• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 12:47
CEST 18:47
KST 01:47
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL22] Finals Preview: Sweet Victory!9[ASL22] Ro4 Preview: Mirror Mirror6[ASL22] Ro8 Preview: Within Reach5[ASL22] Ro8 Preview: In A Tizzy11[ASL22] Ro16 Preview: Holy Diver5
Community News
Evil Geniuses - shutting down14ISSL (IntoTheTV x SOOP SC2 League): Premier5Weekly Cups (October 12-18): 5.0.17 era begins1[$1250] International ShieldBattery League58Weekly Cups (October 5-11): Farewell to 5.0.167
StarCraft 2
General
REPORT: StarCraft 2: Remastered In Development No more SC2 streamers on team liquid? Evil Geniuses - shutting down How do you feel about the mass reverts in the 5.0.17 PTR? Daily SC2 Player Grid - feedback wanted
Tourneys
ScienceCraft (October 24-25) - Live Event RSL goes to London! 2026 Offline Finals Nov 21-22 ISSL (IntoTheTV x SOOP SC2 League): Premier Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament WORTEX Challenger Series — Open SC2 LAN in Budapes
Strategy
[H] ZvP Mid-Late Game: Stalkers Collossi HT
Custom Maps
[G] How to playtest arcade maps [A] Nemrods 1/4 players [M] (2) Sweltering Sands
External Content
Mutation # 548 Shining Bright The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 547 Temple Of Terror Mutation # 546 Catch the Train
Brood War
General
Bot on ladder Battle.net abbreviations list Starcraft player cRuZa Passed away. Young Players Tournament Announced by SOOP Do we even care about balance?
Tourneys
[$1250] International ShieldBattery League [BSL23] RO24 Group C Small VOD Thread 2.0 2v2v2v2 Tournament
Strategy
Cliff Jump Revisited (1 in a 1000 strategy) 50,000-Word Terran Builds Memo 2026-10-22 Simple Questions, Simple Answers
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Nintendo Switch Thread Armies of Exigo - YesYes? General RTS Discussion Thread Dawn of War IV
Dota 2
Dota 2 Champions League Season 3 Begins April 25!
League of Legends
[TL LoL EUW IHs] Teemo shall perish
Heroes of the Storm
Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Artificial Intelligence Thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread
Fan Clubs
Serral Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece Anime Discussion Thread
Sports
Football (Soccer) Thread TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 MLB/Baseball 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
Recent Gifted Posts
Blogs
Innovate or Game Over?
TrAiDoS
ShieldBattery on Mac
Kraekkling
[ASL22] Ro4 Day1 Ticket Giv…
bITt.mAN
Can Bots Beat Pros?? Starcr…
namkraft
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 8973 users

from losing to winning

Forum Index > BW General
Post a Reply
1 2 3 4 Next All
silver_fox
Profile Joined June 2008
Canada243 Posts
August 01 2008 19:44 GMT
#1
ok i started playing iccup a couple of months ago..

started to watch replays, work on build orders, and basically get my ass kicked with something learned from every loss (hopefully).

now my question is, how long did it take you to get comfortable and started to win most of your games? my record now including alts is 17-35.. the win ratio hasn't improved since i started. thats about 50 games, at what point did most of you start to see a huge improvement and general turnaround from losing to winning? (im obviously playing D level, with a goal of eventually D+ .. yes im a noob but i sill love this game)

i feel as if im learning still from my losses but its a slower process to learn the mid/late game compared to the early game..
ShaLLoW[baY]
Profile Blog Joined January 2007
Canada12499 Posts
Last Edited: 2008-08-01 19:48:51
August 01 2008 19:47 GMT
#2
When iCCup first started I hit D- on every account I made, and now I can hit C with a ~52% record. It does take a while, but one day you'll just click and suddenly those fucking 9/9 gating Protoss players aren't auto-loss anymore!

EDIT : As to exactly how long, 3-4 seasons for me, more or less for you depending on the quality and frequency of your practice.
ALEXISONFIRE ARE FUCKING BACK (sAviOr for life)
silver_fox
Profile Joined June 2008
Canada243 Posts
August 01 2008 19:54 GMT
#3
how frequent would you play? with a job, gf, and sports its tough to find time although i try to play at least 1-2 games a day. i was thinking maybe just hardcore it for a while to get to a certain level and try to maintain it.
Presony-Boy
Profile Joined April 2007
Israel812 Posts
August 01 2008 19:59 GMT
#4
in my first season (it was on theabyss, be4 iccup) i went like 20-30.
now after few seasons with lots of breaks, im C rank with 59-56 stats,
for me it always been like when i get better and i achieve new rank, ill be stuck on this rank for a while and keep a 50% win ratio(sometimes it goes lower), when i start winning my ratio will get a lil better and thats how i get to the next rank.
to sum it up, u have to keep playing till u get better (in ur case, lets say u manage to have a 40%
win ratio then it means u improve, always have a goal u want to reach),
always keep a goal in ur mind, that helps a lot (well at least for me).
check ur replays, find the mistakes, check what u have to work on, and work on it.
if u cant manage to find the mistakes, post a rep + description of the rep and im sure ppl will be glad to help u.
another thing i suggest to u, is to play only motw and play ppl that are the same rank as u (or better if u'r willing to improve).
what i like to do, is when there is a new motw, i pick one map, then i go and download replays with these maps played and watch them of course.
then i usually play only this map for 1 week till there is a new motw.
Hwasin fan since 15 February 2007 - Hwasin/Calm/Kal Fighting~!
intrigue
Profile Blog Joined November 2005
Washington, D.C9935 Posts
Last Edited: 2008-08-01 20:07:10
August 01 2008 20:02 GMT
#5
for me my improvement came in big jumps that happened randomly, usually for specific matchup. i'd be playing a ladder game and all of a sudden something would click, and i'd suddenly be drastically better than i was before. this happened about once every few months when i was active, which was probably 50-100 serious games each period (i'm not really a massgamer). between each leap in skill i'd plateau and stay around the same.

i guess the best explanation for my pattern of getting better is the gradual culmination of little things that i worked on every game, coming together to make a significant impact on my overall play. not sure how other people get better though, i've never really experienced a linear improvement in my play.

this is boring advice, but it's the best and only way to get better - keep on going at it, ignore your record (at your level your priority should be getting better, not winning games), look over your replays, and remember to think critically about why you won or why you lost. i used to save only loss replays and watch them over and over in agony but they really paid off. everybody here who's laddered knows what it's like to feel like you're going absolutely nowhere, but don't give up! good luck!
Moderatorsloppy little slug
Xeris
Profile Blog Joined July 2005
Iran17695 Posts
August 01 2008 20:13 GMT
#6
I never really massgame or anything, so when I game for periods of time, I always improve slowly.

If you are able to play 5-10 games per day, and carefully analyze games you lose / constantly thinking about mistakes you are making and work to fix them, you should see fairly rapid improvement, especially if you are only a D rank player.

If you really dedicate yourself to it, I think its pretty feasible to jump from D rank to C rank in about 1-2 months (2 if you are between 5-10 per day , 1 if you are 15-20 per day).

Higher than C ranks though becomes more difficult to improve rapidly.
twitter.com/xerislight -- follow me~~
silver_fox
Profile Joined June 2008
Canada243 Posts
August 01 2008 20:16 GMT
#7
i guess i should play more often then .. i usually do 1-2 games a day with a few more on weekends. for the next couple of months ill try to play 5-10 games a day.

maybe ill post some replays but im sure everyone will just laugh.
WindCalibur
Profile Blog Joined February 2008
Canada938 Posts
August 01 2008 20:19 GMT
#8
shouldnt this depend on the player? different players improve faster than others. I think it took me around 2 weeks to get from 7-16 to 16-7 after i sharpened my build orders and got my macro better. (my micro still struggling in some degree)
imperfect
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
Canada1652 Posts
August 01 2008 20:23 GMT
#9
I think the first iCCup seasons are really different to the current iCCup - it's so much harder.
For me personally, the first iCCup seasons, I hit C or C+ with like 60-70% win rate; but now, i'm at C+ and barely holding on with like 55% hahaha.

anyway, just remember, it gets harder as the ranks go up. from D to C wasn't too difficult for me, even though i was mainly a UMS and 2v2 player.

The only way to improve, is pretty obvious and general. you just keep playing.
blind bisu free and anytime fanboy.
silver_fox
Profile Joined June 2008
Canada243 Posts
August 01 2008 20:32 GMT
#10
On August 02 2008 05:19 WindCalibur wrote:
shouldnt this depend on the player? different players improve faster than others. I think it took me around 2 weeks to get from 7-16 to 16-7 after i sharpened my build orders and got my macro better. (my micro still struggling in some degree)


yes it does depends on the player... but im talking more about an average gamer who wants to improve himself in a particular game. ive played RTS games since warcraft1 but i never played competitively (use map settings, storyline, 8 player bgh ffas etc.), the last time i played ladder was on bnet 8 years ago... and when i saw the level of play at iccup i was absolutely amazed and wanted to get better. im not aiming to be the best, i just don't want to be destroyed every game. From the looks of the replies getting a 50% ratio is considered pretty good.

someone who was just introduced to RTS games in general will take much longer than someone with gaming habbits and a bit of commitment. lucky for me this isn't my first RTS.
Eskii
Profile Blog Joined August 2007
Canada544 Posts
August 01 2008 20:33 GMT
#11
Uh when I started playing PGT I was like D+/C- for about the first 2 seasons I think...

Then once I joined nV. I skyrocked to B+ in another season

All you need is a team and good training partners that you can play 10 games in a row with.
Deleted User 3420
Profile Blog Joined May 2003
24492 Posts
August 01 2008 20:46 GMT
#12
On August 02 2008 04:44 kilika wrote:
ok i started playing iccup a couple of months ago..

started to watch replays, work on build orders, and basically get my ass kicked with something learned from every loss (hopefully).

now my question is, how long did it take you to get comfortable and started to win most of your games? my record now including alts is 17-35.. the win ratio hasn't improved since i started. thats about 50 games, at what point did most of you start to see a huge improvement and general turnaround from losing to winning? (im obviously playing D level, with a goal of eventually D+ .. yes im a noob but i sill love this game)

i feel as if im learning still from my losses but its a slower process to learn the mid/late game compared to the early game..


I played so many games that even early on I was winning the majority of my games.

I started with blood bath and hunters 2v2 and 3v3. Then I joined $playaz$ and started playing 1v1 bgh and lotem. then I started playing ladder and maphacking. then I finally made the switch to broodwar(wasn't hacking anymore, too), and by then I was good enough that I almost always won pub games.

then gamei, etc, etc




basically I moved up so slowly that I was almost always winning, except once I finally got to where I was playing the absolute top foreigners and good koreans. then i resigned myself to the fact that there would be much losing.
iNcontroL *
Profile Blog Joined July 2004
USA29055 Posts
August 01 2008 20:50 GMT
#13
general forum?
memmypoker
Profile Joined May 2008
119 Posts
Last Edited: 2008-08-01 20:54:06
August 01 2008 20:51 GMT
#14
-play better players than yourself
-watch ur own replays after the game

for me the improvement comes like after gaming 15-25 games
hardcore and watching reps of your own games.
[X]Ken_D
Profile Blog Joined May 2005
United States4653 Posts
Last Edited: 2008-08-01 22:02:02
August 01 2008 21:59 GMT
#15
1-2 games a day isn't enough at that level unless you're a genius. Mass games to gain experience.

Watch your own replays and sometimes have someone better comment on it. Better players can see things that you won't notice at all.
[X]Domain - I just do the website. Nothing more.
Tomed
Profile Joined August 2005
United States176 Posts
August 01 2008 22:23 GMT
#16
On August 02 2008 06:59 [X]Ken_D wrote:
1-2 games a day isn't enough at that level unless you're a genius. Mass games to gain experience


Echoing this. 1-2 games a day really isn't enough since SC games are really short. There is no "key" to getting better at SC, just practice and observation.
Ra.Xor.2
Profile Blog Joined May 2008
United States1784 Posts
Last Edited: 2008-08-01 22:43:45
August 01 2008 22:42 GMT
#17
I found it helps to work on specific matchups, especially if you only play 1-2 games a day. Maybe practice BOs against computers first so you get the timings down, then only play that matchup on Iccup for a week or so. Rotate matchups until you can play them all well, then you can start moving up the ladder.

I started with a 1-10 record on Iccup, then it noticebally improved after i adopted this training tactic.
#1 Flash Fan
WindCalibur
Profile Blog Joined February 2008
Canada938 Posts
August 01 2008 23:10 GMT
#18
On August 02 2008 07:23 Tomed wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 02 2008 06:59 [X]Ken_D wrote:
1-2 games a day isn't enough at that level unless you're a genius. Mass games to gain experience


Echoing this. 1-2 games a day really isn't enough since SC games are really short. There is no "key" to getting better at SC, just practice and observation.


actually watching a lot of progamers while keeping a consistent 2-3 game per day and trying your best actually improves you. Why I know this? because i did this during the 2 weeks of when I went from D- to D. You have to be really critical on yourself though. You have to play like its life and death and analyze your replays well.
grobo
Profile Blog Joined February 2007
Japan6199 Posts
August 01 2008 23:16 GMT
#19
So what do you do when you are A MASTER (not really..) of theorycrafting but your mind goes completely blank and you lose your focus as soon as he starts fucking around with his scout in your base?

I watch Z reps everyday and i know the build orders and everything, but i can not for the life of me stay focused whenever shit happens.
We make signature, then defense it.
IntoTheWow
Profile Blog Joined May 2004
is awesome32282 Posts
August 01 2008 23:43 GMT
#20
On August 02 2008 05:02 intrigue wrote:
for me my improvement came in big jumps that happened randomly, usually for specific matchup. i'd be playing a ladder game and all of a sudden something would click, and i'd suddenly be drastically better than i was before.


This.

I remember being 70apm, not wanting to use hotkeys because i found them uncomfortable to use. And then one day I incorporated 2 hotkeys to my play because i don't know, i just did and my multitasking improved a lot (apm went to 120 or so).

Then when i started playing longer matches i would include more hotkeys, and then more harrasing that required more multitasking, then maps that have shitty pathing and you need to babysit your units more, etc.

I play very little, and I play little to no ladder (50 or so was my highest number of games played on a ladder season, and the second would be like 10.
Moderator<:3-/-<
1 2 3 4 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
FEL
18:00
ScienceCraft - Day 1
RotterdaM840
IndyStarCraft 350
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
RotterdaM 840
IndyStarCraft 350
BRAT_OK 69
EmSc Tv 14
StarCraft: Brood War
Shuttle 1903
Bisu 1433
EffOrt 682
BeSt 647
Hyuk 352
firebathero 323
Stork 322
Rush 149
hero 108
Barracks 96
[ Show more ]
Mong 45
Pusan 31
Trap 30
Sexy 23
ToSsGirL 20
Rock 19
Bishop 18
Aegong 17
Terrorterran 16
yabsab 14
Sacsri 12
Dota 2
Gorgc14012
syndereN584
febbydoto6
Counter-Strike
fl0m4159
Heroes of the Storm
MindelVK6
Other Games
singsing1998
Liquid`RaSZi1401
B2W.Neo852
Beastyqt743
FrodaN681
mouzStarbuck232
Hui .177
KnowMe132
Trikslyr59
QueenE41
Chillindude22
CosmosSc2 8
Organizations
Counter-Strike
PGL27560
StarCraft 2
TaKeTV 150
EmSc Tv 14
EmSc2Tv 14
StarCraft: Brood War
lovetv 8
[ Show 15 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Adnapsc2 33
• Airneanach11
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• Migwel
StarCraft: Brood War
• Pr0nogo 2
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Dota 2
• C_a_k_e 1122
League of Legends
• Nemesis2287
• Jankos2139
Other Games
• Shiphtur571
Upcoming Events
AI Arena Tournament
13m
FEL
17h 13m
Sparkling Tuna Cup
17h 13m
Replay Cast
1d 6h
WardiTV Weekly
1d 19h
IntoTheTV X SOOP
2 days
ByuN vs Lambo
MaxPax vs Bunny
PiGosaur Cup
3 days
The PondCast
3 days
Kung Fu Cup
3 days
IntoTheTV X SOOP
4 days
SHIN vs GuMiho
Clem vs Classic
[ Show More ]
WardiTV Invitational
5 days
GSL
5 days
Epic.LAN
5 days
Replay Cast
6 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
6 days
Epic.LAN
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Acropolis #5 - GSC
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
HCC Season 3

Ongoing

Acropolis #5
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 4
BSL Season 23
PGL Masters Bucharest 2026
1win Private Club #2
Thunderpick World Champ. '26
ESL Pro League Season 24
Stake Ranked Episode 4
1win Private Club #1
Logitech G Play Connect 2026
SL StarSeries Fall 2026
FISSURE Playground #3
BLAST Open Fall 2026
Esports World Cup 2026

Upcoming

IPSL Winter 2026-27
SC4ALL II: Brood War
BSL 23: Non-Korean Championship
HSC XXX
Stellar Fest 2: Lunar Cup
SC4ALL II: StarCraft II
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
RSL Offline Finals
eXTREMESLAND 2026
PGL Major Singapore 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 6
BLAST Rivals Fall 2026
IEM Beijing 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 5
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.