EPTlike chill said, you can't force or expect "epic" games. all you can expect is for the top players to play their best -- because when they don't play their best, they'll lose. the only games that are "epic" are those back-and-forth, hard-fought matches -- they don't even have to be long -- where both player is absolutely doing everything he can to win.
*DreamHack Spoilers* I am so mad - Page 7
| Blogs > boesthius |
CTStalker
Canada9720 Posts
like chill said, you can't force or expect "epic" games. all you can expect is for the top players to play their best -- because when they don't play their best, they'll lose. the only games that are "epic" are those back-and-forth, hard-fought matches -- they don't even have to be long -- where both player is absolutely doing everything he can to win. | ||
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smashedpotato
Australia9 Posts
On April 13 2011 06:49 hugman wrote: So I said this like twice already, but I think the tennis analogy of using an underhand serve on a match point is the perfect example. Is that respected in tennis? No. MC can win like that but I'm not going to respect him for showing such a boring deciding game. I beg to differ..sure cheese is a cheese, but MC's absurdity in attempting that at the highest level of the game is mind boggling and decidedly calculative. He wasn't farming for quick results on ladder, he chose to use that particular strat on that particular map in that particular situation (the decider). People are saying it was a coin toss, sure it was extremely risky move but I think it was more of a well-thought out punt at what would best give him the win in the situation. gg no re | ||
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Backpack
United States1776 Posts
I also think that the gossip (that's what it is) that infests many threads on TL and other places just breeds negative attitudes. All it takes is one troll post in a LR thread and then 50 pages of rage come afterward. I've just about lost all faith in internet forums : / Tasteless once said "Teamliquid is like the Bank of America, it's too big to fail and I stopped using my account there 5 years ago." I can see why. edit: i got a little off-topic, but the quantity of angry posters wanting to share their anger with other angry posters just degrades most topics here into pointless arguments | ||
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CrazyF1r3f0x
United States2120 Posts
 Though calling MC a faggot is out of line; nice venting blog though ~_^ | ||
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loveeholicce
Korea (South)785 Posts
On April 13 2011 06:37 Roffles wrote: No one deserves to win a game. If you don't win, you don't deserve to win. Doesn't matter how you lose, how great you may be, or whatever. If you lose, you lost. Doesn't matter if you're Flash playing Hyuk and Hyuk does some gay 6 pool shit while you 14 CC'd. You didn't deserve to win that game. Nonsense i deserve to win every ZvP I play  Edit: I put my opinion on this in the DH thread and im lazy so il just copy paste that here There's a difference between being disappointed in the games and being disappointed in the player. I was disappointed by the last game, and in general I dislike watching MC because I dislike the abusive, all in style he employs in the vast majority of his games. That being said, I have nothing against MC himself. He tries to win and he picks strategies that play to his strengths (his micro) and cloud his *relative* weaknesses (his management). There's nothing wrong with that so theres really no reason to blame MC or hate on him but it still doesn't mean I don't find his games boring, stupid, and anti climatic, | ||
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PanN
United States2828 Posts
Sorry chumps, but it's apart of the game and if it worked, it was intelligent. | ||
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Turgid
United States1623 Posts
On April 13 2011 09:08 Backpack wrote: I think people have just been spoiled by BW and they havn't transitioned well. This whole idea that a game isn't entertaining unless each player has 5+ bases doesn't apply to SC2. I thought people would be used to lower base count and faster games by now but apparently a year wasn't enough. No way. Cheesing in up to 2(3 if you're REALLY crazy) games in a bo5 is actually a staple of BW. The complaining from people who miss BW is from people who hate it when EVERY game is a 1 base all-in, which is not nearly as true of SC2 anymore. All this complaining is about the cheese in one game of a series. Calm 4pooled Fantasy twice in the OSL semifinals  | ||
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PanN
United States2828 Posts
On April 13 2011 09:33 Turgid wrote: No way. Cheesing in up to 2(3 if you're REALLY crazy) games in a bo5 is actually a staple of BW. The complaining from people who miss BW is from people who hate it when EVERY game is a 1 base all-in, which is not nearly as true of SC2 anymore. All this complaining is about the cheese in one game of a series. Calm 4pooled Fantasy twice in the OSL semifinals Don't forget boxers bunker rush, I think thats the definition example of what we're currently discussing. | ||
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Liquid`Nazgul
22427 Posts
They entertain, but are not entertainers. Do you see the difference? They are athletes, and athletes entertain, but they are not entertainers in the sense that they need to go out of their way to amuse you. They amuse you with their skills and desire to win. | ||
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tdt
United States3179 Posts
On April 13 2011 09:08 Backpack wrote: I think people have just been spoiled by BW and they havn't transitioned well. This whole idea that a game isn't entertaining unless each player has 5+ bases doesn't apply to SC2. I thought people would be used to lower base count and faster games by now but apparently a year wasn't enough. I also think that the gossip (that's what it is) that infests many threads on TL and other places just breeds negative attitudes. All it takes is one troll post in a LR thread and then 50 pages of rage come afterward. I've just about lost all faith in internet forums : / Tasteless once said "Teamliquid is like the Bank of America, it's too big to fail and I stopped using my account there 5 years ago." I can see why. edit: i got a little off-topic, but the quantity of angry posters wanting to share their anger with other angry posters just degrades most topics here into pointless arguments I think they never were in the BW scene. Posts hover below 300 for people we are talking about. | ||
Liquid`Jinro
Sweden33723 Posts
Because thats what it was - a clutch as hell play, where he says fuck it, I could lose doing this but I think I will win more times than I lose, and more times than playing normally as well. To do that in the final game of a tournament where second place doesnt get shit, is clutch. If you cant respect that type of play, I dont think you get what makes a great player. | ||
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RoieTRS
United States2569 Posts
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SlapMySalami
United States1060 Posts
On April 13 2011 09:56 RoieTRS wrote: There is exactly as much hiveminding going on in this thread as there are in live report threads. thats the only explanation | ||
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svi
405 Posts
he knew that he had a high probability of winning, since white-bot never changes his early build. there was no luck involved in exploiting a player that plays like a computer. | ||
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aimaimaim
Philippines2167 Posts
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HolyArrow
United States7116 Posts
Instead, what I got was a great, intelligent post that I completely agree with. The sheer amount of MC bashing was just painfully annoying to read through. Fortunately, we also had plenty of actually intelligent posters refuting the whiners/haters, thus cementing my good faith in the general TL community. | ||
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Probulous
Australia3894 Posts
Jinro said it best On April 13 2011 09:47 Liquid`Jinro wrote: To do that in the final game of a tournament where second place doesnt get shit, is clutch. If you cant respect that type of play, I dont think you get what makes a great player. | ||
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HolyArrow
United States7116 Posts
On April 13 2011 06:37 RoieTRS wrote: boesthius I agree. Yet they have valid points. E-sports is an entertainment industry. And that stuff isn't entertaining. Sometimes I think, that even though I wouldn't have found this community if not for GSL classic so1, this entire thing would go back to being a cool kid's club. I don't like how MC is an image or a celebrity of sorts. He is just a player who is known for some things. I don't like how sponsors/KeSPA treated progamers in bw. I don't like how Esports is becoming an industry. I am probably the only one with this perspective. Effective wins by MC, but yeah, to restate, the complaints are legitimate because they are not entertaining games. Spectators feel cheated for wasting their time. But as a player, I can respect MC's decisions. There is a huge difference between spectators/audience and players. And it is getting too large. Hence "I don't like how esports is becoming an industry." I don't think it's a fact that cheese isn't entertaining, but you seem to be treating it like such. Different people find different things entertaining. Personally, when cheese occurs, my heartrate goes up and I go on the edge of my seat watching it all unfold. People need to stop speaking for everyone when they talk about what is and what isn't entertaining. I'm pretty sure that people with enough foresight and with good observational abilities will be entertained by realizing the mindgames and calculated strategy behind what MC does, rather than just seeing cheese, taking it only on surface value, and whining about it. | ||
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Joementum
787 Posts
On April 13 2011 10:17 aimaimaim wrote: Give him a break .. He just wants to be the 'Emperor' on SC2 :D No. No. And. No. There can only be one Emperor and no more. He may be a Prime Minister if he wishes, but no Emperor. | ||
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eviltomahawk
United States11135 Posts
On April 13 2011 10:31 Joementum wrote: No. No. And. No. There can only be one Emperor and no more. He may be a Prime Minister if he wishes, but no Emperor. He's already the President Protoss. I don't think he will run for reelection to be Prime Minister, unless he is a Putin. | ||
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