• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 07:36
CEST 13:36
KST 20:36
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
TL.net Map Contest #22 - Voting & Ladder Map Selection2Code S Season 2 (2026) - RO8 Preview5[ASL21] Finals Preview: Two Legacies21Code S Season 2 (2026) - RO12 Preview2herO wins GSL Code S Season 1 (2026)7
Community News
[BSL22] Non-Korean Championship from 13 to 28 June0Weekly Cups (May 25-31): Clem doubles, 2v2 circuit heads toward finale0StarCraft II 5.0.16 PTR Patch Notes may 26th139Weekly Cups (May 18-24): MaxPax wins doubles0Crank Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League5
StarCraft 2
General
StarCraft II 5.0.16 PTR Patch Notes may 26th My starcraft 2 changes The Death of Cheese: From a Professional Cheeser Oliveira Would Have Returned If EWC Continued SC2 Parody - "Somebody That I Used to Troll"
Tourneys
Maestros of The Game 2 announcement and schedule ! Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament RSL Revival: Season 5 - Qualifiers and Main Event Crank Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League GSL Code S Season 2 (2026)
Strategy
[G] Having the right mentality to improve
Custom Maps
[D]RTS in all its shapes and glory <3 [A] Nemrods 1/4 players
External Content
The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 528 Infection Detected Welcome to the External Content forum Mutation # 527 Hell Train
Brood War
General
FlaShFTW vs A.Alm Grudge Match Event [BSL22] Non-Korean Championship from 13 to 28 June vespene.gg — BW replays in browser Quality of life changes in BW that you will like ? Data analysis on 70 million replays
Tourneys
[ASL21] Grand Finals [Megathread] Daily Proleagues Escore Tournament StarCraft Season 2 [BSL22] WB Final & LB Semis - Saturday 21:00 CEST
Strategy
Any training maps people recommend? Muta micro map competition [G] Hydra ZvZ: An Introduction Fighting Spirit mining rates
Other Games
General Games
ZeroSpace Megathread Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Path of Exile Nintendo Switch Thread Warcraft III: The Frozen Throne
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Vanilla Mini Mafia Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas TL Mafia Community Thread Five o'clock TL Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread How cold is too cold to be outdoors? Dating: How's your luck? Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Trading/Investing Thread
Fan Clubs
The herO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
[Manga] One Piece Anime Discussion Thread [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread McBoner: A hockey love story TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 Formula 1 Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread Facing Challenges in Mobile App Development
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Esportsmanship: How to NOT B…
TrAiDoS
Why RTS gamers make better f…
gosubay
ramps on octagon
StaticNine
ASL S21 English Commentary…
namkraft
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 3921 users

wtf starcraft...

Blogs > JadeFist
Post a Reply
1 2 3 Next All
JadeFist
Profile Blog Joined August 2007
United States1225 Posts
January 08 2010 04:18 GMT
#1
No matter what I do, I cannot grasp starcraft.

I have been on and off for about 2.5 years (mostly off). I have played all 3 races. If I follow a build order, I lose anyway, I don't know what it is.

My APM is around 120, with average redundancy and null actions. But I still suck.

I cheesed my way up to D+ as zerg (4/5pool, 9pool speed, 1 base lurkers, 3hatch mass hydra). That's the best I can do.

Any legit strategy and I'm toast. If the game goes past 5 minutes I've probably lost. I'm so fucking frustrated.

Today, I was 12hatching versus protoss and he blocked my natural with a pylon. Alt+X+X. That's how pissed I was...

If a protoss 2gates I lose ever single time. I even read the topics on how to deal with it. The problem is, if I make sunkens he runs by them into my main.

I feel like what I am doing now is counterproductive. Is there any way for me to improve without so much frustration?

This rant is coming off this game,probably the most humiliating game I have ever played. (I am the zerg)

*
Motiva
Profile Joined November 2007
United States1774 Posts
January 08 2010 04:27 GMT
#2
You are too concerned w/ the results of your matches. You don't get a cookie for winning, and in fact if you just sat down and played 500 matches, it doesn't matter if your winning or losing, your still going to be a much better player at the end.

HaruHaru
Profile Blog Joined November 2009
United States988 Posts
January 08 2010 04:29 GMT
#3
watch some more pro games and watch what the pro's do. then just try to copy it
Long live BroodWar!
2minutevictory
Profile Joined December 2009
United States89 Posts
January 08 2010 04:35 GMT
#4
lol. i took the time to watch the replay. if that's the most humiliating game you've ever played then you haven't played many humiliating games =/=

When i was improving my friends frequently raped me with mass broodling/mass queens/mass das/mass nukes just to laugh at me. Now that i'm awesome and better at sc i can beat them 95% of the time

as for advice against 2gate..

it's ok if he attacks your buildings, you don't engage zealots with drones XD

you need to make 1/2 sunks if you just did something like letting your hatch go down to half hp while you get a bunch of zerglings. Or when he's not anywhere close to your base instead of getting a bunch of lings get like 4 to 8 sunkens( depending on when he's attacking) and block your ramp with lings

Another thing, when you've clearly lost the game and have no chance of coming back to win you should just gg and leave don't be stubborn like i was and try to win 1 base against 10.
intrudor
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
Canada446 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-01-08 04:38:43
January 08 2010 04:38 GMT
#5
the fact that Starcraft is the most competitive video game ever created could be escaping your attention. You have been on and off for about 2.5 years (mostly off). Maybe D/D+ players just practice more than you. D/D+ players are NOT necessarily horrible.. some of them are actually quite good...its just that C- users themselves are kinda good. Practice more. Play more. Win more. Talk less.
USER MIGHT BE WARNED FOR THIS COMMENT
Poriyan1
Profile Blog Joined April 2009
United States54 Posts
January 08 2010 04:50 GMT
#6
"I've missed more than 9,000 shots in my career. I've lost almost 300 games. Twenty-six times, I've been trusted to take the game-winning shot and missed. I've failed over and over and over again in my life. And that is why I succeed." -- M. Jordan.
n.Die Jaedong himself is a spoiler alert. ㅎㅎ
Count9
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
China10928 Posts
January 08 2010 04:54 GMT
#7
Don't miss ovies, make that your number 1 priority. Figure out when you're supposed to make ovies beyond the 9/9 and 17/18 marks (in single player), try to have a number ready all the way up to the 60s. Build orders are completely useless if you miss more than one ovie. (e.g. 3 hatch muta against terran, if you miss 1 ovie your lings + sunken will be late and you might just die to 1 group of mnm, missing 2 basically means useless mutas that run head straight into turrets, late hydra den, and you get rolled by mid game push) Missing 1-2 ovie hurts, missing 3+ basically cripples your entire game and you'll get rolled like that replay and will never get past the win with cheese stage.

Oh, and don't 12 hatch on python.
banana
Profile Joined January 2009
Netherlands1189 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-01-08 05:06:02
January 08 2010 05:02 GMT
#8
This might sound stupid since you are playing for so long and I've only starting actually playing a month ago, but my mindset changed from win and be as competative, to more humble (d-/d atm);

- play to improve, not to win or get a certain rank
- follow the one map, one strategy rule
- chose a strategy that relies on a lategame
- watch day9, there you'll understand that you should focus on establishing a midgame plan. If you have to deviate from your normal plan duo to proxy pylon, 2 gates or anything, just think to adjust and continue with your gameplan. No need for perfect counters just now.

If you can play a decent macro game, you'll be getting all the way to D+ reliably (keep in mind you only need 28% winrate to get to C- playing motw)

funsies : a hero http://www.iccup.com/starcraft/gamingprofile/dpakrhrh.html

T.O.P. *
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
Hong Kong4685 Posts
January 08 2010 05:17 GMT
#9
On January 08 2010 13:54 Count9 wrote:
Oh, and don't 12 hatch on python.

Don't listen to this guy. He has no idea what he's talking about.
Oracle comes in, Scvs go down, never a miscommunication.
BanZu
Profile Blog Joined June 2008
United States3329 Posts
January 08 2010 05:42 GMT
#10
Ok, first off, I'm going to tell you that one thread won't help enough. What you need is to have someone play with you, talk you through it, give you tips while you play, etc, etc. Talk to you about strategies. Just immerse yourself in the game, watch more games from the very start, play play/ob games on bnet (eh not that great but depending on your level, talking to people can help somewhat).

I'm not sure how much you know, how much effort you've put it, nor how you've tried to learn the game so I'm just going to say that you probably haven't done everything you could have done OR you haven't done it long enough.

Just keep trekking

Sun Tzu once said, "Defiler becomes useless at the presences of a vessel."
zer0das
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
United States8519 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-01-08 05:56:11
January 08 2010 05:49 GMT
#11
On January 08 2010 13:50 Poriyan1 wrote:
"I've missed more than 9,000 shots in my career. I've lost almost 300 games. Twenty-six times, I've been trusted to take the game-winning shot and missed. I've failed over and over and over again in my life. And that is why I succeed." -- M. Jordan.


The reason Michael Jordan succeeded was because in some random year he could tell you exactly how many game winning shots he had missed in his career. And I'm sure that it pissed him off and motivated him every time he thought about it (which was probably quite often).
RoieTRS
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
United States2569 Posts
January 08 2010 06:07 GMT
#12
Actually I've seen so many people get better at starcraft by not playing it for a while. At first I thought it was an absurd notion, but every time, when the person I know stops playing then comes back and practice a bit, they are much better than before.
konadora, in Racenilatr's blog: "you need to stop thinking about starcraft or anything computer-related for that matter. It's becoming a bad addiction imo"
writer22816
Profile Blog Joined September 2008
United States5775 Posts
January 08 2010 06:10 GMT
#13
Just chill and enjoy the game. Even D rank players are considered very good at RTS from a casual point of view and you can probably do pretty well on Bnet. That is assuming you're a solid D from playing standard.

Stop cheesing, play standard and have some fun.
8/4/12 never forget, never forgive.
Loser777
Profile Blog Joined January 2008
1931 Posts
January 08 2010 06:24 GMT
#14
I picked up the game in 2003... Barely can play low D TvZ.
6581
Glaucus
Profile Joined June 2009
479 Posts
January 08 2010 06:30 GMT
#15
If you 12 hatch on a 4 player map you know there's a 33% chance that your hatch will be pylon blocked in most ZvPs and there's nothing you can do about it? Why insta leave?
Cambium
Profile Blog Joined June 2004
United States16368 Posts
January 08 2010 06:32 GMT
#16
you are taking losses the wrong way, and don't cheese.
When you want something, all the universe conspires in helping you to achieve it.
Not_Computer
Profile Blog Joined January 2007
Canada2277 Posts
January 08 2010 06:32 GMT
#17
I see what you mean.

After watching the replay and reading your post, the main thing holding you back isn't in your hands but in your head - you nerves get to you when you're under pressure and you have trouble staying calm.
You're not alone though, this is a problem that a lot of players of all levels have to deal with (especially pros on televised games).

When you scouted the 2 gate (or even if you didn't, but if you felt early pressure was coming), you should have saved up 3 larvae instead of 2, so you would get 6 lings immediately instead of just 4.
Then as you go, pay attention to the number of zealots coming in and make just enough lings to hold them off until you can get your sunken up and block the ramp.

What you did instead was panic. You sent out all but one of your drones to fend off the initial 1 zealot + 2 probe rush/early pressure/harass and he simply outmicroed you and made you waste precious mining time. Then you made way too many creep colonies and attempted to morph them all into sunkens while they were being attacked. By the time they finished morphing they were dead.

Of course the downside was that he ran up your ramp into your main, but you didn't need to waste the 2 drone + 150 minerals to make those two creeps that died.

You could have spent the minerals making zerglings (you had 5 larvae unused, 150 minerals spent on creep colonies, and 98 minerals unused at that specific moment), and although yes they take time to hatch and your main is being prodded, stay calm and let it happen. Leave two to block the ramp and prevent reinforcements and take the rest and do a proper surround and get rid of the intruders.
You probably also noticed your own over-reaction when you made 3 creep colonies but realized you only needed to morph one.

The rest of the game was just your opponent being bm and messing with you. The game was over after the first 5 minutes, though maybe a slim chance of a comeback if he made a big mistake or you managed to miraculously prevent him from expanding all over the map.

Perhaps if he didn't tell you to leave by saying "re?" you would have left by yourself, but stayed behind because of his bm.

Another example of you panicking is when he sent a scout into your main to distract you. You fell for it, made two spore colonies (for just a single scout) meanwhile your front gets stormed and 1a2a3a-ed (though by now it didn't matter because the game was over anyway).

But ya, as the other posters have said before me, just relax and let a loss be a loss.
"Jaedong hyung better be ready. I'm going to order the most expensive dinner in Korea."
jello24
Profile Joined July 2009
Canada327 Posts
January 08 2010 06:35 GMT
#18
On January 08 2010 13:50 Poriyan1 wrote:
"I've missed more than 9,000 shots in my career. I've lost almost 300 games. Twenty-six times, I've been trusted to take the game-winning shot and missed. I've failed over and over and over again in my life. And that is why I succeed." -- M. Jordan.

The reason Michael Jordan succeeded was because he had Dennis Rodman with him. God people not giving credit where credit is due.
just lurking around...
Zoler
Profile Blog Joined June 2008
Sweden6339 Posts
January 08 2010 07:49 GMT
#19
On January 08 2010 13:18 JadeFist wrote:
I have been on and off for about 2.5 years (mostly off). I have played all 3 races. If I follow a build order, I lose anyway, I don't know what it is.


That's why you lose, 80% of improving is knowing why you lose.
Lim Yo Hwan forever!
ThunderGod
Profile Blog Joined February 2009
New Zealand897 Posts
January 08 2010 07:53 GMT
#20
Why do you want so badly to be better? It is certainly a difficult game to be "good" at.
Serious question though, have a proper think about this and you will either resolve to train more effectively - e.g. studying reps/practising more - or you will just start playing for fun (like a lot of people who get frustrated at laddering).
"Certain forms of popular music nowadays, namely rap and hip hop styles, are just irritating gangsters bragging about their illegal exploits and short-sighted lifestyles." - Shiverfish ~2009
1 2 3 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Kung Fu Cup
11:00
#10
WardiTV458
IntoTheiNu 436
Rex83
SteadfastSC81
Liquipedia
The PondCast
10:00
Episode 95
CranKy Ducklings SOOP36
CranKy Ducklings35
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Ryung 353
ProTech84
Rex 83
SteadfastSC 81
gerald23 22
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 37276
Rain 15573
Calm 10432
Shuttle 1397
Horang2 759
actioN 719
Mini 329
BeSt 299
Last 156
Pusan 140
[ Show more ]
EffOrt 130
Sharp 111
hero 107
Rush 104
Shine 88
ToSsGirL 78
Liquid`Ret 75
PianO 75
Zeus 75
ggaemo 67
sSak 42
JYJ 35
Shinee 35
[sc1f]eonzerg 28
sorry 24
Sacsri 20
IntoTheRainbow 17
Hm[arnc] 12
zelot 12
Movie 9
Noble 8
Dota 2
Dendi768
League of Legends
Reynor69
Counter-Strike
olofmeister2715
shoxiejesuss1378
zeus595
allub201
Other Games
B2W.Neo558
Lowko338
Happy212
DeMusliM125
Livibee70
RuFF_SC216
Organizations
StarCraft: Brood War
UltimateBattle 40
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
[ Show 15 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Gemini_19 31
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• iopq 6
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Nemesis5667
• Jankos2595
• Stunt825
Upcoming Events
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
3h 24m
Maestros of the Game
3h 54m
ByuN vs herO
Rogue vs Bunny
Replay Cast
12h 24m
Replay Cast
21h 24m
WardiTV Spring Champion…
23h 24m
OSC
1d 1h
Maestros of the Game
1d 3h
Serral vs Percival
SHIN vs ShoWTimE
Replay Cast
1d 21h
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
2 days
Maestros of the Game
2 days
Clem vs Lambo
Zoun vs SKillous
[ Show More ]
Replay Cast
2 days
Solar vs Classic
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
3 days
Grudge Match
3 days
FlaShFTW vs A.Alm
GSL
3 days
herO vs Rogue
Maru vs Cure
Patches Events
4 days
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
4 days
BSL
4 days
Replay Cast
4 days
Monday Night Weeklies
5 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
5 days
Replay Cast
6 days
Kung Fu Cup
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

KK 2v2 League Season 1
RSL Revival: Season 5
Heroes Pulsing #1

Ongoing

BSL Season 22
IPSL Spring 2026
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 2
Acropolis #4
CSCL: Masked Kings S4
YSL S3
SCTL 2026 Spring
WardiTV Spring 2026
Maestros of the Game 2
2026 GSL S2
Murky Cup 2026
IEM Cologne Major 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
PGL Astana 2026
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026
IEM Rio 2026
PGL Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 1
BLAST Open Spring 2026

Upcoming

BSL 22 Non-Korean Championship
CSLAN 4
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
CranK Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League
HSC XXIX
uThermal 2v2 2026 Main Event
Heroes Pulsing #3
Heroes Pulsing #2
Esports World Cup 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual
Stake Ranked Episode 3
XSE Pro League 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.