EPTTL Mafia LXXIV: Storm Mafia 3
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Kurumi
Poland6130 Posts
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Kurumi
Poland6130 Posts
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Kurumi
Poland6130 Posts
On March 24 2016 07:13 Koshi wrote: Confirmed Town + Show Spoiler + Likely Town + Show Spoiler + Maybe town + Show Spoiler + Not going to lynch Town + Show Spoiler + Null + Show Spoiler + VayneAuthority Kurumi Stutters695 Damdred sandroba ObiWanShinobi Rels justanothertownie Tictock ritoky sicklucker Alakaslam Tumblewood Shapelog Vivax rsoultin LightningStrike Superbia Tubesock gumshoe Won't lynch right now Mafia + Show Spoiler + Maybe Mafia + Show Spoiler + Likely Mafia + Show Spoiler + Confirmed Mafia + Show Spoiler + What was the meaning of this post? What the hell is "Won't lynch right now Mafia" - is there any case where you don't lynch a Mafia I am missing? Why do you need the "Confirmed" spoiler if the confirmation comes from the host through flips and the updated player list? Is the reason you made that list is that Mafia has a cheatsheet for shots? Nothing good can come from this. I highly dislike this type of lists, especially that you have not commented on what is going to happen with it. On March 24 2016 07:53 gumshoe wrote: Maybe I've missed an evolution somewhere along the line but slam seems to be actually trying as opposed to just flaunting his usual semi troll trot. Which isn't a point I'm going to level against him cause wow that would just be bad, but is of note for better or worse. Damdred is of course fishing as one would expect of ether side, words like interesting are rather neutral. A call to arms is also fairly vague, clearly he has notions of how peeps react to something like that, or mabs he's willing to play it by ear. His post feels cautious and calculated few words as it may be. Which could be scummy depending on his meta ( never played with him ) seems intelligent regardless. Parabola sounds like he just doesn't wanna get anyone on his tail but still wants to appear to be a present and beloved member of town. Could be scums, could just be excited to play, maybe he's bieng light to try to attract heat for said lightness thereby kick starting stuff. Multiple personalities can be envisioned from the posts so far, but there is no real leaning towards good or evil. As one would expect a page in to a game. TLDR As of yet, nothing worth acting on outside of concert with more proof. TLDR for TLDR stuff is stuff This post gave me so many rubs in such bad ways that I just can't let it go. a) The comment on Slam: Not only it's absolutely unnecessary, it ends with "Well, I shouldn't bring it up because it's bad" - so why bother? You know it is bad and you still do it. I mean, I guess you want people to focus on that for some reason, but I'd rather focus on you. Also, if Chezinu Rule is to be trusted, we may have another testament to this. b) Damdred's fishing. Not only I have not seen anything of that nature till that post, but also we are met with a statement that "fishing is to be expected of either side". Oh boy, no, not at all. Fishing for roles is not something you expect from either side. Fishing is Mafia's job. I highly dislike the attempt to paint it as ambiguous. I also do not understand why would you bring attention to any odd words in a person's post. If that's a crumb, you don't want Mafia to see it. Odd wording - go ahead, it might be a slip. But random, seemingly non-related words? No way. c) Read on Superbia. Another read straight outta fortune teller. Why would you, gumshoe, try to paint Superbia as suspicious? At the point of posting that, the only thing Superbia has said about himself was that "you should care about him", which pretty much goes contrary to your point about him not wanting anyone on his tail. d) You end your post saying that it is not really worth much, but you managed to paint Superbia scum, excuse Damdred non-existant fishing and point out that pointing out Slam's behaviour at this stage of the game does more harm than good. You note that people might be excited about something, that they look for something, but you seem not to look for anything. You created a mid-sized post detailing less than a page of a game for nothing, what you admit, but you would not have done that if it really was nothing, so what is your agenda behind that post? | ||
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Kurumi
Poland6130 Posts
On March 24 2016 08:51 Superbia wrote: Might still be VT. But I'm claiming I'm not. No role discussion, unless you are Scum and are benefiting from it, damn you! Ritoky, why bring VT thing in the thread?! | ||
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Kurumi
Poland6130 Posts
On March 24 2016 08:59 LightningStrike wrote: So Kurumi any other thoughts you want to share? People should slow the hell down, I am astonished with the role talking and people manage to create another page of it. I see nothing wrong with Superbia's early vote on gumshoe. When did sicklucker say anything about gumshoe? He has vote on him and no posts to back it up. | ||
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Kurumi
Poland6130 Posts
On March 24 2016 09:04 gumshoe wrote: 1: There is no real substance insofar in game hence there is no real substance to the post / : 2: I am self admittedly terrible at fishing, every atempt I have made to fish has ended in disaster because the truth is I am natural bait without a modicum of effort and said effort usually casts me too far into the jaws to escape. So I dont fish except on holidays which limits my early game contribtion 3:my post isnt trying to acomplish anything really / : its a look into my thought process which I usually commit to thread as a matter of course. 4: If you think I posted because I felt pressured to post, your not wrong, I want to play and engage with others, not lurk, if what I have to offer on page two of the game isnt up to par, my apologies / : there are no real accusations because there are no evident scum, only thoughts on play and considerations for the future. 1. Then why did you try to make it look like there is any substance to your post? 2. Okay, but how is that a reply to my point about fishing being mafia-sided? Or that you are accusing Damdred of it, while he has not done that? 3. It does seem more of a process of incriminating others than your thought process. I see more accusations in this post than analysis. 4. Fine. There are many ways to enter a game. Making a post like this is not a town-way of entering the game. One this is to be pressured to post, another is to be pressured to post something of substance. Mafia is more prone to feel the second pressure, which I think your post has shown - it might look like it has substance, but under a second of thought it turns out to only look like it. On March 24 2016 09:04 LightningStrike wrote: It was a indirect reference. Thanks. Still, out of gumshoe's terrible post he decides that talking about Slam is the biggest indicator of gumshoe being scum? Where's the explanation sicklucker?! I disagree that talking about Slam is an indicator of being scum (in this case) - the way gumshoe has talked about Slam is an indicator of being scum. Huge difference. | ||
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Kurumi
Poland6130 Posts
On March 24 2016 09:55 gumshoe wrote: just voted for Kurumi, but yeah my primary problem is she is pursuing two reads that are fairly opposed without a hint of reservation regarding that conflict. From a townie perspective those two reads would clash and be worthy of note in provided logic, but it hasnt even occured to Kurumi insofar. What seems more likely is she just doesnt want to draw atention to the Janus nature of her current logic, a setup that favours an outcome for scum wherein I and lick are both town. it feels like an opinion born of machinations rather then genuine perspective. Poisened at it's root with contradiction. (ok now I'll go out.... ON A HIGH NOTE) I opinion born of machinations rather then genuine perspective. You are clearly trying to twist your errors so they fit your narrative. I've never called sicklucker scum. I only have said that his reason for voting you is: a) nonexistent as in, he never gave his own reason for that b) the one we can dig up from his one-liner is that he feels that talking about Slam early is scum-indicative, which I disagree. As I said before, the way you talk about Slam is scummy, not the fact you have talked about him at all. As you can see, I have my vote casted on nobody. Not you, not sicklucker. The reason? I believed that you might really be a Townie with a really weird approach, so I pushed you to give me an explanation for your actions. Your explanation so far was that you've done those things to do anything at all for the sake of not being accused of doing nothing. That is not a Townie perspective. As for sicklucker, I still await his response. Can you be both scum? Sure, you can be. His vote has weight of zero, being so fast and based on a such dubious reasoning. There's nothing contradictory in a story where sicklucker votes for you because he sees you dun goofed and then he "changes his mind" based on your explanations. He voted in such a way it is very easy to unvote you. There was no case or explanation given. But that's not the story I believe in. I believe that sicklucker has laid down a weak vote because he could. Really, it doesn't require much to vote, I could vote anyone right now, especially a person who has not shown up yet and what happens? Nothing. Everyone knows that my vote is a weak one. I could pick a one line off someone's post this early, which is not strongly indicative and decide that's my reason for voting. It's a weak vote - everyone will see that. If he were to unvote you it would not say much to me, yet. But I believe he will be more dead-set on you after your follow-up play. And I am not "setting up a lynch". You are doing it yourself. Setting up a lynch is enraging Kavdragon and pushing your agenda so Town agrees that his anger and his play is not Town-oriented. I want to lynch you based on what you have said and what you have done, not what explanations I give to people. I am not trying to create a narrative surrounding your actions: I am openly questioning them and your explanations, your own words, condemn you. After the initial "well I am a weak player, I make mistakes, oh well, but they were good mistakes! Ones to be done!" you go after me as if your previous actions did not take place. I called your behaviour into question, you have defended it, never explaining how are they not scum-indicative, but saying over and over that it's just you being bad. When I called you on your iffy reasoning for thinking people are scummy - you have not commented on that. You have defended fishing as a townie thing to do. No, fishing (that is, trying to get a role read off someone) is not a townie thing to do. As a townie, you do not try to give information that mafia might act upon! What good can come from getting someone to claim VT or non-VT? None! None for a townie! All in all, all you have done this game is post the way a scared scum feels like, admit to it, defend a scum agenda and try to paint me in a bad light. That won't pass. I am now voting you, because I am sure that you are Mafia. On March 24 2016 09:13 Shapelog wrote: Kurminia or how ever you spell that name. Since you hate this role talk, lets talk something else. What is your favorite color of a bomb pop? Also do you have any stances on player's alignment yet that you have not meation? It's Kurumi and I am a he. I have no idea what a bomb pop is and why it should matter. Yes, I do. I am very vary of ritoky, I like Superbia, LightningStorm. No idea what your sonic post was meant to bring to the thread. You seem to like the idea of gumshoe being town, but you have so far not done much to defend him or anything else. Why are you so careless about your town-read being the main topic so far? | ||
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Kurumi
Poland6130 Posts
On March 24 2016 11:42 LightningStrike wrote: You sure that all of gunshoe's post can be from scum!gunshoe? If so I getting townie vibes from him atm so I heavily disagree with you there. Show me what I am unable to see. I might be tunneled, I don't really believe that, but maybe I am missing something. I mean, he is defending himself through attacking me - which doesn't rub me any townie way. | ||
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Kurumi
Poland6130 Posts
On March 24 2016 11:50 LightningStrike wrote: He isn't really afraid to speak to others and actually talked other people outside of you granted it was before you attacked him but he aint afraid to speak his mind when he's around which I feel is townie. Although granted he haven't played a game on TL for a while. But that talking was for the sake of talking. That's why I am pushing him. Not being afraid is a natural thing here - he's now the topic, if he buries underground it will be even worse for him. | ||
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Kurumi
Poland6130 Posts
Also, bollocks. I really was wrong. I really was too harsh. I wanted to keep up with that and attack Koshi, but then he decided to play his Town game and break all the vows and rave around. So Koshi moved from a scum-leaning to town-leaning in my eyes. Play after gumshoe's death and his relentlessness about ritoky only proves that. Also, don't do the list only Koshi, because what I am doing right now is giving you a pass for now, not forever. As for ritoky: Holy shit dude, your plan... wasn't that... great. Yeah, you've done that and I believe you, but that brought a lot more harm than anything else. As a person who has hosted games and has played in fair share of them, not only hosts give the Vanilla Townie name (and sometimes more) they also offer fakeclaims for every role under the sun. Your argument that revealing VTs would create an impossible-to-combat Town Circle is also wrong, because, well, your assumption was that people who know the name will behave accordingly... which is people being VTs and Mafia. I think your play is more indicative of a naive townie than a scum. If you were scum, you'd be more blunt about the claim. Maybe claim the name in some disorted way, maybe hint it more strongly, I have no idea, but for sure you'd try to fish for someone disagreeing with you. Another slight-town read. Back to Slam. If he were Mafia and that was a Mafia shot, all I'd see now should be "LYNCH KURUMI" and it is not the case. So it means the shot was not used as a means to incriminate me or cast doubt, or leverage it in any way. While I was not the only one voting gumshoe, I was the person pushing the hardest since the very first post of mine. Is there a chance that Slam was bluffing/trolling/whatever and Mafia decided to use that to kill Shoe and let the responsibility for the kill just land on Slam? There's no one on Slam either, yet... So it seems that this kill went through without any group agenda, leading me to believe that it was Town KP, be it Slam or anyone else. It just lacks follow-up, both ways (against me and against Slam) have not been taken by anyone. I think Slam is town. So that's it for the current things. I will look up shoe's filter and wander around in thread as well, because I need another shot of Scumus Readus for both this shift and another or I'll goddamn die. | ||
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Kurumi
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Kurumi
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On March 24 2016 22:52 Superbia wrote: Actually my problem lies with Koshi's push, and it doesn't necessarily directly relates to Koshi's alignment, but more to the fact that I feel he may have been spewed by mafia (i.e. people are calling him town too quickly). I will elaborate. Koshi's "anger-push" on Ritoky was completely unfounded, as Ritoky had gum high in his town-list (a post that was posted pretty much before the shot), as a result of his post (and a small number of other circumstances), Ritoky would've never shot gum. This is somewhat obvious from first glace, and completely obvious after looking deeper into it (even without considering Slam's soft). I felt that the emotion behind Koshi's post was townie, but the content was absolutely not. It was undirected and based on nothing close to logic. I believe that this does not mean Koshi is mafia, but rather that the people who piled on to calling Koshi town that quickly are more suspect (i.e. I'm the first to bring this up). He is more likely town precisely because of his anger-push being unfounded. Classic town Koshi. | ||
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Kurumi
Poland6130 Posts
While I was still doing pressure Vivax came into the thread calling Koshi, Shoe and Me into question. | ||
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Kurumi
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On March 24 2016 23:42 Superbia wrote: What's the average mafia count in a 21 player game? Assuming there is 3rd party and stuff too (I'm assuming there is). The formula is usually Players/5 rounded down, so that'd be 4 Mafia this game, was there a third party in either of Storm Mafias? On March 25 2016 00:02 justanothertownie wrote: I don't understand this paragraph at all. Why does mafia need to follow up on this? The logical/natural thing for them to do if slam is in fact mafia is to wait and see how well it goes/if he gets away with it before acting. Well, I think that they'd use the momentum created by the shot to some end. I have not seen that in the thread, people are not really reading Slam as scum, people are not super focused on people who were pushing gumshoe, I think if Mafia shot gum, they'd want the discussion to be on those points, not any others like we have right now. That's just the world I am in. On March 25 2016 01:24 Tubesock wrote: Good morning. Kurumi is my biggest scum read. Seems opportunistic with the Gumdrops push. Damdred was fishing (but not for roles) and it didn't seem Gums was saying Damdred was fishing for that, but Kurumi jumps his ass. Meanwhile Ritoky ACTUALLY fishes for roles yet all Kurumi says is "very vary of Ritoky". The rest of Kurumi's posts seem nitpicky. Tumble and Shape are forgettable and blending. I'm going to leave Koshi at null. I'm not liking his "play" but I did like his little outburst of emotion. Although, I find it hard to believe that can't be faked. As far as town I think my strongest TR's are Superbia, Vivax just below Jat and Rels. Damdred with a town lean. Ritoky probably is in fact VT. Slam I think is probably town. I am having trouble seeing the point of breadcrumbing so much if he were mafia. Why not just shut up and blow someone up? I do want to hear his explanation. Read my posts again(not skim!) so you can have a good town read on me, because my filter defends itself without any problems. Just because I have not coloured every of my reads or made a list of them doesn't mean they are not there. Gumshoe's filter wasn't really that exciting besides him sharing my suspicions on both Koshi and sicklucker, he did not have time to bring anything new to the table sadly. His last couple of posts was finally something I expected out of him. He also looked like agreeing with me more and more. On the topic of sicklucker: What was good in my post you quoted? What are your scumreads and why? I don't like that you just quoted my entire post and said it was good while not really pushing anyone or anything in the thread. I am also let down by Alakaslam, he could've said that we have a way to kill two D1, basically a double lynch and we could just make him shoot the second person in line... Why the bloodlust Slam, why?! It's so anti-town the only reason I think you are Town is that noone is trying to capitalize on it... For the last 20 minutes I've been looking for a post suggesting that scum's KP is up for them to decide whether to use it day or night, it felt like hardcore slip, but then I might've dreamt it... | ||
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Kurumi
Poland6130 Posts
On March 25 2016 06:38 Tubesock wrote: I didn't skim your posts. I did not bring up your lack or reads so why the defensiveness? What I think your reads were is basically Superbia and Lightninstrike are town and ritoky and Gum were mafia. ALthough you didn't talk much about ritoky. Not nearly as much as Gum anyway. What do you currently think of Ritoky? You accused me of not being hard enough on ritoky - that I am hard on fishing, but not on him, although he is fishing. Look at my posts! I said that role talk is absolutely terrible, that people should stop and that I am vary of ritoky. He was my 2nd scum read at the time - but what I saw in gumshoe was more sure for me - I saw scum agenda together with defending scum agenda, can't get more scummy than that this early. I have already voiced my opinion on ritoky, if you really read my posts you should know that he had a paragraph in my last big post. | ||
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Kurumi
Poland6130 Posts
On March 25 2016 06:52 justanothertownie wrote: I think I said that I wouldn't lynch slam very soon. Ritoky still deserves a lot of suspicion for making a play that only helps mafia. I would love to lynch Ritoky, but his play was so terrible I can't believe a scum would make it... Or am I being double fooled here, JAT? | ||
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Kurumi
Poland6130 Posts
On March 25 2016 06:58 justanothertownie wrote: As long as you get away with it it is not a terrible play as mafia. And ritoky is known for making plays. Yeah, fair point. From ritoky's posts I get mixed signals as well - I feel that he really doesn't know what's more important for him: establishing his own innocence or establishing an outcome good for the town. My gut tells me that his line of thought was: "I have a plan, if it works, I will be a hero and I will be established as confirmed town!" while for plans it should rather be a communal perspective: if it works, Town has the upper-hand. So what I am trying to say is that I feel like ritoky wanted to use the plan as a mean to prove himself as "Town", while helping Town in any way was a secondary consideration. But did this plan ever have a chance of success, knowing the prowess of the hosts? I don't think so. So it either was a play, or a badly thought-out plan, which you tell me I should not expect from someone like ritoky. Am I making sense here? | ||
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Kurumi
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On March 25 2016 07:15 ritoky wrote: holy fuck it was not badly thought out. screw everyone who thinks so. that plan is really fucking good. execution dumpster tier? yes. but that plan is amazing, will defend it to no end. do not give any fucks. You do know that hard setups like to have additional conditional KP? Like Assassins? You could've put us into a quite a pickle. | ||
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Kurumi
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Is it really that huge? 21 players total. 4 probably Mafia. 17 players left. 8 players believe that they are Town. You still have 9 Townies not sharing that sentiment. That's excluding possible 3rd party shenanigans and different Mafia size (I could see it being 5 even). It does not seem that huge. Because it is 8 players analysing 13 players, you are much more likely to down or out a blue. This would probably result in last minute switch shenanigans and disorder. This would lead to Mafia having even more information. In that 8, you could have three Mafia who figured out that it is a good idea to get on that Ford Wave and now you have 5 townies believing strongly that 3 players are Townie, but are actually Mafia. Mafia creates lynch after lynch, blue blood is the last sight of the day, blue blood is the first sight of the day and since this setup is about being careful, I don't see it being good. | ||
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