EPTPronouncing "XiGua" - Page 2
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Redmark
Canada2129 Posts
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raviy
Australia207 Posts
On August 16 2011 21:26 Newbistic wrote: What? Mandarin is the official dialect for mainland China and even Taiwan uses a variation of Mandarin (they call it Taiwanese). The "X" letter is pronounced "sh" in Mandarin. This is the standard and correct pronunciation, period. Maybe it's pronounced "s" in Singapore but that doesn't make it standard; it's simply a deviation used by a geographically isolated population. To compare to the English language, you wouldn't call pronouncing the word "nine" in the southern drawl as "naaahhne" as standard, it's a deviation. I have trouble believing you're from China. Because if "X" is pronounced "sh", then explain to me the phonetic difference between Xi, Si, Ci, Shi, and Chi. There is no "h" in the pronunciation of "Xi". Also, when did the Taiwanese refer to Mandarin as "Taiwanese". There is no such thing as a Taiwanese language. They speak mostly Mandarin and Min Nan Hua. | ||
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MaGariShun
Austria305 Posts
On August 16 2011 20:48 conTAgi0n wrote: Ignoring the implication that there is a proper way to use the Roman alphabet, the eccentricities of English spelling have nothing to do with why people don't intuitively understand how XiGua should be pronounced. You just say that like it's a proven fact. Of course there are other problems with romanization too, but an English speaker (americans even more so it seems, because of their pronounciation), who is pronouncing the very same characters differently than say a french, german, italian etc., will obviously have problems reading something romanized using the "standard" (note the quotes) pronounciation of the latin alphabet. I am not saying english speakers are using the characters "wrong", but they need to understand that their pronounciation is not the common one and is in fact very specific to their language. Using a romanization for english speakers, like proposed in the OP, will only help english speakers and confuse almost every other language that uses the roman alphabet. | ||
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fOrQQ
Hong Kong321 Posts
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Ryo
8787 Posts
On August 16 2011 21:26 Newbistic wrote: What? Mandarin is the official dialect for mainland China and even Taiwan uses a variation of Mandarin (they call it Taiwanese). The "X" letter is pronounced "sh" in Mandarin. This is the standard and correct pronunciation, period. Maybe it's pronounced "s" in Singapore but that doesn't make it standard; it's simply a deviation used by a geographically isolated population. To compare to the English language, you wouldn't call pronouncing the word "nine" in the southern drawl as "naaahhne" as standard, it's a deviation. lol Are you really a native speaker of mandarin? | ||
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rauk
United States2228 Posts
On August 16 2011 22:44 raviy wrote: I have trouble believing you're from China. Because if "X" is pronounced "sh", then explain to me the phonetic difference between Xi, Si, Ci, Shi, and Chi. There is no "h" in the pronunciation of "Xi". Also, when did the Taiwanese refer to Mandarin as "Taiwanese". There is no such thing as a Taiwanese language. They speak mostly Mandarin and Min Nan Hua. xi is pronounced "shee," si is pronounced "see," ci is "tsee," shi is "shee" fuck i suck at pinyin there is definitely an "h" in the pronunciation of "xi." and we also call taiwanese "taiwanese" or daiwanwei. lol? no one in taiwan calls it min nan, just like how we say "guo yu" instead of "putong hua." if you're referring to the indigenous aboriginal language, they might no longer be as widely spoken but they certainly still exist. | ||
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Newbistic
China2912 Posts
On August 16 2011 22:44 raviy wrote: I have trouble believing you're from China. Because if "X" is pronounced "sh", then explain to me the phonetic difference between Xi, Si, Ci, Shi, and Chi. There is no "h" in the pronunciation of "Xi". Also, when did the Taiwanese refer to Mandarin as "Taiwanese". There is no such thing as a Taiwanese language. They speak mostly Mandarin and Min Nan Hua. Lol? Prepare to be owned. The transliteration of pinyin syllables to english language sounds isn't perfect using the alphabet, but here goes: Xi = shee Si = sssss Ci = tssss Shi = Shrr (Make the "shhhh" sound while rolling your tongue like when pronouncing "er" in American english) Chi = Chrrr (make the "chhhh" sound while rolling your tongue) Assume American English pronunciation for all sounds to the right of the equal sign. + Apply the correct intonation depending on the words. Where the fuck are you from? I was born in China and know how to pronounce Mandarin. "shee" may not be absolutely perfect in describing the sound, but it's about as close as you can get. If you're white and you pronounce "xigua" as "shee gwahh" Mandarin speakers will know what you're talking about. On August 16 2011 23:39 Ryo wrote: lol Are you really a native speaker of mandarin? That's an affirmative. | ||
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Resolve
Singapore679 Posts
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Redmark
Canada2129 Posts
On August 17 2011 00:11 Newbistic wrote: Lol? Prepare to be owned. The transliteration of pinyin syllables to english language sounds isn't perfect using the alphabet, but here goes: Xi = shee Si = sssss Ci = tssss Shi = Shrr (Make the "shhhh" sound while rolling your tongue like when pronouncing "er" in American english) Chi = Chrrr (make the "chhhh" sound while rolling your tongue) Assume American English pronunciation for all sounds to the right of the equal sign. + Apply the correct intonation depending on the words. Where the fuck are you from? I was born in China and know how to pronounce Mandarin. "shee" may not be absolutely perfect in describing the sound, but it's about as close as you can get. If you're white and you pronounce "xigua" as "shee gwahh" Mandarin speakers will know what you're talking about. That's an affirmative. ... ok that's definitely regional differences then Rolling your tongue, really? Are you sure you're not conflicting the following vowel with the consonant? | ||
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Ryo
8787 Posts
On August 17 2011 00:11 Newbistic wrote: Lol? Prepare to be owned. The transliteration of pinyin syllables to english language sounds isn't perfect using the alphabet, but here goes: Xi = shee Si = sssss Ci = tssss Shi = Shrr (Make the "shhhh" sound while rolling your tongue like when pronouncing "er" in American english) Chi = Chrrr (make the "chhhh" sound while rolling your tongue) Assume American English pronunciation for all sounds to the right of the equal sign. + Apply the correct intonation depending on the words. Where the fuck are you from? I was born in China and know how to pronounce Mandarin. "shee" may not be absolutely perfect in describing the sound, but it's about as close as you can get. If you're white and you pronounce "xigua" as "shee gwahh" Mandarin speakers will know what you're talking about. That's an affirmative. And yet you don't acknowledge the variations in accents across different regions, even within China. Interesting. | ||
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SarR
476 Posts
what ? | ||
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Chromyne
Canada561 Posts
On August 17 2011 00:46 Redmark wrote: ... ok that's definitely regional differences then Rolling your tongue, really? Are you sure you're not conflicting the following vowel with the consonant? I don't think he really meant rolling the 'r'. That doesn't sound like any Mandarin I've heard. Disclaimer: I am NOT a native Mandarin speaker, but I am Chinese and have learned Mandarin. Xi = she (EDIT: I admit xi != she, but I can't think of a more accurate romanization) Si = can't think of a romanization, closest is s+ugh (like 'ugh, that's disgusting' without the gh sound... not sure if that makes sense) Ci = ts+ugh like Si Shi = like sure, or Shure. I guess less of the 'r' depending on how thick your accent is or where you're from XD. Chi = like Shi but with a ch, like churro | ||
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Sufficiency
Canada23833 Posts
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Newbistic
China2912 Posts
On August 17 2011 00:52 Ryo wrote: And yet you don't acknowledge the variations in accents across different regions, even within China. Interesting. Ugh, I think I'm just digging myself into a hole arguing against idiots here, but dude... YES, there are hundreds of different accents and dialects, but there is a single standard dialect and pronunciation deemed to be the official dialect and pronunciation method, and it is called Mandarin. That's what's being argued here. Pinyin is designed to be used with this official dialect, NOT with other Chinese dialects. What I have written is the correct pronunciation of these letters IN MANDARIN. Seriously, if you're not even Chinese why the fuck are you arguing about things you don't know about. On August 17 2011 00:59 Chromyne wrote: I don't think he really meant rolling the 'r'. That doesn't sound like any Mandarin I've heard. Disclaimer: I am NOT a native Mandarin speaker, but I am Chinese and have learned Mandarin. Xi = she (EDIT: I admit xi != she, but I can't think of a more accurate romanization) Si = can't think of a romanization, closest is s+ugh (like 'ugh, that's disgusting' without the gh sound... not sure if that makes sense) Ci = ts+ugh like Si Shi = like sure, or Shure. I guess less of the 'r' depending on how thick your accent is or where you're from XD. Chi = like Shi but with a ch, like churro I meant everything I wrote. I am a native born speaker of Mandarin Chinese. Are you? No? Then stop spreading misinformation about shit you don't fully understand. I doubt you can even pronounce the words properly with what you have written. "Si" does NOT have an "ugh" sound. It's just flat "sssss" with whatever intonation the word is assigned. Sound it out, or have someone who actually knows how to speak the language sound it out for you. Jesus Christ people, if you don't know Mandarin Chinese don't fucking post misinformation. Suddenly everyone's an expert. | ||
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Caphe
Vietnam10817 Posts
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Diglett
600 Posts
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j0k3r
United States577 Posts
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rei
United States3593 Posts
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Redmark
Canada2129 Posts
Honestly not sure why you're so angry. | ||
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Melchior
United States112 Posts
I think the only possible confusion with "rolling the tongue" might be that "捲舌" is typically used to describe the "ü" sound. EDIT: And for the person who asked about XiaOzl before, "zi" is probably best approximated as "ds" or "dz" as in "friends". So, something like sheeow (as one syllable) ds, ignoring any tones. | ||
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