• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 09:34
CEST 15:34
KST 22:34
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL22] Ro8 Preview: In A Tizzy0[ASL22] Ro16 Preview: Holy Diver5[ASL22] Ro16 Preview: Rough Waters10[ASL22] Ro24 Preview: Siren's Call8[ASL22] Ro24 Preview: Summer's End9
Community News
Weekly Cups (Sep 7-12): SHIN, ByuN, MaxPax double down1StarCraft open world shooter announced at BlizzCon100Weekly Cups (Aug 30-Sep 7): herO thrives amid growing schism10Official StarCraft website teases new content ahead of BlizzCon?179Stellar Fest TWO the Moon (Dec 16-20)9
StarCraft 2
General
Balance hotfix patch 5.0.16b (July 16) SC4ALL II: StarCraft 2 Player Announcement 8/8 The Death of Cheese: From a Professional Cheeser Yamato Cup Series StarCraft open world shooter announced at BlizzCon
Tourneys
2026 GSTL Announcement Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament RSL Revival: Season 6 - Qualifiers and Main Event RSL goes to London! 2026 Offline Finals Nov 21-22 SC2 AI Tournament 2026 Fall
Strategy
[H] ZvP Mid-Late Game: Stalkers Collossi HT
Custom Maps
Nexus Wars 2021 GUIDE [M] (2) Industrial Park
External Content
The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 543 Enhanced Defenses Mutation # 542 The Ascended Mutation # 541 Binary Choice
Brood War
General
Bot on ladder [ASL22] Ro8 Preview: In A Tizzy BW General Discussion an AI researcher's take on the ladder bot Working 1v1, 2v2, 3v3 Ladder
Tourneys
[ASL22] Ro16 Group D [ASL22] Ro16 Group B [BSL23] SM: Ret vs TerrOr -> DragOn vs StRyKeR [Megathread] Daily Proleagues
Strategy
Cliff Jump Revisited (1 in a 1000 strategy) Replay Review Process - What do you do? Simple Questions, Simple Answers Odyssey Mineral Stack Saturation
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread Warcraft III: The Frozen Throne Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread EVE Corporation Diablo IV
Dota 2
Dota 2 Champions League Season 3 Begins April 25! Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
[TL LoL EUW IHs] Teemo shall perish
Heroes of the Storm
Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread All you football fans (soccer)! Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Canadian Politics Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
MarineLorD Fan Club The Creator Fan Club The ShoWTimE Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece Diablo Animated Series on Netflix
Sports
Football (Soccer) Thread TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 MLB/Baseball 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
Recent Gifted Posts
Blogs
Gaming Intensity, Problemati…
TrAiDoS
38 yo Retired SWE loo…
PurE)Rabbit-SF
Can Bots Beat Pros?? Starcr…
namkraft
[meme] I finally understa…
LUCKY_NOOB
Regacy Esports:Our Goa…
regacyesports
Dreaming of BW patches (mod…
c3rberUs
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 7808 users

10/15 Rush? [Q's]

Blogs > Salv
Post a Reply
1 2 Next All
Salv
Profile Blog Joined December 2007
Canada3083 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-01-25 19:13:10
January 25 2009 18:45 GMT
#1
So I was watching Skyhigh vs Bisu on Colosseum II (http://www.gomtv.net/videos/549) and Tasteless said that Bisu was doing the 10/15 rush. He didn't really give an explanation of what the build order was, he just said you cut three or four probes, and make range and dragoons very early to try to bust down the Terran wall. I've heard Artosis also talking about this build too (I think it's when NonY was in Courage?).

So a couple questions, if anyone knows.

  • Did Artosis, NonY & Tasteless invent this build?
  • Does anyone know the exact build order or timing?


Thanks.

**
BottleAbuser
Profile Blog Joined December 2007
Korea (South)1888 Posts
January 25 2009 18:47 GMT
#2
I actually made this build back in '94. No, I have no clue. I just wanted to say something.

Oh, and someone pls tell me how these fuckers walk up to my base with 5 goons when my first tank is just arriving.
Compilers are like boyfriends, you miss a period and they go crazy on you.
TonyL2
Profile Blog Joined August 2007
England1953 Posts
January 25 2009 18:48 GMT
#3
There was a whole thread on this, although mainly about it on Medusa

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=84900
freelander
Profile Blog Joined December 2004
Hungary4707 Posts
January 25 2009 18:54 GMT
#4
10 gateway
12 gas
13 core
15 another gateway
goon range asap
SKIP PROBES
now you are 15/17 so you skip two probes at least to let your first dragoon come out sooner
so dragoon, 17/17
place a pylon
when pylon is ready, you can afford two dragoons immediately

this build grants you 3 dragoons very fast.
And all is illuminated.
mogg
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
59 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-01-25 19:01:58
January 25 2009 18:57 GMT
#5
Gateway
Gas
Cybercore
Cut probes at 15 population
get a gateway at 15 population once you get 150 minerals
make a goon once core finishes
goon range
pylon
your gateway will finish when your pylon and first goon do
naonao
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
United States847 Posts
January 25 2009 18:57 GMT
#6
I do
10 gate
11/12 gas
13 core(as gate finishes)
15 gate/cut probes
pylon
range
goon
start probes again and pump goons

works well for me.
Salv
Profile Blog Joined December 2007
Canada3083 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-01-25 19:04:53
January 25 2009 19:01 GMT
#7
Thanks for the responses! I tried 10/15 in the search, but it won't let you search that.

On January 26 2009 03:54 freelander wrote:
10 gateway
12 gas
13 core
15 another gateway
goon range asap
SKIP PROBES
now you are 15/17 so you skip two probes at least to let your first dragoon come out sooner
so dragoon, 17/17
place a pylon
when pylon is ready, you can afford two dragoons immediately

this build grants you 3 dragoons very fast.


When do you scout, in this bo?
freelander
Profile Blog Joined December 2004
Hungary4707 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-01-25 19:28:41
January 25 2009 19:19 GMT
#8
On January 26 2009 04:01 Salv wrote:
Thanks for the responses! I tried 10/15 in the search, but it won't let you search that.

Show nested quote +
On January 26 2009 03:54 freelander wrote:
10 gateway
12 gas
13 core
15 another gateway
goon range asap
SKIP PROBES
now you are 15/17 so you skip two probes at least to let your first dragoon come out sooner
so dragoon, 17/17
place a pylon
when pylon is ready, you can afford two dragoons immediately

this build grants you 3 dragoons very fast.


When do you scout, in this bo?


well, it's up to you to decide
later than usual for sure

basically you just have to make sure you send your dragoons to the right base immediately, I think on a 3 player map you can get away with sending the builder of the second gateway.

Also the answer for your question in the op:
this is an old build, noone knows who started doing it. Certainly not those guys.

Also, the follow ups for the build:
I think if you want to continue the hardcore dragoon producing after the first three, you have to skip some more probes. Because after your 3 goons, you'll be at 21/15. You can build your next goons and a pylon if you skip your probes, so you'll be at 25/25 and a pylon building. If you build only one goon instead of two, you don't have to skip the worker production.
And all is illuminated.
Pengu1n
Profile Blog Joined October 2004
United States552 Posts
January 25 2009 19:25 GMT
#9
I actually do a similiar build like this in pvp on maps like tau cross or longinus. It gives 3 dragoons very fast and with good micro you can do a lot of damage especially if they make a zeal or 2 first.
Racenilatr
Profile Blog Joined August 2008
United States2756 Posts
January 25 2009 19:27 GMT
#10
I would say scout after gateway because you only need to find the Terran's position. You don't really need anything else
NonY
Profile Blog Joined June 2007
8751 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-01-25 19:28:03
January 25 2009 19:27 GMT
#11
this build is reaaaaaaalllly old. i take no credit for inventing it at all. but it's still good on some maps. but it's the micro that really makes it happen
"Fucking up is part of it. If you can't fail, you have to always win. And I don't think you can always win." Elliott Smith ---------- Yet no sudden rage darkened his face, and his eyes were calm as they studied her. Then he smiled. 'Witness.'
Pholon
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
Netherlands6142 Posts
January 25 2009 19:30 GMT
#12
My P mate used this a lot vs me. I one time countered by hopping temples and getting a bunker on his cliff (ref. Flash vs Bisu some time ago) and now he claims he has time to scout up there (twice! - timing depending on whether I hop the correct temple first) while not slowing down the build. Didn't seem logical to me since it sounds like the build has a meticulous timing to it (on the other hand, it is Protoss so why not) but meh

Also, since he became predictable doing this most of the time I just cut marines (mkaing one or zero) and tank gets out soon enough. The build's worse on Colloseum when he can put the goons on the ramp.
Moderator@TLPholon // "I need a third hand to facepalm right now"
RaGe
Profile Blog Joined July 2004
Belgium9950 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-01-25 19:41:46
January 25 2009 19:41 GMT
#13
I think anytime popularized this build back on the flat map days. Supercommon on longinus

edit: hmm wait this build was used on neo guillotine too if I remember correctly. Dunno who popularized it then
Moderatorsometimes I get intimidated by the size of my right testicle
TT1
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
Canada10072 Posts
January 25 2009 19:47 GMT
#14
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=84900
ab = tl(i) + tl(pc), the grand answer to every tl.net debate
ahole-surprise
Profile Joined August 2007
United States813 Posts
January 25 2009 20:08 GMT
#15
What is an optimal build for Terran on flat maps that will take care of this build? Perhaps 11/11 rax/gas?
Pulp can move, baby!
Malongo
Profile Blog Joined November 2005
Chile3479 Posts
January 25 2009 20:12 GMT
#16
Sometime ago i saw a rep of Nal_ra vs Iris on Longinus, blizzcon07 if my mind is right, but i cant find it anymore (Nal_ra used this BO, Iris countered with a wall/fake expo + proxy fact/mines). Please help me find it.
Help me! im still improving my English. An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind. M. G.
ShaLLoW[baY]
Profile Blog Joined January 2007
Canada12499 Posts
January 25 2009 20:17 GMT
#17
On January 26 2009 05:12 malongo wrote:
Sometime ago i saw a rep of Nal_ra vs Iris on Longinus, blizzcon07 if my mind is right, but i cant find it anymore (Nal_ra used this BO, Iris countered with a wall/fake expo + proxy fact/mines). Please help me find it.



I don't have the rep but I do have the VOD link!
ALEXISONFIRE ARE FUCKING BACK (sAviOr for life)
Psyonic_Reaver
Profile Blog Joined June 2007
United States4342 Posts
January 25 2009 20:26 GMT
#18
I like doing 10/15 into DT. Works great, all the goons keeps the terran busy with macroing troops and then BAM. DT are taking him out.

But if you can't finish the T off with your goons or your DT, Terran will get ahead in econ and run you over later because you get your robo super late.
So wait? I'm bad? =(
LaLuSh
Profile Blog Joined April 2003
Sweden2358 Posts
January 25 2009 20:27 GMT
#19
Dreiven also used it every PvT game on longinus in TSL.
Malongo
Profile Blog Joined November 2005
Chile3479 Posts
January 25 2009 20:28 GMT
#20
thank you ShaLLoW[baY].
Help me! im still improving my English. An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind. M. G.
1 2 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 1h 26m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
RotterdaM 477
SHIN 154
ProTech136
Rogue 57
Cure 49
MindelVK 37
Rex 30
StarCraft: Brood War
Shuttle 1082
BeSt 833
Snow 343
Soulkey 282
actioN 261
firebathero 223
Last 220
Hyun 127
PianO 76
Mong 69
[ Show more ]
ToSsGirL 53
Aegong 48
910 48
Hm[arnc] 37
NaDa 36
Sexy 35
Sharp 30
soO 23
yabsab 19
scan(afreeca) 16
HiyA 10
Noble 9
zelot 9
JulyZerg 7
Icarus 5
Dota 2
Gorgc6041
qojqva1343
Dendi1003
febbydoto20
Counter-Strike
byalli1286
x6flipin658
Heroes of the Storm
crisheroes347
Trikslyr72
Other Games
singsing1881
B2W.Neo553
DeMusliM211
XaKoH 209
Hui .203
Railgan23
Chillindude9
Organizations
Dota 2
PGL Dota 2 - Main Stream8858
PGL Dota 2 - Secondary Stream2839
StarCraft 2
IntoTheiNu 1198
Other Games
gamesdonequick832
StarCraft 2
TaKeTV 225
WardiTV0
[ Show 11 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Berry_CruncH216
• CranKy Ducklings SOOP132
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• Migwel
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Other Games
• WagamamaTV252
Upcoming Events
Shopify Rebellion Sundays
1h 26m
Spirit vs Mixu
BSL
5h 26m
Ret vs TerrOr
DragOn vs StRyKeR
Replay Cast
10h 26m
Afreeca Starleague
20h 26m
Shine vs Rush
WardiTV Weekly
21h 26m
Monday Night Weeklies
1d 2h
Sparkling Tuna Cup
1d 20h
Afreeca Starleague
1d 20h
Light vs EffOrt
PiGosaur Cup
2 days
Kung Fu Cup
2 days
[ Show More ]
The PondCast
3 days
Replay Cast
4 days
Korean StarCraft League
5 days
CranKy Ducklings
5 days
GSL
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

K-JUNGMAN
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
Big Dog Cup 2026 Div 1

Ongoing

ASL Season 22
Super Anchor Qualifying S3
CSL 2026 AUTUMN (S22)
Acropolis #5
Acropolis #5 - GSA
Calamity Invitational
Logitech G Play Connect 2026
SL StarSeries Fall 2026
FISSURE Playground #3
BLAST Open Fall 2026
Esports World Cup 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual
Stake Ranked Episode 3
XSE Pro League 2026

Upcoming

Acropolis #5 - GSB
Acropolis #5 - GSC
SC4ALL II: Brood War
HSC XXX
Stellar Fest 2: Lunar Cup
SC4ALL II: StarCraft II
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
RSL Offline Finals
Copium Cup
PGL Major Singapore 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 6
BLAST Rivals Fall 2026
IEM Beijing 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 5
PGL Masters Bucharest 2026
1win Private Club #2
Thunderpick World Champ. '26
ESL Pro League Season 24
Stake Ranked Episode 4
1win Private Club #1
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.