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On February 16 2012 03:24 Bengui wrote:
Call me back when the prize pool minus what Valve sponsors directly is higher than the SC2 prize pool minus what Blizzard sponsors directly.
The prizepool including dota 1 is actually comparable to SC2. Also I believe GomTV is somewhat sponsored by blizzard.
If you look at even the prizepools during dota 2 beta it's higher than SC2's. The Defense, Premier League, SEA tournaments, dreamhacks, and Russian/Ukraine tournaments are all higher prizepools than anything from sc2 beta, and SC2 beta was available to everyone practically wtih a pre-order.
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Yea I think I'll tune into the "king of e=sports" whenever the melatonin, ambien, or kush doesn't work, and I am in dire need of the ultimate solution to put one to sleep.
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the activision valve lawsuit will kill dota 2 I think. Activision might go as to even not allow events that have dota 2 to get an sc2 licence killing its initial growth. not to mention how late to the party dota 2 is going to be all around the world including korea and china.
the fact that its got lan and will be f2p is something that it needs to do to even be competitive. lol hasn't had a problem arguably without lan and I'm sure that it was going to be pirated hugly in asia anyway.
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Does it make anyone else sad that a 1990 PC gaming feature such as LAN play is worthy of being a big announcement now?
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how are these games even fun? HoN, LoL, Dota... all of them are just so boring to play.
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On February 16 2012 00:27 heyoka wrote:
There is a pretty good chance Dota is too late to market and LoL will blow it out of the water for many years. Features and functionality are (sadly) far from the most important thing when it comes to how big a pass-time becomes.
Myself and other dota player don't mind this at all. DotA 2 will have the whole DotA fanbase (China, which is huge), and we can tell who the LoL and HoN players are in game because they're bad. If we can keep the LoL and HoN community out of it, then all the better. DotA 2 is probably going to be F2P, so the fanbase will come.
DotA is a better ESPORT because the developers care about the community and its competitive. the developers will help the community grow, while the competitive scene will propagate itself. We're in the beta and there are tournaments every week with people nobody has heard about playing and doing well, its great for the scene.
In sc2, the developers are hurting the community and the competitive scene by patching before we can figure out how to deal with new strategies and putting poor maps in the ladder pool. Blizz puts almost no prize money in the scene and has bad community interface.
In LoL, there is a competitive scene and money, but the only time the game advances is when new heros are implemented or heros are buffed. How often do you see a game where a team isnt running 1 jungle 2 solos 1 duel lane? It's not a good game competitively.
Is DotA the "king of ESPORTS"? Of course not, but it has a huge potential and a huge scene, a lot of it is still stuck in dota, waiting for the DotA 2 release.
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Is it gonna be free? If not I don't see it besting LoL. Sadly the measure of an esport is longer based on competitive merit but on how much money a company can throw at it. Valve is amazing though, this kind of support makes me wish they made sc2 instead of blizzard.
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If it's free I have a feeling it will be a super competitor to LoL. The game is more challenging, has more depth and more features (LAN, replays, etc) for a traditional competitive title than a game like LoL without question. It really just depends how much money Valve is willing to throw at it to control its "esports longevity". We see now that you don't need to be the best game that displays the highest amount of skill and dedication to thrive in the tournament scene, it's which company buys out the tournament for the most money.
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On February 16 2012 05:35 13_Doomblaze_37 wrote:Show nested quote +On February 16 2012 00:27 heyoka wrote:
There is a pretty good chance Dota is too late to market and LoL will blow it out of the water for many years. Features and functionality are (sadly) far from the most important thing when it comes to how big a pass-time becomes. Myself and other dota player don't mind this at all. DotA 2 will have the whole DotA fanbase (China, which is huge), and we can tell who the LoL and HoN players are in game because they're bad. If we can keep the LoL and HoN community out of it, then all the better. DotA 2 is probably going to be F2P, so the fanbase will come. DotA is a better ESPORT because the developers care about the community and its competitive. the developers will help the community grow, while the competitive scene will propagate itself. We're in the beta and there are tournaments every week with people nobody has heard about playing and doing well, its great for the scene. In sc2, the developers are hurting the community and the competitive scene by patching before we can figure out how to deal with new strategies and putting poor maps in the ladder pool. Blizz puts almost no prize money in the scene and has bad community interface. In LoL, there is a competitive scene and money, but the only time the game advances is when new heros are implemented or heros are buffed. How often do you see a game where a team isnt running 1 jungle 2 solos 1 duel lane? It's not a good game competitively. Is DotA the "king of ESPORTS"? Of course not, but it has a huge potential and a huge scene, a lot of it is still stuck in dota, waiting for the DotA 2 release.
It's this exact attitude that will hurt DoTA2. Trying to alienate any new players who dare to come into 'their' game.
I know all gaming communities aren't exactly friendly or the best, but the DoTA community is one of the tougher ones on noobs for sure.
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On February 16 2012 03:15 SigmaoctanusIV wrote:
I don't see a MOBA ever passing SC2 in watch-ability they are so boring to watch. I've played probably LoL and Dota2 and While they are fun to play they are boring to watch imo. Starcraft is so much fun to watch BW even doubly so.
Well, LoL numbers already pass sc2 numbers. And don't bring in that "embedded" talk because it's been discussed and refuted before. They don't embed streams and count the numbers.
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On February 16 2012 04:51 sermokala wrote:
the activision valve lawsuit will kill dota 2 I think. Activision might go as to even not allow events that have dota 2 to get an sc2 licence killing its initial growth. not to mention how late to the party dota 2 is going to be all around the world including korea and china.
the fact that its got lan and will be f2p is something that it needs to do to even be competitive. lol hasn't had a problem arguably without lan and I'm sure that it was going to be pirated hugly in asia anyway.
...Do you even know what the lawsuit about?
It's about keeping the name "Dota" free from being trademarked. If Blizzard wins, they get nothing.
If Valve wins, they trademark the name "Dota"
At least educate yourself before you say something.
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Valve is doing so much for the game already.
LAN, the UI is near perfect and evolving, investissement in tournaments, etc
Can't see them not be a huge thing with Dota when you compare it to Blizzard or Riot way to be involve in their game.
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On February 16 2012 02:19 Itsmedudeman wrote:Show nested quote +On February 16 2012 02:17 Tryndamere wrote:
I seriously don't get Valve's intention. Before the game was even out you had players playing for millions of dollars of prize money, and the general public didn't even have access to the game. That was just completely retarded from Valve's perspective. 1000% agree. The hype from it is already gone and it's still miles away from release and not even many people have beta access yet. I'd like to hear what a valve representative would have to say before I slapped them in the face and told them hosting a tournament when the game was available would have been better in any situation imaginable.
They've said that the invitational they did is going to be annual, so there's going to be another tournament with just as big of a prize pool this year, and next year, and so on. And while doing something like that for a game like starcraft 2 would be utterly retarded because it's a completely different game, dota 2 is a carbon copy of dota for warcraft 3.
Everyone was talking about dota 2 in july/august last year, because they announced such a massive prize pool, and since they're going to keep hosting similar tournaments, I don't see why it could've possibly been a bad idea.
On February 16 2012 05:29 IMoperator wrote:
how are these games even fun? HoN, LoL, Dota... all of them are just so boring to play.
how are these games even fun? Starcraft, Warcraft, Command and Conquer... all of them are just so boring to play.
Hey guess what, different people enjoy different kinds of things. Dota is HUGE in china, and if valve manage to win china over from warcraft 3 dota, to dota 2, there's going to be far more (as in, far more than twice as many) people following dota 2 than there are people following games like LoL.
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Thought they wanted to do more production this year for the international, meaning lets NOT bog down dota2TV with tens if not hundreds of thousands of clients overloading the server, and ideally watch it on a stream 
That said, this is the first major esports title to have LAN mode since like...Counterstrike Source, or if you dont consider that major, then Warcraft 3. But this will lead to the SEAsian and Chinese scenes the ability to blow up and grow the game in LAN Centers and tournaments.
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On February 16 2012 01:43 Sm3agol wrote:Show nested quote +On February 16 2012 01:22 shaftofpleasure wrote:
uhhh.. Broodwar?
You guys are 10 years late. LOL Get with the times, BW is dead.
How? Because It doesn't have sponsors?
STX, Samsung, KT, SKT1, CJ, Woongjin, An Air Force of a Fucking Country and a Company that is recognized by the Ministry of Culture.
What does your game have? lol
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On February 16 2012 06:46 Candadar wrote:Show nested quote +On February 16 2012 04:51 sermokala wrote:
the activision valve lawsuit will kill dota 2 I think. Activision might go as to even not allow events that have dota 2 to get an sc2 licence killing its initial growth. not to mention how late to the party dota 2 is going to be all around the world including korea and china.
the fact that its got lan and will be f2p is something that it needs to do to even be competitive. lol hasn't had a problem arguably without lan and I'm sure that it was going to be pirated hugly in asia anyway. ...Do you even know what the lawsuit about? It's about keeping the name "Dota" free from being trademarked. If Blizzard wins, they get nothing. If Valve wins, they trademark the name "Dota" At least educate yourself before you say something.
First of all it's not a lawsuit it is an opposition to a trademark filing. Secondly Blizzard very much so intends to get the rights to the trademark "dota" as there's a whole section titled "Blizzard's Rights In And To The DotA Marks" (here).
That doesn't mean that Blizzard will start suing people for using "dota" after acquiring it but neither does it mean that Valve would. There's no evil party in this dispute. It's just two companies trying to assert their rights. And give me a break with the "for the community" talk, that's just publicity. They wouldn't give two shits if some WC3 map that got played by 100 people was remade into a sequel by another company.
Blizzard wants to stop effectively ignoring dota after they've seen the numbers that LoL got and release "Blizzard DOTA". After they release it, they of course want exclusive rights to the trademark to license it out for merchandise, etc.
Valve has hired Eul (the guy who actually came up with the Name and the Idea to recreate Aeon of Strife in WC3) and Icefrog and just wants to make a sequel to a successful mod. Just like they did with CS, DoD and TF2 (TF1 was originally a Quake mod). Also, they didn't oppose other mods like Red Orchestra or Natural Selection that were originally on their engine to be remade by third parties. They see this case as little different from all the others, hiring the people who made the successful mod and recreate the idea on a professional level. Again they want the trademark for marketing reasons and licensing deals.
Ok, I must admit that I feel that Valve is in the right here but I must also admit that there are some points that speak for Blizzard. Their EULA (which is not automatically binding in it's entirety as some legal precedent shows) stating that everything made with their editor is automatically their IP for once and the franchise being loosely based on their lore and charaters. Also they did try to reach a settlement out of court which is a plus but I have no Idea what their demands were.
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On February 16 2012 09:01 shaftofpleasure wrote:Show nested quote +On February 16 2012 01:43 Sm3agol wrote:On February 16 2012 01:22 shaftofpleasure wrote:
uhhh.. Broodwar?
You guys are 10 years late. LOL Get with the times, BW is dead. How? Because It doesn't have sponsors? STX, Samsung, KT, SKT1, CJ, Woongjin, An Air Force of a Fucking Country and a Company that is recognized by the Ministry of Culture. What does your game have? lol
In terms of scale, the same except in the second most pivotal country in the world, China.
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As long as Valve does not do anything pretty bad, Dota 2 could easily become the biggest eSport in history.
It won't be surprising (DotA is actually bigger than the SC2 and LoL community in terms of population)
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Maybe the below 15 year olds will prefer these "my little pony" games where everything is sparkly and pretty, because RTS/FPS-games are too hard for them. For the rest of us, I don't think it'll cause much of a ripple.
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Wow another sensationalist piece by you doing nothing but trying to start a fight. Shocker........
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EPT
