EPTI really do not get what you mean. My other post was too long so I put the quotes in spoilers is that making it hard to read?.
I kind of get what you are saying about the red, I will use bold.
Good Night.
Student Mafia (New/Newish players welcome) - Page 49
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BroodKingEXE
United States829 Posts
I really do not get what you mean. My other post was too long so I put the quotes in spoilers is that making it hard to read?. I kind of get what you are saying about the red, I will use bold. Good Night. | ||
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Blazinghand
United States25550 Posts
On December 10 2011 15:30 BroodKingEXE wrote: BH, I really do not get what you mean. My other post was too long so I put the quotes in spoilers is that making it hard to read?. I kind of get what you are saying about the red, I will use bold. Good Night. No, that's not what I'm talking about at all. I'm talking about the fact that you have a ~30% success rate in successfully using [ Quote] tags, and you apparently have yet to notice this fact. The most egregious recent example: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=291067¤tpage=48#953 | ||
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xtfftc
United Kingdom2343 Posts
I think we need to come up with some sort of a plan. Just like yesterday with Jay, I don't think that focusing too much on BKE will do us a lot of good. If he's town, he has to do his best to catch mafia, but if he's town, he'll be happy to waste our time like Jay did (BKE, there's two mafia players alive, so you need two cases, not one.). We need to discuss at least two more things: - do we still want to lynch a lurker if there's no good case (lynching a lurker later in the game is much better than earlier as we have more town reads)? - if we have a DT, should he investigate the lurkerish players? These are not for today but for the next few days. If you think there's anything else important to discuss for the late game, don't hesitate to bring it up. | ||
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xtfftc
United Kingdom2343 Posts
On December 10 2011 10:49 BroodKingEXE wrote: I wrote this above post as the night ended. Did not realize adam died. Oh you... | ||
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Tunkeg
Norway1235 Posts
My vote on ey215 seems to be wrong, I may have put to much into my probability lynch case, and I really wanted a lynch on one of those four. Having some small scumreads on ey215 I went with it. As of now my entire probability lynch case seems pretty dead, I think BKE is scum, and jay flipped scum, therefor there can't be 2 scum among those 4. ##Vote BroodKingExe | ||
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Tunkeg
Norway1235 Posts
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Velinath
United States694 Posts
On December 10 2011 17:20 xtfftc wrote: Morning everyone. I plan to post a lot over the weekend because I have very limited time during workdays. I have put enough time into EY, so I'll be leaving him alone for now unless I find something very convincing. Everything points to BKE being our best lynch today, so I won't dwell too much on why he is mafia. I will, however, analyse his relationships with the other players, because this would help us for next week. Apart from that, I'm not sure what to focus on. I really hope that layabout steps it up because xsk+Starshard have been having a very easy time. I think we need to come up with some sort of a plan. Just like yesterday with Jay, I don't think that focusing too much on BKE will do us a lot of good. If he's town, he has to do his best to catch mafia, but if he's town, he'll be happy to waste our time like Jay did (BKE, there's two mafia players alive, so you need two cases, not one.). We need to discuss at least two more things: - do we still want to lynch a lurker if there's no good case (lynching a lurker later in the game is much better than earlier as we have more town reads)? - if we have a DT, should he investigate the lurkerish players? These are not for today but for the next few days. If you think there's anything else important to discuss for the late game, don't hesitate to bring it up. In response to your questions, I feel that at this point it does indeed become beneficial to lynch lurkers. Assuming BKEXE flips scum (which, at this point, is nearly certain to me), we have 1 scum left - which means we can afford to use a lynch or two on people who haven't been participating. Right now that's xkstarshayabout and Hassybluelightz, both of which I'm not totally sure about. At least Bluelightz has been posting a bit, but again, expect some analysis from me later today on that. That said, I feel like our DT should be focusing more on active players that seem suspicious to them, rather than lurkers. If we're going to be looking at lynching lurkers, then we'll get the last scum if they're lurking anyway. If there's any active poster that seems like they're suspicious, then that's a better investigation target. | ||
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ey215
United States546 Posts
On December 10 2011 17:20 xtfftc wrote: Morning everyone. I plan to post a lot over the weekend because I have very limited time during workdays. I have put enough time into EY, so I'll be leaving him alone for now unless I find something very convincing. Everything points to BKE being our best lynch today, so I won't dwell too much on why he is mafia. I will, however, analyse his relationships with the other players, because this would help us for next week. Apart from that, I'm not sure what to focus on. I really hope that layabout steps it up because xsk+Starshard have been having a very easy time. This is what I've been planning on doing as well. I think we'll find the third mafia by looking at how Jay and BK have been interacting with others from the start. Now that we've got two days of information from votes and one confirmed scum it should be easier to see patterns. I think we need to come up with some sort of a plan. Just like yesterday with Jay, I don't think that focusing too much on BKE will do us a lot of good. If he's town, he has to do his best to catch mafia, but if he's town, he'll be happy to waste our time like Jay did (BKE, there's two mafia players alive, so you need two cases, not one.). We need to discuss at least two more things: - do we still want to lynch a lurker if there's no good case (lynching a lurker later in the game is much better than earlier as we have more town reads)? I have mixed feelings on the lurkers. We keep hoping the fill ins will step up and help us out here and so far they really haven't. It would not surprise me if our third mafia comes from one of these two but it's damn hard to make a case against either. - if we have a DT, should he investigate the lurkerish players? I agree with Vel on this one, I'd rather the DT look at more active players, since if the lurking continues we'll likely look at one of the lurkers to lynch in the next couple of days. These are not for today but for the next few days. If you think there's anything else important to discuss for the late game, don't hesitate to bring it up. New guys! Get your post on, we want to know what you think is going on around here! | ||
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BroodKingEXE
United States829 Posts
Are you saying that you will ignore EY's lies based on my illegible posts? I have yet to see anyone comment about EY bandwagoning on two of the votes. While I was wrong about Adam others were wrong about Bbyte too. It seems like everyone says I have been defending Jay the whole game from this post: Here Okay, I gave my read on him and defended him...once. On the vote against him I looked at his posts and gave info, others agreed with the vote (like EY) and gave no information whatsoever. | ||
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Grackaroni
United States9832 Posts
On December 10 2011 17:20 xtfftc wrote: Morning everyone. I plan to post a lot over the weekend because I have very limited time during workdays. I have put enough time into EY, so I'll be leaving him alone for now unless I find something very convincing. Everything points to BKE being our best lynch today, so I won't dwell too much on why he is mafia. I will, however, analyse his relationships with the other players, because this would help us for next week. Apart from that, I'm not sure what to focus on. I really hope that layabout steps it up because xsk+Starshard have been having a very easy time. I think we need to come up with some sort of a plan. Just like yesterday with Jay, I don't think that focusing too much on BKE will do us a lot of good. If he's town, he has to do his best to catch mafia, but if he's town, he'll be happy to waste our time like Jay did (BKE, there's two mafia players alive, so you need two cases, not one.). We need to discuss at least two more things: - do we still want to lynch a lurker if there's no good case (lynching a lurker later in the game is much better than earlier as we have more town reads)? - if we have a DT, should he investigate the lurkerish players? These are not for today but for the next few days. If you think there's anything else important to discuss for the late game, don't hesitate to bring it up. I'm assuming you mean lynching a lurker on the next day because it would not make sense to lynch one over BKEXE. The problem with lynching lurkers is that it gives the town no information to go off of for future days especially if he flips town. The DT (if we have one) can choose by himself who to check based on who he thinks is scummy. If the entire town feels he should check a lurker and the DT follows that advice the mafia may choose to target a lurker. (which is not actually too bad for us since it would remove a null read anyways, but it would make us rely more heavily on our analysis of the active players over the blue roles. | ||
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Grackaroni
United States9832 Posts
I realize it's hard to catch up with the thread and all but everyone needs to be actively posting. | ||
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Velinath
United States694 Posts
On December 11 2011 01:45 BroodKingEXE wrote: BH, Are you saying that you will ignore EY's lies based on my illegible posts? I have yet to see anyone comment about EY bandwagoning on two of the votes. While I was wrong about Adam others were wrong about Bbyte too. It seems like everyone says I have been defending Jay the whole game from this post: Here Okay, I gave my read on him and defended him...once. On the vote against him I looked at his posts and gave info, others agreed with the vote (like EY) and gave no information whatsoever. You intentionally misrepresented ey in your case by taking his posts out of order like you did. Explain why you did this. | ||
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ey215
United States546 Posts
On December 11 2011 01:45 BroodKingEXE wrote: BH, Are you saying that you will ignore EY's lies based on my illegible posts? I have yet to see anyone comment about EY bandwagoning on two of the votes. While I was wrong about Adam others were wrong about Bbyte too. It seems like everyone says I have been defending Jay the whole game from this post: Here Okay, I gave my read on him and defended him...once. On the vote against him I looked at his posts and gave info, others agreed with the vote (like EY) and gave no information whatsoever. xttftc would like to disagree with the bolded part of your post. Read my case(s) on EY again, please. It's not just voting - although bandwagonning all game long was part of it This is fun :D | ||
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Grackaroni
United States9832 Posts
If you are town it is important that you get all of your thoughts out before the lynch. Right now you are exclusively pushing Ey215's case which is fine, but the more information you give us the better for town right? Please try to format your quotes correctly, it's really hard to follow who is saying what when the quotes are not done right. | ||
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layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
xtfftc: has made some glaring contradictions and that he owes and explanation Grackaroni highlighted this in an earlier post and i think you (xtfftc) need to expalin: I've posted more on Jay, look at Day 1 but it's mostly one off remarks (such as pointing out how Jay justified not voting for a lurker by saying that we shouldn't lynch a lurker because a lurker isn't around to defend himself) and I don't see how the last quote was me suggesting that he is probably town. It was me pointing out the scumminess of EY's reasoning, and at that moment it was to be expected that mafia would jump on the Jay bandwagon. At the moment I think that Jay is more likely to be scum because if he's not, we have EY, xsk, and Adam left, and I consider Adam to be the worst lynch out of the players I am suspicious of (Adam, Jay, EY, xsk, BKE) you explicity state that you think Jay is the most likely to be scum and grack makes this point On December 09 2011 10:16 Grackaroni wrote: Show nested quote + Here he even admits that Jay is more likely to be scum but his vote still remains on Ey215. . . I stated my reasons for keeping my vote on EY. Your reasoning is pure WIFOM in this case. Jay was obviously going to be lynched hours before I posted the bit you quoted, so what could a townie do in this situation? Vote for Jay and be accused of sheeping after BH and bandwagonning (remember Tunkeg and his analysis of the Bbyte lynch?) Or vote for someone else and be accused of not voting for the obvious mafia. you call his "reasoning" (i see a simple statement of fact) "pure WIFOM" well where is the pure wifom in this? On December 08 2011 06:45 xtfftc wrote: You lynch your best read. You don't start looking for excuses for when the player you're voting for flips town. You didn't want to get into the "pissing match" with BH, you were forced to by his aggressiveness. And using lurking as a proof that you haven't been staying under the radar is a pretty solid point if you're building a case against yourself. You were out of the picture when every good mafia wants to be: during the last ~12 hours before the deadline, so you did a great job. I answered to him after he mentioned me and I don't see how his death changes anything. What is there to be said about EB? His play was arrogant and trollish. He was obviously a veteran smurfing, who thought it would be fun to frustrate the townies (refusing to vote just when he was asked to the most active player in the game just because he felt like irritating us) and then giving us a great demonstration of how a town player has to prove his innocence when attacked. He posted a great case that lacked obvious flaws - and then he was happy to go inactive again. He came back to announce that he's found the whole mafia team - but didn't bother providing any analysis on two of the players he accused. And he also made sure to notify us that the Bbyte lynch was pushed easily... Before the game started (and also in the Looking For Coaches thread) some veterans suggested that there should be some experienced players in this game to help teach the newbies how to play properly. Instead we get a cocky smurf. There was no way to make a good guess about his intentions, which is the reason why I'm not all over Hassy at the moment. EB was good enough to make us do anything he wanted to as long as he was interested in putting a serious effort in the game, and I have no reason to believe that his intentions were pro-town, even after his flip. Ask veterans such as Sandroba and Palmar and they will tell you that the first thing a townie should do is to establish his/her innocence. The first thing EB did was to frustrate town and lose us half a day. So what good would it do to town to focus on him again instead of doing our own analysis? All you're achieving with this is disruping the discussion. you have stated that you should only vote for mafia and that you should lynch your best read and yet in the above quote you do not do that here earlier you didn't On December 06 2011 06:20 xtfftc wrote: Pretty much all I have on Adam is based on two of his posts that push pro-mafia agenda. Now that I think about it, I have a much stronger case on ey215, even though I decided to leave him for day 2. I don't have enough to convince Adam on my own and it seems that most of the others are happy to lurk or to vote for lynching Bbyte. Here's what I wrote on Adam earlier in case you're lazy and can't be bothered to check it out: + Show Spoiler + I'll check the thread again before going to bed. you have a strong case on a player but you would rather not post it and you would rather vote for someone other than your best read? seriously? so you vote for BByte On December 06 2011 07:26 xtfftc wrote: I'm going to bed, so I'm voting for Bbyte. It's not ideal but it's better than some unpleasant last minute surprise. ##Unvote: xsksc ##Vote: BByte why? "its better than a last minute suprise" you just jump on a bandwagon On December 09 2011 05:24 xtfftc wrote: Yes, albeit a short one that doesn't cover some bits. I feel uneasy about the way no one objects on lynching Jay. It feels like Day 1 all over again, which makes me wonder whether Jay might actually be town - even though mafia are probably just bussing him at this point. So my vote stays on EY to remind people that we have to catch the whole mafia team and not just one member of it. another contradiction it also doesn't make sense that "to remind people that we have to catch the whole mafia team" could be a reason for a vote i also think your case against eye is weak i shall soon explain why. | ||
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BroodKingEXE
United States829 Posts
I need to develop my skills about gathering evidence in the game and was not active enough in the scum hunt. I know that the case against me was pretty solid though, as I was not good in double checking my evidence. Well,GG BroodKingEXE | ||
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layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
On December 11 2011 02:29 BroodKingEXE wrote: I do not have anymore time to defend myself as I need to study for finals. I urge everyone to come up with a plan when I do not turn up mafia. I say do not blame the players that created the case against me, but blame the people who used their cases and did not check for errors. I need to develop my skills about gathering evidence in the game and was not active enough in the scum hunt. I know that the case against me was pretty solid though, as I was not good in double checking my evidence. Well,GG BroodKingEXE we still have time do not martyr yourself now if you are town try to contribute and then the things you have said can be considered if you flip town or try to contribute and find us a scum or two to lynch instead there is also enough time for you to write a reasonable defence | ||
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Grackaroni
United States9832 Posts
On December 11 2011 02:29 BroodKingEXE wrote: I do not have anymore time to defend myself as I need to study for finals. I urge everyone to come up with a plan when I do not turn up mafia. I say do not blame the players that created the case against me, but blame the people who used their cases and did not check for errors. I need to develop my skills about gathering evidence in the game and was not active enough in the scum hunt. I know that the case against me was pretty solid though, as I was not good in double checking my evidence. Well,GG BroodKingEXE Sorry BKEXE but this is exactly what scum would do, you know that you're going to be lynched and after I asked you for who you thought Ey215's scumbuddy would be you post this. A town player would try to give as much information for the town as possible, so that even if it's no longer possible to defend himself from the lynch he could still assist the town and give them more to work off the next day. A scum player would want to leave the town with as little information possible after they get revealed. If you are scum you are making the right decision to shut up now but if you're town please keep talking. | ||
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Blazinghand
United States25550 Posts
On December 11 2011 01:45 BroodKingEXE wrote: BH, Are you saying that you will ignore EY's lies based on my illegible posts? I have yet to see anyone comment about EY bandwagoning on two of the votes. While I was wrong about Adam others were wrong about Bbyte too. It seems like everyone says I have been defending Jay the whole game from this post: Here Okay, I gave my read on him and defended him...once. On the vote against him I looked at his posts and gave info, others agreed with the vote (like EY) and gave no information whatsoever. I would really, really like to not ignore his lies, but I honestly don't know what they are. Do you want to know why I don't know what they are? The reason is, your posts are completely, unbelievably illegible. At this point, though, you have planted the seed of doubt in my mind. If you're a mafia player, you've done a really terrible job. But given how a terrible a job you did, it's not beyond comprehension that you are an unbelievably bad town player. I can't read your analysis posts. I ACTUALLY CAN'T READ THEM, MAN. God, this is either the best troll or the worst attempt to defend I've ever seen. If you're a town player I literally refuse to play any mafia games with you ever again. I'm completely serious about this. On December 11 2011 02:29 BroodKingEXE wrote: I do not have anymore time to defend myself as I need to study for finals. I urge everyone to come up with a plan when I do not turn up mafia. I say do not blame the players that created the case against me, but blame the people who used their cases and did not check for errors. I need to develop my skills about gathering evidence in the game and was not active enough in the scum hunt. I know that the case against me was pretty solid though, as I was not good in double checking my evidence. Well,GG BroodKingEXE What the dicks is this? Why not actually be helpful? ._. I'm going to look into Grackaroni and Tunkeg, btw. Just to check them out. I'll have an analysis up sometime today. | ||
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layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
On December 09 2011 02:06 Tunkeg wrote: Probability lynch I think probability should be discussed more before going into a day 2 lynch. Some of you may call this WIFOM and just ignore it, and probably it is somewhat WIFOM, because it involves alot of speculating. we would be right in calling it wifom because it is, speculating isn't helpful is is only marginally better than RNGing votes by pointing out that it may be wifom and not useful he has provided an excuse in case he is called out on using poor logic.If you are trying to help town then why would you make a post full of logic that you think can and possibly should be ignored. A townie cannot help town if people ignore them they also cannot be lynched. Being ignored does not help people scumhunt The first thing I will speculate about is number of scum involved in the lynch on BByte. As I've mentioned before I belive the probability that 2 scums joined in on the lynch is the biggest: so what? we still don't know,there are either 0 scum 1 scum or 2 scum and we have no way of knowing with any certainty which is the correct number so this assumption very unreliable if you allowed to speculate: well yes you are but it is not helpful! you make the assumption that scum were trying to secure the lynch on Bbyte but it is also possible that the lynch was entirely down to town and you then decide that in your opinion 0 scum would be unlikely. This is complete guessworkand it is not helpful to speculate about mafia's actions in such a fashion.It is pure wifom and such not be taken seriously As I belive BH and Velinath is the most green out of these (as of now) I will leave them out. And I will also leave myself out. This leads me to believe that there is 2 scum out of xsksc, gracken, ey215 and xtfftc. Seeing that ey215 and xtfftc is attacking eachother, and the way they are attacking eachother I don't see it as likely that they both are scum. Seeing that Grackorini is somewhat joining in on xtfftc's analyses: based on nothing but the unreliable thought that 2 scum voted for bbyte you then decide that because you think it is likely (which it isnt) you then omit your two best town reads (which have not been comprehensively justified and who could still be scum) and omit yourself (which is not consistant if you are looking at probabilities but is understandable) and decide that we should lynch from the 4 others who lynched bbyte. because you think that 2/3 scum would vote for the lynched townie on day1 you are assuming that bbytes alignment and flip makes the player that voted for him more likely to be scum but it just doesn't. And therefor I don't think both of them are scum. he assumes that the above statement means that they both can't be scum, this s somewhere between bad logic and wifom xtfftc have been voting on xsksc and had him as one of those he suspects as scum throughout the game. I don't think both of them are scum. for almost the same bad reason he assumes that xtfftc and xsksc(me) cannot both be scum So this leads me to think that the most probable scum pairings of those in on the BByte lynch is: xsksc(Starshard)/Grackorini xsksc (Starshard)/ey215 Grackorini/xtfftc the unreasonable ruling out of two scum pairings doesn't even have any relevance to his point. I say we should lynch anyone of these four, it would give us a high probability for actually killing a scum player. this last part is amusing because the chance of scum is either 0% 25% or 50% and i dont like those chances especially when they are based upon unreasonable and not useful speculation. You recommendation is more likely to lynch a townie and that would benefit mafia. I do not see how what you are recommending benefits town in anyway it would only serve to further a mafia agenda. the points i have added have been italicised (for clarity) and underlined (for my ego)+ Show Spoiler + actually it was also for clarity + Show Spoiler + this joke was for my ego i really think that the shoddy reasoning in this yourcould be an attempt at trying to hurt town/ help mafia. i think that tunkeg could be a good lynch candidate unless he can explain himself. if you have a town read on him then why do you think that he would behave this way? i strongly recommend you review your stance | ||
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