Bureaucracy Mafia!

Extra Information:
The mafia kill process goes like this:
Every day, all mafia members except for the CEO send in a name on who they wish to kill. Then, the CEO must choose to kill one player on the list by the night deadline.

On July 17 2012 00:08 Kurumi wrote:

Cycle is day-night. Half cycle is either day or night. They probably can communicate right now. Mind you, that's only 3 messages. CEO-High Rank-Minion and High Rank-Minion.

On July 17 2012 00:14 HiroPro wrote:


Bah, I thought it meant halfway through the day/night. I guess that kinda takes away the reactions we could get from the random lynch then.

On July 17 2012 13:33 Mattchew wrote:

How are his actions scummy?

On July 17 2012 23:23 Palmar wrote:


I share a lot of his initial reads and opinions. using his block against chezinu says nothing about his alignment as it's the only way he can respond, although I guess waiting for a mod to confirm the nuke would've been smarter. But I don't think BH is particularly smart, but he's loud and useful.

On July 17 2012 11:26 Meapak_Ziphh wrote:
I'm kinda hamstrung until rastaban gets back so in the meantime I'll throw my name in with the people who want BH dead.


BH is really just going for whoever is currently the flavor of the hour, if you look at his posts he's simply flipped whenever thread opinion has changed. Also his reasons for voting people have been very sheepy, he's been gunning for syllo for the better part of the game but all of a sudden bugs waltzes in with a case and BH flips again.

##Unvote
##Vote: Blazinghand

On July 18 2012 03:29 Meapak_Ziphh wrote:


You've been very careful and useless so far this game however I don't think I could have made a convincing case on you with your 4 or so posts you had at the time I made my post. You've subsequently posted a little more however they've been just as worthless. I don't think I have enough time to get you lynched today but I'll definitely make a move tomorrow.
...

On July 18 2012 04:44 austinmcc wrote:
I have no name cache here, that's fine. But read this with an open mind. Seriously read point (1). Consider whether it makes sense.

(1) Sandroba's role is way, way, way too powerful
Not a single person here knows how sandroba's power works. Mafia, town, 5th party, whatever. Nobody is curious?

Nobody is thinking, jeez, in a game where mafia cannot communicate except through 2 messages per day cycle, 2 messages per night cycle, and there are NINE of them. A game where they might lynch each other, NK each other, use powers on each other. Nobody is going, holy balls, the ability to SEND FAKE MESSAGES is an incredibly, incredibly powerful role?

Think about it. The way sandroba used it, he's a cop. You ask someone to do something, if they do, they must have assumed it was from a mafia higher-up. So if they obey, they're mafia, you got this game's equivalent of a red check. Moreover, you're a cop that cannot be affected by any kind of framing power. Normal cops can be balanced out by gfs, millers, frames. A red check from a normal cop may or may not indicate scum. Saying "Hey use these 3 phrases in your next post to identify yourself" CANNOT be balanced by any mechanic at all. If they obey a message they received, when they had no idea anyone other than mafia could send messages, they must be mafia. Name a single other explanation, because when kurumi tried to give one, it sounded dumb and everyone agreed it sounded dumb.

Moreover, he's not just a cop. He can check people with that power, AND direct their actions. Not only does he know they're red when they follow orders, he can actively direct mafia action because messages are anonymous. He gets a red check AND gets to direct the actions of a mafia member, tell them who to go after, who to defend, etc.

Oh man, austinmcc, that DOES sound pretty powerful now that I think about it. He's a supercop that can't get false checks in a game where mafia have limited communication?

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(2) Sandroba has played scum IN a sleeper cell game in which a powerful role fakeclaim helped win the game
Well, surely he wouldn't claim such a powerful role, right? He'd wait to use it a few more times. I mean, checks AND mafia action disruption, you'd want to keep that secret. Unless, of course, you'd played in another game where a ridiculous check helped win you the game. You know, like, say, Sleeper Cell Mafia. The game where sandroba rolled mafia with Ace as cell leader and Ace claimed the following role:
Ace skated by after claiming this, with the only person who was suspicious of his claim being another cell member. In the postgame, there was a decent bit of discussion about how town should have questioned Ace's claim given that he could (1) intercept messages and (2) shoot. Sandroba's claimed power is basically on about that level, because he's a combination cop and...disruptor? There's no name for that other role as far as I know. It's basically a townie who gets to sit in mafia QT but isn't mafia.

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(3) Sandroba showed balls as a sleeper agent in that same game
Ace claimed to have shot GGQ N3. There was only one kill. Sandroba, as scum, claimed vet on D4 in order to account for the missing KP. So we KNOW he's got the balls to fakeclaim as scum in this style of game. We know that having those balls won him a game, as scum, in this style of game.

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Maybe I'm being paranoid. But maybe that role is a little overpowered to be in a balanced game. Maybe sandroba can play ballsy as scum in this sort of game. Maybe, even if the role isn't overpowered, Sandroba should be smart enough not to out himself because he caught 1/9 of the mafia team with a role that friggin' powerful. Wouldn't you keep that to yourself and catch more? Wouldn't you catch more and actively disrupt mafia communication/actions?

THAT is why I wanted Sandroba to claim. That is why I find him scummy. Get offa mah nuts, because if you actually think about his role, you should be questioning it too. Either scum have RIDICULOUSLY powerful roles to balance things out, or town simply cannot have a guy who ends up being an uncounterable cop PLUS can actively plant fake mafia communications.

On July 18 2012 12:26 Mattchew wrote:
I think Gonzaw is overwhelmed (not enough time) and that very much plays into why his meta would seem off. His confidence seems to be gone without being able to be the most dominant (usually by sheer volume) poster in the thread. I think this is the first time I have ever seen this little filter out of him and I think this all stems from not having enough time. I think his reactions and posts are sincere and truthful