EPT
Advice on a career in the SC2 pro scene
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Mr_Advantage
28 Posts
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Blazinghand
United States25552 Posts
You'd probably be better off coming at things from the "other end", getting into a management or consultancy position from the direction of the money, rather than the team-- such as working for IGN or the marketing segment of razer. More than that I can't say. | ||
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FaZe
Canada472 Posts
djWheat, Husky, Tasteless, They all just did it. I would find other things with transferable experience and start doing those. A piece of paper from a school is great, but you need real world knowledge. Volunteer to manage a local sports team, handle a budget, do some work for a local news station. Set your eyes on your goal, and don't let a day go by without getting closer to that goal. | ||
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Mr_Advantage
28 Posts
@FaZe Casting is a little different from the business side of a team. Its much better for my chances of being considered as an intern (or an employee) if I have a degree. Obviously the things you mentioned would help me, and would be a great thing to have on a resume, but the college part of it is just as important if not more so for the business and management end. Hopefully the internship, which will probably be the most difficult thing for me to find, is what will get me the real world experience. I would hope that an e-sports team wouldn't hire someone who came and said, "Hey, I don't have a college degree, but I've been a little league coach. Can I be your GM?" I know for lesser known teams that might fly because the just need someone to fill the spot but for a team like EG I doubt they would accept someone just because they had some kind of semi-applicable knowledge. | ||
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Kfish
Chile282 Posts
Find a team that is not managed and has players that practice and want to take a risk with you. Manage them! Give them a schedule to follow, find tournaments for them and make them sign up. Find a coach for them. Win something -> attract sponsors -> start "business" Sounds easy, must be terribly hard but rewarding. Good luck sir. | ||
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Shield
Bulgaria4824 Posts
If I was you, I'd play safe and go for an already well-established career/job. Yes, we all love SC2, but this is an important decision regarding your life and it needs to be considered well and long enough. | ||
Myles
United States5162 Posts
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Fruscainte
4596 Posts
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Mr_Advantage
28 Posts
1. The players and the rest of the structure isn't as serious and devoted as I am. Thus, I have ended up leaving do to unprofessional behavior or immaturity such as: Stupid squabbles between players, players being inactive, lack of skill and commitment to become better, lack of work ethic. 2. Players are much older and are more professional, but because I'm so young they doubt my ability, or I am given a lesser position that has much less power or pull and I end up not being able to accomplish anything. | ||
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Shield
Bulgaria4824 Posts
On November 30 2011 12:10 Fruscainte wrote: Depends on what you want to do. If you want to manage shit, if you want to run the sound and set up all the events, all of it DEPENDS on what you're interested in doing. If you think you'll be the next Sundance, well, I hate to the baron of bad news but you probably won't. Not everyone can be an Astronaut, unfortunately. However, it's very possible, if you put your mind to it, to do some cool shit behind the curtains of SC2. Just don't expect to get a lot of glory and whatnot from it. Yep, a lot of people consider only outcomes of being someone (a.k.a glory/rewards), but not everyone thinks of how hard it is (responsibilities) and sometimes risky. | ||
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Kfish
Chile282 Posts
Ask yourself this, what would the much older and professional players need from you to trust you besides your age? Answer that question and start working on those skills. If you can't find a team, make one. It will probably suck at first but since you will be in charge you can weed out the players that you find are unprofessional and immature or whatever. Use this team as practice. And most important just keep at it, if its your dream follow it. But do so with a plan, study something relevant to your dream. | ||
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Mr_Advantage
28 Posts
@darkness I understand your concern, I have thought about doing this since I was 12 years of age, and I have decided that I will pursue this with all of my being, but having a degree in management and being able to speak a foreign language are all skills that are needed by a plethora of other businesses. @Fruscainte I'm not looking to be a CEO, I just want to manage a team. I agree that not everyone can be an e-sports manager, but not many are attempting to do so at the moment. | ||
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Fruscainte
4596 Posts
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Mr_Advantage
28 Posts
 @darkness I'm not in it for the glory, I'm in it to help players. I don't want to become a GM and expect to be the next super star on SotG and Live on Three. I am fully aware that most likely my name will never be heard by the community, and that I won't walk into a room and all the pro players and big names in e-sports will want to have a conversation with me. I just want to be a small cog in the giant machine of e-sports. | ||
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Mr_Advantage
28 Posts
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Kfish
Chile282 Posts
Dont be in a rush man, Esports will be waiting for you ^_^ | ||
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Myles
United States5162 Posts
On November 30 2011 12:24 Mr_Advantage wrote: @ Myles What I meant from that post was that I didn't want to work for the Marketing Division of Razer because I wanted to be working more with the individual team instead of working from the sponsoring end. As the General Manager though I would be interacting with potential sponsors, work on creating PR events, make sure all players are content with current conditions and meet their needs as best as possible, work with the rest of the white collar division of the team on the current needs, Establish the budget of the team, make sure all players are attending tournaments or streaming/coaching. Look for other staple positions for the team like the coach and fill them. Manage players at LAN tournaments and do things such as making sure players have everything they have to compete and make sure all planned appearances run smoothly and all matches are attended. That is just a taste of some of the things a general manager would be doing. Sorry, I missed the context of the reply. But that's good, you really understood what goes into this. I'm not exactly sure what goes into a management degree, but being good on the financial side only helps. | ||
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Mr_Advantage
28 Posts
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Fruscainte
4596 Posts
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Mr_Advantage
28 Posts
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Mr_Advantage
28 Posts
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d9mmdi
Germany179 Posts
Yes. | ||
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munchmunch
Canada789 Posts
With that in mind, trying to pick your college major to match your ambition is probably overkill. Instead, find something that you like, and do as much eSports stuff as you can in your spare time. (What you do in your spare time is the most important part of college anyway). | ||
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mki
Poland882 Posts
Going to college and university and picking a suitable major and getting that education isn't enough. First and foremost you need connections which you have to start building NOW. Attend events, try and get jobs in teams - you have to do something NOW. I read a post above somewhere which was perfect... the day[9]'s, djwheats of ESPORTS just went out and DID IT. That's what you have to do. | ||
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luckylefty
United States272 Posts
GLHF | ||
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Nizzy
United States839 Posts
On November 30 2011 11:17 Mr_Advantage wrote: So, I've decided that I am going to pursue a career in SC2, but not in the way most people do. I don't want to be a pro player I want to be a General Manager or some kind of "Big shot behind the scenes" kind of title. Like SirScoots or the General Manager of EG (I'm sorry I forgot his name). To do this though, I'm using a logical approach and I'm looking for a good college major for this kind of thing. I'm thinking I could knock out my generals in my first 1-2 years and then finish up my college at Yonsei University. That way I can learn Korean and stay there for awhile and finish up my college in their management program. Hopefully I can then become an intern for a major Korean team or maybe GOMTV. After a couple years there, I want to return and work for an American team, using my knowledge of the Korean language and connections to help manage the team and make a living with my dream. My question is, can I actually do this? By that, I mean can I actually find an internship, and a team? do teams need someone that could speak, read, and write Korean? Would my choice of degree be appropriate or is there another type of program that would help me in this field? Any advice or information about this is welcome. Thank you! -You want to be a GM or some big shot behind the scenes kind of title. Well first there are GMs, it's basically the Korean guys that run the team houses. Kind of like that guy who drove around Artosis in one of his videos. I think for team TSL. Pro Korean teams have a guy that run those houses (some players some not) that control everything. The GM's role isn't just dealing with players, it's everything from getting a chef/food to getting sponsors. There's no "one" big guy behind the scenes doing everything for sc2. It's many many people in many many scenes for the big community of sc2. -The EG comments are kind of funny to me. I don't know EG's background but I bet it was YEARS, maybe even a decade before EG started making legit money. There's really only 2-3 teams that would maybe even bring you in, even as an intern for you to help them. Maybe in a few years esports will be so huge that teams need a fully dedicated "GM" however it's insane to base your whole life on this assumption. -"knock out generals in 1-2 years" I'm sorry, maybe you've been in some college, maybe you're just extremely smart. However you just don't knock out 1-2 years worth of general college classes. From my experiences the general classes at most universities can be the hardest as you're generally not as interested in them and know less about them compared to your core major classes. College is a life style. If you want to finish them all in 1-2 years you'll be taking 5-6 classes a semester to "knock them out". Good luck trying to keep track of the SC2 community as much as you do. It's tough. Are your parents paying for all of your expenses so you don't need a 20 hour/week PT job? -Transferring to a Korean school. New language, environment, etc. Going to be very difficult. It can be done but it will take longer than you think. How do you even know that they will transfer all of your classes? I think the only people making money off a team are the owner and maybe 1-2 other people in the organization. You're going to have a lot of school loans/expenses. I don't think a team will invest in you. Who knows SC2 might suck in 5 years when you're ready and then what? To be honest I don't think college really matters. Does Artosis have a college degree? I'm not sure. I bet if he does it's not in broadcasting, its just natural. I think you're screwed because you sound like your only 17-18 about to go to college. You don't have money to start a real pro team. Shit you probably have better odds right now just trying to get on to a semi-pro NA team and help them now as compared to going to college/waiting 5 """do teams need someone that could speak, read, and write Korean? """ Do you know any Korean right now? Someone to do all those things could take years to get down. MY Advice: This isn't the right thing for you, unless you do it now. However you might be too young. Go to college for something else beside games. If you're planning on this in 5 years it might be too hard to even get behind the scenes. I think this is too far out of reach from where you are right now. | ||
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v1dom
159 Posts
Some of the important points #1. Of teams in North America, there might be one (EG, and I'm not even sure of that), that can afford to pay their "Starcraft manager" a living wage. There are business owners like Jason Lake who have after years and years of working for free, have turned their enterprise into a viable business for himself, but I guarantee that Jason doesn't pay his Starcraft manager any manner of livable wage, and neither does any team in North America as far as I'm aware of. Even in Korea, most of the managers and players don't get paid much more than they need to eat and have very basic necessities, and certainly not enough to "live the dream" in America. Most managers of NA pro teams work for free trips, some sponsor stuff and the love of the game. #2. You're talking about going to college and spending 3-4 years studying, possibly interning with teams in the meantime, with hopes of eventually moving up the ladder to the "big time" after you have a business degree, speak Korean etc. What makes you think the pro scene will be as strong for this game in 4 years? Spoiler alert: It won't. Will the game still be around and played competitively? Absolutely. Will you be seeing sponsors pumping in as much money into it in 4 years as you are now (keeping in mind that even today, managers aren't getting paid). No, you won't. #3. Experience and connections are more important than a degree and book knowledge in this field. Teams don't put an ad up on monster.com and ask you to send your resume over for consideration or an interview. Most managers are ex pro gamers, or just business/people savvy persons willing to put the time in pro bono. People have already said it, but it's not something you study for, you "just do it." You start by managing the shitty teams of squabbling noobs and after months (or years) of that, hope you've met and impressed the right person. #4. I think there may be some confusion about just how many people involved in the Starcraft scene (players and non-players alike) make a living wage off of playing or working on the game. Double spoiler: It isn't nearly as many as you think it is, and the people who do probably don't make as much as you think they do. You asked if it you could "actually do this." The answer is yes, it's possible, but bloody unlikely that you're the next one. Most people "behind the scenes" are either in college working for the love of the game or have day jobs. Most of the people who are making a living who aren't players are popular casters and not managers. Sorry if this is a buzzkill. I've been "working behind the scenes" for hundreds of hours now on this game, and thousands more hours other games prior to this one. I've probably spent more than I've ever earned (including the paid trips and gear) over that time period. Domino 4Kings | ||
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d3_crescentia
United States4054 Posts
On November 30 2011 12:11 Mr_Advantage wrote: @Kfish Kind of hard to do in my position. I'm 16 (going on 17) and I've tried managing teams and 1 of 2 things happen 1. The players and the rest of the structure isn't as serious and devoted as I am. Thus, I have ended up leaving do to unprofessional behavior or immaturity such as: Stupid squabbles between players, players being inactive, lack of skill and commitment to become better, lack of work ethic. 2. Players are much older and are more professional, but because I'm so young they doubt my ability, or I am given a lesser position that has much less power or pull and I end up not being able to accomplish anything. rofl seriously? point #1 basically contains all the bitch work that a team manager HAS to do on ANY new team unless you've got like 5 million dollars behind you like EG does and even then you have to deal with player egos and other retarded shit, and then there's dealing with sponsors that won't give your players enough money to go anywhere or do anything, tournament organizers/refs being retarded, etc. if you can't deal with petty player squabbles how do you think you'll feel when you get a call at 4AM from one of your players who blew the money for his plane ticket on poker and booze? most people that have managed teams did it before ESPORTS was something real, and the drama was even worse then. the reason why EG/Liquid/Complexity are where they are now is because they've been at this for years, and have likely put up with a bunch of bullshit in their time. the most important factor here is your experience rather than anything else, and that includes enduring the stupid stuff and making something work in the end now I'm not saying managing isn't fun or rewarding, because it definitely can be; nor am I saying your plan is necessarily bad, because korean translators are in demand now for SC2 and would probably be useful for a team in the future... but seriously, just be realistic | ||
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Empyrean
16993 Posts
To do this though, I'm using a logical approach and I'm looking for a good college major for this kind of thing. I'm thinking I could knock out my generals in my first 1-2 years and then finish up my college at Yonsei University. That way I can learn Korean and stay there for awhile and finish up my college in their management program. You're only sixteen. Do you think you can just sign up to study at Yonsei? EDIT: Also, my honest opinion is that this is a misguided goal. But good luck regardless. | ||
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zalz
Netherlands3704 Posts
It makes you qualified to work in pretty much 99% of the worlds companies. Also, Esports has a terrible PR problem so communication experts are going to be taken on board some day. | ||
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ExceeD_DreaM
Canada500 Posts
There is absolutely no guarantee you will get into Yonsei, it is top 3 school in Korea, and although it is easier for foreign exchange students to apply and get in, it won't be easy. Who says teams and corps will hire interns? Interns are a stressful position with lots of bitchy work you have to do. And so is the manager position. Also, I'd say 99% of teams and companies will hire someone with experience, not someone who is in early 20s. Just my two cents, and I hope you will put more thought into this. | ||
Rekrul
Korea (South)17174 Posts
LOL | ||
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QuanticHawk
United States32075 Posts
But yeah, what rek said, this is a ridiculous idea | ||
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Kfish
Chile282 Posts
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Mr_Advantage
28 Posts
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Empyrean
16993 Posts
But again, good luck. Let us know how it turns out. | ||
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Mr_Advantage
28 Posts
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Mr_Advantage
28 Posts
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Mr_Advantage
28 Posts
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Mr_Advantage
28 Posts
@Exceed_Dream I was already assuming that the internship wouldn't have pay. I know that this isn't a "gimme a degree" kind of school. From what I have been told I will need a 2.75 GPA to get in the exchange program at the college I will attend. Thanks for your concerns, and I've been thinking about this for 4+ years. @Redkul I know this might seem funny but I am serious about it. @Hawk I know, but I'm looking for advice, not someone to tell me I'm crazy. So if you have any advice please share! I need to know as much as I can. | ||
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