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On December 14 2013 22:41 sidesprang wrote:My reasons for voting on Vayne D1: He does nothing, tunnelvisions on slam, the easiest safest target to go on in the start. Just a policy lynch, if it goes through it dont tell us anything about Vayne regardless of how it flips. N1: Tells us day 2 is when the real game will start. D2: Does nothing despite the real game having started, goes on the easiest safest target to go on again LSB. Dont provide any insight. Is more disruptive than helpfull to the town. That is why I wanna lynch Vayne. He is like an Day 1 Alakaslam just without speaking in code. The fact that If we lynch him we can learn from his flip, is just a bonus. If you read my filter and put the pieces togheter you could have seen this. But I guess I also could have put this case togheter when making the vote. Did not really take me that long 
I won't disagree on the issue of VA being unhelpful, but I think he's more likely town at the moment. And I'd rather lynch scum.
By the way, how is LSB's flip uninformative? I'm actually starting to think that it could be one of the most informative lynches out there. For example, his scum flip would put Artanis in a worse light, and overall this LSB wagon would be neat to analyze if he flips scum (also if he flips town, but to a lesser extent). There's been some decent resistance/counter-pushing to it.
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where do i find who xatalos is currently voting for??
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##Unvote:
I need to think about this. I don't think LSB is a good lynch either. I don't think you are right kush in saying he played a lot better in PYP because even if you were right you can't know that because noone in this game has flipped scum. On top of that LSB's reads have been far more clear than they were in PYP so i don't know where you are getting your info.
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On December 14 2013 23:01 kushm4sta wrote:
where do i find who xatalos is currently voting for??
Artanis, why?
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Xatalos can you give me a recap of your current case on Artanis?
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But actually, yeah, LSB would be decent. I'm content with that for today. It should also shed some more light on Artanis.
##Unvote
##Vote LSB
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On December 14 2013 23:07 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Xatalos can you give me a recap of your current case on Artanis?
Simply put:
1) Illogical stance on me/Corazon at the start (I was scummy since I was - intentionally! - grabbing attention, yet Corazon was town for - unintentionally! - grabbing attention)
2) Scummy bandwagon vote on Spag
3) Weak case on me that painted me as scum for null/towny traits
4) Overall lazy and illogical play
5) Potentially a connection with LSB (?)
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AFK for a bit, but I'll be back ASAP.
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Vote Count
LSB (6): VayneAuthority, Kushm4sta, Alakaslam, Coagulation, Plutarch, Xatalos
VayneAuthority (3): JarJarDrinks, xigxag, sidesprang
Xatalos (1): ArtanisXp
Kushm4sta (1): Blazinghand
sidesprang (1): LSB
raynpelikoneet (1): purpletrator
NOT VOTING: Grackaroni, raynpelikoneet
Currently LSB is set to be lynched.
Let me know if I missed anyone!
Deadline is in
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On December 14 2013 22:20 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Btw all the votes on Vayne are lazy as fuck. I assume u mean "All except JJD" since I've been working on getting vayne lynched forever.
But FWIW I agree w/ you about the other votes. Xigxag didn't give any reason @ all and I really don't like sidesprings explaination. Like, sides reasonig was really weak. I gave a bunch of great reasons throughout the last few days for vayne being scummy and all he could come up w/ is: He tunneled slam/He hasn't scumhunted.
He's clearly not reading the thread and just did a quick filter read of Vayne. But he could easily be a townie doin that.
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@rayn you are thinking about endgame lsb when he stopped caring. Early game he was really smart and good.
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On December 14 2013 23:42 kushm4sta wrote:
@rayn you are thinking about endgame lsb when he stopped caring. Early game he was really smart and good.
Early game he did nothing but told people to massclaim. I don't know where you get that "good"..
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This LSB wagon sucks people. Can we please find a new target. People I'd rather lynch than LSB:
Vayne, Purple, Sidespring, Xatalos, Kush
Can we switch to one of those? Preferaby Vayne since ya know, he was almost lynched yesterday and he was saved last minute.
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I have a town tell on Vayne that I don't want to reveal, but I feel it is pretty reliable.
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I'm going to sauna soon. I read Artanis and purple again and i think they are most likely to flip mafia.
I don't think either of LSB / Vayne is scum. Plutarch issue will solve itself later on in the game. JJD and Grack look town to me aswell. So does kush and Slam. Xatalos is a questionmark to me. Other people are some lurkers that could go either way, but i don't think sidesprang is a good lynch as he is at least trying to play the game. Won't even talk about BH because town.
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I think we need to lynch Xatalos. His response to you calling him out was bullshit.
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The Vayne Case
This is to consolodate what U've already said and there's also some new stuff. Please read.
Point 1 - His policy Lynch of Slam
Here's where he explains why he's willing to vote for Slam whether or he's scum or not:
On December 10 2013 09:15 VayneAuthority wrote:
I would rather enjoy myself and lose then not enjoy it, hence why I am voting you alakaslam, scum or not. I do not care about lynching scum if im not having fun in the first place, that comes first.
OK, so here he says that winning is only his 2nd goal. Having fun comes first. OK, nothing really alignment indicative in that.
He wants to policy lynch slam becase Slam being in the game prevents him from having fun... But for some reason, that only applies to day one:
On December 12 2013 07:02 VayneAuthority wrote:
To be clear we don't have time to waste on alakaslam now so I'm ignoring him from now on scum or not. Real game starts after the flip tomorrow, see you then.
Why couldn't he just ignore him on day 1 as well? Or why is he now all of a sudden letting enjoying the game take a back seat to winning?
Point 2 - He know Spag was town
Here's where I first post about it:
On December 12 2013 03:36 JarJarDrinks wrote:Also, I think this is a slip: Show nested quote +On December 12 2013 02:29 VayneAuthority wrote:On December 12 2013 02:24 raynpelikoneet wrote:On December 12 2013 02:20 VayneAuthority wrote:On December 12 2013 02:17 raynpelikoneet wrote:On December 12 2013 02:14 VayneAuthority wrote:
I have one goal today and one goal only. If you think I would help town get rid of alakaslam as scum I can't help you. That's actually quite an interesting comment Vayne. What you very well know is that even if Slam doesn't get lynched he will most likely get shot on N1. Why would you not help get rid of him as scum, regardless of his alignment? On December 11 2013 13:10 VayneAuthority wrote:
Considering the decent resistance in this game at the day 1 stage I would say there is actually a decent chance for him to flip scum combined with the points I have already made. There is quite a group of people that have pretty much ignored him altogether, which is what I usually do. I would like a better reason on why we shouldn't lynch him besides "lol vigi" because we all know nobody uses their vig shots like that; they always end up being hero vig shots. I've already pretty much answered all of this In this game the thread sentiment actually suggests vigi's WILL shoot useless people. Let's consider a scenario where you are scum. If Slam is scum you: 1) can reasonably assume a vigi will shoot him on N1 anyways so 2) when you lynch him instead you gain towncredit 3) even if you don't succeed, you gain town credit when he flips red 4) you don't need to contribute anything useful If Slam is town you: 1) can't be held responsible for anything scummy because it's a pro-town thing to suggest a policy lynch on him anyways 2) you don't need to contribute anything useful So, why again is it unreasonable to assume you would vouch for his lynch as mafia? because I would never, ever help town get rid of somebody so detrimental to town. He adds another scumplayer to my team, why would I want to get rid of him ever? I could just sheep you on spag or something dumb like that. I know exactly what it looks like. Then when rayn calls him out about it, he says: Show nested quote +On December 12 2013 02:33 VayneAuthority wrote:On December 12 2013 02:31 raynpelikoneet wrote:On December 12 2013 02:29 VayneAuthority wrote:On December 12 2013 02:24 raynpelikoneet wrote:On December 12 2013 02:20 VayneAuthority wrote:On December 12 2013 02:17 raynpelikoneet wrote:On December 12 2013 02:14 VayneAuthority wrote:
I have one goal today and one goal only. If you think I would help town get rid of alakaslam as scum I can't help you. That's actually quite an interesting comment Vayne. What you very well know is that even if Slam doesn't get lynched he will most likely get shot on N1. Why would you not help get rid of him as scum, regardless of his alignment? On December 11 2013 13:10 VayneAuthority wrote:
Considering the decent resistance in this game at the day 1 stage I would say there is actually a decent chance for him to flip scum combined with the points I have already made. There is quite a group of people that have pretty much ignored him altogether, which is what I usually do. I would like a better reason on why we shouldn't lynch him besides "lol vigi" because we all know nobody uses their vig shots like that; they always end up being hero vig shots. I've already pretty much answered all of this In this game the thread sentiment actually suggests vigi's WILL shoot useless people. Let's consider a scenario where you are scum. If Slam is scum you: 1) can reasonably assume a vigi will shoot him on N1 anyways so 2) when you lynch him instead you gain towncredit 3) even if you don't succeed, you gain town credit when he flips red 4) you don't need to contribute anything useful If Slam is town you: 1) can't be held responsible for anything scummy because it's a pro-town thing to suggest a policy lynch on him anyways 2) you don't need to contribute anything useful So, why again is it unreasonable to assume you would vouch for his lynch as mafia? because I would never, ever help town get rid of somebody so detrimental to town. He adds another scumplayer to my team, why would I want to get rid of him ever? I could just sheep you on spag or something dumb like that. I know exactly what it looks like. Fair enough, just wanted to be sure what you meant. Are you suggesting Spaghetticus is town? Yea he was one of the first to want to lynch Slam so I have him as town until further notice. A few moments earlier when kush asked him what he thought of spag and cora, he refused to answer. Why not say you have a townread on someone that is picking up votes? It only became something he was willing to discuss to cover up his slip. and yes I realize that this likely makes spag town.
He say's that if he was scum, he would just sheep the case against spag. How exactly does he know that Spag is town and why hasn't he mentioned it before?
Then he answers vaynes question by saying he figured Spag was town because he "was one of the first to want to lynch Slam". Well why would him wanting to lynch your policy lynch make he town?
Point 3 - The Contradiction
This is all well documented. SO just gonna repost what I've said already:
On December 12 2013 02:50 JarJarDrinks wrote:Show nested quote +On December 12 2013 02:41 kushm4sta wrote:On December 12 2013 02:39 VayneAuthority wrote:
it's not ridiculous at all if you consider how I play mafia. I KILL these kind of players at night because I find it more enjoyable to play with people that can actually scumhunt and try to trick them. Between that and my blue kill sniping I don't see how it is farfetch'd at all. So you would never push a mislynch on slam because he is so bad for town, but you would nk him??/ that makes no sense. ##unvote
##vote VayneAuthorityComplete contradiction Show nested quote +On December 12 2013 02:29 VayneAuthority wrote:On December 12 2013 02:24 raynpelikoneet wrote:On December 12 2013 02:20 VayneAuthority wrote:On December 12 2013 02:17 raynpelikoneet wrote:On December 12 2013 02:14 VayneAuthority wrote:
I have one goal today and one goal only. If you think I would help town get rid of alakaslam as scum I can't help you. That's actually quite an interesting comment Vayne. What you very well know is that even if Slam doesn't get lynched he will most likely get shot on N1. Why would you not help get rid of him as scum, regardless of his alignment? On December 11 2013 13:10 VayneAuthority wrote:
Considering the decent resistance in this game at the day 1 stage I would say there is actually a decent chance for him to flip scum combined with the points I have already made. There is quite a group of people that have pretty much ignored him altogether, which is what I usually do. I would like a better reason on why we shouldn't lynch him besides "lol vigi" because we all know nobody uses their vig shots like that; they always end up being hero vig shots. I've already pretty much answered all of this In this game the thread sentiment actually suggests vigi's WILL shoot useless people. Let's consider a scenario where you are scum. If Slam is scum you: 1) can reasonably assume a vigi will shoot him on N1 anyways so 2) when you lynch him instead you gain towncredit 3) even if you don't succeed, you gain town credit when he flips red 4) you don't need to contribute anything useful If Slam is town you: 1) can't be held responsible for anything scummy because it's a pro-town thing to suggest a policy lynch on him anyways 2) you don't need to contribute anything useful So, why again is it unreasonable to assume you would vouch for his lynch as mafia? because I would never, ever help town get rid of somebody so detrimental to town. He adds another scumplayer to my team, why would I want to get rid of him ever? I could just sheep you on spag or something dumb like that. I know exactly what it looks like.
On December 12 2013 04:01 JarJarDrinks wrote:Show nested quote +On December 12 2013 03:52 VayneAuthority wrote:On December 12 2013 03:51 Grackaroni wrote:On December 12 2013 03:47 VayneAuthority wrote:
not to mention that it isn't even a contradiction to begin with, YOU SEE ME GETTING RID OF ALAKASLAM IN THE THREAD. YOU DON'T KNOW THAT I GOT RID OF HIM IF I'M MAFIA. good lord. it is a contradiction if you say you are town for getting rid of the 4th mafia and that you would leave him in as scum. Then you admit that you would get rid of him because you like a real game. Night killing him for the hell of it is no different than lynching him for the hell of it when you could get a better lynch from 'dumping your vote on spaghetti" I don't think you realize the difference between pushing somebody in thread and night killing them. Hint: one can be seen by everybody, the other cannot. Lmao "He adds another scumplayer to my team, why would I want to get rid of him ever?" That's your quote right there bud. Explain why you'd want to nightkill a scumplayer if you were scum. Or don't since like you said: You'd never want to get rid of him ever. That's pretty definate statement right there. Saying that you would NK him as scum is a 100% contradiction. You're saying that Slam is a scum asset that scum would want to stay in the game no matter what.
And another similiar contradiction:
On December 12 2013 05:55 JarJarDrinks wrote:Show nested quote +On December 12 2013 05:52 Xatalos wrote:On December 12 2013 05:50 raynpelikoneet wrote:On December 12 2013 05:49 Xatalos wrote:On December 12 2013 05:43 raynpelikoneet wrote:On December 12 2013 05:41 Xatalos wrote:
I really don't like the Spag wagon. It has both Artanis and purple... And neither of them provided any reasoning for voting him. The problem is not the voters. I have the same problem (well not really with purple, as he basically chose between spag/vayne)... It's that Spag is so fucking scummy and the evidence is far better than on vayne. I'm not still sure why VA is #2 in votes. Apparently he contradicted himself, but why is he scum just for that? It's not like he needed to talk about how he'd love to NK / lynch Alakaslam. Yes he needed, did you read? I confronted him about his thoughts on lynching Slam. I read through pretty fast. Gonna reread that portion. ALso this: Show nested quote +On December 12 2013 04:26 raynpelikoneet wrote:Here is another one. On December 11 2013 13:03 VayneAuthority wrote:
I hope he flips town so I am actually justified in saying that he is hindering the game. If he's scum he can do whatever the fuck he wants. Read that portal game by greymist if you want to see how hard it is to lynch this guy as scum. His entire team bussed him and he still barely got lynched. nuff said. On December 11 2013 13:10 VayneAuthority wrote:
Considering the decent resistance in this game at the day 1 stage I would say there is actually a decent chance for him to flip scum combined with the points I have already made. There is quite a group of people that have pretty much ignored him altogether, which is what I usually do. I would like a better reason on why we shouldn't lynch him besides "lol vigi" because we all know nobody uses their vig shots like that; they always end up being hero vig shots. ... i really don't get it.. i really don't...
Point 4 - He tried to say that the Alaska vote was more than just a policy vote and then abandoned it.
On December 11 2013 13:10 VayneAuthority wrote:
Considering the decent resistance in this game at the day 1 stage I would say there is actually a decent chance for him to flip scum combined with the points I have already made. There is quite a group of people that have pretty much ignored him altogether, which is what I usually do. I would like a better reason on why we shouldn't lynch him besides "lol vigi" because we all know nobody uses their vig shots like that; they always end up being hero vig shots.
On December 11 2013 13:11 VayneAuthority wrote:
As I said earlier, this isn't policy lynch anymore btw. I am now starting a real discussion on why he is a good lynch.
On December 11 2013 13:34 VayneAuthority wrote:
Let's try this the other way around
can anyone explain to me why alakaslam will not flip scum besides probability? that's one thing he has going for him.
On December 12 2013 02:16 VayneAuthority wrote:
yes, because he doesn't actually post things that can be read. The only time he will ever get lynched is if his entire team throws him under the bus for cred like in portal
Then as I pointed out above he says that we don't have time to waste on slam anymore. Why not pursue your scum read anymore? ESPECIALLY since it's someone you want out of the game based on policy.
Point 5 - The scum slip.
This is also something I already talked alot about so will just repost what I've said:
On December 13 2013 06:14 JarJarDrinks wrote:Show nested quote +On December 13 2013 06:08 VayneAuthority wrote:
so yea HF got doublestacked by mafia and our vig, too strong Well my first thought was that the mafia kill got healed. But I guess you'd know who mafia shot @. ##vote VayneAuthority
On December 13 2013 06:52 JarJarDrinks wrote:Who could possibly read this: Show nested quote +On December 13 2013 05:59 [UoN]Sentinel wrote:
Holyflare the Medic has been shot by an ass-bullet! and come to the conclusion that he was double killed. My first thought was "Do we have a town roleblocker?" then when I realized we didn't, I was like: Oh I guess scum shot was healed. It didn't even cross my mind that "shot by an ass-bullet" could mean that he was shot by both vig and scum. And I checked w/ Sent. He confirmed that it could indeed mean that he was double shot.
On December 14 2013 04:55 JarJarDrinks wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2013 04:44 VayneAuthority wrote:
I realized after that medic could have also saved but I had thought HF one of the more townie people day 1 so I figured he was just double shot since it is more likely then a save.
Simple probability OK, but it specifically said "Shot by an ASS-bullet". So basically, there were 2 deaths. One says that the person was vig-killed, the other says the person was SK-killed. Why would you not assume that a person killed by mafia would get a similiar cause of death?
And then he tried to cook up 2 different excuses for it:On December 14 2013 05:17 JarJarDrinks wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2013 05:09 VayneAuthority wrote:
you really need to take a step back and realize that you are basing your entire game off of something that isn't alignment indicative at all. Stop. Ur very aware I voted you yesterday and have been trying to get you lynched well before this latest scumslip. Show nested quote +On December 14 2013 05:09 VayneAuthority wrote:I always post a stream of consciousness after a phase ends without thinking much about what I am saying. So now your excuse is that you weren't thinking much about what you're saying? A second ago you said that you used simple probablity and thought that HF was shot because he was so townie. Show nested quote +On December 14 2013 04:44 VayneAuthority wrote:
I realized after that medic could have also saved but I had thought HF one of the more townie people day 1 so I figured he was just double shot since it is more likely then a save.
Simple probability So which is it?
Can anyone really tell me that there's a better case for LSB (or anyone else for that matter)?
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I can do that too, but ugh.. Like they look equally bad with Artanis and call each other out for same things they do themselves. But i feel like Xatalos is putting far more effort into the game than Artanis.
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JJD the problem is i kinda get Vayne. He uses a lot of absolutes in his posts and when he explained those "scumslips" he meant it differently than how we read it. It's also his behavior. Vayne is way more tryhard and cooperative as mafia. When he is town he does like policy lynches, especially Slam, i totally get that from him and the whole attitude towards Slam. When people accuse him he basically says "fuck you" to all of them and does not even try to be reasonable. He goes "lynch me fuckers, here are my reads i don't care if you listen to me or not and i am not going to defend myself".
That's exactly what he is doing in this game, and it's not what he does as mafia. As mafia he cares about his team winning and pushes scum agenda and that's definitely not what he is doing here.
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Come back to game, suddenly I'm being lynched.
Anyways ray, at this point its either me or VA. Gotta make your decision now. Would greatly prefer a different lynch by alas, no one has been working on serious reads
##unvote
##Vote: VayneAuthority
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EPT
