EPTDoA's Post about SC2 vs LoL blah blah blah - Page 12
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ImbaTosS
United Kingdom1666 Posts
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Steveling
Greece10806 Posts
It's so easy clicking on targets in these games that they offer no reward for my aiming skillz. Try to snipe someone on quake, now that's a challenge. | ||
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imre
France9263 Posts
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rabidch
United States20287 Posts
On February 05 2013 20:22 OutlaW- wrote: I don't know if this discussion is still going on, but maybe a perspective from player who played dota for 3 years, then starcraft 2 for 2 years and now League for a year and a half can add something. League definitely takes less skill to play than Dota and Starcraft, anyone who says otherwise is being delusional. But that doesn't make League a worse game. It just means what it means. I have much more respect for Sc2 pros and Dota pros than I do for League pros, but that doesn't mean that League pros are inferior players or something - they're doing their best to play their game and that's worthy of respect, too. We live in a world that's based around profits, so, (un)fortunately, the most popular game is the one that gets the most money and that has the most promising future. This is League of legends. I can understand why it makes people like you (dota and starcraft players) angry, because you feel (and rightly so, it's your opinion after all) that your game is superior. That's why when you see players playing this "inferior" game and get more money and more fame and a more promising future than you, you get angry. This is understandable. But there really is no need to start hating on it publicly. All that shows is a certain immaturity of not being able to overcome the shortcomings of your game (popularity is a valid attribute). Another thing you could be blaming is the viewers. But it's not really their fault for liking something else than you, is it? This is why I think there is no need to wage wars between the communities. The games are different and cater to to different people. Maybe Blizzard/Valve should have made different decisions to seize the popularity that Riot has. I don't see how this is the fault of the players who play and enjoy the game, nor the viewers who watch it. "People should like the game that I do and everyone who doesn't is an idiot" is incredibly immature and is the basis of most bashing towards League. The fact that League takes less mechanical skill than the other games is completely and utterly irrelevant - you're just using that argument because it's true and because you feel like it's important, but in the end, it's just something you tell yourself to feel better about the less popular game you're playing. There is no need to talk about it. well written post that i happen to agree with  though i still wish league had a lot of things when i play it | ||
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mordk
Chile8385 Posts
On February 05 2013 20:22 OutlaW- wrote: I don't know if this discussion is still going on, but maybe a perspective from player who played dota for 3 years, then starcraft 2 for 2 years and now League for a year and a half can add something. League definitely takes less skill to play than Dota and Starcraft, anyone who says otherwise is being delusional. But that doesn't make League a worse game. It just means what it means. I have much more respect for Sc2 pros and Dota pros than I do for League pros, but that doesn't mean that League pros are inferior players or something - they're doing their best to play their game and that's worthy of respect, too. We live in a world that's based around profits, so, (un)fortunately, the most popular game is the one that gets the most money and that has the most promising future. This is League of legends. I can understand why it makes people like you (dota and starcraft players) angry, because you feel (and rightly so, it's your opinion after all) that your game is superior. That's why when you see players playing this "inferior" game and get more money and more fame and a more promising future than you, you get angry. This is understandable. But there really is no need to start hating on it publicly. All that shows is a certain immaturity of not being able to overcome the shortcomings of your game (popularity is a valid attribute). Another thing you could be blaming is the viewers. But it's not really their fault for liking something else than you, is it? This is why I think there is no need to wage wars between the communities. The games are different and cater to to different people. Maybe Blizzard/Valve should have made different decisions to seize the popularity that Riot has. I don't see how this is the fault of the players who play and enjoy the game, nor the viewers who watch it. "People should like the game that I do and everyone who doesn't is an idiot" is incredibly immature and is the basis of most bashing towards League. The fact that League takes less mechanical skill than the other games is completely and utterly irrelevant - you're just using that argument because it's true and because you feel like it's important, but in the end, it's just something you tell yourself to feel better about the less popular game you're playing. There is no need to talk about it. Very well written, there's no doubt that all of this, in the end, is about money. And in a business such as esports, money comes through popularity, and nothing else. Sad but true. Personally, I hope Valve can take the heat of being the less popular game, grow a smaller but loyal fanbase (players won't leave, the games are just too different), and continue to give us Dota 2 for many many years and a healthier scene than it ever was with WC3 Dota, which was frankly a gigantic mess . I feel Valve are doing a fine job so far, we'll see when the game's released, right now Steam's popularity has skyrocketted with the large influx of beta keys gifted to everyone by Valve. | ||
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Acetone
United States200 Posts
<3 | ||
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koreasilver
9109 Posts
On February 05 2013 19:18 thezanursic wrote: LoL is SC2 without the mechanics that are required to play the game well. The game knowledge is just as important. So kinda like how SC2 is to BW, right? | ||
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Mr. Black
United States470 Posts
My biggest complaint with watching LoL is that high level teamfights all involve everyone popping all their spells within a few seconds, so there is a ton of stuff happening on the screen and it's hard to tell who is doing what to whom (even with a working knowledge of the game). But that just means that the caster's role is very important in explaining the mess that's on the screen. Those finals that you casted reminded me of the excitement that people used to have in Starcraft 2 when it was first getting really big, and there is definitely something badass about a crowd being that pumped up. Finally, don't let the haters get you down. When you were doing IPL, I always saw you as the analyst, and I thought you were great in that role. But in LoL, while you appear to have learned the game pretty well, you have definitely raised your skills as the hype man, humorist and play-by-play guy. | ||
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birchman
Sweden393 Posts
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Randomaccount#77123
United States5003 Posts
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HeeroFX
United States2704 Posts
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crms
United States11933 Posts
Simply put LoL growth isn't good for everyone, it's not good for 'esports' it's good for Riot and LoL. We've already seen the path Riot wants to take. Tournament Exclusivity Tried for Team Exclusivity Crippled NADOTA by shutting down dota-allstars, while stealing hero ideas from the very boards (Pendragon so honorable) Nobody would care if you like LoL or sc2 more, but let's stop pretending the LoL ship is about anything other than making money. Community figures are exploiting it's popularity because of it's stream views. If Dota2, World of Warcraft or fucking Angry Birds became as popular and watched as LoL we'd have the same fucking post with the new inserted title. Stop trying to justify selling out and trying to make all things equal. Nobody cares if you sold out, go make money, just stop trying to sell us your bullshit. SirScoots always said, like what you like, but don't hate on other games. While in merit it works, but with Riot in the mix, it's not possible. The bigger and stronger Riot and LoL gets, the worse the outlook is for Dota in the west, plain and simple. Riot's growth doesn't help Dota, just as Dota's growth didn't help HoN. The only difference is Dota didn't actively attempt to strongarm HoN out of the scene, they let the community and players decide. League of Legends is synonmous with Walmart, sorry that analogy hurt your feelings but it's the truth. It's a mass marketed casual game that strongarmed its way into the scene through it's huge casual fanbase. It's pushed out whatever competition it could while relying on morally questionable tactics. Seems pretty accurate to me. [edit] I see a lot of people saying popularity is a valuable attribute in deciding a games quality. Well I guess Britney Spears, Taylor Swift, The Jonas Brothers and Justin Beiber are godlike musicians. Just because something is popular doesn't mean it's good. In a community like our own: hardcore and dedicated, esports we should have the power to decide which games have the quality to be taking seriously as an esport. Popularity is a valuable attribute when your endgoal is to exploit said popularity to make money. Popularity says very little about the actual product being offered. | ||
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Steveling
Greece10806 Posts
On February 06 2013 00:59 Barrin wrote: There is a massive difference between "twitch" and "thinking" skill. I wonder how much your sniping skills can help you against a chess grandmaster. How could you not get the sarcasm, I know I went the extra mile and didn't put a "lol" at the end but still, damn. I'm referring to these people that deem mobas too easy cause there's barely the opportunity to multitask. That's like messi saying that bball is so easy compared to football cause you never have to dribble with your feet. | ||
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crms
United States11933 Posts
On February 04 2013 21:22 Yoshi- wrote: I think the most embarrassing thing about the skill debate is that people use it to justify their decision that are solely based on money Great post. | ||
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HardlyNever
United States1258 Posts
I really, really wouldn't try to sell LoL as something "equivalent" to sc2. You just aren't going to succeed. I think LoL sucks, and it should be my right as a fan to say so. I don't think LoL sucks because I can only like sc2; I think LoL sucks because LoL sucks. I've tried to like the game. I've played it. I've watched it. I can enjoy watching it for like, maybe 1 game tops. Everything about the game sucks (especially the community, dear god), except the graphics. I do like those, and I think the art/graphic designers have done a good job with that considering what they can work with. Is it a fact that LoL sucks? No, of course not. But I can express it as "fact" if I want, because I think LoL genuinely does suck. The one point I do agree with you on though is casters and other professionals. They should not be publicly disparaging any game; I don't think that is professional. I wouldn't want to hear baseball casters talk about how terrible they think football is. However, the fan base shouldn't feel guilty about expressing their opinions about another game. Not for "esports" or any other reason. | ||
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Denzil
United Kingdom4193 Posts
Dota just looks so much better and superior. Riot don't do themselves any favours either | ||
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BurnedRice
59 Posts
On February 05 2013 04:41 Sn0_Man wrote: Ya fair but you have to be careful how you word posts that demean SC2 on this site. Nice way to start a discussion post... Either way, League is to dota what SC2 is to broodwar. Thats my analogy and I'm sticking with it. The "newer" games are dumbed down, mechanically simple snoozefests, while the older games were diamonds in the rough, masterpieces that happened almost by mistake. Mechanically challenging, infinitely replayable, deep variance in possible gameplay. Trying to bring some random garbage like supreme commander into it (that game wasn't interesting at all, much less endlessly playable) doesn't make a ton of sense to me, but I suppose everybody sees things differently. Both SC2 and LOL are games for the masses, simple to learn, impossible to master, since 100K+ people make it their life. With such a following even a game like pong would be impossible to master. Games such as supreme commander FA are not made for the masses and will always eclipse SC2/LOL in terms of depth since the designers/community have made/balanced the game for the game itself, not for making it the best e-sport, etc. An SC2/LOL fan calling supreme commander garbage, is like a lady gaga fan listening to Beethoven and calling it garbage. Any self respecting RTS fan needs to grow up at some point rise above the mainstream games, and play something a little deeper. SC2 would be a zero without the marketing and the legacy of SCBW, this is probably impossible for some people to realize. | ||
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writer22816
United States5775 Posts
On February 06 2013 03:45 BurnedRice wrote: Both SC2 and LOL are games for the masses, simple to learn, impossible to master, since 100K+ people make it their life. With such a following even a game like pong would be impossible to master. Games such as supreme commander FA are not made for the masses and will always eclipse SC2/LOL in terms of depth since the designers/community have made/balanced the game for the game itself, not for making it the best e-sport, etc. An SC2/LOL fan calling supreme commander garbage, is like a lady gaga fan listening to Beethoven and calling it garbage. Any self respecting RTS fan needs to grow up at some point rise above the mainstream games, and play something a little deeper. SC2 would be a zero without the marketing and the legacy of SCBW, this is probably impossible for some people to realize. What on earth? I thought supreme commander was the most casual game out of the three... | ||
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BurnedRice
59 Posts
On February 06 2013 03:54 writer22816 wrote: What on earth? I thought supreme commander was the most casual game out of the three... It is the hardest to understand/learn, because it takes a lot of different concepts and puts them together. Most people who have an opinion about the game were noobs playing the vanilla campaign, which really has little to do with the nline multiplayer game, where all the difficulties come out. Pretty casual  in a sense that quantum mechanics is also casual to a small number of people) | ||
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Bubbadub
United States156 Posts
Hating an entire community based on a few rumors is sickening and unjust, don't even try to defend that. | ||
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