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This is in reference to decisions to expose information, for example telling someone about your life experiences, or problems, or successes... etc.
I've been thinking about this a lot recently because I got a huge amount of positive feedback over the last few years when I talked about my personal life in depression and my screw-ups relating to it, and a lot of other very personal information. I was told on multiple occasions that I was very brave for doing so, even though it was very easy and wasn't something I felt was a big deal to be able to say.
Via that, and thinking about the things I did NOT talk about, I feel like there is a pattern of being ashamed of what I chose not to discuss. Like I find it easy to talk to people about all the emotional feeling in being depressed as well as some of my personal faults, but some were really difficult. For example one of my faults that I had huge trouble with talking about, and only eventually told a single person, is a habit I finally realized I have of lying in order to smooth over situations. Sometimes that could be considered a small thing a lot of people do, sometimes I feel like it escalated beyond that to the point of being seriously wrong. I happen to value honesty immensely so I felt really badly about it once I realized I do this. I've put a lot of effort into avoiding it since, but I still feel and felt shame about having done it.
Also, the idea of reaching out for help or describing troubles being described as brave seems like it would be difficult for most people, and I can understand that as something people would be really ashamed of.
I thought was an interesting correlation for me, and I'm wondering if anyone knows anything more about this hypothesis. Also anybodies personal opinion on if they agree/disagree on it?
 
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With regards to not talking about successes, that's just modesty. We know what it sounds like when someone brags so we don't want to be that guy.
I can agree with the rest. Shame, and not wanting to bother others. Like even if something happens that's not your fault you may not want to tell everyone.
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United Kingdom14103 Posts
id like to put it out there that irl i never talk about my successes unless someone directly asks me about that subject and i never talk about my problems, this time even if someone asks me.
i'll happily joke about my flaws though
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On November 26 2014 16:41 cheesfactory wrote:
This is in reference to decisions to expose information, for example telling someone about your life experiences, or problems, or successes... etc.
I've been thinking about this a lot recently because I got a huge amount of positive feedback over the last few years when I talked about my personal life in depression and my screw-ups relating to it, and a lot of other very personal information. I was told on multiple occasions that I was very brave for doing so, even though it was very easy and wasn't something I felt was a big deal to be able to say.
Via that, and thinking about the things I did NOT talk about, I feel like there is a pattern of being ashamed of what I chose not to discuss. Like I find it easy to talk to people about all the emotional feeling in being depressed as well as some of my personal faults, but some were really difficult. For example one of my faults that I had huge trouble with talking about, and only eventually told a single person, is a habit I finally realized I have of lying in order to smooth over situations. Sometimes that could be considered a small thing a lot of people do, sometimes I feel like it escalated beyond that to the point of being seriously wrong. I happen to value honesty immensely so I felt really badly about it once I realized I do this. I've put a lot of effort into avoiding it since, but I still feel and felt shame about having done it.
Also, the idea of reaching out for help or describing troubles being described as brave seems like it would be difficult for most people, and I can understand that as something people would be really ashamed of.
I thought was an interesting correlation for me, and I'm wondering if anyone knows anything more about this hypothesis. Also anybodies personal opinion on if they agree/disagree on it?
Recently wrote a long blog which adheres to this quite strictly.
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On November 26 2014 22:32 obesechicken13 wrote:
With regards to not talking about successes, that's just modesty. We know what it sounds like when someone brags so we don't want to be that guy.
I can agree with the rest. Shame, and not wanting to bother others. Like even if something happens that's not your fault you may not want to tell everyone.
Yea I totally forgot about successes, I definitely agree.
On November 27 2014 00:34 Jockmcplop wrote:Show nested quote +On November 26 2014 16:41 cheesfactory wrote:
This is in reference to decisions to expose information, for example telling someone about your life experiences, or problems, or successes... etc.
I've been thinking about this a lot recently because I got a huge amount of positive feedback over the last few years when I talked about my personal life in depression and my screw-ups relating to it, and a lot of other very personal information. I was told on multiple occasions that I was very brave for doing so, even though it was very easy and wasn't something I felt was a big deal to be able to say.
Via that, and thinking about the things I did NOT talk about, I feel like there is a pattern of being ashamed of what I chose not to discuss. Like I find it easy to talk to people about all the emotional feeling in being depressed as well as some of my personal faults, but some were really difficult. For example one of my faults that I had huge trouble with talking about, and only eventually told a single person, is a habit I finally realized I have of lying in order to smooth over situations. Sometimes that could be considered a small thing a lot of people do, sometimes I feel like it escalated beyond that to the point of being seriously wrong. I happen to value honesty immensely so I felt really badly about it once I realized I do this. I've put a lot of effort into avoiding it since, but I still feel and felt shame about having done it.
Also, the idea of reaching out for help or describing troubles being described as brave seems like it would be difficult for most people, and I can understand that as something people would be really ashamed of.
I thought was an interesting correlation for me, and I'm wondering if anyone knows anything more about this hypothesis. Also anybodies personal opinion on if they agree/disagree on it? Recently wrote a long blog which adheres to this quite strictly.
Yea reading that was actually what caused me to think about it at the time, and via that end up posting this.
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United States15275 Posts
Cheesfactory, you're conflating shame and guilt. They are not synonymous. 
Depression and personal flaws stem from shame; by the same token, you describe them as facets of your personality instead of behaviors. This makes it easier for you to discuss since they don't constitute a relationship between you and those people. In fact, you probably find it easier because you innately know some people will support you and tell you how the act of revealing reveals other good traits.
Your reluctance to discuss your lying stems from guilt. It's not that you lie that makes you feel bad, but the fact that you lie to others; you don't have the same hesitation to talk when you lie to yourself.
Your high esteem of honesty is probably not the reason you feel guilty. If you valued honesty as a precursor to lying, you wouldn't be lying at all. Your description of that relationship (particularly "I happen to" i.e. by coincidence) suggests a rationalization to provide a basis for the guilt.
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On November 27 2014 03:33 CosmicSpiral wrote:Cheesfactory, you're conflating shame and guilt. They are not synonymous. Depression and personal flaws stem from shame; by the same token, you describe them as facets of your personality instead of behaviors. This makes it easier for you to discuss since they don't constitute a relationship between you and those people. In fact, you probably find it easier because you innately know some people will support you and tell you how the act of revealing reveals other good traits. Your reluctance to discuss your lying stems from guilt. It's not that you lie that makes you feel bad, but the fact that you lie to others; you don't have the same hesitation to talk when you lie to yourself. Your high esteem of honesty is probably not the reason you feel guilty. If you valued honesty as a precursor to lying, you wouldn't be lying at all. Your description of that relationship (particularly "I happen to" i.e. by coincidence) suggests a rationalization to provide a basis for the guilt.
Whoa this is super insightful.
Okay I guess the difference makes sense, having now looked for exact definitions for guilt and shame. Previously I would've considered them synonymous.
"....suggests a rationalization to provide a basis for the guilt." on that part, implies that this isn't the actual basis for the guilt. Is guilt as a reaction to lying just an inherent part of being a person?
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United States15275 Posts
On November 27 2014 05:05 cheesfactory wrote:
"....suggests a rationalization to provide a basis for the guilt." on that part, implies that this isn't the actual basis for the guilt. Is guilt as a reaction to lying just an inherent part of being a person?
Yes, I'm saying it's not the basis of your guilt. The discrepancy betrays itself. If you truly valued honesty as one of your priorities, it either means you're being controlled by outside forces into incongruence or something else supersedes it so consistently that it's not a priority at all. Your mind came up with the rationalization to provide a positive contrast between your act and your identity (I value X vs what I actually do -> what I value is my real identity -> my lying is a mere habit, not an expression of my true self). The end result is "I'm a good person but..."
It's a wash. People casually lie to others all the time and don't feel bad about it; people feel guilty over events that they aren't responsible for. After all, finding the "true cause" may not even be beneficial in the end. If you are looking to change your behavior, it can be advantageous to adapt a frame that doesn't strictly correspond to reality.
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This makes a lot of sense. Thanks a lot for the detailed response, its really interesting to think about.
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EPT
