in korea for pro gaming teams." You stayed on there when you said former pro gamers were failures and how they failed because they focused on having fun and exploring korea and didn't play starcraft enough. You defined everyones failure because they didn't win tournaments and didnt practice hard. The only reason you should be gaming in korea is for fun man.
Maybe you see me as having a superiority complex but it's just because you're a naive misguided kid. You're terribly misguided and smug and arrogant in your misguided ways. I've seen others speak about you and to you about how you're fucking everything up. Rekrul for one. Its not because we hate its because we've been there and done that and can see how you're fucking things up so horribly bad.
You also say things like discounting grrrs success because he had practice partners and you don't. Grrr was fuckin good thats why he won. Saying shit like that is gonna rub people the wrong way because you're seriously so off on your assessment of the situation. You know what dude? Its so easy to get korean players to want to be your buddy. Every single korean guy would wanna play w/ you if you weren't such a prick. EVery single Korean gamer was my friend and wanted to hang out, game, and go out. Chill out and enjoy shit more.
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On April 13 2010 01:34 cgrinker wrote:Show nested quote +On April 12 2010 16:06 29 fps wrote:On April 12 2010 16:04 MorningMusume11 wrote:On April 12 2010 16:02 LosingID8 wrote:
what i'm wondering is that kespa was clearly aware of these illegal betting sites and yet did not take action until now?
seems kind of weird... I actually think KeSPA had a significant part to do with this, I mean come on now, dq'ing GoRush for some random letter typed in game? KeSPA has the stupid "no tolerance" policy similar to what some schools have. OMG 0.5% alcohol? SUSPENSION! Not to quote something at the beginning of a thread or anything but .5 is like the world record for BAC. Most people die at .25
0.5% alcohol is 0.005 BAC
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they should make a "jail" team after this. jaedoooong
good thing i quit like 8years ago. what a wasteful end to such a beautiful game/esport.
srsly bw was really the purest form of strategy and fun ive ever experienced/played
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On April 13 2010 01:34 Maynard wrote:Show nested quote +On April 13 2010 01:21 3clipse wrote:On April 13 2010 01:12 Maynard wrote:On April 13 2010 01:07 Azarkon wrote:On April 13 2010 01:03 Maynard wrote:On April 13 2010 00:57 Azarkon wrote:
Well, this certainly made me a lot less interested in Korean SC. I guess it's foreigner SC/SC2 for me, now, though I have no doubt it'll be tainted at some point in the future as well. It does create an interesting dilemma for e-sports in general, where tourney money is low enough that players can be easily tempted into illegal gambling, where the profit margin is potentially so much higher. Non-Koreans are also notorious for cheating. Every event has had rampant cheating. This will not end. Cheaters are not hurt in any long term fashion. Look at everyones acceptance of this Testie guy. I can tell you back in the day this guy would even cheat and maphack in fun custom games. Cheating was so ingrained in his soul. The chances of there being cheating in small tournaments are probably a lot lower. You'd be surprised at the people i know with close to 99.999% certainty cheated. You'd be pretty shocked. I won't say shit tho so don't ask. Lets just say that i wouldn't really trust any gaming tournament. Why protect them? Why even bring it up other than to increase pessimism in the legitimacy of competitive bw and show off your "inside knowledge"? Why bring up things done a long time ago and call people out? I don't wanna fuck ppl over. Why bring it up? You guys are pretty naive and its annoying. I feel compelled to enlighten and advise in a way.
This is no valid argument, long time ago or yesterday don't change anything. Truth is always better than illusion, consequences mean nothing so don't be a pussy you're the one that bring that up at the first place, spit it out.
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Just in case I missed something: There's still no solid evidence about anyone's involvement right?
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wow this thread really took off overnight lol
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maynard knows what hes talking about. hes not protecting anyone lol. why so serious?
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On April 13 2010 01:46 Mooncat wrote:
Just in case I missed something: There's still no solid evidence about anyone's involvement right?
nothing is for certain atm i think.but many people are convinced Savior is heavily involved in this.
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On April 13 2010 01:40 Maynard wrote:Show nested quote +On April 13 2010 01:22 IdrA wrote:On April 13 2010 01:21 3clipse wrote:On April 13 2010 01:12 Maynard wrote:On April 13 2010 01:07 Azarkon wrote:On April 13 2010 01:03 Maynard wrote:On April 13 2010 00:57 Azarkon wrote:
Well, this certainly made me a lot less interested in Korean SC. I guess it's foreigner SC/SC2 for me, now, though I have no doubt it'll be tainted at some point in the future as well. It does create an interesting dilemma for e-sports in general, where tourney money is low enough that players can be easily tempted into illegal gambling, where the profit margin is potentially so much higher. Non-Koreans are also notorious for cheating. Every event has had rampant cheating. This will not end. Cheaters are not hurt in any long term fashion. Look at everyones acceptance of this Testie guy. I can tell you back in the day this guy would even cheat and maphack in fun custom games. Cheating was so ingrained in his soul. The chances of there being cheating in small tournaments are probably a lot lower. You'd be surprised at the people i know with close to 99.999% certainty cheated. You'd be pretty shocked. I won't say shit tho so don't ask. Lets just say that i wouldn't really trust any gaming tournament. Why protect them? Why even bring it up other than to increase pessimism in the legitimacy of competitive bw and show off your "inside knowledge"? because hes an attention whoring douchebag with a superiority complex. dont feed him. You appeared on my radar when someone messaged me 2 years ago saying "omg theres some dude cleaning toilets in korea for pro gaming teams." You stayed on there when you said former pro gamers were failures and how they failed because they focused on having fun and exploring korea and didn't play starcraft enough. You defined everyones failure because they didn't win tournaments and didnt practice hard. The only reason you should be gaming in korea is for fun man. Maybe you see me as having a superiority complex but it's just because you're a naive misguided kid. You're terribly misguided and smug and arrogant in your misguided ways. I've seen others speak about you and to you about how you're fucking everything up. Rekrul for one. Its not because we hate its because we've been there and done that and can see how you're fucking things up so horribly bad. You also say things like discounting grrrs success because he had practice partners and you don't. Grrr was fuckin good thats why he won. Saying shit like that is gonna rub people the wrong way because you're seriously so off on your assessment of the situation. You know what dude? Its so easy to get korean players to want to be your buddy. Every single korean guy would wanna play w/ you if you weren't such a prick. EVery single Korean gamer was my friend and wanted to hang out, game, and go out. Chill out and enjoy shit more.
um
you're flat out making shit up, ive never said anything bad about grrr and i dont remember any comments about past foreigners "failure" beyond explaining why i think ive stayed here longer than most.
you had your own motives for going to korea, i have mine. im not here for an experience or an adventure or whatever, im here to play a game as well as i can. if you just wanted to have fun and you did, then you succeeded at that, but you still didnt succeed at gaming.
the superiority complex part was mostly due to all your posts on the sc2 forum recently "lolol i dont play this game but you nerds are terrible." basically you're just a faggot in general.
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Idra posting has reminded me, wonder what Artosis' / Tasteless' thoughts are on this? I'd imagine that Idra isn't allowed to speak on this, but Artosis especially is surely in a good position to get some extra info?
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konadora
Singapore66366 Posts
On April 13 2010 01:34 Maynard wrote:Show nested quote +On April 13 2010 01:21 3clipse wrote:On April 13 2010 01:12 Maynard wrote:On April 13 2010 01:07 Azarkon wrote:On April 13 2010 01:03 Maynard wrote:On April 13 2010 00:57 Azarkon wrote:
Well, this certainly made me a lot less interested in Korean SC. I guess it's foreigner SC/SC2 for me, now, though I have no doubt it'll be tainted at some point in the future as well. It does create an interesting dilemma for e-sports in general, where tourney money is low enough that players can be easily tempted into illegal gambling, where the profit margin is potentially so much higher. Non-Koreans are also notorious for cheating. Every event has had rampant cheating. This will not end. Cheaters are not hurt in any long term fashion. Look at everyones acceptance of this Testie guy. I can tell you back in the day this guy would even cheat and maphack in fun custom games. Cheating was so ingrained in his soul. The chances of there being cheating in small tournaments are probably a lot lower. You'd be surprised at the people i know with close to 99.999% certainty cheated. You'd be pretty shocked. I won't say shit tho so don't ask. Lets just say that i wouldn't really trust any gaming tournament. Why protect them? Why even bring it up other than to increase pessimism in the legitimacy of competitive bw and show off your "inside knowledge"? Why bring up things done a long time ago and call people out? I don't wanna fuck ppl over. Why bring it up? You guys are pretty naive and its annoying. I feel compelled to enlighten and advise in a way.
Then don't post.
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EPT
