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Russian Federation1381 Posts
On June 12 2009 07:17 FabledIntegral wrote:Show nested quote +On June 12 2009 07:11 Jayme wrote:On June 12 2009 06:55 FabledIntegral wrote:Personally, if you look at WHO he has beaten, it isn't a highly impressive array of victims. No doubt he's absolutely tearing it up, but at the same time, I think there's little question that Jaedong and Bisu are still better. + Show Spoiler +Jaedong dropping one game doesn't mean shittt I voted an equal mix of random + effort improving. He's prob a top 5 player now though, underneath Flash, Jaedong, Bisu, and one other random player I'm not thinking about. Uh WHAT? his array of victories isn't full of no names either. Stork Mind Luxury (allthough he sucks) Flash Jaedong etc. Out of 25 wins about 6 of them were vs impressive players. The rest were scrubs. Almost no one on that list is a scrub, most are above average pros.
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I'm actually not sure which part of FabledIntegral's post people are objecting to. It seems pretty reasonable to me.
"Scrubs" is probably exaggeration, but he has a valid point that assuming Effort is close to/at Bisu/JD level, then most of his opponents in that streak were severe underdogs
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On June 12 2009 07:17 FabledIntegral wrote:Show nested quote +On June 12 2009 07:11 Jayme wrote:On June 12 2009 06:55 FabledIntegral wrote:Personally, if you look at WHO he has beaten, it isn't a highly impressive array of victims. No doubt he's absolutely tearing it up, but at the same time, I think there's little question that Jaedong and Bisu are still better. + Show Spoiler +Jaedong dropping one game doesn't mean shittt I voted an equal mix of random + effort improving. He's prob a top 5 player now though, underneath Flash, Jaedong, Bisu, and one other random player I'm not thinking about. Uh WHAT? his array of victories isn't full of no names either. Stork Mind Luxury (allthough he sucks) Flash Jaedong etc. Out of 25 wins about 6 of them were vs impressive players. The rest were scrubs.
So what? 6 impressive wins, 19 less impressive wins, and 3 losses to worthy opponents --- what are you trying to say?
In my book that's an amazing record.
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27-0 oov on zerg :D unless that dont count T.T
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On June 12 2009 07:28 geegee1 wrote: 27-0 oov on zerg :D unless that dont count T.T
yeah but that was just vs zerg, there were interspersed losses vs other races in there. I still think oov's start might be better, though.
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Kentor
United States5784 Posts
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On June 12 2009 07:25 Djabanete wrote:Show nested quote +On June 12 2009 07:17 FabledIntegral wrote:On June 12 2009 07:11 Jayme wrote:On June 12 2009 06:55 FabledIntegral wrote:Personally, if you look at WHO he has beaten, it isn't a highly impressive array of victims. No doubt he's absolutely tearing it up, but at the same time, I think there's little question that Jaedong and Bisu are still better. + Show Spoiler +Jaedong dropping one game doesn't mean shittt I voted an equal mix of random + effort improving. He's prob a top 5 player now though, underneath Flash, Jaedong, Bisu, and one other random player I'm not thinking about. Uh WHAT? his array of victories isn't full of no names either. Stork Mind Luxury (allthough he sucks) Flash Jaedong etc. Out of 25 wins about 6 of them were vs impressive players. The rest were scrubs. So what? 6 impressive wins, 19 less impressive wins, and 3 losses to worthy opponents --- what are you trying to say? In my book that's an amazing record.
It is an amazing record. Just not an unprecedented one.
Leta was running hot similarly with a record of 24-3 earlier this year
http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/players/185_Leta/games#tblt-3786-3-1-DESC
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While Effort has improved greatly, and in my opinion is on his way of contending Jaedong in the future, do not forget that the maps generally favor Zergs these days, and he may have been lucky here and there.
CJ fighting anyway !
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I voted on effOrt being amazing. Anyone who can take games off Flash, Stork, July, and Jaedong is brilliant.
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It's a good run of matches on a pretty favorable set of maps. He's good to be sure, very good even, but I really can't see him hanging with the big boys deep in a starleague yet. He reminds me of a zerg version of Leta.
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When you look at the opponent list, it isn't that special.
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On June 12 2009 07:16 Fontong wrote:Show nested quote +On June 12 2009 06:55 FabledIntegral wrote:Personally, if you look at WHO he has beaten, it isn't a highly impressive array of victims. No doubt he's absolutely tearing it up, but at the same time, I think there's little question that Jaedong and Bisu are still better. + Show Spoiler +Jaedong dropping one game doesn't mean shittt I voted an equal mix of random + effort improving. He's prob a top 5 player now though, underneath Flash, Jaedong, Bisu, and one other random player I'm not thinking about. Yeah, beating Jaedong, Luxury, Stork, free, Mind, Hiya, July, fOrGG, and Flash means NOTHING. Seriously, anyone could do this. Even fucking tester could go on a 10 game streak playing scrubs like the ones Effort has played. God, may as well get some random BGHer on East to play these people - no doubt he would at least go 50/50. qft man, qft
Dont mess with Tester, he has 100% wins against Jaedong AND Flash.
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United States10774 Posts
On June 12 2009 07:41 rushz0rz wrote: When you look at the opponent list, it isn't that special. What the fuck? I am by no means a fan of EffOrt or CJ but I don't understand how you can say this. He beat Flash, Stork, Jaedong, Mind, and several other good players. The three losses come from Bisu at his best PvZ ,Yellow's ZvZ, and Mind in which EffOrt won the series anyway. What he's doing right now is very special and impressive. I honestly don't know what you guys expect to see. Consecutive BO3 victories against Jaedong, Bisu, and Flash? Of course he still has lots to prove, at least until he wins or comes close to winning an individual title. Still, it's pretty amazing.
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T.O.P.
Hong Kong4685 Posts
Effort wins because he is Savior's apprentice. Unlike the other zergs out there. Effort does 3 hatch every game, truly Savior style.
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United States2186 Posts
From what I've seen Effort's ZvT does not resemble Savior's at all (i,e he lacks Savior's tactical brilliance but makes up for it with ridiculous mechanics).
Can anyone recommend some vods that show Effort's ZvT at his best?
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Yeah this guy is no joke. He has beaten alot of good names. Mind in a bo3 Baby Hiya Forgg FLASH.
Those are just some terrans.
Protoss, free, Stork, and Pure(who was really strong quite some time ago). Oh yeah Sangho is no joke either. You can't think he is bad. He's got alot of talent.
Lux Jaedong Hyvaa and July. Come on those guys are writing the BOOK on zvz. You can't say this is random. He is just under the radar, and thats the scariest opponent when you do not know how good they really are and they don't get that much attention. I mean, sure everyone knows Jaedong. But Effort is more dismissed when you hear his name. Hes probably the main reason CJ is so high ranked in proleague this season.
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United States10774 Posts
MSL + Show Spoiler +His game vs HiyA was pretty damn good. It was complete dominance though.
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He's been beating StarLeague winners. Thats more than enough proof this guy is someone to watch besides the three giants in Jaedong Flash and Bisu. Thats not to say he will win them during individual leagues. But he is punching the clock, day in day out. Get outta here naysayers.
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United States13896 Posts
On June 12 2009 07:50 Ver wrote: From what I've seen Effort's ZvT does not resemble Savior's at all (i,e he lacks Savior's tactical brilliance but makes up for it with ridiculous mechanics).
Can anyone recommend some vods that show Effort's ZvT at his best? His game vs Flash in PL a while back was the best I've ever seen his ZvT imo.
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I think people who choose random variance or evenly split variance and practice is not looking at all and doesn't know what they are talking about. Sure you look at results but do you watch the game!? Come back till you do.
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