What would be the best follow up strategy to a failed 1 gate reaver in pvt. Failed meaning your reaver died doing minimal to no damage. Lately i have been playing safe and staying on 2 base since the terran is more then likely going to be doing some sort of 5/6 fact 110 supply push which would rape you if you got your 3rd expo at it's normal time. But I find if the terran instead take's his 3rd expo fast then its extremely hard to beat if you had gone 2 base.

Before my last 50/60 (**EDIT** Not to sound noob i just mean lately ive been trying to go 2 base, as a way to be safe) PvT's I usually went a bit low econ to be able to get my 3rd expo faster, and then i will be able to macro enough to stop the 5/6 110 push MOST of the time.

After doing a 1 gate reaver pvt and losing it doing minimal damage, what is the best thing to follow up with?

Raithed

China7078 Posts

August 10 2008 02:10 GMT

get an expo up, at least thats what id do.

Shauni

4077 Posts

August 10 2008 02:32 GMT

double expand (one to island is fine), deny scouting and get relatively early speedlots. Try to make him siege as much as possible on his way to your base and then make a good surround attack with lots + goon. But to do this you need to cut probes and make 7-8 pretty early gates.
A safer variant is staying two base - and try to work something out with your gas surplus - stormdrops or dts or early arbiter can bring you back into the game. He usually won't move out too early if you're staying two base since you should be able to rape his army if he isn't careful and siege up defensively. But in this case, remember that you have to get your third sooner or later. You still need to get it up before he gets his third or you will only be even more behind at this point.

But this is all advice to beat someone lesser than you.
On my level (I'm at B ranks), if I die to a turret with an early reavershuttle and my opponent was going 1 fac siege exp I'm dead against 99% of the terrans. There is just no coming back against a competent terran unless you try to very very slowly catch up to him by playing safe with minimal risks and get him in lategame. So the simple advice is always best: don't lose it.

nAi.PrOtOsS

Canada784 Posts

August 10 2008 02:44 GMT

Well most times i don't lost it, but vs good terrans once they get a hint that you could be going reaver, then they just turret up, lay some mines and siege a tank up near there min line. Usually, i just try to pick off some supply deapot's or scv's building factories, and mostly just try to annoy him. But sometimes you do lose your reaver, and others you do almost no damage. It's a pretty risky stratagy overall since losing the reaver put's you at a huuuggee disadvantage, and the terran can just do 2 fact which counter's 1 gate reaver pretty well.

Shauni

4077 Posts

August 10 2008 03:22 GMT

Well, the reaver(s) helps alot if he tries to push out early so doing no damage and keeping it alive is usually better than killing a few scvs yet shuttle dies. If you keep it alive, it's a lot easier to fend off his timing push when you double expo. A reaver and two zealots makes a huge difference against sieged tanks, especially if they are clumped together. I usually just pick off a tank or so when I harass with 1gate reaver and leave the rest to turret investment.

RoC)Ninjah

United States238 Posts

August 10 2008 03:50 GMT

From my experience, it's very map dependant. If you lose the reaver early on, it's a very big blow, so you need something to get back in the game, ie double expand. If you try to play it safe, good terrans are going to walk all over you with that advantage.

Also make note of map positions, if it's adjacent positions on python sharing and island, you're pretty much fucked, as its riskier to take island, and easier push distance. In this situation I would probably play it a bit safer, but its really neccesary that you do something to change the way the game is going. but if it's the other half of the spectrum like cross positions on othello, it's safe to assume that the terran is going to take the third free expo.

i'm a terran not a toss player, so im just stating what you'd have to do vs a competent terran. hope i helped!

Raithed

China7078 Posts

August 10 2008 04:57 GMT

On August 10 2008 11:32 Shauni wrote:
double expand (one to island is fine), deny scouting and get relatively early speedlots. Try to make him siege as much as possible on his way to your base and then make a good surround attack with lots + goon. But to do this you need to cut probes and make 7-8 pretty early gates.
A safer variant is staying two base - and try to work something out with your gas surplus - stormdrops or dts or early arbiter can bring you back into the game. He usually won't move out too early if you're staying two base since you should be able to rape his army if he isn't careful and siege up defensively. But in this case, remember that you have to get your third sooner or later. You still need to get it up before he gets his third or you will only be even more behind at this point.

But this is all advice to beat someone lesser than you.
On my level (I'm at B ranks), if I die to a turret with an early reavershuttle and my opponent was going 1 fac siege exp I'm dead against 99% of the terrans. There is just no coming back against a competent terran unless you try to very very slowly catch up to him by playing safe with minimal risks and get him in lategame. So the simple advice is always best: don't lose it.

agreed, however, even if you try to slowly catch up, he will have more base than you and the flash build with the quick +1 hes going to eitherr mass expand and just outmacro you or contain you to death.

Grobyc

Canada18410 Posts

August 10 2008 06:37 GMT

On August 10 2008 13:57 Raithed wrote:

Show nested quote +

Which is why he said "I'm dead against 99% of the terrans. There is just no coming back against a competent terran"

FirstBorn

Romania3955 Posts

August 10 2008 07:12 GMT

You don't lose your shutle when doing something like that. Your reaver is a great investment and it plays the role of a threat, making the terran spend money on building turrets, and concentrate less on the macro and more on deflecting your shutle.

If he's alreay got turrets up, it's not necesary to tride to "trade your shutle" by trying to kill a number of SCV's knowing you'll lose it. Just search blind spots in his defense and force him to stay inside his base while macroing your shit out at home.

And I really don't see any follow up if you lose your shutle early on and didn't do enough damage to delay his push.

Grobyc

Canada18410 Posts

August 12 2008 06:05 GMT

#10

On August 10 2008 16:12 FirstBorn wrote:
You don't lose your shutle when doing something like that. Your reaver is a great investment and it plays the role of a threat, making the terran spend money on building turrets, and concentrate less on the macro and more on deflecting your shutle.

If he's alreay got turrets up, it's not necesary to tride to "trade your shutle" by trying to kill a number of SCV's knowing you'll lose it. Just search blind spots in his defense and force him to stay inside his base while macroing your shit out at home.

Sort of, eBay = 125$, turret = 75$, if he gets lets say 2, then thats still <300$, fast reaver tech = 200/200 for robo fact, 150/100 for robo bay, 200 for shuttle, 200/100 for reaver. 750$/400 compared to 275$/0, is still a lose situation for you, also it defends him against DT incase you chose to do that, 275$ gives him great protection with virtually no risk, while 750$/400 is a risky thing and can fail doing minimal damage. Not saying it isn't a good idea to go fast reaver but if it fails then your high-risk investment is no longer something you can really rely on, his eBay is something almost any terran needs to get quite quickly anyway, unless they are doing some sort of rush. In other words, if it fails against a mediocre player, then you are most likely fucked unless you push some gosu shit out your ass.